View Full Version : Driver's side tail light stuck "bright"
As I was leaving my parents' place, I get a call from my cousin telling me that my left brake light was stuck on. Well, upon further examination, it isn't the brake light. It appears the driver's side tail light, when the lights are on, has 1 bulb stuck in bright mode.
Anyone ever have this happen before?
RChoudry
11-27-2003, 05:29 PM
sounds like my Audi's rear fog light!
not sure...
As I was leaving my parents' place, I get a call from my cousin telling me that my left brake light was stuck on. Well, upon further examination, it isn't the brake light. It appears the driver's side tail light, when the lights are on, has 1 bulb stuck in bright mode.
Anyone ever have this happen before?
Could it be one bulb went bad, and it's in its backup mode?
Could it be one bulb went bad, and it's in its backup mode?
If it goes into backup mode, isn't one of the check lights supposed to come on?
If it goes into backup mode, isn't one of the check lights supposed to come on?
Hmmm... yes, I suppose so. :dunno:
Hmmm... yes, I suppose so. :dunno:
I guess the car is broken. Clearly I need an M3 now. :eek:
I guess the car is broken. Clearly I need an M3 now. :eek:
:rofl:
Well, you knew that as soon as that leaf hit your paint!
:lmao:
Dr. Phil
11-27-2003, 05:57 PM
:rofl:
Well, you knew that as soon as that leaf hit your paint!
:lmao:
It was just a matter of time :tsk: :smokin:
Dr. Phil
11-27-2003, 05:58 PM
As I was leaving my parents' place, I get a call from my cousin telling me that my left brake light was stuck on. Well, upon further examination, it isn't the brake light. It appears the driver's side tail light, when the lights are on, has 1 bulb stuck in bright mode.
Anyone ever have this happen before?
My guess is it will go into backup soon or blow out.
SergioK
11-27-2003, 08:49 PM
As I was leaving my parents' place, I get a call from my cousin telling me that my left brake light was stuck on. Well, upon further examination, it isn't the brake light. It appears the driver's side tail light, when the lights are on, has 1 bulb stuck in bright mode.
Anyone ever have this happen before?
If it's a two filament bulb, it most likely was inserted in the socket incorrectly. Thus, the standing light is actually lighting up the brake light filament. Conversely, when you hit your brakes, the standing light filament will illuminate. Simply take the bulb out, rotate 180 degrees, and re-insert.
If it's a single filament bulb, someone simply replaced the correct bulb with the wrong bulb.
Thanks sergiok ... ok, now the dumber question, how do I get to the bulb? :D
SergioK
11-27-2003, 09:31 PM
Thanks sergiok ... ok, now the dumber question, how do I get to the bulb? :D
Inside the trunk, there's a small tab that you use to release the backing plate which holds the bulbs. Simply press the tab and pull the backing plate. Should come right off.
SergioK
11-27-2003, 09:35 PM
Here ya go:
Here ya go:
Thanks! :thumbup:
I guess tomorrow or Saturday I will pop the bulb out and reseat it and see if that fixes the problem. I never checked to see if it was out of phase (standing light when braking, brake light when standing) but it sounds like the problem.
SergioK
11-27-2003, 09:47 PM
Thanks! :thumbup:
I guess tomorrow or Saturday I will pop the bulb out and reseat it and see if that fixes the problem. I never checked to see if it was out of phase (standing light when braking, brake light when standing) but it sounds like the problem.
No prob!
doeboy
11-27-2003, 11:01 PM
That was just your car getting all excited because you actually drove it... :p :D
Drive it more often and it won't do that anymore... ;) :p
Ok, real newbie question: How do I get the bulb out of the socket?!
Ok, real newbie question: How do I get the bulb out of the socket?!
:eek: Should you really be touching your car?
Push down, turn CCW (<90deg) then it will pop out. It's a bayonet (BNC-like) connector.
Oops :D
http://staff.pop3now.com/alee/rearlight.jpg
What the hell did you do with the outboard bulb???
The bulbs are keyed so they should only go in one way. The bulb style # is stamped into the base (you can see it on the right pic)
SergioK
11-28-2003, 09:46 AM
Ok, real newbie question: How do I get the bulb out of the socket?!
Someone forced the two filament bulb in the socket thus making it light up incorrectly and now you have the standard problem that it won't easily come out. Just as when the bulb was inserted... use brute force.
What the hell did you do with the outboard bulb???
The outboard one came apart. :D I need a new one. :eek:
The inboard one was the one that went bright. Is this the failover mode?
SergioK
11-28-2003, 09:56 AM
The outboard one came apart. :D I need a new one. :eek:
The inboard one was the one that went bright. Is this the failover mode?
