Z4: NAVI - Factory and Portable question...

[BimmerZ408]

Hello fellow Bimmer lovers!

I am considering maybe not doing a custom order, as I do not want to wait - nor do I want to have to pay more with the increase June 1/08.

There is a Z4 on the lot that has all the features I want, except for the NAVI. So I guess I am wondering if I should buy this one on the lot, or is it worth it to pay the extra for the custom and BWM's NAVI?

2 Questions:

1) Do you like the NAVI that comes with the Z4 (if you have this feature)? And is it worth the money?

2) If you do not have the factory NAVI and have a portable NAVI, which model do you have and what size do you have that fits the Z4?

Thx in advance for your help! :o)

[wingspan]

It will help to know if you currently have a portable nav unit or a factory nav unit in another car of yours?

[SystemR]

1) the navi is horrible, no i don't have it.
2) partial to the garmin nuvi line

[Ron Stygar]

1) the navi is horrible, no i don't have it.
2) partial to the garmin nuvi line

Mine works fine. Worth every invoice penny.
Everything in the car is based on that screen.
Phone,audio, OBC, NAV etc.

[SystemR]

Mine works fine. Worth every invoice penny.
Everything in the car is based on that screen.
Phone,audio, OBC, NAV etc.

i'm glad you like it, maybe i'm just not a fan of bmw navi. there is something to be said about the integration you get w/ factory nav, but its still a poor implementation IMO compared to lets say lexus or acura

[GH41]

Garmin Nuvi 660 for me. The Blutooth is not as good as the factories probably is but you can buy them now for $3-400. GH

[BimmerZ408]

Wingspan - I do not have a NAVI in my SUV, but I would like to get one for the Z4 I am about to purchase - which is why I wanted to know others opinions about factory for the Z4 or to get a portable. :o)

SystemR - What Garmin screen size are you using for your Z4? I am considering the 7" or 5.2" - unless that would be too big. This is of course IF I decide not to custom order my Z4, and go with the one on the local lot.

Ron - when you say audio, does this include HDR, and iPOD? I've been looking for screen shots of the NAVI for the Z4, other than the 1 on the BMW site. Do you know of a site with more details on the NAVI that comes with the Z4?

Thx again! :o)

[HotDogWater]

the only to like about the bmw navi is that it looks nice integrated into the car

[ebruder]

I purposely chose against the BMW Navi as I felt it was quite crude and also I didn't want the screen popping up every time I used the radio (maybe there's a setting so that won't happen).

For nav I use Telenav over my Black Berry from AT&T for $10.month. I know Verison has a similar plan, but I have never used it.

EB

[Ron Stygar]

I purposely chose against the BMW Navi as I felt it was quite crude and also I didn't want the screen popping up every time I used the radio (maybe there's a setting so that won't happen).
EB

There is a software fix for that.

Mine is always open normally on the OBC screen, Sirius etc.. and NAV.
And recently with the front and rear cameras.

[HotDogWater]

There is a software fix for that.

Any more details? This has always driven me crazy

[Ron Stygar]

Any more details? This has always driven me crazy

The fix was in one of the newer versions. Don't remember the number.

[Burt Reynolds]

I have 2 Garmins and my factory nav. I like the integration with the stereo, dsp, blue tooth, Car computer and etc... but the navigation is pretty basic. Frankly, I think the Nuvi 660 whips the factory GPS in almost every regard- except (dead reckoning) which is important. If you live in a city like me (Chicago) where there are tall buildings, the Garmin will struggle to aquire/keep satellite lock. The factory GPS with dead reckoning keeps working while it loses the satellite signal.

Hope that helps.

[pvr]

Love the OEM nav. Retrofitted it in my previous Z, it is much quicker in route planning then the TomTom I have, the voice volume goes up with the speed of the car, my Intravee iPod interface is on it, extra board computer functions are on it, telephone, BMW Assist.

Also, it does not get nicked from the car like the portable ones

[dug01]

Mine works fine. Worth every invoice penny.
Everything in the car is based on that screen.
Phone,audio, OBC, NAV etc.

