Finally! Now we can get down to business, lets talk price!

[tron1043]

Thank you to whomever created this sub-section.

Now, can anyone help me with some of my ordering questions?

1. I heard that Logic 7 (sans the 6-disc changer), xenons, and power seats will be will be standard on the 330, and options on the 325i. That's like 1800, 800, 995 if the prices refelct what BMW is charging on other cars. So, is it looking like the 330 will be a better value?

2. My dealer told me that, the premium package will include BMW assist, power seats, lumbar support, autodimming mirrors, leather, and some other smaller stuff. The leather and power seats I want, but he wasn't able to tell me how much the package was going to cost, today leather and power seats would be 995 and 1450, not too mention that cost of the smaller items. Is it looking like the cost of the premium package is going way up? Anyone got the 'word' on this?

3. My dealer, who happens to be the largest BMW in the midwest, claims that the demand for the new 3 will be so high, they are goingto be strictly going by MSRP on the car, AND the options! I was expecting to pay somewhat of a premium so that I could have the car early in its release, but c'mon, the way I want to spec out my car, they stand to make like more than 7 grand. Anyone else heard about their dealers wanting MSRP?

[AF]

3. My dealer, who happens to be the largest BMW in the midwest, claims that the demand for the new 3 will be so high, they are goingto be strictly going by MSRP on the car, AND the options! I was expecting to pay somewhat of a premium so that I could have the car early in its release, but c'mon, the way I want to spec out my car, they stand to make like more than 7 grand. Anyone else heard about their dealers wanting MSRP?
I am not quite clear on this ... are you saying they are charging the window sticker plus adding additional dealer installed options on the car and that will be the price or are you saying the dealer is charging whatever the window sticker from the factory says which is MSRP ?

If it's the window sticker (MSRP) then I can understand them wanting it for this new model. I would think the first set of E90's will be at MSRP but then after the hype is over for those that MUST have the first ones, I am sure they will discount some ...

Keep in mind, there are only limited number of people who MUST have the first set coming out, this isn't going to be like low volume car like the Lotus Elise where there is a waiting list. It is a sport sedan which will be available in volume ...

[Technic]

My dealer, who happens to be the largest BMW in the midwest, claims that the demand for the new 3 will be so high, they are goingto be strictly going by MSRP on the car, AND the options! I was expecting to pay somewhat of a premium so that I could have the car early in its release, but c'mon, the way I want to spec out my car, they stand to make like more than 7 grand. Anyone else heard about their dealers wanting MSRP?

Sorry, but I had heard this rap before so many times (PT Cruiser, Mini, GTO, Thunderbird, Z3, M3) that it just make me... : puke:

Can you just wait until they actually sell you the car at a nice, reasonable price? :confused:

[gojira-san]

Anyone else heard about their dealers wanting MSRP?My dealer wants MSRP for everything (even 04 leftovers :) ). You have to walk out a couple of times before they throw you a bone.

Unless you have your heart set on being the first one on the block, I'd wait until the initial frenzy stops. Of course too, it is the dealer that is telling you there will be a frenzy... and there are only a few dealers -I- know who I'd believe if they told me that. Some may throw that line just to keep the price up.

[Rob325_in_AZ]

My dealer wants MSRP for everything (even 04 leftovers :) ). You have to walk out a couple of times before they throw you a bone.

Unless you have your heart set on being the first one on the block, I'd wait until the initial frenzy stops. Of course too, it is the dealer that is telling you there will be a frenzy... and there are only a few dealers -I- know who I'd believe if they told me that. Some may throw that line just to keep the price up.

It's all supply and demand. If you're dealer wants to sell the car bad enough, they will discount it. It's all talk until the cars hit the market and we see how much immediate demand is there. I'm sure they claimed this was going to happen when the new 5's were coming out, and I doubt there was a big rush then.

Any dealer can sell you a car at any price, but you have to agree to buy it. If anyone ever comes at me with "market adjustment" for a hot new model (S2000, 350Z, etc), then I walk. I can wait, but the dealer can't. They have to move cars.

