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View Full Version : How many miles on a new car before it's a demo?


mac101
06-20-2005, 04:11 PM
I saw an 05 that I'm considering. The car had 100 miles on it, but still classified as new by the dealer. Is there a guidline on how many miles a new car can have before it's considered "less than new" or a demo? Does the mileage number give me more leverage when negotiating?

The Other Tom
06-20-2005, 06:37 PM
I saw an 05 that I'm considering. The car had 100 miles on it, but still classified as new by the dealer. Is there a guidline on how many miles a new car can have before it's considered "less than new" or a demo? Does the mileage number give me more leverage when negotiating?

I'm not sure, but i think the distinction between new and demo is whether or not the car has been "punched", or listed as sold. As long as the car hasn't been punched , it is listed as a new car, regardless of mileage. As a practical matter, I think most dealers will go ahead and punch a car after it has been on the lot for x months .
I think a "new" car with excessively high mileage would have been on the dealer's lot for a while, and the dealer would want to get rid of it, so you should have some negotiation leverage. In my opinion, 100 miles isn't excessive. Just my 2 cents....I may be wrong.

hammerman
06-21-2005, 04:55 PM
100 is certainly new

a friend of mine bought a G35 with 400 miles that was still "new"

i'd say somewhere around 1000 for a demo

my 05 ZHP had 5 when i took delivery though :)

felt so nice to get a brand spanking new car that no one had driven

beware_phog
06-25-2005, 05:05 PM
100 is certainly new

a friend of mine bought a G35 with 400 miles that was still "new"

i'd say somewhere around 1000 for a demo

my 05 ZHP had 5 when i took delivery though :)

felt so nice to get a brand spanking new car that no one had driven

100 is NOT new. 400 is NOT new. It better be under 50 if I'm buying new. 1,000???? Are you crazy? Would you buy a "new" car that has 1,000 miles on it? That is practically the entire break in period. Would you be comfortable buying it "new" not knowing how it was driven during that time? I wouldn't. New is new.

Patrick330i
06-25-2005, 05:12 PM
That's a lot of miles for a new car, but I don't see much of a chance at all in getting the Stealer to deal with you based on that mileage amount. If you can find what you want and order, that would be a better way to go. Good luck.

RodneyORourke
06-25-2005, 05:27 PM
Noone is going to like my answer, but here it goes.

If it is in demo status, then it is a demo. Whether it has 50 miles or 5500 miles. None of these vehicles are used, unless they has been titled. If it is not used then it is new. Just remember, when talking discounts, a dealer is willing to deal better on a 5500 mile demo than a 50 mile demo.

Isn't that a dealers point of view???

lol :thumbup:


Sorry for the cut and dry answer,

Rodney :angel:

Jon Shafer
06-25-2005, 05:29 PM
Fact: In CA, a car is technically a "new" car until it has been reported sold to DMV.
There are a couple of minor points that can be argued, but even a car with thousands
can be considered "new" under most definitions. A discount for accrued mileage is
definitely a bargaining point, but frankly, you won't be able to get it for less than
another vehicle without miles if you are a skilled negotiator. In other words, the dealer
is going to expect a fair margin of profit over factory invoice even with the miles...

amt7565
06-25-2005, 09:52 PM
100 miles is still new!
Think about it...maybe 10 people drove it...people test driving it. Since they test drove it they would have been very careful driving it.....there is no damage the car could incur in 100 miles...well...the chances are slim. Unless someone cranked the RPM at over 6000RPM.

I got mine with 36 miles on it....I test drove the car 1 week earlier and it had 20 miles on it...I test drove about 6 miles....so some one else probably drove 10 miles.

However, you can try negotiating with the dealer for a discount...you could ask for another $500 off. Ask him if the car was used as a loaner.

SpeedFreak!
06-25-2005, 11:07 PM
100 is NOT new. 400 is NOT new. It better be under 50 if I'm buying new. 1,000???? Are you crazy? Would you buy a "new" car that has 1,000 miles on it? That is practically the entire break in period. Would you be comfortable buying it "new" not knowing how it was driven during that time? I wouldn't. New is new.