No, the bulb was inserted incorrectly.
No, the bulb was inserted incorrectly.
Ok, I've gotten both bulbs out (finally). :banghead:
The outboard one is basically destroyed. I think it was about to go... it came apart when I tried to remove it, and then I made it worse by trying to force it out.
The inboard one is the dual filament one, and that one popped in and out without a problem. It will only go on one way... it does not appear to have been forced in.
___lk___
11-28-2003, 10:32 AM
u can buy the replacements at pepboys, or probably any auto parts store.. :rolleyes:
here's what u need for brake and tail (and head) lights.. i dont have a pack of the amber turn signals, but they're available anywhere too. i keep a bag of all of them in my spare tire well, so the minute the warning lite goes on, i can pull off somewhere and swap out the burnt bulb in < a minute. :thumbup:
doeboy
11-28-2003, 12:49 PM
Is this kind of thing covered under the full maintenance? If so just take it in Al so you don't break any more bulbs... :p :neener: :angel: :D
Is this kind of thing covered under the full maintenance? If so just take it in Al so you don't break any more bulbs... :p :neener: :angel: :D
hehe, didn't want to wait 3 weeks for an appointment. :D
vexed
11-28-2003, 12:59 PM
hehe, didn't want to wait 3 weeks for an appointment. :D
Did you call the local blood bank to make sure they have sufficient supplies on hand for you:p
I carry a few spare units of blood with me wherever I go. :D
SARAFIL
11-28-2003, 01:02 PM
Oops :D
http://staff.pop3now.com/alee/rearlight.jpg
I knew it was your fault, but I didn't think THAT was how you broke it. ;) Has anyone worked on the car recently and changed the bulb? I'm wondering how the light got all bent out of shape like that. You didn't do it, did you?
Those bulbs are quick and easy to replace. I used to have a bag of them in my desk when I worked in our service department, and when people came in to our drive through drop off area with a burnt out bulb, I used to replace them in under a minute. It's an extremely easy twist in-twist out procedure. I can't understand how that light could get so bent out of shape. :eeps:
If it's a two filament bulb, it most likely was inserted in the socket incorrectly. Thus, the standing light is actually lighting up the brake light filament. Conversely, when you hit your brakes, the standing light filament will illuminate. Simply take the bulb out, rotate 180 degrees, and re-insert.
If it's a single filament bulb, someone simply replaced the correct bulb with the wrong bulb.
Although the tail light (the inner one, not the outer one which is the brake light) is a dual filament bulb, there is no electronic or mechanical provision for lighting the other filament in it. Can anyone explain this bizarre design?
SergioK
11-28-2003, 05:28 PM
Although the tail light (the inner one, not the outer one which is the brake light) is a dual filament bulb, there is no electronic or mechanical provision for lighting the other filament in it. Can anyone explain this bizarre design?
There should be two contacts inside the socket; the outer shell is ground of course.
For everyone's amusement :D
http://staff.pop3now.com/alee/bmw/fdbulb.jpg
elbert
11-28-2003, 05:46 PM
Is that red stuff dried blood? :D
Is that red stuff dried blood? :D
haha, no. I drew no blood. :D That red stuff was whatever crud keeps the glass bulb on the base.
xspeedy
11-28-2003, 09:07 PM
Although the tail light (the inner one, not the outer one which is the brake light) is a dual filament bulb, there is no electronic or mechanical provision for lighting the other filament in it. Can anyone explain this bizarre design?
It is for the rear facing fogs, isn't it? Of course we don't get fogs here, so there won't be anything to actually switch them on.
doeboy
11-28-2003, 09:10 PM
It is for the rear facing fogs, isn't it? Of course we don't get fogs here, so there won't be anything to actually switch them on.
No, the rear fogs go in the spot below the reverse lamp. In most US cars, there is not a bulb there at all. (Or in the case of the newer E46 sedans, the bulb is there, but it is a running lamp instead of a rear fog.)
There should be two contacts inside the socket; the outer shell is ground of course.
I checked again just to be sure: there is only one contact on the lens holder, which touches only one of the two contacts at the bottom of the bulb. As a result, only one filament lights up.
Alee . . . this problem is pretty major, I think you should go back to plan A and get the M3 . . .
Plan B which is getting a new bulb is way too time consuming, the bulbs will never light the same way as they did from the factory :D
SergioK
11-29-2003, 08:19 AM
I checked again just to be sure: there is only one contact on the lens holder, which touches only one of the two contacts at the bottom of the bulb. As a result, only one filament lights up.