Regarding the new 3-series MSRP, it would be very bold of BMW to increase significantly. They are getting more competition from G35s, the new cadillacs, and others.

[philippek]

the way I want to spec out my car, they stand to make like more than 7 grand.

There is no possible equipment level possible that would create a 7 grand gap between invoice and MSRP on a 3 series. Even 6ers and 7ers don't have that kind of margin between invoice and MSRP.

[jetstream23]

I didn't want to pay MSRP for a new vehicle and I didn't want to wait a year for the fanfare to die down on the E90 before getting a new vehicle so I'm taking a brand new 2005 330i ZHP for about $2,100 below Invoice and about $6,000 below MSRP. I hear its a good car :D :p

I like BMWs and a brand new E46 is the way to go if you are at all concerned about price. If it was a $500 or $1,000 difference I probably would have waited for the E90. But I probably saved myself over $7,000 on what an E90 would have cost me versus the E46 I'm getting. Hey, its a brand new BMW, its a ZHP and its under invoice....I'm very, very happy.

[tron1043]

There is no possible equipment level possible that would create a 7 grand gap between invoice and MSRP on a 3 series. Even 6ers and 7ers don't have that kind of margin between invoice and MSRP.

You are probaly right, 7 maybe an exageration, but I was thinking,

4000 on the car, 3000 for the options and the BMW extended warranty, I am probably too high on the options, I was thinking about the sales tax with the MSRP premium as well, which doesn't go to the dealer. So, you are right 7 would probaly be an overestimate, what do you think it would be? I'm guessing about 6, to as high as 8K in additions over the base car, so 31K + 6 - 8, what do you think the dealer stands to make?

[Desertnate]

Sorry, but I had heard this rap before so many times (PT Cruiser, Mini, GTO, Thunderbird, Z3, M3) that it just make me... : puke:

Can you just wait until they actually sell you the car at a nice, reasonable price? :confused:

I think the dealer is just trying to charge him the "dummy tax".

I bougt my E46 sedan in November '98 only a few months after the E46 had hit the market. Even with the timing and the fact the dealer in Oklahoma City had sold VERY few (I only remeber seeing two others at the time), I was still able to talk them down from MSRP. It wasn't much, but they did come down.

[philippek]

You are probaly right, 7 maybe an exageration, but I was thinking,

4000 on the car, 3000 for the options and the BMW extended warranty, I am probably too high on the options, I was thinking about the sales tax with the MSRP premium as well, which doesn't go to the dealer. So, you are right 7 would probaly be an overestimate, what do you think it would be? I'm guessing about 6, to as high as 8K in additions over the base car, so 31K + 6 - 8, what do you think the dealer stands to make?

On a current (E46) 330i base invoice is $33,340 (including destination, but not including T&S or MACO, which may or may not apply). This also does not include any overhead costs which every dealer will charge to the car, in one way or another.

That same car has an MSRP of $36,395. So figure about $3k on the car.

The margin on options, however, is embarrasingly slim. Automatic Transmissions, for example, retail for $1275 and have an invoice of $1210.

Unless they charge you over MSRP, it's hard to imagine them making more than $3500 on the car itself.

[JST]

Thank you to whomever created this sub-section.

Now, can anyone help me with some of my ordering questions?

1. I heard that Logic 7 (sans the 6-disc changer), xenons, and power seats will be will be standard on the 330, and options on the 325i. That's like 1800, 800, 995 if the prices refelct what BMW is charging on other cars. So, is it looking like the 330 will be a better value?

2. My dealer told me that, the premium package will include BMW assist, power seats, lumbar support, autodimming mirrors, leather, and some other smaller stuff. The leather and power seats I want, but he wasn't able to tell me how much the package was going to cost, today leather and power seats would be 995 and 1450, not too mention that cost of the smaller items. Is it looking like the cost of the premium package is going way up? Anyone got the 'word' on this?

3. My dealer, who happens to be the largest BMW in the midwest, claims that the demand for the new 3 will be so high, they are goingto be strictly going by MSRP on the car, AND the options! I was expecting to pay somewhat of a premium so that I could have the car early in its release, but c'mon, the way I want to spec out my car, they stand to make like more than 7 grand. Anyone else heard about their dealers wanting MSRP?


