1er Teething Problems

[MiniRoll]

I'm a bit new to BMWs - like most poeple I always thought they were good reliable cars that gave trouble free motoring from day one.

However, having looked that this, and other forums, it seems that like most other car companies, BMW has its fair share of problems.

It seems that when a new model comes out, there are always a number of initial technical/quality problems.

Based on your experience of other BMW models, what would you think the likely problems would be with the initial production run of the 1 series?

Cheers!!

[nudel]

I would wait 6 months, or better, one year.

I bought a new 316ti Compact E46 in June 2001, 2 days after the dealer presentation.

It was an error.:rolleyes:

The car was badly finished (Valvetronic software problems, a lot of rattling noises, water leakages).

After 6 months and 4 weeks in the shop, my dealer gave me a new Compact.:thumbup:

No problems since this time!:)

[bmw325]

I'm going to make sweeping generalizations, but my sense is that with a new model release, BMW generally screws up in the following areas:
--miscellaneous engine cooling components (thermostats, radiators, hoses, cooling fans)
-rattles
-suspension components (underspecced)
-door hardware (door seals, door handles, window regulators)
-electronic equipment

[MiniRoll]

This all sounds a bit worrying!

I really need to replace my Mini and the 1 Series looks good (especially the 120d). But I dont really want to wait 18 months!

[The HACK]

This all sounds a bit worrying!

I really need to replace my Mini and the 1 Series looks good (especially the 120d). But I dont really want to wait 18 months!
That's a sweeping generalization.

It is NOT a guarantee that YOUR car will have more problem than any other car. Look at the 2004 E46, the automatic transmission is being recalled. The 2001-2002 E46 had the aux fan problem.

How much problem you have with your particular car is always more up to lady luck than anything else. Yes, first year cars may have a higher percentage of problem but you should not let that be your sole decisioning factor.

And people on this board make all the problems sound a lot worse than it really is.

[Kaz]

I wouldn't hesitate to buy a first-year Toyota. I wouldn't buy a first-year BMW.

[MiniRoll]

I wouldn't hesitate to buy a first-year Toyota. I wouldn't buy a first-year BMW.

Why is it that makers like Toyota can get it right from the outset and perceived luxury makes like BMW have more problems?

I was following the launch of the Maxda RX-8 and that had incredibly few problems from launch (admittedly it was about 5 months late!!).

Is it just more effecient for some makers to let the end user find the faults? I realise that there will alway be some problems that only volume testing can uncover, but I just don't understand why some car makes are so much more trouble free than others.

[swchang]

I wouldn't hesitate to buy a first-year Toyota. I wouldn't buy a first-year BMW.

Yeah, from what I hear, BMW can't get first-year models right, whereas Toyota/Lexus (and I guess Scion), and Honda do very well with their firsties. :dunno:

And then some, like VW, never get it right. :p

[Motown328]

Yeah, from what I hear, BMW can't get first-year models right, whereas Toyota/Lexus (and I guess Scion), and Honda do very well with their firsties. :dunno:

And then some, like VW, never get it right. :p


I was the 3rd person in Detroit to snatch up the Acura RSX when it hit in July of 2002. That car was bulletproof. No squeeks, no rattles, build-quality was amazing, everything was tight-fit and secure. CR has the 2002 RSX as ALL RED DOTS and that comes as no surprise, no matter what you personally think of CR.

Fact is, some makers CAN do it right, others don't... :dunno:

[xspeedy]

My 2004 330i, which is in the 5th year of production and only 2,800 miles old has an idle/stalling problem that several others have.

My 1995 Integra, with 130,000 miles on it and from the second year or production has never stalled once in the entire life of the vehicle.

Fun stats!

[01silber]

My opinion is that bmw spends less money on real word tests and long term test, where as some of the others spend the money up front so as not to deal with them later
its like a rebate program, companies that offer 100 cds for 25 dollars but then have a 22 dollar rebate, well that company was able to pile a ton of cash in a pile quick for other things and then over time 2 or 3 months give some back
I love my car but yes other makers to get it right the first time more so then not

[nowonder]

I bought a first year Z4, Jan 2003 build. Not a single issue to complain about. Other than it's annual inspection and first oil change, it's never been back to the dealer.

I would be more concerned with the first year of a new engine or transmission.

--nw

[swchang]

I bought a first year Z4, Jan 2003 build. Not a single issue to complain about. Other than it's annual inspection and first oil change, it's never been back to the dealer.

I would be more concerned with the first year of a new engine or transmission.

--nw

Is the '04 Audi S4's engine a new one? And what about the M3 engine troubles I hear about? Were those new engines, too?

[andy_thomas]

Is the '04 Audi S4's engine a new one? And what about the M3 engine troubles I hear about? Were those new engines, too?

The Audi's engine is a development of an existing engine and cylinder head, both of which had been around for a number of years. Likewise the BMW's - although the 321 bhp engine which came before the current, troubled version was absolutely bombproof.

It doesn't surprise me that BMW pays more attention to early build quality nowadays. The reputation for iffy build quality (E36) and unreliability (E46) has been difficult to shake off. I have not heard of any problems with the Z4, although that car is relatively simple compared to the overbearing electronica found in, say, a 5er.

[swchang]

The Audi's engine is a development of an existing engine and cylinder head, both of which had been around for a number of years. Likewise the BMW's - although the 321 bhp engine which came before the current, troubled version was absolutely bombproof.

It doesn't surprise me that BMW pays more attention to early build quality nowadays. The reputation for iffy build quality (E36) and unreliability (E46) has been difficult to shake off. I have not heard of any problems with the Z4, although that car is relatively simple compared to the overbearing electronica found in, say, a 5er.

So they were new, but evolutions of old. Kinda like XP in relation to 2000?

BTW, what's the difference between poor quality and poor reliability? Don't most people conflate the two?

[andy_thomas]

So they were new, but evolutions of old. Kinda like XP in relation to 2000?

BTW, what's the difference between poor quality and poor reliability? Don't most people conflate the two?

Not necessarily - and further, "build quality" can be split into material quality (where lovely materials are thrown together haphazardly) and construction quality (naff materials put together with precision and care). Reliability is quite another matter - look at TVR. Milled brass dashboard panels, titanium instrument needles and machined aluminium driver controls - but partly as a consequence of iffy construction, TVRs sport the the reliability of a drugged donkey* :).

In contrast, a Russian-made Lada will be made of low-quality materials but mostly likely have the build quality of a tank. Whilst this approach does not support the integration of anything but the most basic motoring requirements, it ensures that the car will remain reliable and dependable throughout. And Ladas are pretty hard to kill, too.

* TVRs aren't as bad as they were but compared to almost any other car, reliability is still very poor indeed

[MiniRoll]

Are there any reports of initial problems with the X3? This may be important to the 1-series as I understand the interior will be fairly similar.

[bmw325]

The Audi's engine is a development of an existing engine and cylinder head, both of which had been around for a number of years. Likewise the BMW's - although the 321 bhp engine which came before the current, troubled version was absolutely bombproof.

It doesn't surprise me that BMW pays more attention to early build quality nowadays. The reputation for iffy build quality (E36) and unreliability (E46) has been difficult to shake off. I have not heard of any problems with the Z4, although that car is relatively simple compared to the overbearing electronica found in, say, a 5er.

In the case of the Z4, I think it also helped that its largely based on existing e46 components--- so many of the kinks have been worked out. And, they didn't really introduce any sort of new technology w/ it.