My neighbor's $149 NUVI 200 blows my X3's nav away--get a portable with BT for about $400-- BTW....BMW wants $200 for upgrades. First $1800 for the factory nav then a year later $200 to upgrade???--and the BMW BT is a hit and miss system.. I am looking for portables for my Z4 now..actually I find nothing in the X3 "worth the money":dunno:----now my Z4--well thats another story. :thumbup:

[Ron Stygar]

I have 2 Garmins and my factory nav. I like the integration with the stereo, dsp, blue tooth, Car computer and etc... but the navigation is pretty basic. Frankly, I think the Nuvi 660 whips the factory GPS in almost every regard- except (dead reckoning) which is important. If you live in a city like me (Chicago) where there are tall buildings, the Garmin will struggle to aquire/keep satellite lock. The factory GPS with dead reckoning keeps working while it loses the satellite signal.

Hope that helps.

Good point.

[BimmerZ408]

Burt - I live in Denver, and I am in the city a lot - so I guess I should consider the factory NAVI. Thank you to all who have taken the time to post your experience/opinion. :o)

[FZbar]

I didn't have the BMW Navigation unit in my 2002 Z3, so I bought a Garmin Nuvi 350. The navigation is very good & I've used it on 3 cars & two motorcycles.

Lastly, I just returned from a trip abroad to the south of France, where the Nuvi did a fine job in getting me from chateau to vineyard to a friend's home along many secondary roads without an error.

For me, it's simple, the Nuvi for flexibility of use.

Fred

[dug01]

Lastly, I just returned from a trip abroad to the south of France, where the Nuvi did a fine job in getting me from chateau to vineyard to a friend's home along many secondary roads without an error.
For me, it's simple, the Nuvi for flexibility of use.

Fred

Can't do that with the factory unit--:)

[dug01]

Burt - I live in Denver, and I am in the city a lot - so I guess I should consider the factory NAVI. Thank you to all who have taken the time to post your experience/opinion. :o)

Or borrow or buy a portable unit and try it in the city--if it don't work then take it back..that $1800 you won't spend on the nav could buy something you can really use. :thumbup:--The way I look at it is that for what BMW wants for just the nav upgrade ($200) you can buy a portable GPS..

[khammack]

The after market unites will give you more functionality, but because they are not built in, they create a bit of a problem. I had a portable unit and really liked it except that I had to deal with it when ever I left the car. I didn't have the option of getting a built in unit in my MZ3 because it wasn't offered, so I installed an after market radio with an integrated Garmin GPS. This not only gave me the benefits of the after market units, but those of the built in OEM too.

Just another option to consider.

[BimmerZ408]

Good idea dug01, I'll consider that. :o)

Khammack; I had thought to maybe do an aftermarket install, but feared the cost would be far worse than the $1800 BMW charges.

Thx! :o)

[Vodka G]

factory bimmer navi SUX!!!! IMO......

BUT is nice to have everything in one piece...look-wise

[Ron Stygar]

factory bimmer navi SUX!!!! IMO......

BUT is nice to have everything in one piece...look-wise

It sure is. Can't imagine not having it.

[Bammered]

It sure is. Can't imagine not having it.

+ 1 couldnt imagine not having it... the only problem i see is that i have become over reliant on the nav and dont mind map as much ....

[kav]

I like the factory nav system. The integration is a big bonus.

Ron,
I updated my Nav system and have the newest DVD as well but I my screen still always pops up and I have little control over it. Do you know where I could find more information on controlling the screen deployment?

[Reach]

Aftermarket stereo navi myself: Pioneer Avic N4. Its a whole new stereo with flipout navi screen. Got it more for the stereo than the navi, but IMO its still better than the OEM option.

I also have a Garmin Nuvi 260. Its a superior portable unit, all-in-one (no antenna flap), text-to-speech, and all of US and Canada pre-loaded. Also charges and updates via USB. I travel a lot for work and take this with me whenever a rental car is necessary.

[Ron Stygar]

Ron,
I updated my Nav system and have the newest DVD as well but I my screen still always pops up and I have little control over it. Do you know where I could find more information on controlling the screen deployment?


I assume your pushing the down button.
I'll have to look. Thought it was in a bulletin explaining the differences.
Don't remember seeing it on X5 or other forum.
Did you purchase the upgrade from BMW? Did you install it?
Do you have the part number?

[Ron Stygar]

Aftermarket stereo navi myself: Pioneer Avic N4. Its a whole new stereo with flipout navi screen. Got it more for the stereo than the navi, but IMO its still better than the OEM option.

I also have a Garmin Nuvi 260. Its a superior portable unit, all-in-one (no antenna flap), text-to-speech, and all of US and Canada pre-loaded. Also charges and updates via USB. I travel a lot for work and take this with me whenever a rental car is necessary.