Have heard that SE Mich is a difficult market to buy in, since there are relatively few dealers and the metro DTW dealers are (or at least were) owned by relatives.

I've heard of people getting better deals in Toledo--you might try going to out of the way dealers. You could also arrange for the sale from a much farther away dealer and either take delivery there or do Performance Center.

It wouldn't surprise me if the 330 is MSRP only for the first month or two, as demand outstrips supply. That won't last very long--when I bought my first E46 coupe, it was three or four months into the production run and the car was well discounted.

[jetstream23]

Have heard that SE Mich is a difficult market to buy in, since there are relatively few dealers and the metro DTW dealers are (or at least were) owned by relatives.

I've heard of people getting better deals in Toledo--you might try going to out of the way dealers. You could also arrange for the sale from a much farther away dealer and either take delivery there or do Performance Center.

It wouldn't surprise me if the 330 is MSRP only for the first month or two, as demand outstrips supply. That won't last very long--when I bought my first E46 coupe, it was three or four months into the production run and the car was well discounted.

I'd expect that as well. Its really easy when someone comes into the dealership a month or more before the E90's have even hit shore to charge them MSRP. If you have that twinkle in your eye and you say the magical question, "Is there a waitlist?" he knows he has you. I'd guess the first 2 months or so would require MSRP and then probably $500 to $1,000 off through the rest of the year depending upon what MSRP is on the car.

[KickinA]

Does anyone know when the E90 will be available for European Delivery?

thanks

[Rob325_in_AZ]

Not sure why a person couldn't just wait for the hype to be over, before buying the new car (ignoring current lease expirations, etc.).

Why not just wait?

I would definitely wait. If not to avoid paying too much for a new car, then to avoid having to come back multiple times for recalls or minor bugs in a brand new model.

[tagheuer]

Have heard that SE Mich is a difficult market to buy in, since there are relatively few dealers and the metro DTW dealers are (or at least were) owned by relatives.

I've heard of people getting better deals in Toledo--you might try going to out of the way dealers. You could also arrange for the sale from a much farther away dealer and either take delivery there or do Performance Center.

It wouldn't surprise me if the 330 is MSRP only for the first month or two, as demand outstrips supply. That won't last very long--when I bought my first E46 coupe, it was three or four months into the production run and the car was well discounted.

My advice exactly. SE Mich is a SCAM because all the dealers are owned by the SAME PEOPLE, therefore there is no competition. Every dealer lied to my face about the existence of the factory money when I bought my 04 325i ZSP. I drove 50 minutes to Toledo and got a fantastic deal, 3 percent over invoice, absolutely no haggling. I faxed him a quote with invoice prices from here, and it was a done deal.

[tron1043]

My advice exactly. SE Mich is a SCAM because all the dealers are owned by the SAME PEOPLE, therefore there is no competition. Every dealer lied to my face about the existence of the factory money when I bought my 04 325i ZSP. I drove 50 minutes to Toledo and got a fantastic deal, 3 percent over invoice, absolutely no haggling. I faxed him a quote with invoice prices from here, and it was a done deal.

Mind mentioning the dealer in Toledo, is it Yark? The big plus about buying the car from the dealer in SE Mich, is that when you purchase the car from them, you get a BMW loaner (had a trans go out, took over three weeks to fix but I didn't mind because i basically got the exact same car I took in). Talked to "Adrian's BMW" from Atlanta (dealer active on the boards here) and was impressed with what he had to say as well.

[MarcusSDCA]

I wonder how the I-drive vs non-I-drive is going to play out. This is the first 3 series where the dashboard can be ordered in 2 distinct styles.

If you have to have the first E90 on the block then pay the price. But I think this 3 series is going to see more people ordering them from the factory with and without all of the techno stuff.

One way to tell a dealer "yeah, I want the new 3 series but you don't have exactly what I want" is to discuss ordering it and lettting them know that you'll "get back to them" after you do your pricing homework. You can order the car from any BMW dealer.

I agree with everyone here...the first cars might go out for sticker or close to it...but that will end fast. This is their "bread and butter" high volume model....not the 645.

