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View Full Version : 2011 BWM 335d with many 4D35 fault codes


johnson12345
11-15-2010, 12:11 AM
Recently bought a new 2011 335d and during the past 4 months of driving, I have the "Service Engine Soon" check engine light come on three times already with less than a total of 5000 miles on the engine. The first check engine light came up at only 2000 miles!

Each time the dealer says it is a #4D35 fault code from the Reducing-agent metering valve. The first time they cleaned it out to clear the code. The second time they replaced the valve, but the code still came back 6 weeks later. The third time (this weekend), the dealer cleaned the valve again. What is going on??? Seems like the 335D is a lemon with some major design issues with the diesel system. Anyone else have this problem? I'm starting to regret getting the 335d. :mad:

anE934fun
11-15-2010, 01:09 AM
Recently bought a new 2011 335d and during the past 4 months of driving, I have the "Service Engine Soon" check engine light come on three times already with less than a total of 5000 miles on the engine. The first check engine light came up at only 2000 miles!

Each time the dealer says it is a #4D35 fault code from the Reducing-agent metering valve. The first time they cleaned it out to clear the code. The second time they replaced the valve, but the code still came back 6 weeks later. The third time (this weekend), the dealer cleaned the valve again. What is going on??? Seems like the 335D is a lemon with some major design issues with the diesel system. Anyone else have this problem? I'm starting to regret getting the 335d. :mad:
Something is going on with the DEF (Diesel Exhaust Fluid) application system. All vehicular diesel power systems are going to be using DEF for NOx control, so there are not problems with the DEF design, just problems with your particular car. You have a couple of options: 1.) Keep taking the car to the dealer until they get things sorted out (you might want to consider changing dealers to see if a different dealer is better able to fix the problem); or 2.) Start positioning for a Lemon Law remedy. You apparently have 3 failed repair attempts. California's Lemon Law kicks in after the 4th failed repair attempt provided you have given the manufacturer written notice of the problem and allowed at least one repair attempt after giving the manufacturer written notice of the failed repair attempts.

It is your choice how to proceed. I know from personal experience that if you have the requisite number of failed repair attempts and have met the written notification requirement, the CA Lemon Law will produce results.

Flyingman
11-15-2010, 04:09 AM
Johnson,

The 335d is in no way a "Lemon". You however may have an isolated problem that I am sure a competent dealer service department should be able to resolve to your satisfaction.

I agree with AN above. If you feel the service folks are just not "getting it", try another dealer in your area.

Very few of us have experienced any issues with our DEF system thus far. A few were never properly filled up from the delivery.

Good luck and hope you can get it resolved so you can enjoy the car.:thumbup:

tlak77
11-15-2010, 05:51 AM
I had that code few times but only once it trigger SES (dealer checked the valve - and no parts were replaced at the time). As any code it needs to be there for number of cycles - if it clears itself indicating not present condition over allowed amount of cycles it will not trigger SES. 4D35 (http://www.bmwtis.com/tsb/bulletins/bulletin_graphic_temp/B110210g.htm)
AnE934fun is absolutely right about un-experience of some dealers.

Snipe656
11-15-2010, 09:57 AM
Definitely try another dealer, most of my piss poor experiences with this car are 100% related to dealers not knowing how to work on it.

Mr. Sparkle
11-25-2010, 03:51 PM
Each time the dealer says it is a #4D35 fault code from the Reducing-agent metering valve. The first time they cleaned it out to clear the code. The second time they replaced the valve

Same thing happened to me. My car is in the shop right now waiting for the valve.
:mad:

KarlB
11-25-2010, 05:33 PM
7800+ miles on my 2011 335d and not a problem one---- except--- how to wipe this **** eating grin off my face every time I put my right foot down!!!:thumbup::thumbup:

bimmerdiesel
11-28-2010, 08:33 AM
4D35: metering valve is clogged/partial clog due to crystalized DEF. Dealer should check the valve to see if its work. They will flush it with warm water, if doesnt work then they would do warranty replacement of the SCR Metering Valve. Part # 18-30-7-807-206.

