Is this a problem with Sport Package?

[mikeuno]

Just got my 325 delivered last week, with sport package. So far the drive is excellent, but I found a problem here, this car is too sensitive to uneven road surface. you must hold steering wheel firmly otherwise the car will go out of lane easily on uneven road.

So is this a problem due to sport package with 17" rim? I thought the car should be tuned with the 17" wheel. Anyone has some ideas? Thanks

[Jupeman]

I'm a newbie with BMWs and await my first (ED in October). That said, I do have considerable experience with Porsches and I think what you're experiencing isn't unique to the 3 series sport package.

Any time you stiffen the suspension, the car is less compliant. You might be used to a softer car that simply absorbs the subtle road-rut undulations without you noticing. Once you stiffen up that sidewall (bigger wheels) and stiffen the springs, the car is going to react more to any uneven surface. Although I'm sure BMW does tune for the 17" wheels, the car is still stiffer than the standard suspension so you will get the tramming effect a bit. Also note that the sports package has wider tires which will be less likely to nicely "run in a rut".

Overall, I don't think what you're feeling is a "problem", it is just part of the trade-off for higher performance and better handling.

[kyfdx]

Just got my 325 delivered last week, with sport package. So far the drive is excellent, but I found a problem here, this car is too sensitive to uneven road surface. you must hold steering wheel firmly otherwise the car will go out of lane easily on uneven road.

So is this a problem due to sport package with 17" rim? I thought the car should be tuned with the 17" wheel. Anyone has some ideas? Thanks

It is the summer performance tires that cause your problem.... The same thing that makes them grip the road, also makes them follow the imperfections of a bad road.. also known as tramlining...

You'll get used to it.... if you drive faster to take advantage of the increased performance, you may forget all about it...

[ic]

It is because of the wider tires, stiff suspension and run-flat.

[jpsquared]

The tramlining the kyfdx described is very pronounced in the 330i with the Sport Package. The stiff suspension, wide rubber and large wheel diameter really take some getting used to on uneven road surfaces or on roads with ruts worn into them. Changing lanes at speed (70+ mph) on one of these rutted surfaces for the first time in my car was an eye-opening experience!

But as mentioned, the upside of the stiff ride and rubber on the road is the amazing grip on smooth surfaces. Cornering and on/off ramps are taken remarkably fast. I've had passengers get that ashen-faced look of terror as I've bombed through tight corners without a squeal from the tires, and then they ask me to do it again! :thumbup:

[Nick325xiT 5spd]

It sounds liek you are used to 175/90-14 tires. :p

[Rob325_in_AZ]

Just got my 325 delivered last week, with sport package. So far the drive is excellent, but I found a problem here, this car is too sensitive to uneven road surface. you must hold steering wheel firmly otherwise the car will go out of lane easily on uneven road.

So is this a problem due to sport package with 17" rim? I thought the car should be tuned with the 17" wheel. Anyone has some ideas? Thanks


What kind of uneven roads are you talking about? Do you mean pot-hole patched rough roads or just the gently sloped lanes designed to drain water off to the side, like the right lane on a standard US interstate?

Without having driven an e90, I suspect what you're experiencing is normal. Just part of the "feel of the road" you get with these cars.

[Mauricio]

I've experienced the shifting of the car and I complained about it on another forum but it didn't seem like a big deal to anyone. I used to own a e46 325i and it felt rock solid on the road while driving at any speed. The first time I drove home from the dealer in my new car I noticed what you're describing and I was a little dissapointed. It is very shifty and it seems to want to follow grooves and imperfections in the road. The steering feels very easily disrupted. I find myself constantly correcting the direction.

I understand about having better traction on smooth roads and when cornering it is amazing how well it behaves, but I'm questioning whether or not I made the right decision in getting the sport package because most of my driving is on the highway. Don't get me wrong...I don't mind the stiffer ride and I drive it hard when cornering, it's just that it doesn't feel planted and solid at freeway speeds.

And don't even get me started on the 18" run-flats and their unexpected cost and rate of replacement. I have a 3 year lease on my car and with the miles I drive, it's looking like 4 sets of tires over the life of my lease. At minimum, $1200 dollars per set it comes out to over an additional $130 / month cost of ownership. That's expensive!

[ObD]

Tramlining can be minimized by adjusting air pressure. I'd experiment a bit before throwing in the towel.

[matrix1]

I have the 330i with the Sports pack/18-inch wheels and I'm experiencing the same feel everyone is describing. On the highways you have to really grip the Steering wheel because the Car is "shifty" and at times feels like it wants to pull to the sides. I was getting ready to bring it back to the dealer to have the alignment checked, but after reading this thread it sounds like it's normal with the Sports package.

[Desertnate]

Could all of these complaints stem from the run-flat tires?

If I recall, run flats have much stiffer sidewalls in order to hold the weight of the car with no air in the tires. If that is the case, then tires that already more prone to tramlining will behave even more so. Since the E46 didn't have runflats that might be why it feels so different.

