November Car and Driver Comparo Mid size luxury Sedans

[BimmerGuyFL]

4th place Lexus GS450h

0-60 in 5.5 seconds
1/4 mile 14.1@103mph
skidpad 0.81 g's
Lane change 63.0 mph
70-0 in 176 feet
70 cruise...66 dba
overall gas 20 mpg
Steering 2, Brake 2, Handling 7, Ride 9, fun to drive 11, total points 175


3rd place Mercedes Benz E550 Sport

0-60 in 4.8 seconds
1/4 mile 13.4@106 mph
skidpad 0.84 g's
Lane change 58.8 mph
70-0 in 170 feet
70 cruise...67 dba
overall gas 17 mpg
Steering 3, Brake 3, Handling 7, Ride 8, fun to drive 17, total points 197


2nd Place BMW 550i Sport 6 speed Auto

0-60 in 5.2 seconds
1/4 mile 13.7@104 mph
skidpad 0.89 g's
Lane change 65.1 mph
70-0 in 161 feet
70 cruise...66 dba
overall gas 17 mpg
Steering 5, Brake 4, Handling 10, Ride 9, fun to drive 22, total points 209


1st Place Infiniti M45 Sport

0-60 in 5.9 seconds
1/4 mile 14.5@100 mph
skidpad 0.85 g's
Lane change 63.6 mph
70-0 in 160 feet
70 cruise...69 dba
overall gas 16 mpg
Steering 5, Brake 4, Handling 9, Ride 9, fun to drive 21, total points 210

Does anyone else want any more info from the comparison????

[StevOL]

BMW 530i

Total points 211:rofl:

[BimmerGuyFL]

As tested price the 550i was 71K while the M45 was 56K, they said a 15K difference was a big enough difference to have the M45 first place. here is some extra information.

Weight and weight distribution front/rear
BMW 550i 4048 lbs, 50.1/49.9
Infiniti M45 sport 4082 lbs, 53.6/46.4
Lexus GS450h 4183 lbs, 50.4/49.6
Mercedes E550 sport 4039 lbs, 51.8/48.2

Lexus GS450h
Highs: uptown interior, user friendly secondary controls, delivers on performance -hybrid promise.
Lows: Numb steering, endless cycling of CVT, asthmatic powertrain sounds.
Verdict: Engineering that's easy to appreciate in a car that's hard to love.

Mercedes Benz E550
Highs: Megawatt muscle, understated good looks, seven-speed automatic.
Lows: Flaccid handling responses, noisy HVAC system, seven-speed automatic manual mode.
Verdict: A superb cross-country ride, but hold the decreasing radii.

BMW 550i
Highs: Unerring dynamics, seductively smooth power, superb seats(comfort seats).
Lows: Exasperating iDrive, skimmpy small-object stowage, clutch-your-heart price.
Verdict: A flawless driving machine diminished by pricey options and an infernal device.

Infiniti M45 Sport
Highs:Playful spirit, sports-car steering, excellent chassis, lots of room, best buy of the bunch.
Lows: Chessy Alumalook plastic dashboard trim, lane-departure warning system.
Verdict: Even without the price advantage, a top-notch, no-excuses player in the luxo-sports-sedan game.

[Kzang]

Interesting information. Thank you for sharing.

[BmW745On19's]

I still don't get why people hate the I-Drive, the only thing difficult about is learning how to use it, the problem is the testers are computer-illiterates that have no patience.

[tomv]

thanks for sharing this. Why do they continue to knock IDrive. I think it's a very user friendly interface with many useful features; at least the version in the E60 that is.

[samplemaven]

I know guys at work who say a Palm Treo 650 is just too hard to use. My wife and I each have one and find after learning the system, they are easy to use and fairly intuitive. I fully expect I-drive to be the same way...just fine if you show a little patience and just learn how to use it.

[Suraj]

Negative publicity about IDrive is so overrated. In my experience, I found it to be very easy to learn. And it does a great job in keeping the car less cluttered with few buttons.

[Emission]

I'm one of those automotive journalists... and I understand why they hate i-Drive (but I don't agree with them).

I've driven just about every car out there. When you jump into a car, and hop on the highway a minute later... and THEN decide to change the climate control, mirrors, and radio... and you CAN'T do it intuitively at 70 mph... you curse the car. When you have to pull off the highway to read the owner's manual because the journalist before you was 5'2" and liked the heater at full blast, you really get pissed!

As a future E60 owner, I am looking forward to i-Drive.