Although, I, for one, respect and agree with your opinion... both of my BMWs had never been test driven... our opinion has little to do with reality and the facts as they pertain to legal definitions. Jon, amt7565, RodneyORourke, hammerman, and The Other Tom all nailed it 100%. :thumbup:
Patrick330i... :rolleyes:

'Cane
06-26-2005, 12:04 PM
In FL it is new until it has been reported as sold, or until it reaches a certain mileage (don't remember what it was though).

bzap
05-16-2006, 12:01 PM
I think that aside from the states legal definition of new, the car is new with as many miles as you the buyer feel comfortable with. If that is 20 or 200. My M3 had about 100 miles on it, but I leased it so aside from any road damage (it had none, I checked) I did not care. My contract reflected the start miles and that was that. This is the most miles I have ever had at a new purchase, but it didn't really matter. I think that car was driven in from another local dealership, plus I know I put like 20 hard miles on it during the test drive. But... jet black/imola red is not easy to find. :D

Andrew*Debbie
05-16-2006, 01:46 PM
Fact: In CA, a car is technically a "new" car until it has been reported sold to DMV.
There are a couple of minor points that can be argued, but even a car with thousands
can be considered "new" under most definitions.

All correct and a 100 miles is nothing. 100 miles is less than 1% of the milage most of us put on a car in a year.


In 1987 I bought a new 1986 MY car with about two thousand miles on it. It had been through the auto show circuit for 1986. After that the importer installed a 1987 interior and put the car through the show circuit again. Since the car had never been sold, I was able to buy it as a new car for about half the orginal window sticker. I recived the new car finance rate from my bank. I got the standard new car warranty.

X550-ED
05-16-2006, 02:02 PM
100 miles is still new!
Think about it...maybe 10 people drove it...people test driving it. Since they test drove it they would have been very careful driving it.....there is no damage the car could incur in 100 miles...well...the chances are slim. Unless someone cranked the RPM at over 6000RPM.

I got mine with 36 miles on it....I test drove the car 1 week earlier and it had 20 miles on it...I test drove about 6 miles....so some one else probably drove 10 miles.

However, you can try negotiating with the dealer for a discount...you could ask for another $500 off. Ask him if the car was used as a loaner.

Everyone has their own definition of "new"

Yes, test drivers are usually very careful but it's not always the test drivers I'm concerned about, the salesmans too.

I went on a test drive and this salesman who took the 545i (at the time) brand new with only 20 some miles. Floored and Red lined it on a narrow 2 way street. I felt the G's pushing me into the seat, he went up to 80+ mph in the time it took to flash my whole life before my eyes. We came around this wide curve road at 100mph as I felt the car grip the road but sliding a little on occasions b/c of the holes in the road.

He then stopped at a parking lot and allowed me test it however I want. I did not floor it but I did race it to 60mph in that same road and fell in love with it :D and went into neg. with him and deal fell apart (wanted to sell at full MSRP - couple of hundred)

I felt sorry for whoever bought that car.

Eurocar
05-16-2006, 03:13 PM
It's interesting that BMW CCA specifically excludes "new, non-registered vehicles in excess of 1,000 miles including ... retail demos ..." from the Membership Reward program.

bzap
05-16-2006, 05:15 PM
Something else to keep in mind. BMW has one of the best service programs (everything pretty much free) while you are in the warranty period. So, especially if you are going to lease it, who really cares. If it breaks, they fix it... well, usually....

SARAFIL
05-16-2006, 06:05 PM
Fact: In CA, a car is technically a "new" car until it has been reported sold to DMV.
There are a couple of minor points that can be argued, but even a car with thousands
can be considered "new" under most definitions. A discount for accrued mileage is
definitely a bargaining point, but frankly, you won't be able to get it for less than
another vehicle without miles if you are a skilled negotiator. In other words, the dealer
is going to expect a fair margin of profit over factory invoice even with the miles...

This is very true. The invoice is the same and the dealer usually doesn't have any cost difference in a car with 500 miles vs. 100 miles vs. 5 miles... if you are good at working a deal, you can get the same price on any of them. It might be "easier" to get the deal on the higher mileage car, though.