I initially was going to install the Traffic Pro like I have in my 318ti. Have the template for it. Glad I didn't since I would have lost a lot of things.

[kav]

I assume your pushing the down button.
I'll have to look. Thought it was in a bulletin explaining the differences.
Don't remember seeing it on X5 or oth= er forum.
Did you purchase the upgrade from BMW? Did you install it?
Do you have the part number?

Hi Ron,
All very good questions. I downloaded the most recent update and loaded it myself. Since the dealer lost my actual DVD Maps, they replaced them with the newest ones out. The up/down button work as well as the screen off button. But the screen will still pop up whenever the stereo is turned on or even more annoying, when the song is changed.

[moonridur]

I have the BMW NAV in a 3 month old 2008 Z4 and I love it. Sure, there may be other NAVs that are better but I have not been disappointed. I am currently on a 3400 mile, two week road trip from Texas to California. I pre-programmed all of my hotel stops in the NAV and it has been perfect. I just follow the "NAV Lady's" directions for the whole trip and she has been right on. I also like the convenience of the NAV being built in and integrated with all the other functions previously mentioned. The BMW system has been very accurate and not having to deal with additional cables and gadgets suctioned cupped to the windshield is beneficial.

Despite numerous posts stating negative comments about the NAV, I have found it to be very useful and I am very satisfied with mine.

[enigma]

This is a polarizing topic.

I personally don't like it a whole lot. My old Toyota touchscreen navigation unit was far better (and cheaper) than the one on our lovely Z4s.

This being said, like many others already said, I like the integration it provides (Nav, Radio/CD/Changer, Bluetooth). One thing that I didn't see discussed is the cost of updating the map.

At $200/update and two updates/year, it's a costly thing to maintain unless you don't mind looking at outdated maps (i.e. floating in space). Instead of selling brand new disks every year (i.e. two disks at $200/ea), I wish BMW would do something like a subscription model (e.g. for $50/yr you get updates as they become available).

I understand the map info is owned by NavTeq, but I am sure BMW has enough pull to bring a better deal to its customers.

[Ron Stygar]

This is a polarizing topic.

I personally don't like it a whole lot. My old Toyota touchscreen navigation unit was far better (and cheaper) than the one on our lovely Z4s.

This being said, like many others already said, I like the integration it provides (Nav, Radio/CD/Changer, Bluetooth). One thing that I didn't see discussed is the cost of updating the map.

At $200/update and two updates/year, it's a costly thing to maintain unless you don't mind looking at outdated maps (i.e. floating in space). Instead of selling brand new disks every year (i.e. two disks at $200/ea), I wish BMW would do something like a subscription model (e.g. for $50/yr you get updates as they become available).

I understand the map info is owned by NavTeq, but I am sure BMW has enough pull to bring a better deal to its customers.

Do you have the part number from your NAV disc? I'll get you a better price.

[enigma]

Do you have the part number from your NAV disc? I'll get you a better price.

Thanks Ron.

It's the 2008.1 DVD Nav Disk High. I am not certain of the part #, but based on my google search results (and we know how reliable it can be :D), it's 65 90 0 431 723.

The worst part of the deal is that neither BMW nor NavTeq tells you exactly what changed from the previous version. The granularity of the provided information is at the city/county level (e.g. San Diego County map has been updated). That says little about the streets/areas I am interested in San Diego. FWIW, I have a 2007.1 disk that came with the car, which doesn't have streets in my neighborhood (was built out in 2005).

[GH41]

"The BMW system has been very accurate and not having to deal with additional cables and gadgets suctioned cupped to the windshield is beneficial"

My Nuvi is hardwired. It just snaps in and out of the bracket. The wire is attached to the bracket. It is also portable. It can run off of it's own battery for 4-5 hours. I have another cord I use in my other cars. GH

[FZbar]

FWIW, Navteq updates for the Nuvi 350 are about $75 for the US geography. Must be room in there for BMW to make a small profit for reselling at $200 per shot!

Fred

[erdoran]

Does the 3d menu enhancement work on the factory navi for the '08s? I tried holding down the menu key while on settings, but it just brought me back to the menu. Is it not there, or am I doing something wrong? thanks

[pvr]

Go to Set first, then hold the menu for 8 - 10 seconds, you get on the hidden menu there. Enable perspective there, then change the orientation on the main screen

[erdoran]

Do you mean the SETTINGS accessed from the main menu screen, or do you mean a sub-menu when you are already within the navi?