[unit]

I love my e60 despite i-drive. It is a great concept, but I feel like the execution of it leaves much to be desired. I enjoy technology, I have spent the time to figure out the system, and I can make it do everything I want it to. The problem is it takes too long to make it happen. My three primary complaints in the design of the interface are:


The combinations of pushes & pulls (side to side, front to back) vs. rotating is a slow and clunky way to move around menus. I could get where I wanted to go much faster if they could remove the push/pull movement function, redesign the menus, and make everything work with twists and clicks – much like an ipod.



The speed of the processor. Damn that thing is slow. It reminds me of computers from 15 years ago where you would click a button and then wait for the command to execute. Processors are so cheap these days, I just can’t figure out how this system is so slow. Every time I hit a button (especially the programmable ones on the steering wheel) I start to wonder if the car accepted my input or if I have to do it again.



The organization of the menus is such that I can adjust the distribution of my seat heaters with fewer clicks than I can change from a FM radio station to a satellite radio station. This is an example of how the most commonly used functions are often buried deep in menus and not up closer to the main menu.


And then there are all the little things:

Flipping through the satellite radio stations with the steering wheel buttons – it must tune in on each station before you can move to the next. You can’t just hit it twice and skip to the station you are looking for.

RDS – How difficult is it exactly to get this to work properly, displaying all the text in one line? I get like 5 or 6 letters displayed at a time, which isn’t very helpful.

Only two programmable buttons? It looks like they may have resolved this with the new X5 however.


On the flip side, I think that i-drive is the best concept I’ve ever seen for navigating through Bluetooth phone numbers and the navigation system. With some refinement, this thing could be a 100% winner, but it just isn’t there yet.

[krash]

I still don't get why people hate the I-Drive, the only thing difficult about is learning how to use it, the problem is the testers are computer-illiterates that have no patience.


I know. It kills me. Especially when all other high end car manufacturers are emulating it with similar systems.

[eaglesfan]

ask each of the testers which car they would like own..if anyone picks the M45 over the 550 they should have their head examined...also 10 years from now the 550 and mercedes will still look classic and the m45 will look like....well the way pearl white paint looks on a lexus.- dated.

[M-technik-3]

Mid sized? 71k they are high. Get real that is more than a house price in certain regions.

Nice toy but BMW give us some semblance of an affordable sedans. I'll stick with my used BMW's and let someone else asorb the depreciation.

[TL2E90]

How come a b-ugly car like infinity m45 which is years behind 550 in handling dept. can be rated as best in its class? IMO Consumer Reports has a thing or two for japanese cars!

[Tigeraaron]

thanks for sharing this. Why do they continue to knock IDrive. I think it's a very user friendly interface with many useful features; at least the version in the E60 that is.


Owning BMW cars and motorcycles I can tell you this isnt isolated to I-Drive. BMW has a very unique system for their blinkers on motorcycles and you have to hear about that in every review! Really gets old. As many people have stated, once you learn it you have trouble going back to the "old ways".

[sbb]

Comparos should include cars priced similarly. Hence, this comparo should have been done with a 530i.
I drive totally sucks, I have owned several BMWs, and I buy them IN SPITE of idrive.
BMW needs to learn ergonomics from the japanese... look at their atrocious cup holders. Too bad. But I like the drive enough to ignore the major interior issues.

[quackbury]

Thank God they continue to trash iDrive! With all due apologies to Emission, there are a lot of ignorant consumers out there who think automotive "journalists" actually know what they are writing about. If all those folks realized that iDrive actually works (and works well), (A) demand for E60's would be higher, (B) waiting lists would be common, and (C) our days of buying the cars for $1,000 over invoice would be over!

Let the journalists bash iDrives to their hearts' content, so the indiscriminate masses will buy Infiniti's. I like being in on a secret that eludes the mainstream!

[BayAreaBMWFan]

The 550 is better than the M45 in every metric except for price!

And I think BMW should start suing these reviewers when it comes to iDrive. Are people who review cars, idiots?

[Emission]

The 550 is better than the M45 in every metric except for price!

And I think BMW should start suing these reviewers when it comes to iDrive. Are people who review cars, idiots?

Quakbury - no offense taken. :thumbup:

They could be idiots. :dunno:

Realize most press "introductions" happen over a day or two. The journalist gets to actually drive the car maybe 5 hours - between cities if lucky. If the journalist gets to check the car out ("loaner") then they get the car for a week - still not long enough to understand i-Drive (on the slight chance they do RTFM).

I don't know i-Drive at all. So, when I jumped into an E60 M5 at the track last November (press introduction) I just glanced over and shrugged my shoulders. Every other car I was able to mess with the NAV or A/C with just a glance. Same thing an hour later when I drove the 650i.

