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View Full Version : What should I purchase to replace my 330Ci?


Sean
09-05-2002, 09:20 PM
Have several very serious buyers lined up for the car.

nate
09-05-2002, 09:25 PM
Why are you selling?

Sean
09-05-2002, 09:29 PM
I love the styling/design of the car, but I've never been very fond of how the E46 drives/handles, plus I'm just ready for something new. I've been in this car now just a little over 2 years, getting bored.

nate
09-05-2002, 09:33 PM
Originally posted by Sean
I love the styling/design of the car, but I've never been very fond of how the E46 drives/handles, plus I'm just ready for something new. I've been in this car now just a little over 2 years, getting bored.

Bored after 2 years :confused:

But, besides the Mini. if you don't like the 330, I doubt you would like the others....

I voted keep driving the E34....

Sean
09-05-2002, 09:41 PM
Originally posted by nate328Ci


Bored after 2 years :confused:

But, besides the Mini. if you don't like the 330, I doubt you would like the others....

I voted keep driving the E34....


Yes, I tend to get bored easily and I like change, well at least with my cars. The longest I've owned a car is 5 years, 1990 Acura Integra LS (great car!). Now I Typically only stay in one for 16-18 months.

I just dropped $1300 on the E34 when there are others things it needs repaired, this repair was totally unexpected. Nothing like the hose blowing off the expansion tank and taking off part of the neck. Needless to say, I now have a new Radiator, Thermostat and Water Pump (went ahead and did it even though it was only 3 yrs old, same goes for the thermostat) What a pisser! :mad:

TD
09-05-2002, 09:43 PM
Nate is correct this time. If you think the E46 isn't fun to drive (and I wholeheartedly agree with you on that - but you already know this), you will almost certainly not find either the Audi or Infiniti to be any better. The IS300 maybe. But then you'd have to live with the stigma and that maddening gauge layout.

I think an E30, E28 or E36 are all good choices. None of them are any larger than the E46 and all of them offer the feel the E46 is lacking.

Or maybe you can get a stripped 350Z in a few months after the initial over-MSRP fervor dies down.

Rufus330Ci
09-05-2002, 09:48 PM
Just get it over with and buy the Modena 360 :D Thats what I would do. You only live once :bigpimp:

nate
09-05-2002, 09:51 PM
Originally posted by TD
Nate is correct this time. If you think the E46 isn't fun to drive (and I wholeheartedly agree with you on that - but you already know this), you will almost certainly not find either the Audi or Infiniti to be any better. The IS300 maybe. But then you'd have to live with the stigma and that maddening gauge layout.

I think an E30, E28 or E36 are all good choices. None of them are any larger than the E46 and all of them offer the feel the E46 is lacking.

Or maybe you can get a stripped 350Z in a few months after the initial over-MSRP fervor dies down.

Well, MY E46 is fun to drive :p

But, an E28 is larger. I have put many thousands of miles on a 533i :)

TD
09-05-2002, 09:56 PM
Originally posted by nate328Ci


Well, MY E46 is fun to drive :p


"But these go to eleven..." :rolleyes:

Sean
09-05-2002, 10:03 PM
Oh, another possibility would be to hold out until 2004 for a Z4 2.5. I've been warned off about buying one the first year (common sense) from several BMW Techs. They have a feeling the new electric steering is going to be a problem. I mentioned that the MINI has it, but apparently it's different. If the Z4 is anything like the New 7-Series it will have many teething problems. I saw at least 8 New 7's in for various problems, with 2 of them not being able to be resolved. :thumbdwn:


I could consider an older P'car. One of my friends in a Porsche nut, owns 3. The bug may bite me. :yikes:

nate
09-05-2002, 11:27 PM
Originally posted by TD


"But these go to eleven..." :rolleyes: http://forums.off-topic.net/images/smilies/squintfinger.gif

geomax
09-06-2002, 04:35 AM
I would go for the MINI S. With the supercharger, the thing is damn fun! And of the new cars in your list, it's the least expensive. With the SP, it drives like it's on rails...more nimble than an E46.

We actually stopped by the MINI dealership last night. The lot was full of traded cars - mostly SUV's. But there were lots of unexpected cars as well: An Audi S4, Mustang Cobra, an M3...the Sales Rep told me he's seen some "very interesting trades", like the guy who traded his Lotus V8 Espirit for a MINI S. He also said that "a lot of kids come in and trade their Porsches for a MINI"

WTF? What person in their right mind would trade a PORSCHE for a MINI?? Why? "Well, the reason they usually give is that they like the look of the MINI"

Well, to each their own. But the car thats the most fun, and bang for the buck, is the MINI. Not that practical though - it is SMALL.

One caveat: Due to the orders they're receiving, the wait is now 8 months from deposit to delivery. :(

PhilH
09-06-2002, 05:05 AM
Being in a sort of similar position, I'll give my $.02.

For the moment, I'm keeping my E34 since it does the job of providing fun daily transport for the family and I don't feel bad driving it on the odd track day.

The only car currently available that I'm seriously considering (other than the 330Ci) is an E36 M3. The others are the yet to be released ///M2 and the next generation 3-series.

I voted keep driving the E34.

JPinTO
09-06-2002, 05:06 AM
Originally posted by Sean
I love the styling/design of the car, but I've never been very fond of how the E46 drives/handles, plus I'm just ready for something new. I've been in this car now just a little over 2 years, getting bored.

Sell it now... the boredom won't go away, only escalate.

You can attempt to "fix" the problems by modding the car... but they are only band-aids. In the end you will have a E46 that you paid too much for and that doesn't fundamentally drive any better (ask me how I know). Sell it and be done with it.

I also doubt that the A4 or G35 will offer anything different.

I haven't got the foggiest what to replace it with. I've been trying to figure out something for the last year and there isn't anything out without a stratospheric price tag or useless practicality.

E36M3 - IF you can get a good one that isn't outrageously priced or isn't yellow. Old ergonomics and the used thing are definite negatives.

E46M3 - Too much money, IMO.

350Z - Unfortunately it's highly impractical

G35 Coupe

S4 V8

Next gen 5-series 3.0 TT

Not for me... but interesting none the less: http://www.vwvortex.com/news/index_golfr32.html

Let us know what you come up with.