[RichReg]

Does anyone know when the E90 will be available for European Delivery?

thanks
:thumbup: Well speaking of getting a good price......I think you've got the right idea KickinA!

Actually, it will be available almost right away! (surprise)
You can actually get an E.D. E90 as soon as May, starting with April production.

[Marco]

:thumbup: Well speaking of getting a good price......I think you've got the right idea KickinA!

Actually, it will be available almost right away! (surprise)
You can actually get an E.D. E90 as soon as May, starting with April production.

Are you positive on this, Rich?
I was under the impression that the e90 won't be available for ED until after the summer.
Do you have good sources?

[iSpY]

I wonder how the I-drive vs non-I-drive is going to play out. This is the first 3 series where the dashboard can be ordered in 2 distinct styles.

If you have to have the first E90 on the block then pay the price. But I think this 3 series is going to see more people ordering them from the factory with and without all of the techno stuff.

One way to tell a dealer "yeah, I want the new 3 series but you don't have exactly what I want" is to discuss ordering it and lettting them know that you'll "get back to them" after you do your pricing homework. You can order the car from any BMW dealer.

I agree with everyone here...the first cars might go out for sticker or close to it...but that will end fast. This is their "bread and butter" high volume model....not the 645.


Same here. I totally agree that buyers may need to pay sticker when the E90 first come out, however, when the volume ramp up, one should easily get 1K or 1.5 discount.

[missing23]

When the E90 comes out initially it will probably be a very good time to get a sweet deal on an E60 though.

My current E46 lease is up in June of 06 so I won't have to order my ZHP E90 for another 13-14 months, maybe by then we will be back to the old rules of invoice plus 4-5% or so.

[RichReg]

Are you positive on this, Rich?
I was under the impression that the e90 won't be available for ED until after the summer.
Do you have good sources?

:D Well, yeah......I'd like to think I do. But all I did was contact the BMW European delivery department about two weeks ago and that's what they said. Also stated that the 325 would be available right away as well (unlike the 2001 E46 325, which was delayed)

Have you spoken to any BMW reps very recently?

[Marco]

:D Well, yeah......I'd like to think I do. But all I did was contact the BMW European delivery department about two weeks ago and that's what they said. Also stated that the 325 would be available right away as well (unlike the 2001 E46 325, which was delayed)

Have you spoken to any BMW reps very recently?
Excellent news!!! :sabrina: :fruit: :beerchug: I NEED ED by end of June!!
My only sources were a uninformed dealer in Boston, posts in this forum, and the E46 precendent.
So your source is much more reliable! I'll start looking for a local good dealer rightway (any suggestions in that department, anybody?).
Are you thinking to do ED soon?

[pharding]

I did not ask about May, but I assume that I could get one in May. The build date for Euro Delivery one month before you pick it up. My son is getting an e90 325 for ED.

[RichReg]

I did not ask about May, but I assume that I could get one in May. The build date for Euro Delivery one month before you pick it up. My son is getting an e90 325 for ED.
:) Yes, Pharding that would follow, but what has happened in the past with brand new models is that BMW delays Euro-Delivery allocations to the dealers until at least six months of production have passed. This then encourages dealers to persist with their pessimistic attitude about giving discounts on Euro-delivery cars, which I believe is something Marco & I would prefer to avoid if at all possible. Not the case this time.

:thumbup: Marco, I'm not familar with the Massachusetts area, but anyone will tell you to find the highest volume dealer around for the best results in price. I believe Herb Chambers BMW does quite a bit of business and were something like number 6 in sales volume for the Eastern region a few months back. I would try them.

I myself was planning to buy in May for delivery in June, but my plans to use a third party in the family for pickup got shot down (not by BMW), so I am now looking at sometime in September for a 330i. (Sigh)...well, at least SMG & Comfort access might be available by then......

....but with my luck, BMW will raise prices 3 more times before that happens. :bawling:

[Jalli]

:) Yes, Pharding that would follow, but what has happened in the past with brand new models is that BMW delays Euro-Delivery allocations to the dealers until at least six months of production have passed. This then encourages dealers to persist with their pessimistic attitude about giving discounts on Euro-delivery cars, which I believe is something Marco & I would prefer to avoid if at all possible. Not the case this time.