I'm not knocking it... just pointing out it is confusing for someone (journalist or layman) who doesn't have a chance to read up on it, or take the time to understand it.

[quackbury]

Quakbury - no offense taken. :thumbup:



Oops! Forgot when I posted that you had an Infiniti - didn't mean to give you the dreaded "double flame" (once for your profession, second for your ride), especially since you already fessed up about the Infiniti's impact on penis size on tthe 525/550 thread!:supdude:

[Emission]

Oops! Forgot when I posted that you had an Infiniti - didn't mean to give you the dreaded "double flame" (once for your profession, second for your ride), especially since you already fessed up about the Infiniti's impact on penis size on tthe 525/550 thread!:supdude:

I don't like my Infiniti (just waiting for the lease to end in five months...). Did I mention I really don't like it?

I am a freelance journalist. I also own an import company (hey, you have to make money somehow, right?).

I hope my tool grows when I get my E60 in the spring. :thumbup:

[SergeyM]

Comparos should include cars priced similarly. Hence, this comparo should have been done with a 530i.
I drive totally sucks, I have owned several BMWs, and I buy them IN SPITE of idrive.
BMW needs to learn ergonomics from the japanese... look at their atrocious cup holders. Too bad. But I like the drive enough to ignore the major interior issues.

I don't think that cars prices should be a part of equation at all. Magazines should just review cars; performance, luxury, and so on, and maybe mention prices. Everyone will decide for himself if the price is justified. Also with all those leases, residuals, MFs and so on it is very difficult to compare the actual car costs until the moment you signing the paperwork.

It is also weird than Infiniti got the highest marks for "gotta have it" factor. I cannot imagine someone say "since I was a little boy I dreamed of owning an Infiniti" or "I actually wanted to buy M45 but decided that 550 is a more prudent decision". Just does not sound right.

[Kayani_1]

Does that Benz E550 have a hidden turbo........:rofl: :eek:

I mean that thing is fast and makes every other car look slow in comparison. I know there is more to a car then just straight line acceleration. But that is awesome times none the less.:thumbup:


Also, gotta give Lexus credit for keeping the GS light weight and keeping weight dist % on par with BMW 550i.:thumbup:


A good close win by Infiniti M45. But I think BMW 550i lost mainly because of price. Maybe the 535i I might turn the tide back in favor of 5 series. As I predict it will offer straight line performance pretty similar to M45 and price wise would be right there with it to.

I agree with those that said it is truly getting old with the constant media bashing of I-drive:rolleyes: . I know I dont find it hard to use at all:dunno: .

[Emission]

Does that Benz E550 have a hidden turbo........:rofl: :eek:

I mean that thing is fast and makes every other car look slow in comparison. I know there is more to a car then just straight line acceleration. But that is awesome times none the less.:thumbup:


It's all about the torque and proper gearing. They did it properly, apparently.

[SergeyM]

It's all about the torque and proper gearing. They did it properly, apparently.


And the car has torque. You can't get 4.8 sec to 60mph with 360 lb/ft. Wake up BMW!

[Lorch92]

I have subscribed to Car and Driver for many years, and generally appreciate their reviews. However, I found their ranking the 550i one point behind the Infiniti absurd -- while there is a price differential, people look to car magazines for information about the vehicles and their performance characteristics, not to tell them what they can afford. And giving that category 20 points, and then rating the Infiniti 6 points higher, moved the latter from 5 points behind to a win -- ridiculous. As for the continuing attack on I-Drive, I must say that I am really baffled. I've had my car back here in the States (I did ED in August) for just over a week, and already feel very comfortable with the system. I find the interface to be quite intuitive, and appreciate the way that it alleviates the button clutter that afflicts so many cars -- including the Infiniti. (BTW, in response to the post about switching bands on the radio, that is one of the presets on my steering wheel, and it works fine). Anyone who can post messages on this board can use I-Drive. I suppose there's something to the argument that misguided arguments like those in C&D make the car more exclusive, but I hate to see a wonderful vehicle being criticized without merit.

There, I've vented. The car, BTW, has been wonderful. Other than having to replace a tire that I split driving over some idiot's discarded liquor tumbler, it has everything I hoped for -- great acceleration, wonderful handling, more room and comfort than my E46 330xi, and, particularly with ED, at a price that wasn't cheap, but was certainly reasonable for the value. I know the phrase is old, but "you get what you pay for" and, in this case, what I got was a fantastic vehicle. Cheers,

[emPoWaH]

And the 550i was loaded up with equipment that none of the other cars offered -- head-up display, night-vision, heated rear seats, and so on. A 550i with the "essentials" (sport and nav) is $63K.

