Nitrogen in tires?

[Boile]

Costco fills the tires with pure Nitrogen.
They cite several advantages over regular air. I'm not disputing the advantages but...
Isn't that a ridiculous and wasteful overkill? If the current tires don't hold up air good enough, have the manufacturers go back to the drawing board. I refuse to use Nitrogen to compensate for their design shortcuts. :mad:
The latest generation of kids (elementary school) already think that they must have a computer to play tic-tac-toe. The previous generation (their 20-something parents) don't know how to make their own kites; they have to buy the kit (with instructions on how to assemble :confused: ).
What's next? We'll have to pay for the air we breath? Isn't there anything free anymore?

Sorry Garry. Move this to the Political Science board is you think appropriate. :angel:

[Gary@Tirerack]

An excellent rant :thumbup: .

The use of 95%+ nitrogen in street tires does not have any tangable improvement over the regular 78% nitrogen in the air we breathe for free and fill our tires with IMO.

[Jalli]

The manufacturers took no shortcuts, its just that with the technologies we have right now, EVERYTHING leaks. Ever wonder why coke goes flat when its just sitting in an unopened bottle..

Not sure what kites have to do with it though...

[Boile]

The manufacturers took no shortcuts, its just that with the technologies we have right now, EVERYTHING leaks. Ever wonder why coke goes flat when its just sitting in an unopened bottle..
Coke may go flat unopened, but only after years, which is good enough.
If consumers required more than a few years, the bottling industry would not have gone with the twist-by-hand to open technology. Surely a tighter (and more expensive) seal would have been developed. In that sense, the twist-by-hand is a design shortcut. In this case, it's a win-win, since it's also good for the consumer.
In the case of tires, we use to have tubes. Manufacturers switched to tubeless (a design shortcut) for simplicity. If that doesn't hold air tight enough, they should switch back to tubes, not require me to buy Nitrogen.

Not sure what kites have to do with it though...Are you one of those 20-something that don't even know what a kite is? :p :rofl:
BTW, did you know that one can make a kite with just one (double) sheet of newspaper and some string (not even glue required)? And yes, it will fly higher than your fancy-schmancy kite with carbon-fiber sticks.
My kids were amazed the first time I showed them. :thumbup:

[tienbagua]

Have you actually research the advantages of nitrogen filled tires? I just read about it and found out that nitrogen molecules are lager than oxygen molecules which means that it is easier for oxygen molecules to seep out of your tires causing you more refills. In addition, oxygen molecules are more susceptible to heat buildup than nitrogen. With heat built up the oxygen filled tire is caused to change tire pressure while nitrogen keeps a more stable tire pressure. Thus improving your mileage; not to mention it is an inert gas. Nitrogen has been used for years in the tires of race cars, large commercial trucks, aircraft and even the space shuttle.

[Penforhire]

The N2 fill should be drier than a compressed air fill so the pressure varies less when hot. And as Tien noted, oxygen attacks rubber (I tend to wear mine out before "aging" is a problem). A bigger issue is how do they fill? A proper purge requires two valves in a tire. Otherwise you need to fill and dump the tire several times through a single valve to get to reasonably pure levels in the tire.

[Boile]

Please read my original post. I'm not argueing that N2 has no advantages over O2.
I'm saying that it's an unecessary overkill for street tire applications.
Same thing as drinking bottled water. :rolleyes:

[roninnotroamin]

The N2 fill should be drier than a compressed air fill so the pressure varies less when hot. And as Tien noted, oxygen attacks rubber (I tend to wear mine out before "aging" is a problem). A bigger issue is how do they fill? A proper purge requires two valves in a tire. Otherwise you need to fill and dump the tire several times through a single valve to get to reasonably pure levels in the tire.


As you say, you will wear out the tire before oxidative damage becomes an issue (unless you plant to park your car in a garage for three or four years). Tire pressure shouldn't be an issue either, if you are checking it regularly as you should.

Go to Wal-mart and buy a stick gauge for a couple bucks and keep it in your glove box. Gives you something to do when filling the tank.

Pure N2 is also supposed to provide marginally better gas mileage over air. Is this really an issue in an "Ultimate Driving Machine?"

My impression: Some egghead found marginal differences and published the work. Some tech writer with no imagination found the egghead's publication and hyped it. N2 is the kind of "performance" upgrade a driver of a hybrid car might consider. For a BMW? Please...

[Nick325xiT 5spd]

As you say, you will wear out the tire before oxidative damage becomes an issue (unless you plant to park your car in a garage for three or four years). Tire pressure shouldn't be an issue either, if you are checking it regularly as you should.

Go to Wal-mart and buy a stick gauge for a couple bucks and keep it in your glove box. Gives you something to do when filling the tank.

Pure N2 is also supposed to provide marginally better gas mileage over air. Is this really an issue in an "Ultimate Driving Machine?"

My impression: Some egghead found marginal differences and published the work. Some tech writer with no imagination found the egghead's publication and hyped it. N2 is the kind of "performance" upgrade a driver of a hybrid car might consider. For a BMW? Please...
Dry N2 has the virtue of consistent pressure change with heat. For racing/track/autocross purposes, dry N2's consistency is an ENORMOUS advantage that can save a great deal of testing effort. Not to mention other things.

I can't believe that anyone is complaining about a nitrogen fill. Is it necessary? Certainly not. Is it helpful? Yes. Is anything that reduces the likelihood of pinheads increasing our insurance costs by killing themselves after a tire failure for near zero cost worthwhile? I'd suggest it is.