G*** D*** F*** WIT Service Advisor!

[Cliff]

:mad: I just got a call from a service advisor harassing me for giving him a substandard review on the quality survey. At this point, he's still got an open item from a service that occurred 3 weeks ago (June 26) and he's giving me **** for rating him poorly?!? It's **** like this that make me question if I EVER want to buy another BMW. I will NEVER buy from East Bay BMW again, and I suspect I'd be better served finding a different dealership to handle service for the remainder of my warranty period (I'll find an independent mechanic once it's off warranty and the heck with the BMW dealer network) in the hopes that someone else will remember why they're still in friggin' business.

:mad: :mad: :mad:

[Kaz]

BMWNA really needs to do something about this. What the hell is the point of a rating system if those you are rating only care if they get the most (only) desirable rating? How is this any different than the dealers or BMWNA automatically giving everyone a "5"?

[Cliff]

BMWNA really needs to do something about this. What the hell is the point of a rating system if those you are rating only care if they get the most (only) desirable rating? How is this any different than the dealers or BMWNA automatically giving everyone a "5"?

Then you get a call and get harassed about it, literally. I had to tell the guy that "this conversation has ceased to be productive." because he wouldn't stop whining about how he injured himself (news to me, smacks of an excuse, and even so, he obviously failed to adequately cover his outstanding items). If I get another call like that, I'm starting with the GM at the dealership and working my way up the chain. That's absolute bull****.

[Tanning machine]

Then you get a call and get harassed about it, literally. I had to tell the guy that "this conversation has ceased to be productive." because he wouldn't stop whining about how he injured himself (news to me, smacks of an excuse, and even so, he obviously failed to adequately cover his outstanding items). If I get another call like that, I'm starting with the GM at the dealership and working my way up the chain. That's absolute bull****.

Why not start now. You don't have to name names. You can call up the GM and explain to him, in a balance way, that you had your car serviced, while overall it was okay, there were a couple of items not done, and, after you gave ratings accordingly to BMW NA, you were harassed by your service advisor.

It's really not acceptable, and you might as well find out now if East Bay is a place you want to keep taking your car.

[PropellerHead]

First, if the service rating comes over the phone, you can request that your replies not be associated with your name.

Second, if it comes in the form of a paper survey, simply magic marker over all identifying information (on both sides of the paper). If they truly want our feedback to be objective, they should keep it anonymous by some means other than us jumping through hoops.

In my case, if I pissed off my dealer, I'd have to go to a dealer up to 2 hours away for service. It's simply not WORTH it to be completely honest and have your name and car(s) put at risk.

[bmw325]

Did he even acknowledge what he did to earn the substandard rating? Did even offer to get it resolved? It amazes me that many of these people don't see any connection between the job they do and the ratings you give them. Its a total surprise to them that they could do a bad job and then get a bad rating as a result. WTF?! :tsk:

[Kaz]

In my case, if I pissed off my dealer, I'd have to go to a dealer up to 2 hours away for service. It's simply not WORTH it to be completely honest and have your name and car(s) put at risk.

I think this fear of retaliation is one of the reasons why a lot of people, I'm sure, do not reply honestly to the surveys. This doesn't only defeat the purpose of the survey, but it also tarnishes BMW(NA) in general.

It's starting to look like the Domestic carmakers are finally starting to realize the value of good actual (vs. perceived) customer relations. The Germans (not just BMW) really need to get their asses in gear.

[Cliff]

First, if the service rating comes over the phone, you can request that your replies not be associated with your name.

I didn't know that, thanks.

In my case, if I pissed off my dealer, I'd have to go to a dealer up to 2 hours away for service. It's simply not WORTH it to be completely honest and have your name and car(s) put at risk.

I'm in the San Francisco area - there are 3 additional dealerships within a reasonable driving distance. As far as anything being put at risk, I would hope that BMW operates a little more professionally than this particular service advisor.

[Kaz]

Did he even acknowledge what he did to earn the substandard rating? Did even offer to get it resolved? It amazes me that many of these people don't see any connection between the job they do and the ratings you give them. Its a total surprise to them that they could do a bad job and then get a bad rating as a result. WTF?! :tsk:

Of course it's a surprise. The SA and all the signs in the service department, as well as the note attached to your copy of the work order and invoice, all tell you that you must answer "5" to all customer service surveys. Why would their customers do anything different? :dunno: :tsk:

[Cliff]

Did he even acknowledge what he did to earn the substandard rating? Did even offer to get it resolved? It amazes me that many of these people don't see any connection between the job they do and the ratings you give them. Its a total surprise to them that they could do a bad job and then get a bad rating as a result. WTF?! :tsk:

No, he offered up excuses (torn ligament resulting in some sort of leave, his colleague didn't follow up on his open items satisfactorily, my ongoing gripe with the dealer's loaner/rental policy is not his problem, etc.). He basically tried pushing everything back onto me. In the meantime, they had the car for two days, I had to wait for one (minor) item to be repaired, and one item has yet to be repaired because no one has contacted me for three weeks (and no one likely would have if I hadn't relayed the truth to the survey).

