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View Full Version : Smoke on idle = valve stems


blegacy
09-11-2012, 09:27 AM
02 745i I've been dealing with a smoking car for the last 6 months! If i caught a red light I was sure to leave a cloud of smoke behind. I also had the check engine light on for secondary air system. I've tried everything on this forum from ccv to hoses to additives so finally Took it to the dealer diagnosis- carbon built up at 70k miles not covered under warranty. Smoke diagnosis- valve stems they wanted approval to open engine for warranty inspection cost $6000 I said thanks but no thanks. Took it to a local shop and they guaranteed to have the work covered under warranty they owned up the engine and sure enough carbon build up on the heads and the stems were no longer round but a little oval. They pulled the heads to do the work and had them sent to a machine shop, all carbon was cleaned up and new valve stems installed. Picked it up yesterday, No more smoke no more check engine light! Cost $200 deductible warranty covered the rest. So for anyone having the same issue sorry to say there's no easy solution to solving it other than opening the engine and replacing the stems. Here's a picture of the heads after they came back from the machine shop. Wish I would have taken a before picture but I didn't the carbon built up was bad.

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SFbay
09-11-2012, 10:16 AM
70k only????!!!!!
I bet the previous owner was a total pig who changed oil every 15k miles no matter how many years passed;)
But yes 2002 with 70k miles, less than 10k a year which means once in 2 years at best, that's why it's clogged up and finally screwed up stems.
Recently saw 745 with 190mls and no issues!!!! No smoke or anything. Owner puts 0w-30 Mobil 1 every 5k. Surprisingly but valve cover gaskets are still okay. Wheep hole is fine. So low miles are not always the best thing to look at.

blegacy
09-11-2012, 10:39 AM
I'm glad to hear that there are 7 series out there over 150k cause I was starting to think after 100k they end up in the junk yard. I agree owner ignorance and dealers stupidity amount to 15k mile oil changes. Its their job security cause by the time issues start showing the manufactures warranty is long gone. After I purchased the car I took it to the dealer for an oil change and they refused because according to the idrive it wasn't due for one. After insisting they finally did it, :mad:but I have never heard of 15k miles oil change intervals. That's why I'm no longer taking my car to the dealer they don't have the owners best interest in mind.

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phil996
09-28-2012, 10:29 AM
ok, so you have new valve GUIDES or stem seals? the clearances on these valve to guides is huge and the guides are NOT repairable..only new heads, I suspect after the old valve stems 'wallar out" the new valve stem seals you'll be back to smoking in no time.
Thicker oil will also stop smoking BUT secondary air will eventually get clogged up and cleaning that out is quite the procedure (not impossible, just no fun)
Please confirm your technician PREPLACED or repaired the valve guides.
would love to know how he did it. I have same problem. Have many BMW master techs that are still buddies and there advise to me was sell it fast( I havent) I like the car and am cheap. thanks

chrisrees
09-28-2012, 11:55 AM
Does Mercedes have this many problems at 70-90k miles? Seems like the problems I read shouldn't happen on $100,000 cars.

phil996
09-28-2012, 12:07 PM
owned a 1998 500 sl never an issue with with mine or any other. The valve guide issue is unique to bmw and some older porsches.
sucks that my $77,000 car smokes !!!

chrisrees
09-28-2012, 12:33 PM
Lets just face it BMW just doesn't make a reliable car. My mechanic says 7 series is very bad and recommends a 3 series if you have to have a BMW. He drives a 2001 3 series which he said starting in 02 everything went bad. If I didn't have warranty till 2016 I would have sold this car and bought a Mercedes. I agree Phil at $77,000 it is very disappointing. My car has been at the mechanic every month this year except July. All major issues. Now I have a rough idle.

phil996
09-28-2012, 12:51 PM
yep, the 3 series 6 cylinder of the past, 2.5 and 3.0. is absolutely bullet proof.
don't know about the newer models. My 750i has been excellent...except for the smoking issue. I live in Washington DC and have been tempted to make door signs and drive it around Dc with "BMW, the ultimate smoking machine " proudly displayed.

kmatthews
09-29-2012, 06:50 AM
yep, the 3 series 6 cylinder of the past, 2.5 and 3.0. is absolutely bullet proof.
don't know about the newer models. My 750i has been excellent...except for the smoking issue. I live in Washington DC and have been tempted to make door signs and drive it around Dc with "BMW, the ultimate smoking machine " proudly displayed.

I live in DC to. I had my car ckeck out by dealer and they said my valve stems were good.
Whats is the name of the shop you went too?

Catanzaro
09-29-2012, 08:39 AM
What warranty company did you have that paid the claim? How much was the total claim? We know the deductible was $200. Thanks!

modethirteen
09-29-2012, 09:47 AM
I have a 2007 750li that started smoking when it hit 70,000 miles. I've had it for 2 years (bought with 48,000 miles) doing oil changes as necessary. I have a warranty but am afraid that the dealer will give me the same response as they gave you. Can you please give me the contact info for the indy shop that repaired your car? I'd like to give them a call to ask if they take a look at my car. I greatly appreciate your help!

blegacy
09-29-2012, 10:04 AM
What warranty company did you have that paid the claim? How much was the total claim? We know the deductible was $200. Thanks!

I have total protection plan with the deluxe package the claim was $5300.

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blegacy
09-29-2012, 10:05 AM
I have a 2007 750li that started smoking when it hit 70,000 miles. I've had it for 2 years (bought with 48,000 miles) doing oil changes as necessary. I have a warranty but am afraid that the dealer will give me the same response as they gave you. Can you please give me the contact info for the indy shop that repaired your car? I'd like to give them a call to ask if they take a look at my car. I greatly appreciate your help!
I'll pm you the info ask for Billy in service great guy to deal with.


