PDA

View Full Version : Questions regarding lowering springs


First_745Li
06-20-2012, 09:11 AM
I went to my mechanic to get an idea what it would cost to get lowering springs installed (haven't purchased yet) he stated that in lowering the car (since there are sensors on the suspension) I'd would likely trigger about 3 different types of dash indicators. And it might require manual adjustments (not sure I'm saying this correctly).. Anyway, he made it seems as tho it's not a cut and dry install especially if the car has the auto-leveling suspension (which I dont know if the car has it or not). Maybe you guys might know what he's talking about, I'm new to this car so I really need some help.

:dunno:

What else is involved in addition to replacing the springs (with or without auto leveling)?
Are there any programming, coding to the sensors or manual adjustments required?
I thank you guys in advance for your help and suggestions.

DFEL750I
06-20-2012, 09:17 AM
If you have springs all around then you can just replace the springs like any other car. If auto levelling or EDC you might need to put springs in the front and lowering links in the back.

I am not sure about whats involved with the lowering links so wait for someone else to comment. If you have EDC there should be options for it in the settings menu in idrive. Also if you take a look at the rear shocks and they look larger than regular shocks around the top then it means you have EDC. I have springs all the way around so any information on EDC or autolevelling is based on what I have read on here.

First_745Li
06-20-2012, 09:58 AM
Ok thank you. I will check the i-drive menus and physically look at the rear shocks. Appreciate it.

First_745Li
07-01-2012, 11:01 AM
It's all sorted, I called the dealer with the VIN, and they confirmed mine doesn't have auto leveling. So it shouldn't be a problem lowering. I also got some input from SanHonda. Thanks to everyone that shared their thoughts.

Keif
07-01-2012, 04:56 PM
Make sure they know to detach the headlight level sensors on the front and rear passenger-side control arms. After that, it's an install just like any other car with MacPherson style struts.

Sent from my ADR6425LVW using Bimmer App

First_745Li
07-01-2012, 06:03 PM
Hey Keif,
Will there be any errors displayed on the dash when these sensors are detached?

Keif
07-01-2012, 06:30 PM
No, you're just disconnecting the linkage, not unplugging the sensors from their wires or anything.

Sent from my ADR6425LVW using Bimmer App

First_745Li
07-01-2012, 08:17 PM
Ok sounds simple enough. Thank you

First_745Li
07-12-2012, 09:15 PM
Ok fellas, I was about to pull the trigger on getting the car lowered. The custom wheel shop advised me
away from doing so..Which I found weird bc they were going to be doing it.

Reasons are..
Camber will be out, may need camber kit, Will cause excessive wear of the tires, don't do it if it's an everyday driver with passengers and especially if I plan to take long trips with it.

So now I'm stuck on the fence..Those that have lowered, I really would appreciate your feedback..

Rookie2008
07-12-2012, 09:51 PM
Mostly everyone on the forum has a lowered 7 an they have not seem to have a problem. Although I do agree with the shop in some degree. Your tires will wear even factory tires for that matter. The 7 series along with the S550 an Audi A8 sits on a negative camber. Being that these cars are rear wheel drive along with negative camber you will have an unusual were on the rear rather than the front. As for how fast a tire wears... I would say it depends on (Yes) how much you drive an what brand tire you buy. As for lowering the car I don't think it will wear any different. Just keep eye on your tire pressure an you should be good. Ask yourself how often do you have passengers an how much do you drive your car. I don't think you will have a problem but I could be all wrong:dunno:. Lower the car. It will look good. Did I go off topic....?:dunno::rofl:

Rookie2008
07-12-2012, 09:53 PM
Also think of this they make 2 different types of suspension Standard an Sport. The sport is 1" lower than the standard an I don't think they wear any more than the other. As for the camber kit I'm not too sure. I don't have one.

Expo BMW
07-12-2012, 10:21 PM
You can have the back tires turned inside out to mitigate camber wear and extend the life of your tires. I took mine to a shop nearby and they charged me $40 to do this.