[SteVTEC]

What a bunch of cry babies. :wahwah:

Because the BMW did not get #1, Car and Driver is therefore biased, people need to get their heads checked, automotive journalists are stupid (not necessarily disagreeing), their standards for points are absurd (just because they don't match your own), and my favorite, BMW needs to start suing reviewers. Are you people for real? Get over it, it's just a friggin magazine review.

I would be buying an M35 except for the fact that it's fugly and makes me want to vomit everytime I see one, heavy as crap, and also gets miserable gas mileage even with the V-6. What I like is that it'll be a ton more reliable than a BMW ever will be, I could purchase it to own and put 150k miles on it without much worry, and the V-6 is pretty darn powerful and gives a lot of performance per dollar, despite the poor fuel mileage. So I agree with the car getting #1. It's definitely a fine ride, but I still won't buy one. Along with the above, the last time I got a C&D #1 rated car (a Honda Accord) I ended up being extremely displeased with it and felt it was a very overrated car. Nice yeah, but nothing to get excited about.

I'll still go for the E60 5er for much better looks and road presence, nicer design and interior, better handling and driving dynamics, superior fuel mileage, the sexiness of an Inline-6, and because the raw power of the Infiniti doesn't excite me anyways. It's far more fun to push a slower car harder than it is to just dink around in an over powered car. Yes I consider the M45 overpowered, along with the 550, E550, and all these other V8 bruisers? I live in the DC area - where can I possibly enjoy that kind of power without worrying about hitting somebody or getting a ticket on heavily patrolled mostly 45 mph roads? Absolutely nowhere.

If I still lived in the midwest I might have a different perspective, though. :D

[kukrudu]

I don't know why a lot of these so called journalists bad-mouth the iDrive. They had the patience to learn and use mr. softy's MS Word to write their articles about iDrive. They should spend just 10 minutes to learn the stuff before they drive the car. I love it, my kids think it's the coolest thing in the car, they hate the wife's RX for all the buttons.

[dirty Sanchez]

Thank God they continue to trash iDrive! With all due apologies to Emission, there are a lot of ignorant consumers out there who think automotive "journalists" actually know what they are writing about. If all those folks realized that iDrive actually works (and works well), (A) demand for E60's would be higher, (B) waiting lists would be common, and (C) our days of buying the cars for $1,000 over invoice would be over!

Let the journalists bash iDrives to their hearts' content, so the indiscriminate masses will buy Infiniti's. I like being in on a secret that eludes the mainstream!

I couldn't agree more! People are sheep, and clueless writers are their shepherds.

[Kayani_1]

Since when did disagreeing rightly with the out come of a comparison test has become a valid reason for calling others cry babies. :rolleyes:

Those comments can fly both ways. As many of us can say that such statement coming from a guy whose main auto is listed as a Nissan are no big surprise. So one can also label you in childish fashion saying you are a cry baby for not being able to stomach others opinions.

So please refrain from total :bs: comments like that & calling others unprovoked names. You can make your point without insulting. Dont take what I said in negative fashion Iam just giving u some advice. The rest is upto you;)

As for C/D being bias against BMW. That is not the case. However, them being utterly bias towards I-drive is quiet evident in their non stop bashing of this setup. The most funny comment with regards to I-drive setup was "A nav screen that irritatingly displayed duplicate maps (one big, one small)." :rofl:

I mean that comment shows their lack of understanding towards I-drive. They took something so positive and turned it into something so negative due to their lack of common sense and understanding of the system. The two screens are present so that you can perform multiple tasks at the same time while moving one of them to a smaller screen if needed. For example, when leaving on long trip after I put my address for a new destination I often move the nav map to the smaller screen on the side. While I continue to use other features of I-drive on the bigger screen. One can do any number of configurations of moving nav map to big screen and the entire trip computer info to the small screen or vise & versa. As well as using many other functions on big screen while never closing the navigational map or trip computer etc..etc and moving them to smaller screen.

The fact of the matter is most of these guys jump from vehicle to vehicle and it truly annoys them when things are not just how they found it in the other 3 cars. To learn something new and master it requires a bit of effort & time. Which they dont have the luxury of as it is evident in that mistake of making misleading comment about I-drive/dual screen. As another fellow member pointed this out earlier.

I give C/D kudos that for the first time in the same comparison. They actualy mentioned some of the inherit flaws of touch screen setups. Below is their statement about Lexus touch screen setup.