Of course, there are some exceptions to this. If the car has been legitimately used as a demo (someone, such as a sales manager or general manager, was driving it), the dealer might have depreciated the car during its time in service. This all depends on the dealer, though... some don't do this at all, and the ones that do probably do it in many different ways. This means that you can probably get a "better" deal on a demo if the dealer has depreciated the car.

JBasham
05-16-2006, 06:55 PM
I bought a Jeep with 100 miles or so "new." I also got my Mom a Celica with 100 or so miles "new." Both these deals were several years back. I stressed out about both purchases, but they were end-of-model-year steals when stock was limited and that's what we had to take if we wanted to be picky about options and colors. We each drove those cars for years with no problem.

Looking at a new BMW, if it was giving me stress, I'd go buy a new 2006 off the truck instead. I bought one yesterday with 2 miles on it for $1000 over invoice.

X550-ED
05-19-2006, 12:08 AM
Congrats! Post pics

I bought a Jeep with 100 miles or so "new." I also got my Mom a Celica with 100 or so miles "new." Both these deals were several years back. I stressed out about both purchases, but they were end-of-model-year steals when stock was limited and that's what we had to take if we wanted to be picky about options and colors. We each drove those cars for years with no problem.

Looking at a new BMW, if it was giving me stress, I'd go buy a new 2006 off the truck instead. I bought one yesterday with 2 miles on it for $1000 over invoice.

P.Chas
05-19-2006, 03:34 AM
100 is NOT new. 400 is NOT new. It better be under 50 if I'm buying new. 1,000???? Are you crazy? Would you buy a "new" car that has 1,000 miles on it? That is practically the entire break in period. Would you be comfortable buying it "new" not knowing how it was driven during that time? I wouldn't. New is new.

Absolutely right!

Stuff any of the legal definitions of "new" that have been quoted on this thread.

When I buy a NEW car, factory test mileage only is acceptable.

I insist that everything I buy comes in the "factory sealed" box. The slightest defect
and back it goes.

Anal?- well I guess so, but I really take care of possessions. I had trouble bringing a
10 year old Olympus camera back through U.K. customs because it looked like new,
and they thought that I had just bought it abroad. Now after more than 25 years it is
still in mint condition.

DallasBimmer
05-19-2006, 09:27 PM
What "Factory Test Milage" should I expect as "normal" when I take delivery? Someone had mentioned less than 5 miles and someone else said less than 10 miles on the car off the truck is acceptable.
Which is it or it's just subjective?

jrp
05-20-2006, 12:47 PM
...Which is it or it's just subjective?

Subjective.

30 miles put on by Danica Patrick or 10 miles by a 400lb sumo wrestler who doesn't know how to drive a stick?

javelina1
05-20-2006, 06:04 PM
I bought a Jeep with 100 miles or so "new." I also got my Mom a Celica with 100 or so miles "new." Both these deals were several years back. I stressed out about both purchases, but they were end-of-model-year steals when stock was limited and that's what we had to take if we wanted to be picky about options and colors. We each drove those cars for years with no problem.

Looking at a new BMW, if it was giving me stress, I'd go buy a new 2006 off the truck instead. I bought one yesterday with 2 miles on it for $1000 over invoice.

our new 330i only had 3 miles on it when we took delivery. :thumbup:

My Wife and I test drove another vehicle. It had a little over 200 miles on it. The SA
even told me to Red Line it during the test drive. To show off the power. Needless to
say, it was cool to Red Line someone else's car. :tsk:

Glad ours only had 3 on it. I know exactly how & what it's been driven like. :bigpimp:

chuck92103
05-20-2006, 06:06 PM
Check the CCA rebate form. I believe it is under 1000 miles or you won't get the discount. It might even be as low as 250 miles. but i knwo it is not more than 1000 miles.

you get the discount if the car is new or if it is untitled and has less the "X" miles.

jrp
05-21-2006, 09:36 AM
Needless to
say, it was cool to Red Line someone else's car. :tsk:


Yeah but, it is infinitely more fun to redline my own cars on a near-daily basis. :D