Keith
09-06-2002, 07:31 AM
You know Sean, I drive a '95 540 and have been considering leasing a new 330ci.
My vote was for you to keep the 525.
I think it's interesting that so many people are selling their 330's for something else, BMW or not, WHY?
Is there something I should know about this car?
In about a week, I'm particapating in "The Ultimate Drive for The Susan G. Kormen Breast Cancer Foundation, at my local dealer.
They, along with BMW, suppply 20 new BMW's of different models and people test drive these cars and $1.00 per mile ( for the test drive) will be donated to this foundation and BMW matches dollar for dollar.
After this event, I get to drive the 330ci that they have to the next dealer, (this fleet of vehicles is traveling all across the country) which is about 50 miles away, so I will be able to see for myself how the 330 handles itself on the open highway.

Anyway, good luck on your decision, Keith "The Wine Guy":)

TD
09-06-2002, 07:36 AM
Originally posted by Keith

I think it's interesting that so many people are selling their 330's for something else, BMW or not, WHY?

Anyone who has experience with older BMWs, after the initial newness wears off, realizes that the E46 is just boring to drive. The only guys who remain happy with the E46 are the guys who came from Japanese FWD cars and Nate, who's affection for the E46 I cannot explain.

CD-55
09-06-2002, 07:38 AM
If you think the E46 isn't fun to drive (and I wholeheartedly agree with you on that - but you already know this),:flipoff: you will almost certainly not find either the IS300, Audi, or Infiniti to be any better.

I think an E30 is a good choice :thumbup: . It is a lot smaller than the E46 it offers the feel the :flipoff: E46:flipoff: is lacking.


oh... did TD just sort of say that?:angel:

JPinTO
09-06-2002, 08:01 AM
Originally posted by TD

... and Nate, who's affection for the E46 I cannot explain.

:lmao:

·clyde·
09-06-2002, 08:07 AM
Originally posted by TD


Anyone who has experience with older BMWs, after the initial newness wears off, realizes that the E46 is just boring to drive. The only guys who remain happy with the E46 are the guys who came from Japanese FWD cars and Nate, who's affection for the E46 I cannot explain.

Explain this...

The newness of my E46 Monster Truck has worn off. I have plenty of experience with rear wheel drive and front wheel drive cars made on three continents. I used to own and drive an E30 BMW. I don't think that the E46 AWD wagon is boring or unfun to drive. There's lots of cars out there that are more fun, but there's even more that are less fun.

Dr. Phil
09-06-2002, 08:08 AM
Originally posted by Clyde@work


Explain this...

The newness of my E46 Monster Truck has worn off. I have plenty of experience with rear wheel drive and front wheel drive cars made on three continents. I used to own and drive an E30 BMW. I don't think that the E46 AWD wagon is boring or unfun to drive. There's lots of cars out there that are more fun, but there's even more that are less fun.
What he said:thumbup:

nate
09-06-2002, 08:11 AM
Originally posted by TD


Anyone who has experience with older BMWs, after the initial newness wears off, realizes that the E46 is just boring to drive. The only guys who remain happy with the E46 are the guys who came from Japanese FWD cars and Nate, who's affection for the E46 I cannot explain.

LOL!!

I guess that I just don't know what's good for me :dunno:

Actually, since you mention it, I don't think that I have EVER driven an Accord, Camry, Civic, or any of the boring Japanese FWD cars EVER :p

AF
09-06-2002, 08:27 AM
Originally posted by Keith

I think it's interesting that so many people are selling their 330's for something else, BMW or not, WHY?


The E46 is a lot of fun to drive . . . I love mine after having a 330Ci for over 2 years and consider it THE best car I have ever owned.

If I were going to buy a new car today, another 330 would be in the top running.

There are a few people here that have traded in their 330's but that is because what they value in a car is not the same as 95% of us.

It's about time that we realize that these guys like a different type of car then most of us and there is no reason to bash them. Like I've said before, it's not a bad thing or a good thing, it's just different.

While the older E36 M3 might be a great car for some, the majority of us love the E46 more. It's pretty obvious considering the E36 M3 costs about the same, if not less then a 323/325 so if that's what WE wanted, we could have gotten it.

TD
09-06-2002, 08:29 AM
Originally posted by Alan F


The E46 is a lot of fun to drive . . . I love mine after having a 330Ci for over 2 years and consider it THE best car I have ever owned.

If I were going to buy a new car today, another 330 would be in the top running.

There are a few people here that have traded in their 330's but that is because what they value in a car is not the same as 95% of us.

It's about time that we realize that these guys like a different type of car then most of us and there is no reason to bash them. Like I've said before, it's not a bad thing or a good thing, it's just different.

While the older E36 M3 might be a great car for some, the majority of us love the E46 more. It's pretty obvious considering the E36 M3 costs about the same, if not less then a 323/325 so if that's what WE wanted, we could have gotten it.


In the interest of full disclosure...

Alan F drives a slushie-equipped 330Ci and has raved about the driving feel of his minivan.

So Alan F is correct. We do all have different priorities when it comes to our cars.

johnlew
09-06-2002, 08:33 AM
Originally posted by nate328Ci


LOL!!

I guess that I just don't know what's good for me :dunno:



Funny, in one thread he's comdemning Rip's perceived (rightly or wrongly) intolerance of *alternative* lifestyle and yet condemns and is intolerant of E46 fans.

AF
09-06-2002, 08:34 AM
Originally posted by TD



In the interest of full disclosure...

Alan F drives a slushie-equipped 330Ci and has raved about the driving feel of his minivan.

So Alan F is correct. We do all have different priorities when it comes to our cars.

Yeah . . . that's true so I must not be a true car enthusiast like you :flipoff:

I guess owning 2 RX-7's (one being a twin turbo), 2 Corvette's, 2 MR2's (one being a turbo) and having had as a family extra car 2 Miata's, a Boxster, a Z3 and an Acura NSX doesn't qualify me as a driver.