"Touch screen systems have the downside of messy fingerprint accumalation, which can be irritating for the neatniks and also effect legibility in direct sunlight"
:thumbup:

However, they forgot to mention that you cant even use the lexus Nav on the go. One has to park the thing and then use it. Who in their right mind does that now a days. To me that is far more annoying then a useful feature like split/dual screen feature. The other thing is that even tho there are inherit annoying flaws that plague Lexus touch screen setup. The following complains never made it into the highlight lows and the points for them were never deducted from ergonomics. As reflected by a near perfect score of 9 for Lexus. Where as all the positive attributes of I-drive setup were over looked as reflected in ergonomics score of 6. This is despite them realizing and saying that touch screen setups are messy and due to that less legibile then I-drive like setups.

I think the touch screen nav setups are equaly complex and have there own inherit flaws as discussed above and can be very distracting. As they take your eyes away from the windshield and lower towards mid-dash. While I-drive screen is mounted up on top of the dash and inline with windshield. Iam not saying I-drive is flaw less. It also has its own inherit flaws. But to bash one setup and over look the other makes no sense. Except for the fact they are stubborn to learn or accept anything new and different that might require a tiny bit effort.


As far as the test goes BMW was laden with too many features that are not found on Infiniti M45. That is a fact not some made up thing. Why a $1500 slush box was selected when a better perfromance oriented and far more involving and fun 6-speed traditional manual is free of cost on 550i. After all we are comparing performance luxury sedans are we not. As someone else pointed out there was no need for Infrared Night Vision, Heads up display, rear seat heaters etc...etc...etc to inflate price. Because one can easily skew the price of any car by ticking every single option.

One thing is clear M45 is cheaper and great bang for the buck. But which is a more pure luxury sports sedan then without a doubt 550i. It would eat, chew and spit the M45 aside on any track, straight away or twisties. The real difference in M45 vs 550i with regards to price in my mind is base of $51K vs $59K. Indeed M45 is cheaper and for a good reason. Because it is no match for 550i with regards to performance.:p

What a bunch of cry babies. :wahwah:

Because the BMW did not get #1, Car and Driver is therefore biased, people need to get their heads checked, automotive journalists are stupid (not necessarily disagreeing), their standards for points are absurd (just because they don't match your own), and my favorite, BMW needs to start suing reviewers. Are you people for real? Get over it, it's just a friggin magazine review.

[SteVTEC]

Since when did disagreeing rightly with the out come of a comparison test has become a valid reason for calling others cry babies. :rolleyes:Disagreeing "rightly"? Who made you the supreme judge of "rightful"? No you just have different standards, and are failing to respect the "rightful" opinions and perspectives of others who do not like the prices of BMWs, and who also do not like iDrive PERIOD. A lot of peope have legitimate complainsts about iDrive and simply do not like the system whether you agree with them or not. You are being intolerant of the views of others.

Those comments can fly both ways. As many of us can say that such statement coming from a guy whose main auto is listed as a Nissan are no big surprise. So one can also label you in childish fashion saying you are a cry baby for not being able to stomach others opinions.LMFAO.

You have no clue what I'm even talking about, your attempted use of moral equivalence is laughable, and you're also engaging in brand snobbery now. Very cute, and oh-so-typical. I don't even like the Infiniti, am not a member of any infiniti forums, and said exactly why. But you don't like my opinion, therefore you look for childish ways to try to attack me. Do I care? No. About par for the course on forums like these when somebody goes against the flow. I can handle opposing opinions just fine. I've been a moderator and an admin on other forums for years now and deal with pissing matches all the time, and also have the displeasure of trying to resolve them. What annoys me is how people on forums like these cannot handle the "rightful" opinions of others and then make ridiculous comments like this.


"I couldn't agree more! People are sheep, and clueless writers are their shepherds."


Funny how you didn't reply to that one... So it's okay to call people as a whole stupid (sheep) and the writers their clueless guides, but if somebody dares to flip the tables around suddenly there's a problem. :) All because a BMW got #2 instead of #1 for a few small things. You've got to be kidding me. How old are all of you again? That's why I'm standing by my "rightful" opinion that there are a lot of cry babies in this thread. Just calling it like I see it. If you're insulted by that then that's fine by me. I'm "insulted" by the supreme arrogance and haughtiness of some people in this forum, as if everything BMW ever made is perfect and blessed by God, and anybody that feels differently is stupid and ignorant for not being able to realize the supreme brilliance of BMW's designs.

Get over yourselves. Some of you are worse than the Honduh fanboys, and believe me that isn't saying much.