Mauricio: On a lease, you don't have to continually put run flats on the car do you? If not that would be a no-brainer when the first set wore out. Replace the runflats with tires that better matched what you wanted.

[daoushy]

This is exactly why I didn't get the SP... I love the seats and teh wheels, but since I commute 80 miles on highway with 70MPH average I did not want the stiff ride...

I asked the dealer if I can get the SP with normal suspension.. and the answer was a straigt NO

I'm happy now that I decided againest it :rofl:

[brybarrett]

I test drove a new 330 with SP the other day. From my observations the car seemed not to follow the road as much as any 46 that I have owned and I'm on my 3rd one. It appeared that it could cruise right through the imperfections of the road. Overall the new 3 is nice, refined to the point where I think it's a little numb and less spirited than the E46 & E36.

[mikeuno]

I've experienced the shifting of the car and I complained about it on another forum but it didn't seem like a big deal to anyone. I used to own a e46 325i and it felt rock solid on the road while driving at any speed. The first time I drove home from the dealer in my new car I noticed what you're describing and I was a little dissapointed. It is very shifty and it seems to want to follow grooves and imperfections in the road. The steering feels very easily disrupted. I find myself constantly correcting the direction.

I understand about having better traction on smooth roads and when cornering it is amazing how well it behaves, but I'm questioning whether or not I made the right decision in getting the sport package because most of my driving is on the highway. Don't get me wrong...I don't mind the stiffer ride and I drive it hard when cornering, it's just that it doesn't feel planted and solid at freeway speeds.

And don't even get me started on the 18" run-flats and their unexpected cost and rate of replacement. I have a 3 year lease on my car and with the miles I drive, it's looking like 4 sets of tires over the life of my lease. At minimum, $1200 dollars per set it comes out to over an additional $130 / month cost of ownership. That's expensive!

Totally agree with you! I used to drive e46 325i as well and it didn't have this kinda problem at all. The tramlining is a bit annoying sometimes though I quite enjoy the stiffer sporty ride. Once the car was almost crashing into the car in the next lane when I was answering the cell!

[mikeuno]

Could all of these complaints stem from the run-flat tires?

If I recall, run flats have much stiffer sidewalls in order to hold the weight of the car with no air in the tires. If that is the case, then tires that already more prone to tramlining will behave even more so. Since the E46 didn't have runflats that might be why it feels so different.

Mauricio: On a lease, you don't have to continually put run flats on the car do you? If not that would be a no-brainer when the first set wore out. Replace the runflats with tires that better matched what you wanted.


I can't see any advantage of run-flat tires so far. (maybe u save some space in trunk).

[mikeuno]

I have the 330i with the Sports pack/18-inch wheels and I'm experiencing the same feel everyone is describing. On the highways you have to really grip the Steering wheel because the Car is "shifty" and at times feels like it wants to pull to the sides. I was getting ready to bring it back to the dealer to have the alignment checked, but after reading this thread it sounds like it's normal with the Sports package.


I went back to dealer last week and they did a testdrive on it. the technician said the tramlining is normal and has nothing to do with wheel alignment. So save your time and try to get used to it!

[NaTuReB0Y]

Run-flats :thumbdwn:

Non Run-flats :thumbup:

[KG330i]

I have the 330i with the Sports pack/18-inch wheels and I'm experiencing the same feel everyone is describing. On the highways you have to really grip the Steering wheel because the Car is "shifty" and at times feels like it wants to pull to the sides. I was getting ready to bring it back to the dealer to have the alignment checked, but after reading this thread it sounds like it's normal with the Sports package.

Which New York highway are you traveling on? I have taken the I95, I80, 280 to name a few and have not experience this behavior. I have indeed noticed this on my local route in Brooklyn. Whenever I go a bit faster then the pull is less. I had an E46 without SP and the same pull was felt.

[mapezzul]

Tramlining is a fact of tire pressure more so than runflats, so check your tires and make sure they are correct. I had this problem with my previous car and pressure was the culprit. I personally like the run flats and do not see what everyone complains about. The ride with the E90 is NO harsher than a normal car without runflats, they designed the suspension around the runflat concept and regulated the spring rates and dampers around the tires. The benefit of the run flat is much added safety, I am not talking about being able to drive with a flat... that is great and all but rather preventing a blow out. These tires are unable to blow out and if anyone has ever experienced a blow out it is a scary thing at highway speeds and can be real difficult to come out of. Also as far as the wear of the tire with the sport suspension..... those are performance tires with a stickier less durable compound if you opt for all seasons and a less sticky compound you can get upwards of 30k mile on the tires. (I know this because I had 25k + a lot of thread on my previous car with runflats). Good Luck! :thumbup:

[LarryN]

I haven't had any tramlining to speak of in my ZSP 330i. I keep pressures at around 34 cold though.