Copying this info from another 335d owner met him on dealer service bay who also had same issue and his work order said this info

Philm35
11-28-2010, 12:11 PM
Where is the metering valve physically located? Is it something we can easily replace ourselves, post-warranty?

Mr. Sparkle
11-28-2010, 12:23 PM
4D35: metering valve is clogged/partial clog due to crystalized DEF. Dealer should check the valve to see if its work. They will flush it with warm water, if doesnt work then they would do warranty replacement of the SCR Metering Valve. Part # 18-30-7-807-206.

Copying this info from another 335d owner met him on dealer service bay who also had same issue and his work order said this info

What is the urea concentration?

Snipe656
11-30-2010, 10:33 AM
I was just reading earlier today on a MB forum that with their DEF systems they are supposed to be topped off I think it is every 10k miles and then flushed every 20k miles. The stated reason for the flushing though was to break out or avoid any crystalization issues. Wonder how valid of a reason that is and if it is valid then why they stopped draining and refilling the DEF during oil changes for these cars and now only top off.

bimmerdiesel
11-30-2010, 10:46 AM
I was just reading earlier today on a MB forum that with their DEF systems they are supposed to be topped off I think it is every 10k miles and then flushed every 20k miles. The stated reason for the flushing though was to break out or avoid any crystalization issues. Wonder how valid of a reason that is and if it is valid then why they stopped draining and refilling the DEF during oil changes for these cars and now only top off.

Its not only top off. BMW also follows similar rule. They drain and refill on alternate oil changes. So under free warranty you will be entitled to 2 drain-refill

Snipe656
11-30-2010, 10:54 AM
See, the one oil change I got is back when they always drained and refilled. So now I wonder if next month they will do the same since that will be the second oil change for the car ;) The Mercedes forum made it sound like it is a flushing and not draining but I did not dig deep into it.

bimmerdiesel
11-30-2010, 11:01 AM
Flush or just drain:dunno: Need to check up my invoice again what they did. I assume they should do flush else its no point.
I got drain-refill on 2nd oil change so you too should get same for your d.

tlak77
11-30-2010, 11:44 AM
Its not only top off. BMW also follows similar rule. They drain and refill on alternate oil changes. So under free warranty you will be entitled to 2 drain-refill
Link or any supporting document?
Updated SIB160109 (http://www.bmwtis.com/tsb/bulletins/bulletin_graphic_temp/B160109g.htm) does not require purge of DEF anymore and don't see any reason why BMW dealers would do otherwise unless some other condition requires it.

Snipe656
11-30-2010, 11:53 AM
When mine was done it was a drain-fill and not a flushing of any sort. At least when the process was explained to me, that is what I was told.

bimmerdiesel
11-30-2010, 11:56 AM
NOPE no written confirmation. I tried searching varios SIB but nothing concrete. What i said is partially my speculation and my SA's word. During my 2nd service (not aware of new service rules) I blindly thought they would do drain and refill. Then someone in another thread mentioned under new service rules he got top off on 1st service. My invoice said they did drain-refill. To confirm I called up my SA if they bypassed rules to make more money. He said they do drain-refill on 2nd service and my speculation is that they will do it on 4th service as well.

mxxx
11-30-2010, 03:53 PM
7800+ miles on my 2011 335d and not a problem one---- except--- how to wipe this **** eating grin off my face every time I put my right foot down!!!:thumbup::thumbup:

I have the same problem... When my wife takes the car to work it solves the problem. ;)

primetime
12-02-2010, 05:22 AM
I have a new 335d and have started working with the check engine light problem. This thread is very helpful. Has everyone finally solved the DEF problem?

primetime
12-09-2010, 08:30 PM
335d needed a new delivery module and metering valve cleaning for check engine light at 7000 miles

primetime
12-09-2010, 08:34 PM
great car to drive and great mileage

tlak77
01-02-2011, 02:03 PM
I had that code few times but only once it trigger SES (dealer checked the valve - and no parts were replaced at the time). As any code it needs to be there for number of cycles - if it clears itself indicating not present condition over allowed amount of cycles it will not trigger SES. 4D35 (http://www.bmwtis.com/tsb/bulletins/bulletin_graphic_temp/B110210g.htm)
AnE934fun is absolutely right about un-experience of some dealers.
Yesterday I had SES light come up, scanned the codes and it is again 4D35, wonder what is gonna be a remedy this time.

primetime
01-06-2011, 07:14 PM
if they change the delivery module, they will keep the car and drive it and then check it again. They put 100 miles on my car. Hmmm!