First_745Li
07-13-2012, 11:28 AM
Mostly everyone on the forum has a lowered 7 an they have not seem to have a problem. Although I do agree with the shop in some degree. Your tires will wear even factory tires for that matter. The 7 series along with the S550 an Audi A8 sits on a negative camber. Being that these cars are rear wheel drive along with negative camber you will have an unusual were on the rear rather than the front. As for how fast a tire wears... I would say it depends on (Yes) how much you drive an what brand tire you buy. As for lowering the car I don't think it will wear any different. Just keep eye on your tire pressure an you should be good. Ask yourself how often do you have passengers an how much do you drive your car. I don't think you will have a problem but I could be all wrong:dunno:. Lower the car. It will look good. Did I go off topic....?:dunno::rofl:

I will at the most have my two littles one in the back. This car wasn't meant to be a daily driver. Sounds like I should be ok. I did find some camber kits (if needed) for the rear that allows for 2 degrees of adjustment for $230-250. It's something I can look into later on if tire wear becomes that major of a problem. You're right Rookie, I don't recall this being a concern of any of the members on here. I've settled on the Eibach springs, 1.2''F &R.
I think I'll pull the trigger on this in the next month or so. Thank you so much for your insight.

First_745Li
07-13-2012, 11:29 AM
You can have the back tires turned inside out to mitigate camber wear and extend the life of your tires. I took mine to a shop nearby and they charged me $40 to do this.

I never thought of that.. that sounds like a good way to have even wear.. thanks!! You guys have helped me off the fence, I appreciate it.

ECSTuning
07-13-2012, 11:50 AM
If you go with H&R Sport springs (LINK (http://www.ecstuning.com/BMW-E66-745Li-N62_4.4L/Suspension/Springs/ES263494/?salesrep=JRiggsbee&utm_source=bimmerfest&utm_medium=forum&utm_content=JRiggsbee&utm_campaign=postreply)) you'll be lowering the car about 1.3" front and 1.2" rear. The 7 has enough stock camber adjustment to keep you fairly close to being in spec.

After any suspension work it is a good idea to have an alignment done, I've seen cars grow nasty amounts of toe after an install along with excessive camber. This isn't necessarily due to the drop, most of the time it's due to the re instillation of the parts and is corrected during an alignment.


http://c1552172.r72.cf0.rackcdn.com/60258_x600.jpg (http://www.ecstuning.com/BMW-E66-745Li-N62_4.4L/Suspension/Springs/ES263494/?salesrep=JRiggsbee&utm_source=bimmerfest&utm_medium=forum&utm_content=JRiggsbee&utm_campaign=postreply)

First_745Li
07-13-2012, 12:07 PM
If you go with H&R Sport springs (LINK (http://www.ecstuning.com/BMW-E66-745Li-N62_4.4L/Suspension/Springs/ES263494/?salesrep=JRiggsbee&utm_source=bimmerfest&utm_medium=forum&utm_content=JRiggsbee&utm_campaign=postreply)) you'll be lowering the car about 1.3" front and 1.2" rear. The 7 has enough stock camber adjustment to keep you fairly close to being in spec.

After any suspension work it is a good idea to have an alignment done, I've seen cars grow nasty amounts of toe after an install along with excessive camber. This isn't necessarily due to the drop, most of the time it's due to the re instillation of the parts and is corrected during an alignment.


http://c1552172.r72.cf0.rackcdn.com/60258_x600.jpg (http://www.ecstuning.com/BMW-E66-745Li-N62_4.4L/Suspension/Springs/ES263494/?salesrep=JRiggsbee&utm_source=bimmerfest&utm_medium=forum&utm_content=JRiggsbee&utm_campaign=postreply)

My reason for going with Eibach springs is because the shop (in an earlier conversation) mentioned that the H&R Springs changes and takes away from the the ride comfort more than the Eibachs... now it's what I've heard. This car is fairly new to me, so I'm going on mere feedback and suggestions. I'll definately check out the link.