You don't know tramlining unless you have driven a e46 with S-03's on them. Those things are nearly dangerous, as they wear down. You have to really stay on top of it.

I also have a set of Azenis RT-615's mounted to 17x8.5 Kosei K1's. When I have those mounted, you gain a LOT of the steering feel that the much heavier stock 18" wheels and run flats take away. It fealt like a different car on my first drive with them on. Almost jittery, it was so precise.

[ic]

Mauricio and Mikeuno, what tire size are you using in your E46 325i? The new E90 325i with sport package has a wider and lower profile tires then E46.

[Spanish Fly]

I hate run-flats. On my girlfriend's Cooper S they make handling a bit wierd on the limit. When she got a puncture the other month it took 7 days for the tyre centre to get one into stock and cost a bundle.

When she wears them all out we'll stick some YOKOHAMA AVS SPORTs on. They are the dogs bollox. I have had them on the TT for about 3 years and are incredible even on track days! :D

Cheers,

Chay

[.Nikki.]

Once the car was almost crashing into the car in the next lane when I was answering the cell!

And you're blaming this on the car? :tsk:

[turpiwa]

I hate run-flats. On my girlfriend's Cooper S they make handling a bit wierd on the limit. When she got a puncture the other month it took 7 days for the tyre centre to get one into stock and cost a bundle.

When she wears them all out we'll stick some YOKOHAMA AVS SPORTs on. They are the dogs bollox. I have had them on the TT for about 3 years and are incredible even on track days! :D

Cheers,

Chay
I love the run flats on my Mini - they handle superbly :)

[RICH2005]

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeuno
Once the car was almost crashing into the car in the next lane when I was answering the cell!


And you're blaming this on the car? :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Jupeman]

Ironically I love this thread as it just confirms for me that the sport package 3 is not some marshmallow car. I was disappointed in the non-sport model when I test drove it as it felt large and soft. The sport package really transformed the car for me and made it feel lighter and more nimble. I'll trade some tram-lining for superior handling any day.

[Moderato]

The ZSP or ZHP on the 330i is the perfect blend of comfort and handling. Personally I wanted more so I got an M3, and while that car isn't what I would consider to be too harsh it did make the 330i ZSP feel even softer to me.

[Spanish Fly]

Anybody who knows how to drive hard will know run flats are for girls who can't change wheels when they get a puncture!

Pirelli tried it back in the 70's with their Donovo tyre. It sucked then and it sucks now!

Chay

[mapezzul]

Anybody who knows how to drive hard will know run flats are for girls who can't change wheels when they get a puncture!

Pirelli tried it back in the 70's with their Donovo tyre. It sucked then and it sucks now!

Chay
Arrogance or ignorance?

See if you had done your research modern run flats,a bit of an update from the 70's (how can someone even compare a 20+ year old design to a modern one?). actually improve performance. The stiffer side walls do not only provide safety benefits but improve driving dynamics. When tested on the 5 series while driving on the Nurbrgring the car with runflats on averaged 10 seconds faster than the car without runflats. Tires transfer the movements of the steering wheel to the road so with the stiffer runflat the tire turns more quickly and accurately. Oh yeah and runflats also improve braking performance. So if you actually drove hard you would want a stiffer side wall, but obviously you should know that b/c apparently you know how to change a punctured tire. The 3 has specially calibrated suspension and drive line components specifically engineered for runflats. Without them the car is not going to be "right" For those of you that read, check out the 3|2005 issue of BMW THE MAGAZINE, it clearly explaind the benefits of the newer runflats. I loved them on my previous car and will love them on Monday driving on the autobahn... no need to worry about a blow out :) Oh yeah I forgot to mention how rediculous the comment above was about girls.... that is just stupid, I know many women who can do more with a car than some men, especially men that use comments like that... sad. Not to flame SPANISHFLY but that just errrkks me, lack of respect is just not cool.
Best of luck :thumbup:

[inline6]

I hate run-flats. On my girlfriend's Cooper S they make handling a bit wierd on the limit. When she got a puncture the other month it took 7 days for the tyre centre to get one into stock and cost a bundle.

When she wears them all out we'll stick some YOKOHAMA AVS SPORTs on. They are the dogs bollox. I have had them on the TT for about 3 years and are incredible even on track days! :D

Cheers,

Chay

Are you sure you want to do that? Your girl is safer with the runflats.

[Spanish Fly]

Bloody Hell! Some people have no sense of humour! Take a chill pill and be a bit more sexist. :gay:

Who wants a woman who knows how to change a wheel? That would mean they wouldn't have a clue in the kitchen. Leave the car stuff to us blokes it's all we're good for. :thumbup:

Have you actually driven anything other than a big fat bimmer? We in Europe grew up with light under-powered hot-hatches through the 80's and we learnt how to drive and make a slow car go quicker. We didn't just go out an buy a 200 Bhp car and think we could drive just because we could push an accelerator pedal!