Also, I'm sure my extra car, the turbo 5 speed eclipse convertible is a real dog as well . . . yeah, all of these car's aren't for the REAL enthusiasts :rolleyes:

johnlew
09-06-2002, 08:38 AM
Originally posted by Alan F


Yeah . . . that's true so I must not be a true car enthusiast like you :flipoff:

I guess owning 2 RX-7's (one being a twin turbo), 2 Corvette's, 2 MR2's (one being a turbo) and having had as a family extra car 2 Miata's, a Boxster, a Z3 and an Acura NSX doesn't qualify me as a driver.

Also, I'm sure my extra car, the turbo 5 speed eclipse convertible is a real dog as well . . . yeah, all of these car's aren't for the REAL enthusiasts :rolleyes:

Guess you qualify for "been there, done that."


But you haven't had an E36 M3, so none of it counts.

AF
09-06-2002, 08:39 AM
Should I have addeed, with the exception of the Corvette's they were all 5 speed manual's !!

johnlew
09-06-2002, 08:40 AM
Originally posted by Alan F
Should I have addeed, with the exception of the Corvette's they were all 5 speed manual's !!

Sorry, still doesn't count.

nate
09-06-2002, 08:40 AM
Originally posted by johnlew


Funny, in one thread he's comdemning Rip's perceived (rightly or wrongly) intolerance of *alternative* lifestyle and yet condemns and is intolerant of E46 fans.

Without TD's advice, I don't know how I could fuction in life

He should be dictator....

AF
09-06-2002, 08:42 AM
Originally posted by johnlew


Guess you qualify for "been there, done that."


But you haven't had an E36 M3, so none of it counts.

Well my best friend/Business Partner had a 97 M3 for 4 years and I drove it a lot plus I borrowed it once for a weekend . .. does that count ?

Josh (PA)
09-06-2002, 08:43 AM
I have to toss my vote in with the other who said if you didn't like the e46 because it was boring, take a step back and get an e36, or an e30. The only thing on your list that will come close to the fun factor of even the e46 is the Mini Cooper S, but with that you have the size issue, and the stigma of the Mini cliche that marketing has built up (similar to the new beetle). Convetibles always add to the fun factor of any car, so an E36 ic or even a Miata would be good times. Not to mention you can get a 97-98 boxster CHEAP now.

Josh (PA)
09-06-2002, 08:46 AM
Originally posted by Josh (PA)
I have to toss my vote in with the other who said if you didn't like the e46 because it was boring, take a step back and get an e36, or an e30. The only thing on your list that will come close to the fun factor of even the e46 is the Mini Cooper S, but with that you have the size issue, and the stigma of the Mini cliche that marketing has built up (similar to the new beetle). Convetibles always add to the fun factor of any car, so an E36 ic or even a Miata would be good times. Not to mention you can get a 97-98 boxster CHEAP now.

Oh yeah, and sorry for staying on topic and not bashing the piss out of the rest of you :rolleyes:

AF
09-06-2002, 08:46 AM
oops, forgot to mention I once owned the almighty great enthusiast car . . . the E36 but it was a 325is not an M3, (even had a crappy 325 Conv for a month or two but that was a POS)

Does that count ? ?

JPinTO
09-06-2002, 08:51 AM
Originally posted by Alan F
oops, forgot to mention I once owned the almighty great enthusiast car . . . the E36 but it was a 325is not an M3, (even had a crappy 325 Conv for a month or two but that was a POS)

Does that count ? ?

No soup for you!

AF
09-06-2002, 08:56 AM
Sean, I'd vote for the G35 because no car is fun if you can't take the kids along for the ride . . .

I would have voted for the Audi if it were the 3.0 but i think the 1.8 would feel too slow since your coming out of a 330

To me, the mini looks like fun but is to small !!


To all my other buds: I'd love to stick around and battle this one out but I gotta go to the Hamptons for the weekend !!!

Maybe I'll spot Alec Baldwin like I did last year !!!

Have a great weekend guys (and that includes you too Tom)

johnlew
09-06-2002, 08:57 AM
Originally posted by Alan F


Well my best friend/Business Partner had a 97 M3 for 4 years and I drove it a lot plus I borrowed it once for a weekend . .. does that count ?

No! Dammit. Nothing you say counts! ;)

johnlew
09-06-2002, 08:58 AM
Originally posted by nate328Ci


Without TD's advice, I don't know how I could fuction in life

He should be dictator....

One of the joys of youth is believing you have all the answers.



























One of the joys of age is the wisdom to know you don't.

nate
09-06-2002, 09:01 AM
Originally posted by johnlew


No! Dammit. Nothing you say counts! ;)

Exactly!

TD is the only one here who knows anything about cars and driving fun. He should tell us all what to think :angel:

JPinTO
09-06-2002, 09:03 AM
Originally posted by Alan F

I would have voted for the Audi if it were the 3.0 but i think the 1.8 would feel too slow since your coming out of a 330


The cool thing about the 1.8T is that it easily and cheaply gets to the 3.0's power level with a chip. Also, it has the potential to get much more powerful than the 3.0 with reasonable expenditure.

TD
09-06-2002, 09:09 AM
Originally posted by nate328Ci


Exactly!

TD is the only one here who knows anything about cars and driving fun. He should tell us all what to think :angel:

Nate,

We pick on each other. I thought that was understood.

nate
09-06-2002, 09:10 AM
Originally posted by TD


Nate,

We pick on each other. I thought that was understood.

Yes, I am just returning the favor :dunno:

TD330ci
09-06-2002, 09:34 AM
I have a modded 94 Mr2 turbo and a 330ci and love BOTH of them. But I guess that also does not make me an enthusiast. :rolleyes:

Anyway I have gotten used to TD's E46 bashing, it's kind of fun watching him go off at EVERY chance he gets to do so.

My 330 is everything I wanted it to be and yes I have driven many a E36 M3. I chose the 330 over the M after driving both. I will never track this car as I have the MR2 to do that with. I find the E46 much nicer to deal with on a day to day basis and with some of the mods I have done a very sporting car as well. I don't think I could safely explore it's upper limits on public streets.

Btw, speaking of mods, is the shark injector for the 330 out yet??

johnlew
09-06-2002, 10:08 AM
Originally posted by nate328Ci


Yes, I am just returning the favor :dunno:

Ever notice when TD is backed into a corner, it becomes an *understanding* or a *joke* or suddenly something benign, and again, you're to look the fool for not knowing?