First_745Li
07-14-2012, 08:02 PM
So today I had a conversation with the shop and they said that I need a camber kit. Only reason I want to stay with this shop is because they did my alignment on this car and said that they wouldn't charge me again for the alignment after the springs install. I will check another shop for a second opinion.

First_745Li
07-20-2012, 03:11 PM
Ok.. finally did it!! Ordered the springs, going to be around 2 weeks before the shop will have them.. So I just want to mention, the shop (where I bought my rims & tires) will be doing the job... $550.. parts and labor which includes alignment..
What do you guys think?

DriftGirl
07-20-2012, 03:52 PM
Sounds like a good price for parts, labor and alignment...


taking apart the front suspension is a mild headache

First_745Li
07-20-2012, 09:29 PM
Let's hope they don't break anything in the process...

DriftGirl
07-21-2012, 12:44 PM
Its an easy job for a shop. Im sure they'll have no problems with it :thumbup:

I took everything apart from the back of the caliper side. the first front corner took about 30-35 minutes to get the strut out. The opposite side took about 15-20 minutes.

The rears were pretty straight forward. I left all of the sensors connected and just unbolted them from the chassis...I wasnt sure if it would cause any "issues" that would need to be re-registered or sumthin'.

rears arent low enough but im assuming they'll settle in a little bit*





or when I put in the 100lbs sub box :p

pelonx1st
07-21-2012, 02:25 PM
So today I had a conversation with the shop and they said that I need a camber kit. Only reason I want to stay with this shop is because they did my alignment on this car and said that they wouldn't charge me again for the alignment after the springs install. I will check another shop for a second opinion.

Why would you need a camber kit? That sounds fishy to me; when my car was on springs just took off the old in with the new.

Rookie2008
07-21-2012, 02:27 PM
Why would you need a camber kit? That sounds fishy to me; when my car was on springs just took off the old in with the new.

I would say pelonx know best when it comes to camber kits.

sanhonda22
07-21-2012, 02:29 PM
Why would you need a camber kit? That sounds fishy to me; when my car was on springs just took off the old in with the new.

Does not sound fishy to me. Shop was just laying all the cards out on the table and letting him know whats up. I dont do alignments at my place so Im not 100% sure or not if you can get the alignment within factory specs with or without one.

pelonx1st
07-21-2012, 02:31 PM
Does not sound fishy to me. Shop was just laying all the cards out on the table and letting him know whats up. I dont do alignments at my place so Im not 100% sure or not if you can get the alignment within factory specs with or without one.

No its fishy sanhonda, i dont even have a camber kit and my car is cambered negative 6.5 rears all they have to do is adjust lower arms. Right now both front and rear of my arms are adjusted to maximum negative camber. Trust me yolu do not need a camber kit to do alingment.

sanhonda22
07-21-2012, 02:42 PM
No its fishy sanhonda, i dont even have a camber kit and my car is cambered negative 6.5 rears all they have to do is adjust lower arms. Right now both front and rear of my arms are adjusted to maximum negative camber. Trust me yolu do not need a camber kit to do alingment.

I have no camber kit on my car, tucking half the sidewall on the front, and pretty close to tucking to the lip of the rim on the rear, have never gotten an alignment on this car since day 1, so I wouldnt really know. :rofl::rofl::rofl:

Like I said, I dont do alignments over at my place so I dont know if there is or is not enough room to adjust back to factory specs.

First_745Li
07-22-2012, 12:03 PM
Its an easy job for a shop. Im sure they'll have no problems with it :thumbup:

I took everything apart from the back of the caliper side. the first front corner took about 30-35 minutes to get the strut out. The opposite side took about 15-20 minutes.

The rears were pretty straight forward. I left all of the sensors connected and just unbolted them from the chassis...I wasnt sure if it would cause any "issues" that would need to be re-registered or sumthin'.

rears arent low enough but im assuming they'll settle in a little bit*





or when I put in the 100lbs sub box :p

Sounds pretty straightforward. Thanks for your feedback

First_745Li
07-22-2012, 12:07 PM
Why would you need a camber kit? That sounds fishy to me; when my car was on springs just took off the old in with the new.