You're correct! I checked it and mine is the same, weird for sure. Maybe Guru Kaz knows how this thing works. :dunno:
Purchased 2 single filament and 2 dual filament bulbs this morning. Going to replace all the bulbs this afternoon and see if my problem goes away. Grrrr.
bluer1
11-29-2003, 09:05 AM
Shwew! I thought for a minute I though that alee had rear fogs.
I'd hate to have to dredge up the official alee sucks (http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16651) thread.
:neener:
SergioK
11-29-2003, 09:12 AM
Shwew! I thought for a minute I though that alee had rear fogs.
I'd hate to have to dredge up the official alee sucks (http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16651) thread.
:neener:
Well, he only got a month off... it's not like someone I know who's off til January 15th. :p :neener:
If I leave it the way it is, I guess I can say I have rear fogs. :D
I had an opportunity to replace all the bulbs today. Unfortunately the problem still exists. Furthermore, unless it is related to my problem, as far as I can tell, the dual filament bulb never gets used in more than 1 state.
I'm hoping it's not some sort of psycho electrical problem. I'm tempted to borrow the light array from another coupe to see if the problem goes away, but more likely I'm going to need a trip to the dealer. :banghead:
Here is an illustration of my current problem:
http://staff.pop3now.com/alee/bmw/problem/problem.jpg
As you can see, the driver's side inner bulb is stuck on high, and the passenger side inner bulb is always on low, regardless of whether the car is being braked or not. The inner bulbs are the P21/4W dual filament bulbs.
When the car has the brakes applied, the outer bulbs turn brighter, but these are single filament bulbs. So why are we using dual filaments on the inner bulbs anyway? :dunno:
Below you can see the driver's side light array when the lights are turned on.
http://staff.pop3now.com/alee/bmw/problem/problem1.jpg
Lights are on:
http://staff.pop3now.com/alee/bmw/problem/problem2.jpg
Brakes being applied while lights are on:
http://staff.pop3now.com/alee/bmw/problem/problem3.jpg
Hmm, I took my cluster out and hooked it up to a test battery to see what's going on. Clearly, you're right; the bright filament of the dual-filament is a total waste. There isn't even a contact in the socket for it. This means it should NEVER be bright, since the brakes only light up the outboard light anyhow (single filament, normally run low, and switched to high when the brakes are on). The turn signals operate this way as well, and is controlled by the LCM. The only things I could think of is the bulb is inserted backwards, or the LCM is sending a LOT of voltage to pin 4 of that housing, though that would more likely blow the bulb.
FWIW, the 4w (low) filament of that bulb is the taller, skinnier one.
The only things I could think of is the bulb is inserted backwards, or the LCM is sending a LOT of voltage to pin 4 of that housing, though that would more likely blow the bulb.
FWIW, the 4w (low) filament of that bulb is the taller, skinnier one.
I'm mostly blind from staring at lights all day, but I believe the taller 4W filament on the driver's side is indeed the one that is lit and being overdriven. In which case I guess I need a dealer appointment huh? :mad:
Alex Baumann
11-29-2003, 03:07 PM
I'm mostly blind from staring at lights all day, but I believe the taller 4W filament on the driver's side is indeed the one that is lit and being overdriven. In which case I guess I need a dealer appointment huh? :mad:
Yup, let them check the LCM.
Also, if they have another Coupe, ask the tech to test the cluster on that car.
Yep, sounds like a LCM problem.
___lk___
11-29-2003, 05:36 PM
al, have u been hacking around in your wiring harness lately? :rolleyes:
there's a pretty funny <a href="http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=87373&cid=7583487">post</a> over on slashdot about some guy d1cking around w/ his M3 wiring harness and causing all kinds of trouble...in fact, that <a href="http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/11/28/1446239">whole thread</a> is worth reading, since it's about BMW's and Microsoft windows. :D
Maybe this is not typical engineer troubleshooting technique, but what about replacing all the bulbs to see if the problem goes away?
Re-read my post. I replaced all the bulbs.
al, have u been hacking around in your wiring harness lately? :rolleyes:
Nope. Just enjoying the fine quality German electronics. :banghead:
Is it time for the dealer to handle this problem yet? :thumbup:
Yes, BMW of Manhattan to the rescue (I hope).
Edit: Whoa, if it is the LCM and it gets replaced, sounds some odo issues...
Post from Kaz (http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showpost.php?p=277656&postcount=14)
Post from Terry Kennedy (http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showpost.php?p=277656&postcount=18)
LmtdSlip
11-29-2003, 09:43 PM
So I assume that the E46 dosent throw codes when you use aftermarket bulbs like the E36 does?
bmw325
11-29-2003, 10:05 PM
Al-
regarding the odometer-- there are procedures for synching up the LCM mileage w/ the cluster mileage so that the "tamper dot" isn't illuminated.