When you have driven the cars we drive and used B roads and driven through hail, sleet, snow and scorching heat in all sorts of vehicles then you can rant.

I grew up with Minis, MG's, RS's, etc. I have participated in track days, and all kinds of competition in all sorts of vehicles. From hill climbs in my old Caterham to Super stocks in a Peugeot 205 gti to banger racing in old Ford Granadas.

I think I am more than a little qualified to hold an opinion on these matters.

Why don't we use Runflats on race cars if they are so wonderful?

BTW, you can keep your wonderful autobahns. We've got the best roads in Europe for driving. Why do you think 90% of manufacturers and magazines test drive their cars down here in Andalucia?

Get a life and learn to drive like a man not like a WOMAN!

Rant over.

[BiggerTwin]

It is because of the wider tires, stiff suspension and run-flat.While these things contribute to the problem of tramlining, my experience shows it is bad engineering and design. The E46 M3 has low profile tires and tracks like it is on rails. The Z4 3.0 with sport package is all over the road. While people like to blame low profile run-flats for the problem, the Corvette has them and exhibits great directional stability. Car and Driver reports that Turner Motorsports has a suspension package that cures the tramlining in the Z4.

I haven’t noticed tramlining in the various 325i and 330i cars I have driven but will stick to the 17 inch wheels on my 330xi based on this thread. While the 17 inch wheels didn’t cure the tramlining on my Z4, they significantly reduced the problem.

[ic]

While these things contribute to the problem of tramlining, my experience shows it is bad engineering and design. The E46 M3 has low profile tires and tracks like it is on rails. The Z4 3.0 with sport package is all over the road. While people like to blame low profile run-flats for the problem, the Corvette has them and exhibits great directional stability. Car and Driver reports that Turner Motorsports has a suspension package that cures the tramlining in the Z4..
Good info. That's my 1st car with run-flat. I will replace with non run-flat for the next set of tires and see.

[ic]

Why don't we use Runflats on race cars if they are so wonderful?

As no one said that run-flats are good for performance, why compare with race cars? :dunno: Just curious, does F1 using some sort of run-flats or something else?

[Spanish Fly]

Arrogance or ignorance?

See if you had done your research modern run flats,a bit of an update from the 70's (how can someone even compare a 20+ year old design to a modern one?). actually improve performance. The stiffer side walls do not only provide safety benefits but improve driving dynamics. When tested on the 5 series while driving on the Nurbrgring the car with runflats on averaged 10 seconds faster than the car without runflats. Tires transfer the movements of the steering wheel to the road so with the stiffer runflat the tire turns more quickly and accurately. Oh yeah and runflats also improve braking performance. So if you actually drove hard you would want a stiffer side wall, but obviously you should know that b/c apparently you know how to change a punctured tire. The 3 has specially calibrated suspension and drive line components specifically engineered for runflats. Without them the car is not going to be "right" For those of you that read, check out the 3|2005 issue of BMW THE MAGAZINE, it clearly explaind the benefits of the newer runflats. I loved them on my previous car and will love them on Monday driving on the autobahn... no need to worry about a blow out :) Oh yeah I forgot to mention how rediculous the comment above was about girls.... that is just stupid, I know many women who can do more with a car than some men, especially men that use comments like that... sad. Not to flame SPANISHFLY but that just errrkks me, lack of respect is just not cool.
Best of luck :thumbup:

Er, this genius did actually mention something about RUNFLATS being the best thing since sliced-bread. :doh:

[mapezzul]

Bloody Hell! Some people have no sense of humour! Take a chill pill and be a bit more sexist. :gay:

Who wants a woman who knows how to change a wheel? That would mean they wouldn't have a clue in the kitchen. Leave the car stuff to us blokes it's all we're good for. :thumbup:

Have you actually driven anything other than a big fat bimmer? We in Europe grew up with light under-powered hot-hatches through the 80's and we learnt how to drive and make a slow car go quicker. We didn't just go out an buy a 200 Bhp car and think we could drive just because we could push an accelerator pedal!

When you have driven the cars we drive and used B roads and driven through hail, sleet, snow and scorching heat in all sorts of vehicles then you can rant.

I grew up with Minis, MG's, RS's, etc. I have participated in track days, and all kinds of competition in all sorts of vehicles. From hill climbs in my old Caterham to Super stocks in a Peugeot 205 gti to banger racing in old Ford Granadas.

I think I am more than a little qualified to hold an opinion on these matters.

Why don't we use Runflats on race cars if they are so wonderful?

BTW, you can keep your wonderful autobahns. We've got the best roads in Europe for driving. Why do you think 90% of manufacturers and magazines test drive their cars down here in Andalucia?

Get a life and learn to drive like a man not like a WOMAN!