Initially they said there was no room for adjustments without the camber kit. They've said otherwise since.

First_745Li
07-22-2012, 12:08 PM
Does not sound fishy to me. Shop was just laying all the cards out on the table and letting him know whats up. I dont do alignments at my place so Im not 100% sure or not if you can get the alignment within factory specs with or without one.

Yea, I think they were stating worst case scenario. Which almost made me not do it. But I'm pretty psyched now waiting patiently.

First_745Li
07-22-2012, 12:10 PM
No its fishy sanhonda, i dont even have a camber kit and my car is cambered negative 6.5 rears all they have to do is adjust lower arms. Right now both front and rear of my arms are adjusted to maximum negative camber. Trust me yolu do not need a camber kit to do alingment.

I'll have to remember to mention that .. Adjusting the lower arms..

First_745Li
07-22-2012, 12:12 PM
I want to thank everyone for their input and helping me make better decisions. I really appreciate it. I'll post some pics when the install is complete. ACS Front lip, trunk spoiler and rear window spoiler is next. :)

First_745Li
08-03-2012, 11:44 PM
So I got my 7 lowered two days ago. How long does it take to "settle" in? Front seems to be lowered but the rear not yet.. ?

335400

Before
335401

After
335402

First_745Li
08-03-2012, 11:46 PM
Correction.. the AFTER photo is actually the back wheel after installing the springs.

pelonx1st
08-03-2012, 11:48 PM
takes about a month to fully settle but it wont go that much lower problem another 5mm at most

First_745Li
08-04-2012, 12:37 PM
Hmmm..Maybe I should have gone lower.."that's what she said" :)

Keif
08-10-2012, 08:02 PM
Good stuff man, looks good! I had my old 745 way low on coilovers, camber was not an issue, a little negative, but nothing of any significance. As long as you got it aligned you'll be fine.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Bimmer App

DriftGirl
08-21-2012, 09:33 PM
So did they settle in a bit more?

Just for kicks n giggles, Im gonna see how far out they take my car from spec.

I'll be taking the H&R's out soon tho ;)

First_745Li
08-23-2012, 06:53 PM
Good stuff man, looks good! I had my old 745 way low on coilovers, camber was not an issue, a little negative, but nothing of any significance. As long as you got it aligned you'll be fine.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Bimmer App

Thanks. Yea I got it aligned.

First_745Li
08-23-2012, 06:55 PM
So did they settle in a bit more?

Just for kicks n giggles, Im gonna see how far out they take my car from spec.

I'll be taking the H&R's out soon tho ;)

The front is sitting nice, the rear not as low as I thought they would be. Maybe more time is needed. Going with the air suspension?

DriftGirl
08-23-2012, 07:31 PM
Thats how I feel about mine as well...rear needs to be a bit lower. :(

I wouldve done your alignment for free! LoL! ..just got an alignment machine the other day. Waiting for them to install the lift and racks next week.

I pulled the air setup off of my E38...Its pretty much the same as the 745. Its coilover/Air hybrid...may see how I like it static first.

Springs "settle" but not by much :(

Expo BMW
08-23-2012, 07:58 PM
I saw another member's car that was on H&Rs like me only his is an "Li" and mine is an "i". Same scenario. Mine looked lower than his. I thought it was only his car.

Rookie2008
08-23-2012, 08:11 PM
Thats how I feel about mine as well...rear needs to be a bit lower. :(

I wouldve done your alignment for free! LoL! ..just got an alignment machine the other day. Waiting for them to install the lift and racks next week.

I pulled the air setup off of my E38...Its pretty much the same as the 745. Its coilover/Air hybrid...may see how I like it static first.

Springs "settle" but not by much :(

Do you own a shop or are you doing this from your house?

DriftGirl
08-23-2012, 08:57 PM
Do you own a shop or are you doing this from your house?

My house...usually just for my own cars. I dont like going to shops, so I try to have everything that I need to build a car.