Sean
09-06-2002, 10:41 AM
Originally posted by Alan F
Sean, I'd vote for the G35 because no car is fun if you can't take the kids along for the ride . . .


Still have the E34 525i as my people/kid hauler.


Did nobody see this post?

Another possibility would be to hold out until 2004 for a Z4 2.5. I've been warned off about buying one the first year (common sense) from several BMW Techs. They have a feeling the new electric steering is going to be a problem. I mentioned that the MINI has it, but apparently it's different. If the Z4 is anything like the New 7-Series it will have many teething problems. I saw at least 8 New 7's in for various problems, with 2 of them not being able to be resolved.


I could consider an older P'car. One of my friends in a Porsche nut, owns 3. The bug may bite me.

TD330ci
09-06-2002, 11:04 AM
Originally posted by Sean

Still have the E34 525i as my people/kid hauler.

Did nobody see this post?


Then I would definitely get the 350Z. Finally went to the dealer the other day to see one and WOW, nice car. The dash is a little cheap, and of course they did not have one to drive, but from looks alone, this car is HOT. My MR2 might not be with me much longer!! :D

TD330ci
09-06-2002, 11:12 AM
She's a beauty!!!!:thumbup:

Josh (PA)
09-06-2002, 11:40 AM
Originally posted by Sean



Still have the E34 525i as my people/kid hauler.


Did nobody see this post?

Another possibility would be to hold out until 2004 for a Z4 2.5. I've been warned off about buying one the first year (common sense) from several BMW Techs. They have a feeling the new electric steering is going to be a problem. I mentioned that the MINI has it, but apparently it's different. If the Z4 is anything like the New 7-Series it will have many teething problems. I saw at least 8 New 7's in for various problems, with 2 of them not being able to be resolved.


I could consider an older P'car. One of my friends in a Porsche nut, owns 3. The bug may bite me.

Go for a boxster....

Sean
09-06-2002, 12:33 PM
Originally posted by Josh (PA)


Go for a boxster....

I've driven the Boxster in the past and I wasn't very impressed. I also sat in a new 2003 yesterday (just for the hell of it) and it still doesn't do much for me. I think the car looks dated now, even with the changes for 2003 and I've never been fond of the cheap materials used in the interior. :thumbdwn:

Josh (PA)
09-06-2002, 12:36 PM
Originally posted by Sean


I've driven the Boxster in the past and I wasn't very impressed. I also sat in a new 2003 yesterday (just for the hell of it) and it still doesn't do much for me. I think the car looks dated now, even with the changes for 2003 and I've never been fond of the cheap materials used in the interior. :thumbdwn:

What are your priorities then sean, and what are you looking to spend?

Sean
09-06-2002, 03:01 PM
Originally posted by Josh (PA)


What are your priorities then sean, and what are you looking to spend?


Something fun, but with reasonable maintenance. $23,000-$27,000.

ed325i
09-06-2002, 03:40 PM
Hold on to your money. The new Audi S4 and Volvo's high power version of the S60 will be out next spring. Besides, the economy sucks now.

Ed

Sean
09-06-2002, 04:13 PM
Originally posted by Ed328Ci
Besides, the economy sucks now.

Ed


True that! :thumbdwn:

LarryN
09-06-2002, 04:46 PM
Originally posted by TD


Anyone who has experience with older BMWs, after the initial newness wears off, realizes that the E46 is just boring to drive. The only guys who remain happy with the E46 are the guys who came from Japanese FWD cars and Nate, who's affection for the E46 I cannot explain.

Well, just as I frequently keep finding, you are wrong again TD. I came from no Japanese cars, and my last 4 bimmers were all 3 series, going back to an e30, and an e36 after that.

Best as I can tell, you sometimes post here to help, and other times, just to piss off and insult. This post is most obviously one of the latter. My "affection" for E46's is now 2 cars deep, and I'd buy another. I found my e36 quite numb, and am much more pleased with either of my e46's that I've owned.

You are entitled to your opinion, just as I am, but please don't make my opinions for me. Thanks you very much.

<edit> added text to remain on topic...

Sean. I voted for you e34. It's still a nice car, and I think (as others have said) you'd most likely grow bored with that quickly as well... Save for what your dream car is... :thumbup:

PhilH
09-06-2002, 06:24 PM
TD really seems to have some kind of grudge against the E46. He goes out of his way to make it seem like it's much more boring to drive than it could ever be.

Funny how in the most recent Car & Driver comparo it's the only car to get a perfect 10 in the "fun to drive" category. If nothing else, according to more than one source, it's the most fun to drive car currently in it's class.

TD
09-06-2002, 06:32 PM
Originally posted by PhilH
TD really seems to have some kind of grudge against the E46. He goes out of his way to make it seem like it's much more boring to drive than it could ever be.

Funny how in the most recent Car & Driver comparo it's the only car to get a perfect 10 in the "fun to drive" category. If nothing else, according to more than one source, it's the most fun to drive car currently in it's class.

That statement may in fact be true.

Hercules
09-06-2002, 06:35 PM
Originally posted by Sean



Something fun, but with reasonable maintenance. $23,000-$27,000.
The Mazda RX-8, like I'm doing :)

50:50 weight distribution, 4 seats, decent trunk space, 250 horses and 0-60 under 6 seconds, and a nice interior comparative to Japanese cars.

All for ~30k loaded.

Dr. Phil
09-06-2002, 06:50 PM
Originally posted by johnlew


Ever notice when TD is backed into a corner, it becomes an *understanding* or a *joke* or suddenly something benign, and again, you're to look the fool for not knowing?
Hammer meet nail............direct hit:yikes:

Josh (PA)
09-06-2002, 07:30 PM
Ultimate in fun to drive, Ultimate in low maintenance costs:

http://www.mazdausa.com/images/miata/2002_miata_main_left.jpg

ashecnc
09-06-2002, 08:28 PM
just get the 350 Z and say the hell with it...maybe no problems with them?!? :D

JPinTO
09-06-2002, 08:48 PM
Originally posted by Ed328Ci
Hold on to your money. The new Audi S4 and Volvo's high power version of the S60 will be out next spring. Besides, the economy sucks now.