So please refrain from total :bs: comments like that & calling others unprovoked names. You can make your point without insulting. Dont take what I said in negative fashion Iam just giving u some advice. The rest is upto you;)Who are you to judge? Because I happen to agree with the ranking and think a lot of people are crying over spilled milk, my comments are therefore BS? Who is not able to handle opposing opinions again? I wouldn't give a hoot either way. Rampant fanboyism leads to inferior products. The idrive system love it or hate it could clearly be a lot better, and there's not as much motivation to improve it without the automotive press keeping the pressure on by continuing to criticize it. Very simple concept, but I guess people just like shooting themselves in the foot.

I'm not buying an E60 because it's perfect in every way and deserves to get #1 in every single comparison test ever in every magazine. I'm buying it because I like it better than competing products all things included, regardless of what some dumb comparison test ranking says. So my point is, who the hell cares, buy what you like, and just enjoy the ride. I've never really been able to understand how and why people get their panties in such a bunch over just what some magazine says. But it's the same way on pretty much every forum I've ever been on.

This is very very simple.

If you like idrive you put it in your PRO column.
If you dislike idrive you put it in your CON column.

Then, when making a buying decision, you take that into consideration in the big picture and maybe it'll matter a lot and maybe it won't matter much at all. To each their own. If you have it in your PRO column and you think anybody that doesn't like it is an ignorant sheep, you need to get your head out of your ass and realize that some people just have different prefrences or process things differently and simply don't like it. My wife is a brilliant woman but she HATES idrive. Unfortunately you'll never know why because people like you are too busy running your mouths off about how people are stupid if they don't like it when "intelligence" has absolutely NOTHING to do with it. Oh well.


People who speak so strongly of "facts" or "rightfulness" when they're really just talking about their personal preferences or opinion really have no clue, and make my head spin. Feel free to ridicule me or make whatever comments you want. I pretty much expect that on almost every forum I go to because people in groups like these don't like hearing anything that goes against the grain, and I'm a whistle blower type of person. I get flamed a lot. I even get flamed on the forums I'm an admin on because I piss people off that bad. People like calling "the masses" or the reviewers stupid even when they have a point, and I just call the people calling the masses and reviewers stupid stupid.

You're right - things go both ways. :)

Peace out.

[AzNMpower32]

I just hate how they factor in price. It's not the BMW engineers' fault that their tester rang up in the mid 60s, rather its just they happened to have a 550i given to them that was loaded.

I don't care what anyone says. In that class, the 5 series rules, followed by the Audi A6.

[doug_999]

Random thoughts here...
The Infiniti is 95% of the 550 in terms of driving dynamics and yet is 82% in terms of cost - that's hard to ignore.

However...
The BMW had HUD, Night Vision, Heated Rear Seats, and Folding Rear Seats - stuff the other cars just didn't have. Add in Comfort Access (something the BMW did not have but should have) and you have an as tested price of $68,615. Personally I think that would have been enough to have tied the M45 in the test.

Last but not least - I LOVE C&D - but what in the world is this Gotta Have It factor?

:)

[e60lover]

:) The Infiniti looks nice and it seems that C&D has a bias to them for some reason. The Audi A6 is nice...A little bland if you ask me. The MB...: puke: It looks like the previous gen E-Class which is not good IMO. The 5 definatley rules this segment. :)

[chuck92103]

C&D can compare all they want. BMW is the largest luxury car make in the world with over 1 million units sold. The consumer decides what is best. :thumbup:

There is something to be said for cars built from the ground up and that are not recycled into multiple marketing brands.

Porsche, BMW, and Mercedes have kept it together so far. Hopefully they will continue. This is why when you see a 911, 7 series, SL500 Roadster, etc. you know what it is and who made it without looking at a badge.

[Emission]

Random thoughts here...
The Infiniti is 95% of the 550 in terms of driving dynamics and yet is 82% in terms of cost - that's hard to ignore.



The '04 Infiniti G35 was 125% of the '04 330i on paper, and at 80% the cost... so I bought one.

Unfortunately, it was missing the driving dynamics BMW has perfected and I have been suffering for nearly three years. :cry:

The M35 and M45 are nothing close to a 5-Series in refinement or driving dynamics. Period - those are SUBJECTIVE measurements only an enthusiast will note.

OBJECTIVELY, the M35 and M45 are better than the 5-Series, and that is why they win magazine contests. It doesn't bother me.

[DrRT]

I still don't get why people hate the I-Drive, the only thing difficult about is learning how to use it, the problem is the testers are computer-illiterates that have no patience.

I agree. I think reviewers like to bash iDrive because it is fashionable. The way they think is they are going to get more respect as judge of driving if they bash anything that doesn't contribute to the actual driving. Either that or they just think iDrive is not cool and they will appear cool if they bash something. But in the end they just come off as idiots since any retard can learn iDrive.