That's not 5 star service. Not even close.

[Tanning machine]

I think this fear of retaliation is one of the reasons why a lot of people, I'm sure, do not reply honestly to the surveys. This doesn't only defeat the purpose of the survey, but it also tarnishes BMW(NA) in general.



Why not tell the SA upon picking up the car and being asked for 5s: "Well, here's what you failed to do. If you make me happy right now, I'll be sure to give you fives. Otherwise, no can do."

[Kaz]

Why not tell the SA upon picking up the car and being asked for 5s: "Well, here's what you failed to do. If you make me happy right now, I'll be sure to give you fives. Otherwise, no can do."

If that would be effective, that's a possible (I hesitate to call it this) solution, and is something I've thought about. I've only seen a service advisor twice and have yet to have an actual problem.

But my point is that the system is flawed. Anything but fixing that is a kludge at best.

[Tanning machine]

If that would be effective, that's a possible (I hesitate to call it this) solution, and is something I've thought about. I've only seen a service advisor twice and have yet to have an actual problem.

But my point is that the system is flawed. Anything but fixing that is a kludge at best.

I agree. The system does not do what it's supposed to. The main problem is the incentive structure, because the ratings might as well be yes/no (where 5=yes, <5=no). The secondary problem is that giving ratings is purely punitive, and does not appear to have a remedial effect. I was trying to fix at least the second problem. Obviously BMW has to fix the first problem.

Really what would be best is if BMW called you up and the first question was "Were you completely satisfied with your service experience" If the answer is no, they should stop the survey, find out what was wrong, and report that back to the dealer. THen call back a week later and ask again "were the problems you explained resolved to your satisfaction" Repeat, if necessary, and only once you get a yes to the initial question should they proceed on the survey.

[Patrick330i]

Why not tell the SA upon picking up the car and being asked for 5s: "Well, here's what you failed to do. If you make me happy right now, I'll be sure to give you fives. Otherwise, no can do."

I was thinking the same thing. What has happened has happened. Yes, the system is flawed. Cliff's in the position he is in. So what can he do right now about his current problems? He has to leave the system stuff for later. The only thing I can think of for right now is, "what are you going to do for me?" If the answer is satisfactory, the customer could then write a letter stating how the SA made things right without going into details about what the SA did for him!

Just a thought...good luck, Cliff!

[PhilH]

I agree the system sucks, and I'm totally put off by the long speeches that I've heard from dealership employees on giving them all 5s.

edit--->spelling

[Cliff]

I agree the system sucks, and I'm totally put off by the long speaches that I've heard from dealership employees on giving the all 5s.

If the system gives a BMW employee the sense that they've been harmed to such a degree by a customer voicing an honest appraisal of that employees performance (the context of which is that they are the customer facing member of a team of BMW employees and I am evaluating the complete experience and not simply the one employee) that they can berate and harass the customer, then the system should be discontinued as soon as possible. It is not a viable performance metric, and I don't appear to be the first customer pissed off by this practise. I'll be a candidate for a 6er (preferably of the M variety) when it comes out. I love my car, but I've no use for this kind of **** and BMW has competitors.

[Kaz]

Hello, vatkens, are you seeing this???

[Kartman]

Totally agree. You and I must have had the same service advisor. I took my car in for a few "warranty items". None of them resolved after 2 seperate trips and many run arounds from both the service manager and the not so personable BMW factory regional rep.

I was waiting for my survey to issue 1's..... never got it. Fired an email off to BMWNA from the owners circle only to get the standard copy and paste answer..... "Thank you for contacting BMWNA.... blah, blah, blah..."

This customer service issue thing really needs to be addressed.....

BMWNA.... are you reading these messages?????????

:dunno: :eek: :thumbdwn: :mad:



:mad: I just got a call from a service advisor harassing me for giving him a substandard review on the quality survey. At this point, he's still got an open item from a service that occurred 3 weeks ago (June 26) and he's giving me **** for rating him poorly?!? It's **** like this that make me question if I EVER want to buy another BMW. I will NEVER buy from East Bay BMW again, and I suspect I'd be better served finding a different dealership to handle service for the remainder of my warranty period (I'll find an independent mechanic once it's off warranty and the heck with the BMW dealer network) in the hopes that someone else will remember why they're still in friggin' business.

:mad: :mad: :mad:

[SupraRZ]

I think this fear of retaliation is one of the reasons why a lot of people, I'm sure, do not reply honestly to the surveys. This doesn't only defeat the purpose of the survey, but it also tarnishes BMW(NA) in general.