Ed

Huh? :dunno: Economy is booming here.

Michael330
09-07-2002, 02:46 AM
TD, I don't know if I am allowed to say that but I actually really like you and your straightforward views. You remind me of my wife's father ( he lives in Olney, MD by the way...) but I really don't know what your problem with E46 is. The car handles better than anything he lists as an alternative for it. At least for sedan buyers, we are looking for a LUXURY SPORTS SEDAN. This is the category we are in. And BMW delivers very well with the 330i. This is absolutely the best luxury sedan in this category. Yes, E36 M3 handles better but I personally could not live with its harshness on an everyday street. 330i is just perfect for a daily application. But that is not the point. That is not the category. E36 looks simply dated, the interior looks like crap compared to E46. Please stop this E46 bashing every time you get a chance. There just isn't much point to it.

blackdawg
09-07-2002, 08:03 AM
i voted for the mini S because you're guaranteed to be able to turn it around and keep a decent residual on it, out of the choices, it's most likely to depreciate the least whil also being the absolute most fun to drive.

i've driven a mini S and it was so much fun.....if it weren't for the waiting list, i would be in one. just for kicks.

the E46 platform is like the 996 chassis. it's so good that most of us are constantly underestimating it, i think. when i climb into the e46 from one of our other 2 vehicles, it's a revelation because it's so fluid and easy to drive.....and then after awhile i get bored because it's not sporty.

so, yeah, the criticisms are true. for someone like me, i find the car flatout boring. the clutch is too light, the throws are a tad long and there is too much insulation from the suspension. but i KNOW i'm in the minority here.

1995 993s are really cheap now.............i'm so happy i'm worse than a pig in slop with my "old" used car.

ObD
09-07-2002, 08:53 AM
Originally posted by Michael330
Please stop this E46 bashing every time you get a chance. There just isn't much point to it.

:rolleyes:

Why some people find the E46 boring:

http://www.schedler.org/images/head-up-ass.jpg

blackdawg
09-07-2002, 09:04 AM
that's a great picture, obD.

ha ha ha ha.

although, if that's directed at me, i'd rather be driving whta i'm driving and have my head up my ass than drive something boring.

TD
09-07-2002, 09:37 AM
Originally posted by ObD


:rolleyes:

Why some people find the E46 boring:

(Image removed)

Well, ObD, I do not see how what you're doing is any different. And, IMO, it's worse.

But we're both expressing opinions. At least mine are based on personal experiences with the vehicles in question. Yours is not.

Quit taking my opinions personally. I have no intention of giving up my opinions (or ceasing to express them), so...

blackdawg
09-07-2002, 09:52 AM
i've read your posts. i don't find them to be personal attacks, you're just opinionated, and who isn't here?

i think the picture ObD posted is funny, his reply a tad personal, but that's the way he is. he doesn't take criticism well, remember his post about driving in boston traffic when nick325xiT brought it up?

both sides are just as true: i.e. E46 is great and/or E46 is too luxe. and both are mainly down to subjectivity now. it doesn't mean that people who drive E46s, such as my wife, and who love them, should take our opinions (very similar) personally. they bought the car, and if they like it.

but, there's a fair consensus that when car comparisons are done, it's versus other cars, not other 3 series cars. i don't doubt the e46 is a revelation when compared to other cars in its class, but the real question is: what about when driven back to back with an e30 and an e36? that would be more informative and a major magazine did this comparison in a quantitative manner.

AB
09-07-2002, 09:55 AM
Originally posted by johnlew


Guess you qualify for "been there, done that."


But you haven't had an E36 M3, so none of it counts.


:lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

AB
09-07-2002, 09:57 AM
Originally posted by johnlew


One of the joys of youth is believing you have all the answers.


One of the joys of age is the wisdom to know you don't.

John, I have taken the time to check out some of YOUR posts and it is very refreshing that you as well has this guy PEGGED!

:thumbup:

AB
09-07-2002, 10:01 AM
Originally posted by johnlew


Ever notice when TD is backed into a corner, it becomes an *understanding* or a *joke* or suddenly something benign, and again, you're to look the fool for not knowing?


Another post in which I am in full agreement with. However, I would respectfully like to add that in addition to this, when backed into a corner, he just plain stops responding to people calling bull**** on his views, and instead will conveniently "skip" over those posts, regardless of who the poster is.

It is HIS way or the highway, baby! :rolleyes:

TD
09-07-2002, 10:03 AM
Originally posted by Ryan330Ci


John, I have taken the time to check out some of YOUR posts and it is very refreshing that you as well has this guy PEGGED!

:thumbup:

Ryan,

Step back and read your own posts and see what a hypocrite you are. You repeatedly do what you accuse me of, merely doing so from a different viewpoint.

However, my comments are never personal (until I'm attacked first). Yours ALWAYS are.

Look in the mirror. In your obsession with slamming me, you are engaging in all the behaviors you accuse me of.

Nick325xiT 5spd
09-07-2002, 10:04 AM
I think that what a lot of people seem to forget is that BMW produces the Ultimate Compromise Machine. BMWs are damned fast, but rarely if ever the fastest... BMWs are damned comfortable, but rarely if ever the most comfortable. BMWs are an excellent overall package if you're looking for a livable, fun car. However, the E46 is much more luxurious than previous Bimmers. Luxury comes with increased isolation from the road and less of a sense of what you're doing. One of the things I loved about my E46 was that I felt like I was moving, even at the speed limit. One of my friends described it as a rocket sled. (NOT positive in his opinion, but he's most adamantly not a car enthusiast and is terrified of my driving. But I digress.) The E46 just doesn't give you the same sense of involvement. You go faster and faster and faster and the car feels perfectly sorted, perfectly planted as it glides across the pavement. Whether or not this is a positive comment depends on your own preferences.
The other problem with the current E46s is that the throttle just plain sucks. Every time I get into an older Bimmer, I'm just stunned by how fast the engine reacts to blip of the throttle.
Am I happy with my E46? Reasonably. It sure beats any other current alternatives that I can think of. COuld it be improved one hell of a lot? Hell yes.
As a sidenote, I compared my CDV-less clutch with an E36 and found that they were approximately as good. (Although the E36 clutch had 82K on it. :p) The last RWD E46 I drove did not have a clutch as good as mine.