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blegacy
09-29-2012, 10:13 AM
ok, so you have new valve GUIDES or stem seals? the clearances on these valve to guides is huge and the guides are NOT repairable..only new heads, I suspect after the old valve stems 'wallar out" the new valve stem seals you'll be back to smoking in no time.
Thicker oil will also stop smoking BUT secondary air will eventually get clogged up and cleaning that out is quite the procedure (not impossible, just no fun)
Please confirm your technician PREPLACED or repaired the valve guides.
would love to know how he did it. I have same problem. Have many BMW master techs that are still buddies and there advise to me was sell it fast( I havent) I like the car and am cheap. thanks
When I first brought it to the dealer they told me to sell it fast which was like a knife in the heart. As far as the guides That's the dealers response that they can't change the guides to sell you new heads which doubles the cost of the repair. The shop couldn't do it in house The heads were sent out to a machine shop. And yes both were changed guides and seals they had my car for about 4 weeks which was fine cause they gave me a loaner and a smoke free car when it was done.


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Catanzaro
09-30-2012, 07:48 AM
I have a 2007 750li that started smoking when it hit 70,000 miles. I've had it for 2 years (bought with 48,000 miles) doing oil changes as necessary. I have a warranty but am afraid that the dealer will give me the same response as they gave you. Can you please give me the contact info for the indy shop that repaired your car? I'd like to give them a call to ask if they take a look at my car. I greatly appreciate your help!

A warranty is a warranty for the most part. I would go back and explain this to the dealer. Do not be afraid of the dealer. They are the dumbest mechanics around and I am not trying to offend them.

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tazman30338
10-17-2012, 09:46 AM
I have an '02 745i with 98k that is blowing a puff of smoke at 2 min + traffic lights. I bought the car 2 years ago with 68k on it from a friend who bought it new in '01. He obviously didn't put many miles on it and I figured it would be a great car to keep for a while. I have gotten a few opinions and it sounds like it is the valve guides. The smoke is coming from the left exhaust pipe so I suspect it is the driver's side head. The repair prices have started at $2200 to do just one head only and $3500 for both from the least expensive guy. Others shops have quoted $4500 up to $12k.

Can I buy a warranty that would cover this work? How do I qualify the mechanic and the machine shop?

Should I even keep the car? It is only worth maybe $11-14k without a smoking issue... I wanted to keep the car for 2 or more years, but what will be next? I am about to do $400+ transmission fluid/filter change. I have done $2k of repairs over the last 2 years already. It is a gorgeous car in near perfect condition. Most people think it only a couple years old.

Your experienced opinions are greatly appreciated!

chrisrees
10-17-2012, 10:37 AM
I have an '02 745i with 98k that is blowing a puff of smoke at 2 min + traffic lights. I bought the car 2 years ago with 68k on it from a friend who bought it new in '01. He obviously didn't put many miles on it and I figured it would be a great car to keep for a while. I have gotten a few opinions and it sounds like it is the valve guides. The smoke is coming from the left exhaust pipe so I suspect it is the driver's side head. The repair prices have started at $2200 to do just one head only and $3500 for both from the least expensive guy. Others shops have quoted $4500 up to $12k.

Can I buy a warranty that would cover this work? How do I qualify the mechanic and the machine shop?

Should I even keep the car? It is only worth maybe $11-14k without a smoking issue... I wanted to keep the car for 2 or more years, but what will be next? I am about to do $400+ transmission fluid/filter change. I have done $2k of repairs over the last 2 years already. It is a gorgeous car in near perfect condition. Most people think it only a couple years old.

Your experienced opinions are greatly appreciated!

I would say $2000 in repairs would be quite low. You'll have to weigh the cost of a new car vs what you think may happen to your car. Sounds like you've got a good one if you've only had 2k in repairs.

Mr.Class
10-17-2012, 12:02 PM
Your complaining about spending 2 grand in two years! That's a joke... This is my second 7 series & I had this one for three weeks now.. & I passed two grand last week bro... Now today this dumb car starts to puff smoke when I'm @ a light!!!! Fu?? This peice of crap car!!! I love the car but its far from reliable & after this smoking problem I have had it!!!!! I feel like just lighting the car on fire!!!!!! I loved this car until today!!!! I'm selling my car this week & buying another Porsche cayenne turbo... It was nice knowing you guys but I'm out.... Worst cars I ever own !!!!

chrisrees
10-17-2012, 12:09 PM
Your complaining about spending 2 grand in two years! That's a joke... This is my second 7 series & I had this one for three weeks now.. & I passed two grand last week bro... Now today this dumb car starts to puff smoke when I'm @ a light!!!! Fu?? This peice of crap car!!! I love the car but its far from reliable & after this smoking problem I have had it!!!!! I feel like just lighting the car on fire!!!!!! I loved this car until today!!!! I'm selling my car this week & buying another Porsche cayenne turbo... It was nice knowing you guys but I'm out.... Worst cars I ever own !!!!

Couldn't agree with you more. One of the worst cars ever. BMW just doesn't make quality cars. Nicely put! lol

ayman
10-17-2012, 12:59 PM
The issue becouse of long period changing the oil
Bmw using the same valve seal of porche and mercedes its the same brand thiinformation from bmw mechanic.

E38 was not having this issue

For my car i change the oil every 5000km 10w50 tItan oil and never had any smoke issue and now my car had 160,000km