Rant over.
Just came back from ED...
The quote was from BMW for the fact of the matter and second I have driven everything from a VW beetle, GTI's and Corrados in autocross and other NON BMW cars oh and my MINI. So you give it a rest. Race cars already use a stiffer sidewall than street cars, unless you are talking about drag tires which are less stiff so they can grow in size to change the ratio. Like I said the NEW runflats are just fine and add safety, the 3er is designed around them and if you take them off it is going to be a real soft spoungy marshmallow like ride. The testing BMW conducted shows that the run flat is indeed a higher performance tire. The tramlining has more to do with pressure than the runflat, hey if there is tram lining you must be in the slow lane anyway with the truck grooves, so put on the trun signal and change lanes! As for the comments against women I am not even going to go there b/c you are either too old to even have a clue or are just joking around.
My original point was that NEW testing shows increased pereformance and of course safety. Check out BMW the magazine and you will see the article. Best of luck :thumbup:

[andy_thomas]

BTW, you can keep your wonderful autobahns. We've got the best roads in Europe for driving.

Given who paid for them, I would say that the roads in Spain "belong" to everyone but the Spanish.

Why do you think 90% of manufacturers and magazines test drive their cars down here in Andalucia?

Because of the wonderful, relaxed lifestyle? :dunno:

Usually test driving is done in harsh environments, not pleasant, paid-for places with sangria and stuff...!

[Moderato]

Given who paid for them, I would say that the roads in Spain "belong" to everyone but the Spanish.



I don't get this, could you explain?

[espo89]

Why don't we use Runflats on race cars if they are so wonderful?

.

Actually NASCAR here in the US does use a version of a "runflat" tire on the larger superspeedways. In addition to the tires having a much stiffer sidewall they actually have an inner liner that acts essentially as a tire in a tire. If/when there is a blow out, the car then rides on the inner liner in give the driver at least a chance to control the car before he hits the wall at 200+ MPH.

[turpiwa]

Just came back from ED...
The quote was from BMW for the fact of the matter and second I have driven everything from a VW beetle, GTI's and Corrados in autocross and other NON BMW cars oh and my MINI. So you give it a rest. Race cars already use a stiffer sidewall than street cars, unless you are talking about drag tires which are less stiff so they can grow in size to change the ratio. Like I said the NEW runflats are just fine and add safety, the 3er is designed around them and if you take them off it is going to be a real soft spoungy marshmallow like ride. The testing BMW conducted shows that the run flat is indeed a higher performance tire. The tramlining has more to do with pressure than the runflat, hey if there is tram lining you must be in the slow lane anyway with the truck grooves, so put on the trun signal and change lanes! As for the comments against women I am not even going to go there b/c you are either too old to even have a clue or are just joking around.
My original point was that NEW testing shows increased pereformance and of course safety. Check out BMW the magazine and you will see the article. Best of luck :thumbup:
Not meaning to hijack the thread - what am I talking about - that happened ages ago ;)

Mapezzul - and anyone else who cares to comment - what is your opinion on the handling o the Mini compared to the E90 SP? I have a Cooper with SP and I reckon it is a great handler - want to manage my expectations when picking up my E90. :D
And also Mapezzul - how did you like the Standard E90 steering?

[choddo]

Isn't using the phone when driving illegal in the US then?

and this is very interesting cos this is exactly the thing I asked about in another thread pre-ordering. I expect the efffect is even worse with the 18" 162s which were plan A.

My MG ZT with 18" rims (no run-flats) is very well behaved on motorways, hardly have to touch the steering wheel, it just goes in a straight line and it's FWD too. Bit surprised that the BMW isn't more stable. But then maybe it's ok at the speeds I drive ;) What sort of speeds are we talking about here?

[choddo]

Bloody Hell! Some people have no sense of humour! Take a chill pill and be a bit more sexist. :gay:

Who wants a woman who knows how to change a wheel? That would mean they wouldn't have a clue in the kitchen. Leave the car stuff to us blokes it's all we're good for. :thumbup:

Have you actually driven anything other than a big fat bimmer? We in Europe grew up with light under-powered hot-hatches through the 80's and we learnt how to drive and make a slow car go quicker. We didn't just go out an buy a 200 Bhp car and think we could drive just because we could push an accelerator pedal!

When you have driven the cars we drive and used B roads and driven through hail, sleet, snow and scorching heat in all sorts of vehicles then you can rant.

I grew up with Minis, MG's, RS's, etc. I have participated in track days, and all kinds of competition in all sorts of vehicles. From hill climbs in my old Caterham to Super stocks in a Peugeot 205 gti to banger racing in old Ford Granadas.

I think I am more than a little qualified to hold an opinion on these matters.

Why don't we use Runflats on race cars if they are so wonderful?

BTW, you can keep your wonderful autobahns. We've got the best roads in Europe for driving. Why do you think 90% of manufacturers and magazines test drive their cars down here in Andalucia?

Get a life and learn to drive like a man not like a WOMAN!

Rant over.
:blink: And Autobahns are in Europe. Ah, yes, I see what you mean. But it's not true is it, probably most of the best driving roads in Europe are in North Wales I'd say, and I've driven in most European countries including lots of bits of Spain.