Snipe656
01-06-2011, 07:19 PM
That is a lot of lunch trips for the mechanics :)

mecodoug
01-07-2011, 07:39 AM
I wonder if the crystallization/valve issues are less likely to occur for folks like me that drive the car a lot of highway miles (I put almost 500 highway miles per week on my car, typically driving 3-4 days per week) or if it is more related to ambient temperatures or just dumb luck.

I figure as long as the passive tank is completely empty when I service the car, I should never have DEF going through that valve that is older than 6 months. Along the same lines I wonder if I will ever really need to flush my system as long as I wait for the DEF warning before adding. I do keep a half gallon at the house in case I get the warning and can't get to a dealer for a couple of weeks.

10K and no SES - actually zero problems with the d whatsoever so far. I did an initial oil and filter change myself at about 5K, and the first official first dealer service is showing as needing to happen at 13K.

I can't imagine enjoying any other sedan more than I enjoy the d!

Snipe656
01-07-2011, 08:02 AM
I think Chris was the first on here reporting a valve problem and his car is almost all highway and lots of it. I bet it is more to do with outside air temps than anything else.

335devil
03-14-2011, 07:05 PM
My car was serviced last week (received on Tuesday), SES light came on late Friday. It was the 4D35 (metering valve) as well. They flushed it out, and I let my service technician know that I was aware of the issue from Bimmerfest :thumbup:. Most of my driving is highway (600 miles/week), so it may be a temperature issue as it has been cold up here in the Inland Empire.

ProRail
03-14-2011, 07:54 PM
Where is the metering valve physically located? Is it something we can easily replace ourselves, post-warranty?

Post-warranty on a 2011 335d? How could that be?

bimmerdiesel
03-15-2011, 03:21 PM
Post-warranty on a 2011 335d? How could that be?

he meant after 4yr/50k miles

AZ335D
06-16-2011, 06:06 PM
I've had my car (2010 335D) in for the SES light twice in the last month. In between taking the car in, the SES light will come on and then clear on the 4th start. The last time I took the car in (about a week and a half ago), the SES light came on just a day or two later and stay on until the 4th start again. Since then, everything has been fine, but I wonder how long it will be before the light comes on again. I'm beginning to get a little pissy about the SES light coming on.

cssnms
06-16-2011, 06:13 PM
I've had my car (2010 335D) in for the SES light twice in the last month. In between taking the car in, the SES light will come on and then clear on the 4th start. The last time I took the car in (about a week and a half ago), the SES light came on just a day or two later and stay on until the 4th start again. Since then, everything has been fine, but I wonder how long it will be before the light comes on again. I'm beginning to get a little pissy about the SES light coming on.

Regardless if the light turns off your DME will store the code. Take it into the dealer and have them read the code and fix whatever is triggering it,

magungo
06-18-2011, 12:19 PM
Post warranty aren't the exhaust components covered until 7 years 70k?

HoustonScott
06-19-2011, 06:07 PM
I am wondering how the car runs with these warnings up. If it runs good with codes, I won't worry about it at all. Just drive it, service when you can.

HS

Snipe656
06-19-2011, 06:19 PM
If a SES light is ignored for a very long time and whatever was wrong led to more damage then I wonder if BMW still covers it all. I ignored something on my truck for upwards of a year because it seemed to drive fine. I ended up paying for a few more repairs than had I just taken it in sooner but it was well out of warranty so not like they had to argue against my laziness.

AZ335D
06-21-2011, 03:26 PM
Took my D in this morning for the third time related to the SES light. They said they will need it for several days. I got a 328i loaner (yuck).