[DrRT]

C&D can compare all they want. BMW is the largest luxury car make in the world with over 1 million units sold. The consumer decides what is best. :thumbup:

There is something to be said for cars built from the ground up and that are not recycled into multiple marketing brands.

Porsche, BMW, and Mercedes have kept it together so far. Hopefully they will continue. This is why when you see a 911, 7 series, SL500 Roadster, etc. you know what it is and who made it without looking at a badge.

C&D reason for picking the Infinity over the 5 series is as lame as can be: cons for the 5 seris were iDrive (lame, iDrive is great), limited utility space (the the ****?) and some other lameass **** I don't remember. The infinity, on the other hand, has crappy interior, which for me is a deal breaker.

[dirty Sanchez]

I've never really been able to understand how and why people get their panties in such a bunch over just what some magazine says.

Dude, you're the only one with their "panties" in a bunch (I've always been more of a "boxer" kinda guy, although I'd probably start cross-dressing too if I had to drive a Nissan)... Kayani_1’s point was that this thread was created to debate the merit of this C&D article, not to insult its members with name-calling.


"I couldn't agree more! People are sheep, and clueless writers are their shepherds."

Funny how you didn't reply to that one... So it's okay to call people as a whole stupid (sheep) and the writers their clueless guides, but if somebody dares to flip the tables around suddenly there's a problem. :)

My point is that most people don't think for themselves, rather waiting for writers to formulate their opinions for them...If you don't want to read comments from enthusiasts who are passionate about what they drive, perhaps you should stick to "honduh" forums ;)

[dirty Sanchez]

I just returned from ED of my 550 (see other ED thread). I had a 2006 330 before, so IDRIVE was new to me. -It took all of 10 minutes (tops) to figure out IDRIVE!! The 550 (including IDRIVE) is an absolute joy, and worth every penny!

[Kayani_1]

Well said Sanchez.:thumbup:

He tells me who am I to judge him. Yet he is doing the same to us in his entire reply. What double standards:rofl:

Listen SteVtec your reply shows who has gotten his panties in a bunch and by far it is you. ;)


You claim you are a moderator on some forum and yet your own comments on the forum you moderate start flame wars. I mean SUPER keep up the good work:tsk: :D

As for your comments that I-drive is not flaw less. Then who told you I said that. I never claimed it is flaw less and neither are those touch screen setups. I-drive could use a bit of improvement just like any other system. But to bash its useful features and then deduct so many points from ergononmics of one car vs another seems a bit bias towards I-drive.


Other then that as sanchez pointed out if you don't want to read comments from enthusiasts who are passionate about what they drive, perhaps you should stay away from such forums.:p






Dude, you're the only one with their "panties" in a bunch (I've always been more of a "boxer" kinda guy, although I'd probably start cross-dressing too if I had to drive a Nissan)... Kayani_1***8217;s point was that this thread was created to debate the merit of this C&D article, not to insult its members with name-calling.



My point is that most people don't think for themselves, rather waiting for writers to formulate their opinions for them...If you don't want to read comments from enthusiasts who are passionate about what they drive, perhaps you should stick to "honduh" forums ;)

[Austinlon]

C&D usually does a good job on it's comparos; it simply missed the boat on this one.

Trashing the 550i because of idrive is asinine. Instead of idrive, the infinity had an "odd little shelf with buttons". The 5 owner will soon learn to use his idrive and enjoy the clean, uncluttered cabin it brings. For as long as you own the infinity, you will have to look at the odd little shelf.

The "gotta have it factor" is stupid. If you prefer the infinity beause its cheaper, great! That's a perfectly legitimate reason. I might even consider one (for about 1 minute) because of the price.

If I bought the infinity, it would be because of the price. If I bought the BMW, it would be in spite of the price. Sorry C&D, I simply gotta have the BMW. Even at $15K more.

[Plaz]

I don't like my Infiniti (just waiting for the lease to end in five months...). Did I mention I really don't like it?

I didn't know that! The G? I thought you really dug it when you first got it.

Interesting. What wore you down?

[AzNMpower32]

iDrive is something that can be learned. On my first test drive with an iDrive equipped 335i coupe, I thought it was fine. Admittedly, some of the menus could load a hair faster. However, I was dealing with it almost like a pro from the moment we left the dealership on the drive. I only had to default to the "menu" button (after getting confused) twice. Adjusting settings was also a breeze. The Infiniti has a cheap interior and an ATM load of buttons on that shelf they dare call a dashboard. Plus, it is one of the worst looking cars in this class IMO. Almost anything looks better, including the 5, E-class, A6, RL, and GS.