[choddo]

I don't get this, could you explain?
Most modern roads in Spain are funded by EU cash

[cntlaw]

Could all of these complaints stem from the run-flat tires?

If I recall, run flats have much stiffer sidewalls in order to hold the weight of the car with no air in the tires. If that is the case, then tires that already more prone to tramlining will behave even more so. Since the E46 didn't have runflats that might be why it feels so different.

Mauricio: On a lease, you don't have to continually put run flats on the car do you? If not that would be a no-brainer when the first set wore out. Replace the runflats with tires that better matched what you wanted.


Although I don't have a clue about what are run flat tires; incidentally, I test driven a 325i ( without sports just normal 17" wheels 225 tires ) few days back , and I experienced twice the steering shifting a bit unintensionally. It was on smooth highway , going straight too. So I asked the salesman why this had happened. He told me it is the run flat tires need to use for some kind of breakin period. Anyway, frankly, I never heard that 18" wheels or stiffer suspension would cause steering shifts; since I love E90 so much, I would take that as it is so long I could get used to that one day. And, I would order a E90 with Active Steering option; and I hope to get rid of run flat tires as I only love Bridgestone, Michellin and Pirelli tires.

[choddo]

Who else makes tyres apart from those 3? And yokohama I guess. Who makes BM's run flats? I thought I saw a Michelin set on a showroom car.

[zboss]

I've been driving my 330i SP for about 3 months now and - at first (maybe for the first 2 months) I noticed the steering wheel pulling all around. While this is my first BMW, my old roommate owned a '97 325i and some year of an XI, so I thought I had a reasonable expectation as to the ride to expect. The 3 I took delivery of did not meet that expectation.

Now - maybe I have gotten used to it - but the ride doesn't bother me at all and I don't usually notice the pull anymore. If I do - it's when I am going slow, once I get up to around 80 - the ride smooths out just fine. BTW - I HAVE noticed that this car starts to really smooth out it's ride above 80-85 MPH.

[bhattimalik]

I have the same damn problem! I have actually lowered the car too with h&r springs. My car runs very solid on straight surfaces but otherwise the steering follows the curves on the road. Its a little annoyting but I have been messing with the tire pressure and can tell it makes a huge difference when you change it. I still haven't found a pressure that solves the problem but find different pressures increase or decrease the problem. I have also put new wheels on the car which are a total of 50lbs lighter and have noticed the problem to be more presistent. Can anyone advice me on what pressure to use. I kept the runflats on the new wheels.

[Artslinger]

Bloody Hell! Some people have no sense of humour! Take a chill pill and be a bit more sexist. :gay:

Who wants a woman who knows how to change a wheel? That would mean they wouldn't have a clue in the kitchen. Leave the car stuff to us blokes it's all we're good for. :thumbup:

Have you actually driven anything other than a big fat bimmer? We in Europe grew up with light under-powered hot-hatches through the 80's and we learnt how to drive and make a slow car go quicker. We didn't just go out an buy a 200 Bhp car and think we could drive just because we could push an accelerator pedal!

When you have driven the cars we drive and used B roads and driven through hail, sleet, snow and scorching heat in all sorts of vehicles then you can rant.

I grew up with Minis, MG's, RS's, etc. I have participated in track days, and all kinds of competition in all sorts of vehicles. From hill climbs in my old Caterham to Super stocks in a Peugeot 205 gti to banger racing in old Ford Granadas.

I think I am more than a little qualified to hold an opinion on these matters.

Why don't we use Runflats on race cars if they are so wonderful?

BTW, you can keep your wonderful autobahns. We've got the best roads in Europe for driving. Why do you think 90% of manufacturers and magazines test drive their cars down here in Andalucia?

Get a life and learn to drive like a man not like a WOMAN!

Rant over.

:thumbup:

[Artslinger]

Run flats suck!!!!!

Run flats are for pussies... a compromise for yuppies that need to fit golf bags in a f'n car.

[blueguydotcom]

Although I don't have a clue about what are run flat tires; incidentally, I test driven a 325i ( without sports just normal 17" wheels 225 tires ) few days back , and I experienced twice the steering shifting a bit unintensionally. It was on smooth highway , going straight too. So I asked the salesman why this had happened. He told me it is the run flat tires need to use for some kind of breakin period. Anyway, frankly, I never heard that 18" wheels or stiffer suspension would cause steering shifts; since I love E90 so much, I would take that as it is so long I could get used to that one day. And, I would order a E90 with Active Steering option; and I hope to get rid of run flat tires as I only love Bridgestone, Michellin and Pirelli tires.

You've never heard of tramlining? :confused:

[blueguydotcom]

I have the same damn problem! I have actually lowered the car too with h&r springs. My car runs very solid on straight surfaces but otherwise the steering follows the curves on the road. Its a little annoyting but I have been messing with the tire pressure and can tell it makes a huge difference when you change it. I still haven't found a pressure that solves the problem but find different pressures increase or decrease the problem. I have also put new wheels on the car which are a total of 50lbs lighter and have noticed the problem to be more presistent. Can anyone advice me on what pressure to use. I kept the runflats on the new wheels.
:rofl: :rofl:

[choddo]

Run flats suck!!!!!