Moxie
06-25-2011, 09:59 AM
We took ours in for the fourth time last Monday. 2010 with 3K on it. Had this issue since the first weekend we owned it when we went to BMW Welt.

They ordered a part from Munich as they don't stock US specific parts. German spec 335d's don't have Def. Should get it put on this Monday/Tuesday. They couldn't explain what the part was cause I don't spreken ze Deutsch so well. I'll post up after I get the invoice.

Moxie
06-28-2011, 09:44 AM
Took the car in today. They ended up replacing the exhaust cooler PN 11717812513

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=PN73&mospid=51054&btnr=11_3884&hg=11&fg=50&hl=3

Would have cost me little over $1k with labor if it wasn't covered under warranty.

EMC
06-30-2011, 05:52 PM
I have a feeling that I'll be getting a reflash via the UK and bypassing some of the emissions pieces after my warranty is up. I'm scheduled to go in for an SES light in 2 weeks.

kravist
10-26-2012, 03:34 PM
You guys are a gold mine. I've had my 335d for a month or 2 and had the SES light come on twice in that period. Each time the warning indicator went off before I was able to make an appointment, so I assume it was not a serious issue.

If it makes any of you feel any better, our last commuter car was a turbo volkswagen. If the check engine light wasn't on, I felt the need to check RPMs to make sure it was still alive. That thing drove me nuts for years with fussy indicators, but always ran like a top. I'll report back when I've had the next dealership service.

GreekboyD
10-26-2012, 04:56 PM
You guys are a gold mine. I've had my 335d for a month or 2 and had the SES light come on twice in that period. Each time the warning indicator went off before I was able to make an appointment, so I assume it was not a serious issue.

If it makes any of you feel any better, our last commuter car was a turbo volkswagen. If the check engine light wasn't on, I felt the need to check RPMs to make sure it was still alive. That thing drove me nuts for years with fussy indicators, but always ran like a top. I'll report back when I've had the next dealership service.

Do you have a code reader? Have you done the emissions (or know it was done before buying it) recall work for your car yet?

floydarogers
10-26-2012, 10:10 PM
Post warranty aren't the exhaust components covered until 7 years 70k?

Only in some states - the 13 in the CA consortium.

GreekboyD
10-27-2012, 07:03 AM
Doesn't the exhaust components warranty period automatically reset after the recall emissions work is done? I'm pretty sure it does.

anE934fun
10-27-2012, 07:10 AM
Doesn't the exhaust components warranty period automatically reset after the recall emissions work is done? I'm pretty sure it does.
And why would the warranty period 'reset'? Any URL to support your claim?

anE934fun
10-27-2012, 07:15 AM
If a SES light is ignored for a very long time and whatever was wrong led to more damage then I wonder if BMW still covers it all. I ignored something on my truck for upwards of a year because it seemed to drive fine. I ended up paying for a few more repairs than had I just taken it in sooner but it was well out of warranty so not like they had to argue against my laziness.
Yup-per. Plus, in places like CA that enforce emissions recalls, you can't renew (or register for the first time if you are doing an out-of-state transfer) your registration if there is a pending recall that has not been performed.

Axel61
10-29-2012, 05:44 AM
Damn Gremlins!! they're starting to come out in these cars!!

kravist
10-30-2012, 09:28 AM
Do you have a code reader? Have you done the emissions (or know it was done before buying it) recall work for your car yet?

The dealership where it had been serviced (different that the dealer I purchased from) informed me it was completely up-to-date re: recalls and service.

bhs 61
10-11-2013, 07:01 PM
1200 miles after my dealer replaced the intake manifold and removed the head and had it cleaned the SES light came on again. This will be the fifth time with a loaner in less than 18 months since buying this 2009 335d CPO. I love driving the car but I wish I had my 2002 525i back!:mad:

mlipman
12-19-2013, 09:26 AM
I am also having my SES light come on frequently. I have a 2010 335d with 56000 miles. 5 times in the last 6 months. Each time I take it to the dealer. First I was told that my urea level was low and they refilled. But the problem with that is the light for a low urea level is a different warning than the SES. But that stopped the light for a couple of weeks. The light came on again and I returned to the dealer. This time they replaced the entire urea tank system. This time it stayed off for about a month. The next time it came on, back to the dealer. This time they replaced the catalytic converter. Light remained off for about a month. Back on again and dealer is now saying it is the DEF injector. They have had my car for 3 days and still working on getting the light off. This has been very frustrating since I assume it was the same problem all along and they are just throwing parts at my car. Also, they obviously misled me the first visit saying the problem was the urea level causing the SES light to come on instead of the low urea indicator light.