[doug_999]

The '04 Infiniti G35 was 125% of the '04 330i on paper, and at 80% the cost... so I bought one.

Unfortunately, it was missing the driving dynamics BMW has perfected and I have been suffering for nearly three years. :cry:

The M35 and M45 are nothing close to a 5-Series in refinement or driving dynamics. Period - those are SUBJECTIVE measurements only an enthusiast will note.

OBJECTIVELY, the M35 and M45 are better than the 5-Series, and that is why they win magazine contests. It doesn't bother me.

Well back in late 2002, with the lease on my 540ia up, I found my self a sweet GS430 - for $230 LESS per month than my 540. All the comparos had this baby at just one point behind the 540. HOW COULD I GO WRONG? Let me tell you, that was a LONG 39 month lease. I remember a salesperson telling me "would you have paid $230 more per month to have had a car you liked and enjoyed?" You might notice I'm driving a 550 now and not a M45....

[Emission]

I didn't know that! The G? I thought you really dug it when you first got it.

Interesting. What wore you down?

Hey Plaz!

It is absolutely, positively... boring.

Sure, it is faster than a 330i (flame on) and handles great, but it is missing SOUL. It is 100% reliable (it has NEVER been to the dealer in three years!) but it doesn't have PERSONALITY. It is a carbon-copy, Japanese-style, of a BMW. They got all the parts together, but the soup just doesn't taste right.

The G35 is a great car, don't get me wrong, but it is just lacking something that you can't really describe. When I get in my 20-year-old 911 Turbo, I get that feeling. When I sit in a BMW, I get that feeling. When I sit in the Infiniti, I am just sitting (and the seats suck, BTW).

I fell for the horsepower and price bait hook, line, and sinker. Big mistake.

I am going to order a White/Terra 335i sedan in December. I can't wait.

[Plaz]

Hey Plaz!

It is absolutely, positively... boring.

Sure, it is faster than a 330i (flame on) and handles great, but it is missing SOUL. It is 100% reliable (it has NEVER been to the dealer in three years!) but it doesn't have PERSONALITY. It is a carbon-copy, Japanese-style, of a BMW. They got all the parts together, but the soup just doesn't taste right.

The G35 is a great car, don't get me wrong, but it is just lacking something that you can't really describe. When I get in my 20-year-old 911 Turbo, I get that feeling. When I sit in a BMW, I get that feeling. When I sit in the Infiniti, I am just sitting (and the seats suck, BTW).

I fell for the horsepower and price bait hook, line, and sinker. Big mistake.

I am going to order a White/Terra 335i sedan in December. I can't wait.


Fascinating. Well, you were under the FreshAlloy spell neck deep at the time, so it's understandable. :D

I've been seriously considering a G for my next car (probably still a year or two off), for the reasons you mentioned. Although now the HP issue is certainly more cloudy with the 335s showing such a large ballbag. :rofl:

Your very trusted opinion carries a lot of weight, though. I hope you love the 335! :thumbup:

[lib]

I still don't get why people hate the I-Drive, the only thing difficult about is learning how to use it, the problem is the testers are computer-illiterates that have no patience.

My only complaint is lack of macro building and a few quirks (like when I play AUX feeds from my ipod and go back to FM, I have to re-enable RDS every time).

Oh.. and bumping the wheel by accident is another legitimate complaint. I'd have to require 2-3 notch moves to activate if unused after N seconds.

[SP330]

First of all its completely immature to call him out on driving a Nissan.

For the record I've been driving Accords and Maxima's for 26 years before arriving to BMW for my automobile needs.

I still have a Maxima, and for the money the car really kicks ass.

Stevtec is on Maxima forums he truly delivers an unbiased opinion on every car. He's the one whos the first to dispell the "INFINITI ROOLZ" "New 335 overheats! G35 fo Lyfe!" threads that flood Maxima forums.

I'd get a 5 over an M in the heartbeat knowing damn well I'm getting what I'm paying for.

look at the recent Motortrend 07 G35 vs. 06 330i

the G undercuts the 3 by $9k with MORE FEATURES than the bimmer MORE performance than the bimmer =on the handling

the 3 won because "it felt solid and good"

of course this comparison was flamed to no end on the maxima forums

Its easier justifying price than it is "driving feel"

Why did i buy a Bang and Olufsen Besound 2 MP3 Player for $460 (the earphones seperately run $160) with no screen or included memory.....and not a $209 ipod with a full video and color screen 30GB internal memory?

Because the B and O SIMPLY SOUNDS BETTER.

Most people will think I'm crazy. Because again: its easier justifying price than it is "feel"