Run flats are for pussies... a compromise for yuppies that need to fit golf bags in a f'n car.
What's the point in having a car if not to get to a golf course? :confused:

And I wish I'd had runflats when I went over a brick last year and punctured the actual rim while the tyre was initially fine. It then deflated through the hole in the wheel! MG didn't have a spare either, just an emergency repair rubber spray compound you insert in the valve... cue 2 hours waiting for emergency recovery truck.

[cntlaw]

I laughed. Everybody has given an entirely different guesses :rofl: Should I start to worry when I leave my deposit of a E90 to the salesman next week? Actually, the 325i test drive I had last week; the first 20 mins, everything was normal. Then, it was the last 10 mins that there were twice that I felt the front wheels went sideways a little. The salesman said , it could be the run flat tires takes some time to break-in. I will not buy a car comes with a problem, therefore, since so many threads I read seemed to say something about this problem; I would order the AS option and on the first day when my car arrives, I will trade in the stock wheels and tires and move 18" to AC Schnitzer wheels and Pirelli P Zero Rosso 225/40 bingo ! ;)

[andy_thomas]

I don't get this, could you explain?
As Choddo mentioned, much of Spain's overhauled motorway system is EU-funded. (I was being flippant.) Spain is a significant net recipient of EU funds, as is Portugal, which also has a very good main road system, although a few years ago it appeared to be in a permanent state of evolution. In both cases I am envious of the smooth, well-drained surfaces, but certainly not the death rate thereon!

[blueguydotcom]

I laughed. Everybody has given an entirely different guesses :rofl: Should I start to worry when I leave my deposit of a E90 to the salesman next week? Actually, the 325i test drive I had last week; the first 20 mins, everything was normal. Then, it was the last 10 mins that there were twice that I felt the front wheels went sideways a little. The salesman said , it could be the run flat tires takes some time to break-in. I will not buy a car comes with a problem, therefore, since so many threads I read seemed to say something about this problem; I would order the AS option and on the first day when my car arrives, I will trade in the stock wheels and tires and move 18" to AC Schnitzer wheels and Pirelli P Zero Rosso 225/40 bingo ! ;)

Tramlining will still occur if you slap on 18s (especially 40 series). the run flats have nothing to do with tramlining. :rofl:

[Jupeman]

I laughed. Everybody has given an entirely different guesses :rofl: Should I start to worry when I leave my deposit of a E90 to the salesman next week? Actually, the 325i test drive I had last week; the first 20 mins, everything was normal. Then, it was the last 10 mins that there were twice that I felt the front wheels went sideways a little. The salesman said , it could be the run flat tires takes some time to break-in. I will not buy a car comes with a problem, therefore, since so many threads I read seemed to say something about this problem; I would order the AS option and on the first day when my car arrives, I will trade in the stock wheels and tires and move 18" to AC Schnitzer wheels and Pirelli P Zero Rosso 225/40 bingo ! ;)

This isn't going to solve the "problem". Guys, just about any car with a stiff suspension and wide tires is going to tram.

[Moderato]

This isn't going to solve the "problem". Guys, just about any car with a stiff suspension and wide tires is going to tram.

B$ a BMW is supposed to handle like an F1 car and ride like a Buick, I'm going to make a big scene in the service department untill this gets fixed under warranty. *end sarcasim*

[Jupeman]

B$ a BMW is supposed to handle like an F1 car and ride like a Buick, I'm going to make a big scene in the service department untill this gets fixed under warranty. *end sarcasim*

Ha ha, I'm sure there are a bunch of Carrera GT owners who are bitching because their $450k cars tram, too. :rofl:

[Lux.SH]

I'm a newbie with BMWs and await my first (ED in October). That said, I do have considerable experience with Porsches and I think what you're experiencing isn't unique to the 3 series sport package.

Any time you stiffen the suspension, the car is less compliant. You might be used to a softer car that simply absorbs the subtle road-rut undulations without you noticing. Once you stiffen up that sidewall (bigger wheels) and stiffen the springs, the car is going to react more to any uneven surface. Although I'm sure BMW does tune for the 17" wheels, the car is still stiffer than the standard suspension so you will get the tramming effect a bit. Also note that the sports package has wider tires which will be less likely to nicely "run in a rut".

Overall, I don't think what you're feeling is a "problem", it is just part of the trade-off for higher performance and better handling.

Couldn't have said better. this guy totally answered your question.
looks like someone wasn't used to driving wider/lower profile wheel/tire combo before.
Its aboustely natural for wider/lower profile wheel/tire combo to do that. don't worry.