[Ron Stygar]

FWIW, Navteq updates for the Nuvi 350 are about $75 for the US geography. Must be room in there for BMW to make a small profit for reselling at $200 per shot!

Fred

Suggested retail is $199.
Only a 15% margin. So dealer cost is $169.15.

[FZbar]

I don't doubt your numbers, Ron, but I believe Navteq provides the geo updates for most all the Navigation units, whether they are OE or add-ons. If Navteq is charging $169 for an update to BMW, & BMWthey sure have a bigger profit margin with BMW than with add-on units like the Garmin Nuvi series.

I do know that adding geography for Europe to the Nuvi from Garmin is about $299. If you buy a Nuvi 370 or 670 series, the European geography comes built in.

While I would have preferred buying the BMW one built-in, I just couldn't justify either the cost or the limitation of it's use only on one vehicle.

Fred

[Ron Stygar]

I don't doubt your numbers, Ron, but I believe Navteq provides the geo updates for most all the Navigation units, whether they are OE or add-ons. If Navteq is charging $169 for an update to BMW, & BMWthey sure have a bigger profit margin with BMW than with add-on units like the Garmin Nuvi series.

I do know that adding geography for Europe to the Nuvi from Garmin is about $299. If you buy a Nuvi 370 or 670 series, the European geography comes built in.

While I would have preferred buying the BMW one built-in, I just couldn't justify either the cost or the limitation of it's use only on one vehicle.

Fred

The dealer pays $169.

[Ron Stygar]

I like the factory nav system. The integration is a big bonus.

Ron,
I updated my Nav system and have the newest DVD as well but I my screen still always pops up and I have little control over it. Do you know where I could find more information on controlling the screen deployment?

http://www.bmwtis.com/tsb/bulletins/bulletin_graphic_temp/B652102G.htm

[enigma]

The dealer pays $169.

I think FZbar's point is that BMW is making a good profit on these disks, not the dealers. If Garmin is able to retail the map updates for $75, their whole sale cost should be smaller.

Let's say $50 is what NavTeq charges for map updates to GPS manufacturers, for the sake of argument. This means that BMW is pocketing the biggest chunk of money in the whole supply chain. I don't have any problem BMW making money in the whole transaction, but when its profit makes the item almost 3x more expensive than similar map updates, I think BMW is doing a disservice to its community.

[Ron Stygar]

I think FZbar's point is that BMW is making a good profit on these disks, not the dealers. If Garmin is able to retail the map updates for $75, their whole sale cost should be smaller.

Let's say $50 is what NavTeq charges for map updates to GPS manufacturers, for the sake of argument. This means that BMW is pocketing the biggest chunk of money in the whole supply chain. I don't have any problem BMW making money in the whole transaction, but when its profit makes the item almost 3x more expensive than similar map updates, I think BMW is doing a disservice to its community.

NavTeq retails it for $199.

I want mine intergrated with the car and everything else so no choice.
I haven't purchased an update yet.
The new one doen't have anything updated where I go.
Lot of folks just copy it.

The car has been overpriced from the start. Why did you buy that?

[erdoran]

What's the big deal about doing updates anyway? Unless you are travelling constantly do you really need them? The navi in my '03 Accord still has the original DVD and it's never been a problem for me. Sure, sometimes I head for a restaurant or store that's no longer there, but I can live with that....

[louv]

I solve the update problem by buying new cars, and "backing up" the DVD into my other cars. But that's a very, very, very expensive upgrade process. Maybe buying new disks instad of new cars would be slightly more frugal?

[enigma]

NavTeq retails it for $199.

I want mine intergrated with the car and everything else so no choice.
I haven't purchased an update yet.
The new one doen't have anything updated where I go.
Lot of folks just copy it.

The car has been overpriced from the start. Why did you buy that?

I also like mine integrated as well. BMW is in the business of making cars and profiting from it. When a car company start price gouging its customers on map updates, that's where I have problems. Was the car over-priced? Probably. But, I knew exactly what I was paying and what I was getting in return.

With this stupid update, I haven't got a clue as to which streets they've updated.

You may be OK with the missing streets and POIs, but there are just way too many areas that the old map doesn't cover. I'll probably suck it up and buy one (and hope that the areas that I am interested in are updated).