AB
09-07-2002, 10:17 AM
Originally posted by TD


Ryan,

Step back and read your own posts and see what a hypocrite you are. You repeatedly do what you accuse me of, merely doing so from a different viewpoint.

However, my comments are never personal (until I'm attacked first). Yours ALWAYS are.

Look in the mirror. In your obsession with slamming me, you are engaging in all the behaviors you accuse me of.

TD,

Actually you could not be more wrong, and I think deep down you know this. Your struggle to be sooooo different merely for the sake of being different is very contrived. And the fact that more people are finally starting to call bull**** on your stances besides me only strengthens this argument.

I could reiterate JohnLew's point about in your youth you think you know everything, but that would just be ad nauseum. Think about this.

Mr. The Edge
09-07-2002, 11:01 AM
Originally posted by TD


Well, ObD, I do not see how what you're doing is any different. And, IMO, it's worse.

But we're both expressing opinions. At least mine are based on personal experiences with the vehicles in question. Yours is not.

Quit taking my opinions personally. I have no intention of giving up my opinions (or ceasing to express them), so...

didn't you know? we were just picking on you.

I thought that was understood.

:angel:

:flipoff:

hts
09-07-2002, 12:08 PM
Well, I had skipped this thread since its inception, but I'm really bored this afternoon (both boys are napping and I finally decided on which big screen to buy this morning), so I'm going back over some of the previous posts I've skipped over the week to add my worthless two cents.

Ref. the car, I agree with Hercules--if you can wait, I think the new RX-8 might be a winner. TD the dictator (thanks Nate--that was a good one!) has brain-washed me into believing that I don't enjoy the numb feeling of my E46. I test-drove a couple of E36 M3's (including Tom's right after he got it), and quite frankly, I don't get it. I don't care for the exterior lines, I don't care for the dated interior/dash, it doesn't feel any quicker than my 330i, I didn't find its handling/suspension appreciably sharper than mine, etc.

In any event, I'm looking fwd to the new Mazda offering.

Good luck with your decision.

BTW, can we please have a moratorium on the TD bashing around here? Since when did everyone else hop on the TD-bashing bandwagon? Everyone knows that Ryan (who can't decide if he hates me or TD more) and I have a monopoly!

:bigpimp:

blackdawg
09-07-2002, 12:21 PM
the personal stuff is silly.

TD has his opinion, i have mine and they often dovetail.

it would be truly mint if the RX-8 outdoes the Z car.

heh heh heh.

ObD
09-07-2002, 01:19 PM
Lest some people forget:

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/images/vBulletin_logo.jpg


In reality what the E46 bashers are:


http://www.mentorseries.com/imagedb/1764.jpg

blackdawg
09-07-2002, 01:48 PM
we're have the future of the.....

TD
09-07-2002, 02:24 PM
If we all completely agreed around here, no one would bother dropping by because it would be utterly and completely boring.

We all have different views, some more at odds than others. While many/most of us here have figured out how to have fun disagreeing, there are a few who think that the dissenters ought to shut up and/or go away. What fun would that be?

And we give even those few something to do. I mean, hell, has Ryan EVER posted except to harrass me? Case closed.

Mr. The Edge
09-07-2002, 02:36 PM
Originally posted by TD


And we give even those few something to do. I mean, hell, has Ryan EVER posted except to harrass me? Case closed.

if I recall he posted to harass hts in the doula to-do.

:eek:

hts
09-07-2002, 02:43 PM
Originally posted by atyclb


if I recall he posted to harass hts in the doula to-do.

:eek:


Bing-bing, we have a winner!

You're quite right, Bono-lover, Ryan did in fact post something meaningful when he joined forces with the evil TD to lambast me for having a nanny.

My grandfather always said that "elephants never forget" (I had forgotten).

Nick325xiT 5spd
09-07-2002, 02:45 PM
As I recall, Ryan got angry at me in the traffic thread. I don't recall him doing anything except trolling. :dunno:

·clyde·
09-07-2002, 03:08 PM
Originally posted by TD
If we all completely agreed around here, no one would bother dropping by because it would be utterly and completely boring.
The same way that none of us would drive E46s if given a choice? :confused:

BTW still waiting for an explanation (http://bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=132227#post132227) :D

We all have different views, some more at odds than others. While many/most of us here have figured out how to have fun disagreeing, there are a few who think that the dissenters ought to shut up and/or go away. What fun would that be?

This place is for fun. Why anyone who isn't having fun sticks around here is beyond the abilities of my pea-sized brain.

AB
09-07-2002, 03:49 PM
Originally posted by Nick325xiT 5spd
As I recall, Ryan got angry at me in the traffic thread. I don't recall him doing anything except trolling. :dunno:

Thanks, Nick. TD the Dictator has selective memory. However, TD is right in one respect. I *do* spend more time focusing on his inane posts as he is the loudest, most arrogant, youthfully brash mouth here, and as a recent poll here by his peers indicated, he is neck and neck with HTS as being the strangest guy here.

'Nuff said.

Mathew
09-07-2002, 08:25 PM
Originally posted by Ryan330Ci


Thanks, Nick. TD the Dictator has selective memory. However, TD is right in one respect. I *do* spend more time focusing on his inane posts as he is the loudest, most arrogant, youthfully brash mouth here, and as a recent poll here by his peers indicated, he is neck and neck with HTS as being the strangest guy here.

'Nuff said.

Are you surprised that you got the responses you did at .org when you got your first got your car??? After reading your various TD posts, i must say its your type of mentality and behavior that makes adults frown upon us. Why dont you start acting mature and maybe people will start to take you more seriously.

AB
09-07-2002, 08:36 PM
Originally posted by ///Mathew


Are you surprised that you got the responses you did at .org when you got your first got your car??? After reading your various TD posts, i must say its your type of mentality and behavior that makes adults frown upon us. Why dont you start acting mature and maybe people will start to take you more seriously.

Matthew -

I never posted about the impending arrival or various questions about my car at the .org. You must have me confused with somebody else. I tried to RTFM front and back before I got it.