It's starting to look like the Domestic carmakers are finally starting to realize the value of good actual (vs. perceived) customer relations. The Germans (not just BMW) really need to get their asses in gear.

At least BMW does surveys... I don't remember hearing about surveys from other automakers, someone prove me wrong.

[SupraRZ]

:mad: I just got a call from a service advisor harassing me for giving him a substandard review on the quality survey. At this point, he's still got an open item from a service that occurred 3 weeks ago (June 26) and he's giving me **** for rating him poorly?!? It's **** like this that make me question if I EVER want to buy another BMW. I will NEVER buy from East Bay BMW again, and I suspect I'd be better served finding a different dealership to handle service for the remainder of my warranty period (I'll find an independent mechanic once it's off warranty and the heck with the BMW dealer network) in the hopes that someone else will remember why they're still in friggin' business.

:mad: :mad: :mad:

What did they mess up on? I wanted to give I***e BMW a "0" for having to bring car in 3 times to fix HK rattle but they never called for a survey :mad:

[Mr. E]

At least BMW does surveys... I don't remember hearing about surveys from other automakers, someone prove me wrong.I feel just the opposite. I'd actually prefer that BMW not do a survey rather than keep this B.S. mockery of an "honest evaluation". I absolutely despise the constant barbardment by my dealer to give them all 5s on the surveys. You know what? In my whole life I've never given 100% on any evaluation, because there's always some room for improvement. Dealers begging for 5s skews the results, therefore this survey system is completely useless since it's not by any stretch of the imagination an evaluation of anything meaningful.

When I get calls about rating my service, I always say "No thanks, I don't want to participate in your flawed survey system."

[woohoo]

:mad: I will NEVER buy from East Bay BMW again, and I suspect I'd be better served finding a different dealership to handle service for the remainder of my warranty period (I'll find an independent mechanic once it's off warranty and the heck with the BMW dealer network) in the hopes that someone else will remember why they're still in friggin' business.

:mad: :mad: :mad:

My mom went into East Bay for an oil change once and the service reps ignored her. A few moments later, a guy walked in behind her and someone immediately asked if he needed help. My mom had to ask one of the reps for assistance. Needless to say, she had some choice words for the Service Manager when she picked the car up.

:violent:

[MC]

:mad: I just got a call from a service advisor harassing me for giving him a substandard review on the quality survey. At this point, he's still got an open item from a service that occurred 3 weeks ago (June 26) and he's giving me **** for rating him poorly?!? It's **** like this that make me question if I EVER want to buy another BMW. I will NEVER buy from East Bay BMW again, and I suspect I'd be better served finding a different dealership to handle service for the remainder of my warranty period (I'll find an independent mechanic once it's off warranty and the heck with the BMW dealer network) in the hopes that someone else will remember why they're still in friggin' business.

:mad: :mad: :mad:

I bought my car at East Bay BMW but never used their service department. I suggest that you use Weatherford BMW at Berkley. I had some good service experience with them. Here's a few list of dealer to avoid for service: Stevens Creek BMW, Allison BMW and Claridge BMW. Now you can include East Bay BMW to the sh**t list.

[teamdfl]

About 18 months ago gave a service dept. mostly 4s and 5s except for a couple 1s (I wish zero was an option) for quality of work performed and explaining the work done. I have not received a survey since. This leaves me with two questions.

1. Why are there so few questions on the survey regarding the actual work done but so many on less meaningful issues such as the flavored coffee in the customer waiting area?

2. Have I been blacklisted from any more surveys because of a couple ones I gave previously?

Ed

[JPinTO]

After having one of those "you've got to do better on your responses" calls from the dealer--- I now respond that "I'm not interested in participating in your useless survey".

You know it's bogus, they know it's bogus.... why waste your time and get crap on future service visits.

[Cliff]

I bought my car at East Bay BMW but never used their service department. I suggest that you use Weatherford BMW at Berkley. I had some good service experience with them. Here's a few list of dealer to avoid for service: Stevens Creek BMW, Allison BMW and Claridge BMW. Now you can include East Bay BMW to the sh**t list.

So far, the quality of work performed at East Bay has been competent. My only complaints with the service department are with this specific service advisor (he's :loco: ), and the dealership's policy on rentals/loaners. They'll never see me again once the car goes off warranty though, and I'm obviously not a referral source for new business for them... I've heard mixed reports on Claridges, Concord, and Weatherford. I suppose I'll just have to try them all and find out for myself.

JP, yeah, in the future I'm pleading ignorance/apathy on surveys.