[erdoran]

Hey Bimmerz408, what did you decide to do? Buy, order, or still making up your mind?

(end of hijack)

Back to topic at hand--thanks to Ron, I finally figured out how to enable the 3D navi display--it's GREAT, makes a big difference. I still am getting used to the user interface, but at least I have more modern graphics.

Another dumb question--in my Accord navi, I can "move" along my route on the screen--sometimes I use this capability to check out detours when my usual route has too much traffic. I haven't figured out how to do this in the BMW factory navi. Can it be done, and how? I know, I should RTFMalready!

[louv]

I had some "corrections" that I wanted to feed back into NavTeq's database. I offered to trade the locations of "your maps are wrong, here, here, and here" for the next software upgrade. They said no.

They want you to do their job for them for free, and aren't willing to even cut you a discount for helping their product get better. F' off then, and have a nice day.

[Ron Stygar]

I also like mine integrated as well. BMW is in the business of making cars and profiting from it. When a car company start price gouging its customers on map updates, that's where I have problems. Was the car over-priced? Probably. But, I knew exactly what I was paying and what I was getting in return.

With this stupid update, I haven't got a clue as to which streets they've updated.

You may be OK with the missing streets and POIs, but there are just way too many areas that the old map doesn't cover. I'll probably suck it up and buy one (and hope that the areas that I am interested in are updated).

NavTeq retail for the other cars like Porsche etc. is $199 too.

Areas:
http://www.navigation.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/WFS/Navteq-NavteqNorthAmerica-Site/en_US/-/USD/ViewProductDetail-Start?ProductUUID=v8sKCggRQfsAAAEOJFJtND2m&CatalogCategoryID=n0AKCggRR.YAAAEOhTNtNDzr&JumpTo=OfferList

[Ron Stygar]

I'll probably suck it up and buy one (and hope that the areas that I am interested in are updated).

Bell BMW discounts 15%. The way there system is set up it discounts 15% which is dealer cost $169.15.
http://www.trademotion.com/partlocator/index.cfm?siteid=26

North Haven BMW uses the same set up. It showed up when someone purchased the Z4 M Coupe model.
They discount 25%.
http://www.trademotion.com/partlocator/index.cfm?siteid=214760

[enigma]

NavTeq retail for the other cars like Porsche etc. is $199 too.

Areas:
http://www.navigation.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/WFS/Navteq-NavteqNorthAmerica-Site/en_US/-/USD/ViewProductDetail-Start?ProductUUID=v8sKCggRQfsAAAEOJFJtND2m&CatalogCategoryID=n0AKCggRR.YAAAEOhTNtNDzr&JumpTo=OfferList

Their update area information is a joke! It's at the county-level (as I stated earlier!), and all it takes is one street update to state that a county map has been updated. I need a bit more granular information, and I won't get that until I buy it.

The Porsches are even more overpriced. So, $199 for P-cars must be a bargain. :rolleyes:

[Ron Stygar]

The Porsches are even more overpriced. So, $199 for P-cars must be a bargain. :rolleyes:

VW retails for $199 too.

[BimmerZ408]

Hey Bimmerz408, what did you decide to do? Buy, order, or still making up your mind?

Hi erdoran!

Well after reading all these post/opinions, I think I'd be happiest with the factory NAVI from BMW (even if it's not all that great), just for the integration with the car itself, is probably worth the money and wait.

I am not real keen on having to wait 30-days (give or take) for a custom order, but as they say; "some things in life are worth waiting for". Now my big dilemma is do I want a black or white Z4? I'll keep you posted on what I decide, and again thx for all your help!

:o)

[gadibbleiii]

Black!

[gadibbleiii]

And I got the integrated NAV. It's not overpowering (overenabling?) and therefore leaves more space for driving. I read somewhere that BMW had a problem with even including the NAV unit in the roadster because it was not in their vision of a driving machine...?

[BimmerZ408]

Black!

gadibbleiii; I agree that black looks great on this car, but I also know that it's a hard color to keep clean and shows scratches easily, not to mention how hot it gets in the summer. If I decide to go with the black, I would get the black/black/beige (lighter inside to help cut down the heat).

I've read that grey, silver & red cars are the cleanest, as far as not showing dirt as much. But I've also considered the deep metallic green too, especially since I already have a white car. So we'll see. Thx for your input/opinion. :o)