I just got the Alignment machine and rack mounts the other day. ..haven't learned how to use the software yet :eeps:....soon tho :p

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg274/DriftGirl2/IMAG1010.jpg

Rookie2008
08-23-2012, 09:01 PM
OMG wish you lived out here I need work done.:rofl: How much did the machine run you is I may ask?

First_745Li
08-23-2012, 09:07 PM
Thats how I feel about mine as well...rear needs to be a bit lower. :(

I wouldve done your alignment for free! LoL! ..just got an alignment machine the other day. Waiting for them to install the lift and racks next week.

I pulled the air setup off of my E38...Its pretty much the same as the 745. Its coilover/Air hybrid...may see how I like it static first.

Springs "settle" but not by much :(

Your own alignment machine, lift and racks? Holy sh!t.. That's awesome..

Here's a dumb question, how can I make the rear lower with the springs I just had installed?

jgriffith007
08-24-2012, 08:20 AM
you cant. Your only way is to heat the spring to make it compress more or to cut a piece of the spring off are your only options. If you do not do either of those, you will need to buy a different set of springs or coil overs.

jgriffith007
08-24-2012, 08:21 AM
By the way, both of those ways I stated are not recommended. your best bet is to find someone who has self leveling suspension and buy their H&R rear springs. I do believe they sit noticibly lower than eibach.

DriftGirl
08-24-2012, 10:34 AM
OMG wish you lived out here I need work done.:rofl: How much did the machine run you is I may ask?

LoL!! It's kinda relaxing to go downstairs when I cant sleep...always something to work on.

I'm around 5k* for the setup. The software is getting updated next week, new hdmi video card so it will show on the Plasma. ...then I can start tinkering with it and screwing up alignments all over Seattle :p


EDIT: Not including the lift. The alignment setup has these plates that mount on your existing lift

Your own alignment machine, lift and racks? Holy sh!t.. That's awesome..

Here's a dumb question, how can I make the rear lower with the springs I just had installed?
Thank you :)

You can snip a quarter coil off. You wont notice the difference in ride quality since they are not progressive springs.

Never cut more than a quarter at a time...its time consuming but you can kinda dial-in a set of static springs if you dont mind re-installing to check ride height and quality.

Never heat springs to lower a car. It compromises the integrity of the metal


I JUST drove my car today with 2 people in the back...rubs like crazy!! :mad: LoL!! Will be rolling the fenders this weekend :thumbup:

DASchell
08-24-2012, 11:48 AM
As a mechanical engineer, (not to mention someone who did this before I knew better), as DriftGirl said do NOT heat up your springs to lower them. The reason they get lower when you heat them is you are tempering or removing the heat treat from the metal. They will continue to sag over time best case and worst case they could break.:yikes:

First_745Li
08-24-2012, 01:42 PM
LoL!! It's kinda relaxing to go downstairs when I cant sleep...always something to work on.

I'm around 5k* for the setup. The software is getting updated next week, new hdmi video card so it will show on the Plasma. ...then I can start tinkering with it and screwing up alignments all over Seattle :p


EDIT: Not including the lift. The alignment setup has these plates that mount on your existing lift


Thank you :)

You can snip a quarter coil off. You wont notice the difference in ride quality since they are not progressive springs.

Never cut more than a quarter at a time...its time consuming but you can kinda dial-in a set of static springs if you dont mind re-installing to check ride height and quality.

Never heat springs to lower a car. It compromises the integrity of the metal


I JUST drove my car today with 2 people in the back...rubs like crazy!! :mad: LoL!! Will be rolling the fenders this weekend :thumbup:

I'll think about the snipping option.. when I have ppl in the back, the car looks better, IMO.

First_745Li
08-24-2012, 01:43 PM
As a mechanical engineer, (not to mention someone who did this before I knew better), as DriftGirl said do NOT heat up your springs to lower them. The reason they get lower when you heat them is you are tempering or removing the heat treat from the metal. They will continue to sag over time best case and worst case they could break.:yikes:

Gotcha.. thank you.