Anyone have any suggestions?

GreekboyD
12-19-2013, 09:34 AM
Do you have the invoices with the fault codes? Sounds like it's been misdiagnosed again.

anE934fun
12-19-2013, 09:36 AM
I am also having my SES light come on frequently. I have a 2010 335d with 56000 miles. 5 times in the last 6 months. Each time I take it to the dealer. First I was told that my urea level was low and they refilled. But the problem with that is the light for a low urea level is a different warning than the SES. But that stopped the light for a couple of weeks. The light came on again and I returned to the dealer. This time they replaced the entire urea tank system. This time it stayed off for about a month. The next time it came on, back to the dealer. This time they replaced the catalytic converter. Light remained off for about a month. Back on again and dealer is now saying it is the DEF injector. They have had my car for 3 days and still working on getting the light off. This has been very frustrating since I assume it was the same problem all along and they are just throwing parts at my car. Also, they obviously misled me the first visit saying the problem was the urea level causing the SES light to come on instead of the low urea indicator light.

Anyone have any suggestions?
While you seem to have a lot of things happening with your d's emission system, I don't know if the dealer is incompetent. Each time there is a part replacement, the SES light goes out for some period of time. May be a circumstance of multiple part failures. It is annoying, but given the computerized reality of the emission control system, the dealer is depending on the car's computer(s) to tell them what has failed. :dunno:

mlipman
12-19-2013, 11:01 AM
Thanks for both of the responses. You make a lot of sense. Hopefully, it is just multiple part failures on the emission system. Still having several part failures in the same system over a relatively short period of time, makes me wonder if there is some type of underlying root cause that is being missed. I will ask them for each of the fault codes when I pick her up this time

anE934fun
12-19-2013, 11:05 AM
Thanks for both of the responses. You make a lot of sense. Hopefully, it is just multiple part failures on the emission system. Still having several part failures in the same system over a relatively short period of time, makes me wonder if there is some type of underlying root cause that is being missed. I will ask them for each of the fault codes when I pick her up this time
Don't they provide the fault code(s) on the repair invoice along with what was done to repair what caused the code to be produced?

Edit: Also, you could be experiencing multiple failures of emission equipment. There was a circumstance back around 2007/2008 timeframe where the oil level sensors for gasser cars were failing.... It got so bad that there was a global parts non-availability.

The car hasn't stranded you, so if you like the car, I would just take it in stride. It is much less of an issue than the gasser HPFP failures were.

floydarogers
12-19-2013, 11:17 AM
Unfortunately, the SCR system is somewhat complicated, and even with all the sensors it's hard to diagnose. I've gotten (even after they replaced the DEF metering valve - that's what they call the injector btw - and SCR catalyst during the recall) a couple of SCR Efficiency faults (or something like that) that have turned on the SES. Earlier this year (Feb/Mar), they replaced the metering valve (again) and then it came on again and they replaced the mixer (kind of a turbulence-inducer just before the SCR catalyst.) Just came on again a couple weeks ago. This time, they said that the Mixer was installed backwards:yikes: (and hope that that fixes it!)