So I assume that the E46 dosent throw codes when you use aftermarket bulbs like the E36 does?
At one time or another I've run aftermarket bulbs, and even LEDs, in just about every socket of the car, and the only time I've ever had a problem was with the LED ones. Dealers have never said anything either.
Appointment made for Dec 15 at BMW of Manhattan. :thumbup:
Terry Kennedy
12-01-2003, 08:09 AM
Edit: Whoa, if it is the LCM and it gets replaced, sounds some odo issues... Post from Terry Kennedy (http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showpost.php?p=277656&postcount=18)
The dealer can code the new LCM (or cluster if that is the part that is replaced). It is only an issue if an end-user does the replacement.
The dealer can code the new LCM (or cluster if that is the part that is replaced). It is only an issue if an end-user does the replacement.
Good to know -- I alway have to wonder if service guys pay attention to fine details like this, so I tend to worry. Choosing BMW of Manhattan this time over my reliable Park Ave BMW with hopes they will have a better chance of having everything I need in stock.
I guess we'll see in 2 weeks. For now I guess I have the functional equivalent of a rear fog... too bad i have no use for that. :D
doeboy
12-01-2003, 09:52 AM
I guess we'll see in 2 weeks. For now I guess I have the functional equivalent of a rear fog... too bad i have no use for that. :D
Go get one of those fog machines that DJs use at parties and have the thing spew fog out of your car as you drive... :p :D
Diagnosis: Housing has melted (how we don't know), creating a short which causes one of the bulbs to be stuck bright.
Alex Baumann
12-15-2003, 07:32 AM
Diagnosis: Housing has melted (how we don't know), creating a short which causes one of the bulbs to be stuck bright.
:eek:
What might be the probability that it could happen again ? :eeps:
What might be the probability that it could happen again ? :eeps:
Clearly if I had LEDs this would not be a problem. :eek:
Alex Baumann
12-15-2003, 07:43 AM
Clearly if I had LEDs this would not be a problem. :eek:
I've told you that before :eeps: :angel:
doeboy
12-15-2003, 08:33 AM
Clearly if I had LEDs this would not be a problem. :eek:
But then the title of this thread might be:
"Tail lights doing the flashy thingy."
:p
But then the title of this thread might be:
"Tail lights doing the flashy thingy."
:p
I've never seen an Orient Blue 330Ci Pace Car before. :D
Repaired!
http://staff.pop3now.com/alee/bmw/repaired.jpg
Orient330iNYC
12-20-2003, 02:21 AM
Al, how did you like BMW of Manhattan?
Are they still doing shoe shines or massages?
:D
bmw325
12-20-2003, 05:13 AM
please tell use what you thought of BMW Manhattan. I'm impressed with the detail they provided on the service invoice atleast---and that they actually figured it out the first time (no small feat for a BMW dealer).
Overall, I was pretty impressed with BMW of Manhattan. I did my service request online, got instant email confirmation, which was followed by a call from them to schedule my appointment. I waited 2 weeks for my appointment.
The day before the appointment, I got another courtesy reminder email.
You pull up to the entrance on 58th and the security guy does a pre-inspection of your car (open the trunk, etc. and he writes down your entrance time). You pull in and the first line someone puts a little plastic "hat" on the car with the time of your service. You pull up and wait in line.
From there a pre-inspection guy walks around your car, notes any damage/dings as well as the general condition of the car.
Your service advisor then comes out, notes the mileage and discusses your problem. You get taken back to the desk, get written up, sign a few papers and you're on the way.
My service advisor, John Choe, did a good job explaining the problem to me over the phone after the diagnosis was made. They offered to keep the car overnight while the part was beng ordered, or I could make another appointment. With my schedule, I went with a 2nd appointment. Upon making the 2nd appointment, I got an instant email from them (my Blackberry notified me of an email before I was out of the building).
I guess they do different things depending on the time of year. I did not get the bottled water, shoe shines, free massage, but I did get a $5 gift card to Starbucks. They had a whole pile of them, and as you drove out, they would give you one. Nice touch.
I would say they are definitely worth checking out. I would say I still prefer Park Ave BMW for the speedy appointments (I never wait more than 1-2 days, and the techs are equally competent). However, if you can wait a few weeks for your appointment, I would definitely check them out. They do get really busy -- I was once quoted an appointment for 6 weeks out. :eek:
You get treated extremely well, and the freebies are really a nice touch. More dealers should do stuff like that. A $5 gift card, a thing of bottled water, etc. cost them so little, yet I would say it was what would make me want to go back. Nice touch. :thumbup:
vBulletin® v3.7.2, Copyright ©2000-2010, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