Thanks for your concern though.

:thumbup:

EDIT: There were several other Ryans at the .org, so your confusion is understandable.

Mathew
09-07-2002, 08:41 PM
Originally posted by Ryan330Ci


Matthew -

I never posted about the impending arrival or various questions about my car at the .org. You must have me confused with somebody else. I tried to RTFM front and back before I got it.

Thanks for your concern though.

:thumbup:

EDIT: There were several other Ryans at the .org, so your confusion is understandable.

I hope im mixing you up. But i seem to remember a certain "Ryan330Ci" who got mad at TD over there too. :dunno:

edit: the Ryan330Ci i was thinking of is 17, and when he posted that he got his car, everybody flamed him, and TD seemed to be of particular attention to him

Sean
09-08-2002, 01:49 AM
I like how my post got jacked! :flipoff:

Mathew
09-08-2002, 08:27 AM
Originally posted by Sean
I like how my post got jacked! :flipoff:

hehe, sorry about that. My vote went to the G35

TD
09-08-2002, 08:30 AM
Originally posted by Sean
I like how my post got jacked! :flipoff:

Of course, I voted to get something older.

IndyMike
09-08-2002, 08:38 AM
Originally posted by Sean
I like how my post got jacked!
No kidding! I just came back from a refreshing service at church, so I'll forgive the slanderous attitudes that seem to be prevailing in this trouble-making thread. But it's your thread, so I hope you'll be as kind.

Back on topic; I say if you can honestly be that impractical get the Mini S. I finally saw my first one yesterday and it looked smokin'. Like someone else said, when you finally do grow tired of it (and given your admitted penchant for tiring quickly, you will) then you shouldn't have any trouble turning it over with a very fair return on investment (at least as far as that can be said for non-exotic vehicles).

What are you honestly leaning towards doing?

johnlew
09-08-2002, 09:06 AM
Originally posted by IndyMike

I say if you can honestly be that impractical get the Mini S. I finally saw my first one yesterday and it looked smokin'. Like someone else said, when you finally do grow tired of it (and given your admitted penchant for tiring quickly, you will) then you shouldn't have any trouble turning it over with a very fair return on investment (at least as far as that can be said for non-exotic vehicles).



My buddy with the 740 sport, Mini S and Z8, just sold his 740 sport and plans to drive his Mini. He just loves driving it. Figures when/if he tires of it he'll have no problem selling. Really lucked out on the 740. It's an '01, bought it new for 59k, spent 1k on winter wheels/tires. I found him a buyer at 58k out the door. Car had 11k miles on it. Now, finding a buyer for the Olds, that's another story.

OLDS FOR SALE (http://home.wi.rr.com/bmw330cic/Olds.htm)

AB
09-08-2002, 09:08 AM
Originally posted by ///Mathew



edit: the Ryan330Ci i was thinking of is 17

I am old enough to be HIS father. :lmao:

AF
09-08-2002, 12:01 PM
Originally posted by Sean



Still have the E34 525i as my people/kid hauler.


Did nobody see this post?




Wow, I go away for a weekend to come back and find out this thread gets even better :)


Sean, I know your keeping the family hauler, perhaps I always look at you similiar to myself which means basically any car I get MUST have a seat in it for my kids . . . I figured you for the same . . .

nate
09-08-2002, 12:15 PM
Sean, I think it would be good to keep the E34 and take a look at the Z4 when it comes out. I doubt that there will be major problems with the car, as most of the major stuff it based on the E46. It won't be like the 7, the car is much more basic and isn't controlled entirely by computer...

Sean
09-08-2002, 02:02 PM
Sorry Guys, I just realized I typed Infiniti G35 when it should read Infiniti G35 Coupe. Opps. :bigpimp:

31st330i
09-08-2002, 02:28 PM
since you mentioned mini... how about a miata (road feel included at no extra charge) and a CARB approved (meaning smog legal) turbo kit?

www.flyingmiata.com

check out the Bell Engineering 4.2 turbo or the Flyin Miata turbos with CARB certification.

if anyone is interested, here's what I've done to my miata so far:
http://www.mindspring.com/~pmbenn/miatamods.htm

I've got turbos on the brain at the moment. just picked up this book and am reading it now (I think they talk about turbocharging a few bimmers in the book - so it's not totally off-topic ;) ):
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0837601606/qid=1031516815/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/102-4433141-9955338?v=glance&s=books

Spiderm0n
09-08-2002, 02:41 PM
Originally posted by TD


Ryan,

Step back and read your own posts and see what a hypocrite you are. You repeatedly do what you accuse me of, merely doing so from a different viewpoint.

However, my comments are never personal (until I'm attacked first). Yours ALWAYS are.

Look in the mirror. In your obsession with slamming me, you are engaging in all the behaviors you accuse me of.

TD, while we are on the subject of you (or are we always? :p ), I have to disagree. You do go personal first...

http://bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11285&perpage=25&pagenumber=1

TD
09-08-2002, 06:22 PM
Originally posted by Spiderm0n


TD, while we are on the subject of you (or are we always? :p ), I have to disagree. You do go personal first...

http://bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11285&perpage=25&pagenumber=1

I would LOVE it if I were never the subject. I hate these threads. I try to ignore them but occasionally I have to chime in to respond because I just cannot ignore the ridiculousness of what is being said.

And, dude, that example you linked, IMO, was nothing. We were all in the middle of discussing a highly charged topic and you take an argument that I happen to believe strongly and dismiss it out of hand. From my POV, dismissing the argument that completely is ignorant just like, to you, the argument itself was ignorant. On this topic, we were 180 degrees apart from each other. You dismissed me before I dismissed you. The dredmo reference came into my head as the only accurate analogy, IMO, for the nature of your dismissal.

But you cannot take an argument from a thread like that and use it as an example of "going personal". And I'm sure dredmo was not offended.

But, dammit, we are all unique personalities on these boards. Why can't we all just appreciate what each of us contribute? These threads only get jacked into becoming TD-slamming threads by a small number of recurring TD-slammers.

I don't feel threatened when other people on these boards hold views different from mine (I see only see it as an excuse to argue). Why do others feel so threatened by my views? Take them for what they are. The opinions of some guy most of you do not know in real life, that I do believe, but that I express for my own entertainment.