Bottom line is, their trouble-shooting procedures are complicated, and seem to lead to ambiguous diagnoses.:dunno: And it seems that their mechanics are not well-versed in our diesels.:thumbdwn:

anE934fun
12-19-2013, 01:11 PM
Unfortunately, the SCR system is somewhat complicated, and even with all the sensors it's hard to diagnose. I've gotten (even after they replaced the DEF metering valve - that's what they call the injector btw - and SCR catalyst during the recall) a couple of SCR Efficiency faults (or something like that) that have turned on the SES. Earlier this year (Feb/Mar), they replaced the metering valve (again) and then it came on again and they replaced the mixer (kind of a turbulence-inducer just before the SCR catalyst.) Just came on again a couple weeks ago. This time, they said that the Mixer was installed backwards:yikes: (and hope that that fixes it!)

Bottom line is, their trouble-shooting procedures are complicated, and seem to lead to ambiguous diagnoses.:dunno: And it seems that their mechanics are not well-versed in our diesels.:thumbdwn:
Hmmm. Sounds like the designers who came up with the packaging should have been spanked - packaging something so it can be installed backwards is a real amateur-hour kind of thing. :rolleyes:

GreekboyD
03-28-2014, 05:38 AM
Maybe some experts can chime in. No SES lights came on but decided to run a diagnosis with my BMWhat app. The 4D35 - Metering Valve fault code popped up. I know my passive tank valve has been clogged for over a year now. About two months ago I got the "DEF low - car won't start" message and topped it up via the active tank.

Could either of these two scenarios cause this fault code? I've erased it for now and will keep an eye on it.

BrokenDreams
09-11-2014, 08:54 AM
I have had problems with the SCR system at least nine or ten times. For the 2009 335d, BMW sent a lovely recall letter apologizing for selling a car with a "less than robust" system, namely the SCR system. Since that first recall, executed within the first 15K miles, 4 DIFFERENT dealers, 2 in NJ and 2 in NC have lined their featherbed with cash from first warranty repairs, then when I was buried in the lease (should have thought through that 30K mile limit a little more) then CPO extended warranty repairs. During the first 50K miles, other than the constant services for the fatally ill SCR system (full system replacement, multiple "metering valve" replacements, scr converter replacement) the only thing that happened was a rear bearing went bad, no doubt due to the excessive torque. Throughout the ownership history, rear tires have had a habit of wearing prematurely. thank Jeebus for Tirerack.com, Oxford A1 Tire in NW NJ, and now in Raleigh, Discount Tire!! Buying tires from BMW would be like being a 15 year old runaway chick in a hobo camp, if you catch my drift. In any case, the transmission failed at 89K. Now, I was told that it was a special more robust trans for this car, but I doubt it. It is probably the same stock auto trans in 328i and 335i vehicles. What I only found out by chance , however, is that they performed yet ANOTHER SCR recall secretly while it was in for the trans; the tech said he replaced the ****e part after a test drive. I then drove it 15 miles from the dealership on the way home, and they replaced it AGAIN! Well, at 93,700 the SES light came on again. I called BMW and told them that if it was the SCR system one more time I was going to sue them to either let me out of the finance contract, which is still way more than this discontinued car's Trade In value, or give me a lifetime warranty on the SCR system. This time it was the "Exhaust Backpressure sensor" Whatever TF that is. I got a new (350 miles) 328i loaner, and let me tell you these cars (I had a 535i loaner last year with 28 miles on it when I got it) whatever the model are always MAGNIFICENT when new, even IF I am partial to diesel (2 prior Jetta diesels). But my experience has been that they are overly engineered, and prone to issues when older, and the Broke My Wallet moniker is on the money.
-- what happened with the Exhaust Backpressure "Sensor"? Well they overnighted the part, installed it, and as soon as I picked up the car at 5 PM the smell of partially burned diesel was pervasive. I thought maybe some fuel needed to "burn off" as the overwhelming stench of burning parts cleaner had been a fixture at some other repairs. But after 30 miles, after a shutoff, the SES light returned, and now we are scheduled to yet ANOTHER service dropoff next Monday. I would have liked to get it back in today (Weds) but there is a heavy demand for loaners.
I still think of BMWs as fine vehicles, but only for rich people (I fell from grace, going from 150K+ a year to about 80K, neither being all that much but certainly I should not be in this money pit at 80K salary) who can change them up after 3 years. As for the rest of us, well it might be wise to steer clear.