[viper501]

Mercedes does the rating thing too. Although my dealer has *never* harassed me when I've rated them below top-notch. I'd absolutely go apesh*t if they did too. There would be letters to everyone and anyone about that behavior which should be *far* more offensive than the rating. Apparently your service advisor doesn't understand the concept of taking responsibilty for his actions. :tsk: Unbelievable. But you shouldn't let him get away with it. Call him on the carpet for that garbage and write a few nasty-grams to BMW N/A and A/G about that kind of behavior. If the sub-five rating got them peeved, imagine what that kind of extortion would create ... :p

[gp330]

http://www.dealerrater.com/index.asp

Post your views of your dealer and how you were treated, good or bad.

This is a valuable resource for BMW service issues.

[dtkw]

I have never stayed long enough for them ask to say good words for them in the survey. But only the last time right before the warrantee expired, I happened to be there long enough for the jerk to ask me to do that, I just asked him if he was joking or what? and left. Now, I don't go to the dealer anymore, too much BS in them. Just luck to find someone in town works on Bimmers and a few others. That's good enough for me. So far they could fix something on the car the dealer did not. Plus the dealer is over an hour drive and it's not worth the time for their games. :thumbdwn:

[Artslinger]

I have never stayed long enough for them ask to say good words for them in the survey. But only the last time right before the warrantee expired, I happened to be there long enough for the jerk to ask me to do that, I just asked him if he was joking or what? and left. Now, I don't go to the dealer anymore, too much BS in them. Just luck to find someone in town works on Bimmers and a few others. That's good enough for me. So far they could fix something on the car the dealer did not. Plus the dealer is over an hour drive and it's not worth the time for their games. :thumbdwn:

I also plan on going to a independent shop when my warranty runs out.

Why do many dealers act like incompetent pr!cks?... You have BMW reimburse you for all warranty work, you can charge 100 plus bucks an hour for service, you have all the latest equipment and parts.

If the dealers would provide owners with honest thoughtful service at a fair price the dealer can make some good money on out of warranty repairs... but many dealers over charge and turn off customers with thier indifferent attitude, that many customers would never think of bringing the car in to a dealer for repairs once the warranty runs out.

[Matthew330Ci]

At least BMW does surveys... I don't remember hearing about surveys from other automakers, someone prove me wrong.

2 other cars I owned since new, honda and infiniti, both had surveys. I don't know about the other marks, but i'd guess it's pretty common.

[1RADBMR]

Just had a less than steller service experience with my own dealer, BMW of San Diego. Service writer was nothing but attitude regarding replacement of front spoiler mud guards (which was my fault, not a warranty issue, and I wasn't expecting otherwise) and sticky accelerator pedal (known problem in hot climates...I have a client in Barstow). Wanted to charge me a non-refundable "rack fee" of $95 just to look at the mud guard issue. (Did I mention I bought the car there!) When I questioned the practice of charging a fee, before the damage (if any) was even diagnosed and priced, he offered to just not look at it at all. Geez...every post I have ever read regarding poor service by BMW came back to me. But back on topic...I too am conflicted on how to rate when BMWNA calls. My dealer has made it very clear that anything less than a "5" is unsat for all concerned.

[Artslinger]

Just had a less than steller service experience with my own dealer, BMW of San Diego. Service writer was nothing but attitude regarding replacement of front spoiler mud guards (which was my fault, not a warranty issue, and I wasn't expecting otherwise) and sticky accelerator pedal (known problem in hot climates...I have a client in Barstow). Wanted to charge me a non-refundable "rack fee" of $95 just to look at the mud guard issue. (Did I mention I bought the car there!) When I questioned the practice of charging a fee, before the damage (if any) was even diagnosed and priced, he offered to just not look at it at all. Geez...every post I have ever read regarding poor service by BMW came back to me. But back on topic...I too am conflicted on how to rate when BMWNA calls. My dealer has made it very clear that anything less than a "5" is unsat for all concerned.


$95 just to look at the mud guard issue?... What is there to look at if your paying to fix the spoiler damage.

Whatever you do don't give them a 5 no matter what the heck they "threaten" suggest. Don't let this dealer intimidate you.

[1RADBMR]

$95 just to look at the mud guard issue?... What is there to look at if your paying to fix the spoiler damage.

Whatever you do don't give them a 5 no matter what the heck they "threaten" suggest. Don't let this dealer intimidate you.

Thanks for the advice, Art. I am inclined to agree with you, but probably won't know exactly what I'll say, until the moment arrives. Probably will depend on how I feel about the car in general and my "oneness with the universe" when the time comes.
Cheers,
Herb

[Cadd]

At least BMW does surveys... I don't remember hearing about surveys from other automakers, someone prove me wrong.
Honda does surveys after you bring in your car for service too. Trust me, Honda service is :thumbdwn:

[Black'n'White]

My service experience with East Bay BMW are summarized here:
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=155848

In a nutshell: They'll never see my car again!

Scot

[realCL23]

Thats why I take all my services to Dinan in Mountain View instead of BMW of Mountain View or Stevens Creek.

Dinan has great service and minor service can be dropped off and picked up by the end of the day almost always.