Who gives a **** what I think?

For me, these threads are ridiculous and embarrassing. I have no desire to be the focal point of anything. I just get enjoy the back and forth of the forum and most of it's participants. Why make it into any more than that?

ashecnc
09-08-2002, 06:37 PM
Originally posted by TD


I would LOVE it if I were never the subject. I hate these threads. I try to ignore them but occasionally I have to chime in to respond because I just cannot ignore the ridiculousness of what is being said.

And, dude, that example you linked, IMO, was nothing. We were all in the middle of discussing a highly charged topic and you take an argument that I happen to believe strongly and dismiss it out of hand. From my POV, dismissing the argument that completely is ignorant just like, to you, the argument itself was ignorant. On this topic, we were 180 degrees apart from each other. You dismissed me before I dismissed you. The dredmo reference came into my head as the only accurate analogy, IMO, for the nature of your dismissal.

But you cannot take an argument from a thread like that and use it as an example of "going personal". And I'm sure dredmo was not offended.

But, dammit, we are all unique personalities on these boards. Why can't we all just appreciate what each of us contribute? These threads only get jacked into becoming TD-slamming threads by a small number of recurring TD-slammers.

I don't feel threatened when other people on these boards hold views different from mine (I see only see it as an excuse to argue). Why do others feel so threatened by my views? Take them for what they are. The opinions of some guy most of you do not know in real life, that I do believe, but that I express for my own entertainment.

Who gives a **** what I think?

For me, these threads are ridiculous and embarrassing. I have no desire to be the focal point of anything. I just get enjoy the back and forth of the forum and most of it's participants. Why make it into any more than that?

I don't think any thread car related to BMW's or considering something else should be considered embarrassing.

AF
09-08-2002, 06:44 PM
Originally posted by CCs328Ci


I don't think any thread car related to BMW's or considering something else should be considered embarrassing.

I am pretty sure Tom was referrring to the thread being directed at him (like a lot of this thread is) as being embarrassing . . . not the original nature of the thread.

AF
09-08-2002, 06:45 PM
Originally posted by Sean
Sorry Guys, I just realized I typed Infiniti G35 when it should read Infiniti G35 Coupe. Opps. :bigpimp:

Now that I know that . . .

G35 for sure !!!!!!

http://members.roadfly.com/alan927/G35Coupe1.jpg

AB
09-08-2002, 07:00 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by TD
[B]

I would LOVE it if I were never the subject.

I have no desire to be the focal point of anything.
---------------------------



That's great! I needed a good laugh this afternoon. Your posts certainly speak otherwise.

An older post from Cosmo911 summarizes you succinctly. It was directed at HACK, but also fits rather snugly around those shoulders of yours as well:


You ever sit there and wonder why people dislike you? If your that much of a baby where you want everybody to respect you, you'll need to start respecting everybody else. Your smart-@ss comments won't help your situation. Your just asking for the so-called "HACK-bashing." There are plenty of regulars here who provide useful information to the public without being such an @ss about it, and they are the ones who are shown respect. If you want to continue posting smart-@ss comments, then your just gonna have to accept the negative attention it will bring. Quit being such a drama-queen...


:tsk:

Sean
09-08-2002, 08:42 PM
Originally posted by Alan F


Now that I know that . . .

G35 for sure !!!!!!


I can't wait to see one in person and also go for a Test Drive. :D

Bad thing re: Infiniti is their resale values sucks. :thumbdwn:

AF
09-08-2002, 08:44 PM
Originally posted by Sean



I can't wait to see one in person and also gp for a Test Drive. :D

Bad thing re: Infiniti is their resale values sucks. :thumbdwn:

that's what turns me off about Infiniti also . . . but maybe this G35 will change things.

Kind of like the original A4 changed Audi !!

Sean
09-08-2002, 08:47 PM
Originally posted by Alan F


Kind of like the original A4 changed Audi !!


That's also the one thing that turns me off on Audi. Their resale also isn't that great.

johnlew
09-08-2002, 08:48 PM
Originally posted by Sean



That's also the one thing that turns me off on Audi. Their resale also isn't that great.

Lease? Maybe Infiniti has more confidence in residual than you. :dunno:

nate
09-08-2002, 09:42 PM
May be fun for a while, but you guys are taking it too far...

Hercules
09-08-2002, 11:20 PM
Originally posted by hts
Well, I had skipped this thread since its inception, but I'm really bored this afternoon (both boys are napping and I finally decided on which big screen to buy this morning), so I'm going back over some of the previous posts I've skipped over the week to add my worthless two cents.

Ref. the car, I agree with Hercules--if you can wait, I think the new RX-8 might be a winner. TD the dictator (thanks Nate--that was a good one!) has brain-washed me into believing that I don't enjoy the numb feeling of my E46. I test-drove a couple of E36 M3's (including Tom's right after he got it), and quite frankly, I don't get it. I don't care for the exterior lines, I don't care for the dated interior/dash, it doesn't feel any quicker than my 330i, I didn't find its handling/suspension appreciably sharper than mine, etc.

In any event, I'm looking fwd to the new Mazda offering.

Good luck with your decision.

BTW, can we please have a moratorium on the TD bashing around here? Since when did everyone else hop on the TD-bashing bandwagon? Everyone knows that Ryan (who can't decide if he hates me or TD more) and I have a monopoly!

:bigpimp:
I wanted the 330Ci, but looking at the price of the car and what I gain, I really couldn't justify it... there are too many cars in that range that are performance sedans, the RX-8 just has a nice interior and Mazda has a good build quality for Japanese cars... so I made my decision on that.

I'm driving a Millenia now and I'm very impressed by its build quality. Add to that a car that can throw .91g on the skidpad (better than the 350Z's .88) PREPRODUCTION... does naught to 60 in under 6 and is built under the assumption that it will be more fun than a Miata...

I couldn't pass it up. I put my deposit on it last week, just to guarantee myself MSRP. The 330 the way I want it ran almost 10k more.. maybe my next car will be the next gen M3 :)

I love Bimmers, but I have to compromise because I'd like some cash in my pocket at the end of the day :P

Besides, school loans first eh :)