[jmorris106]

I feel the pain related to tramlining.
I have a '99 323i with 18 inch Mile Milgia wheels wraped with Pirrelli P-Zeros. I've also got the Eibach Pro Kit suspension (dropped about 1.75 - 2 inches). Let's just say that the car looks sweet as hell and performs very well on smooth level pavement, but the slightest undulation and you really need to hold on with both hands.

I really wasn't to keen on letting anyone else take a test drive before, but now it is absolutely out of the question. Not so much because I'm over protective, but if you've never experienced tramlining, it can freak you out. :yikes:

I've been looking for a solution to this phenomenon for several months now, and the only constant that I have found in all of the posts has been tire pressure or totally different tires. Has anyone had a similar experience with the P-Zeros?

[TIE-Fighter]

I haven't noticed any tramlining at all and I've got 18"runflats...

[///M3lissa]

I noticed the tramlining when I first got my car..but now I am used to it.

[bmw_fan]

Tramlining is a fact of tire pressure more so than runflats, so check your tires and make sure they are correct. I had this problem with my previous car and pressure was the culprit. I personally like the run flats and do not see what everyone complains about. The ride with the E90 is NO harsher than a normal car without runflats, they designed the suspension around the runflat concept and regulated the spring rates and dampers around the tires. The benefit of the run flat is much added safety, I am not talking about being able to drive with a flat... that is great and all but rather preventing a blow out. These tires are unable to blow out and if anyone has ever experienced a blow out it is a scary thing at highway speeds and can be real difficult to come out of. Also as far as the wear of the tire with the sport suspension..... those are performance tires with a stickier less durable compound if you opt for all seasons and a less sticky compound you can get upwards of 30k mile on the tires. (I know this because I had 25k + a lot of thread on my previous car with runflats). Good Luck! :thumbup:


I agree with him, i had my e90 going allover in a rough surface. i wondered what is wrong i never agree it is run flat behaviour becoz i didnot have this problem when i drove in europe. so yesterday i checked the air pressure it was 34 psi. so i reduced the front to 29 and back to 32 . now i feel the car sits and doesnot move all over the road like before and handles well what i would expect. So the tire pressure becomes important but might be some people have other issues not faced by me. So my suggestion is to check and make sure your tire pressures are right. hope this helps.

[FenPhen]

you really need to hold on with both hands.Yes, always. (Except during a shift.)

Maybe I haven't experienced serious tramlining on my near-spec-inflated 225/255 Pilot Sport tires, but what little I have noticed is not bad at all when both hands are on the wheel at their proper positions. :dunno:

[jpsquared]

I just installed a set of Dunlop 225/45-17 DSST (run-flat) winters and the tramlining that I'm used to with the normal ZSP setup has virtually disappeared. Pressure on all 4 tires is at 32psi. Kinda interesting because these are still 8" wide tires - not too different from the summer setup.

The much reduced tramlining is welcome, but the giveup is the mushier cornering from the 17" size as compared to the normal 18"ers that I'm used to. It's probably smarter to slow down in the winter anyway.

I hate slowing down... I hate winter, too... :(

[crowbmw325]

I bought my 2006 325i w/sport package in Decemer of 05 and this is my first bimmer. I have to say the tramlining is a problem. All cars I have driven in the past have had low/stiffer suspension (some with run-flats) and have not been this bad. And I agree , when you get to about 80-85mph it goes away. To bad the speed limit for most highways is about 70. All my friends who have test drove my car notice it right away also. I will try to adjust tire pressure as some have suggested. My suggestions are as follows: when on the freeway, drive in the fast lanes. The slow lanes are all beat up from trucks. Also, when on the freeway, drive with both hand on the wheel. I know this sounds silly, but it makes a big diference and it is how we all should drive anyway. With all that said bmw is still the best car i have ever driven, and I would not even consider buying another brand:)

[shragon]

the particular tire you use will also have an effect on tramlining. i'm used to tramlining, as my e34 has eibach/koni suspension, 18" wheels, and 245 tires all around. i don't think the e90 tramlines any more than my e34. but if you go to tirerack, and look at the reviews, you'll see some tires are very bad when it comes to tramlining. one that comes to mind are the pirelli p zero nero's.

[Moderato]

I bought my 2006 325i w/sport package in Decemer of 05 and this is my first bimmer. I have to say the tramlining is a problem. All cars I have driven in the past have had low/stiffer suspension (some with run-flats) and have not been this bad. And I agree , when you get to about 80-85mph it goes away. To bad the speed limit for most highways is about 70. All my friends who have test drove my car notice it right away also. I will try to adjust tire pressure as some have suggested. My suggestions are as follows: when on the freeway, drive in the fast lanes. The slow lanes are all beat up from trucks. Also, when on the freeway, drive with both hand on the wheel. I know this sounds silly, but it makes a big diference and it is how we all should drive anyway. With all that said bmw is still the best car i have ever driven, and I would not even consider buying another brand:)
What tire pressure are you running now?