:thumbup: Marco, I'm not familar with the Massachusetts area, but anyone will tell you to find the highest volume dealer around for the best results in price. I believe Herb Chambers BMW does quite a bit of business and were something like number 6 in sales volume for the Eastern region a few months back. I would try them.

I myself was planning to buy in May for delivery in June, but my plans to use a third party in the family for pickup got shot down (not by BMW), so I am now looking at sometime in September for a 330i. (Sigh)...well, at least SMG & Comfort access might be available by then......

....but with my luck, BMW will raise prices 3 more times before that happens. :bawling:

Is it possible to have a third party in the family pick up a car ED..?

[solsurfr]

Is it possible to have a third party in the family pick up a car ED..?
Nope.

[Jalli]

Nope.

That's what I thought.. to bad I have family in Germany

[RichReg]

Nope.

:bustingupWanna bet? How do you think I got my 323Ci?

Yes, its true that BMW discourages it.....and I'm sure you can guess the reasons why.
:nono: BMW doesn't want people calling up their friends that live near the delivery center and picking a car up only to drop it off 5 minutes later.

Truth be told, up until about a year or so ago, the actual European Delivery order form SPECIFICALLY had two different spots to fill out: one for the customer & one for the purchaser (where it stated:Purchaser (if different from customer)). Now it only has one spot to fill out for the CUSTOMER (NOT purchaser, mind you), but my dealer told me the car can still be registered to whomever he decides to register it to once it is back in the States. The same dealer who sold me my current 323Ci.
As long as the European delivery department is fully convinced that SOMEONE is leaving the U.S. to visit Germany, they will do it. :thumbup:

Think about it, what if you suddenly get sick and can't go? They're going to stick you with a surcharge? That's not good business & BMW knows it...

[solsurfr]

:bustingupWanna bet? How do you think I got my 323Ci?

Yes, its true that BMW discourages it.....and I'm sure you can guess the reasons why.
:nono: BMW doesn't want people calling up their friends that live near the delivery center and picking a car up only to drop it off 5 minutes later.

Truth be told, up until about a year or so ago, the actual European Delivery order form SPECIFICALLY had two different spots to fill out: one for the customer & one for the purchaser (where it stated:Purchaser (if different from customer)). Now it only has one spot to fill out for the CUSTOMER (NOT purchaser, mind you), but my dealer told me the car can still be registered to whomever he decides to register it to once it is back in the States. The same dealer who sold me my current 323Ci.
As long as the European delivery department is fully convinced that SOMEONE is leaving the U.S. to visit Germany, they will do it. :thumbup:

Think about it, what if you suddenly get sick and can't go? They're going to stick you with a surcharge? That's not good business & BMW knows it...
I've read about the situations where people are sick but generally these are extreme cases. If you want to jump thru hoops so you don't have to go to Germany, be my guest, but it defeats the purpose of the ED experience. It is safe to say they won't allow you to have a proxy but if you beg and plead, I'm sure anything is possible.

[RichReg]

I've read about the situations where people are sick but generally these are extreme cases. If you want to jump thru hoops so you don't have to go to Germany, be my guest, but it defeats the purpose of the ED experience. It is safe to say they won't allow you to have a proxy but if you beg and plead, I'm sure anything is possible.

I use "being sick" as just that, the EXTREME example.
Point being is that BMW just wants to make sure someone is actually planning on going. I would have gone myself back in 2000, but I had just gotten a new job and was not yet allowed vacation time. This time its a little different.

[tagheuer]

Mind mentioning the dealer in Toledo, is it Yark? The big plus about buying the car from the dealer in SE Mich, is that when you purchase the car from them, you get a BMW loaner (had a trans go out, took over three weeks to fix but I didn't mind because i basically got the exact same car I took in). Talked to "Adrian's BMW" from Atlanta (dealer active on the boards here) and was impressed with what he had to say as well.

Yes, it was Yark. I know that you lose a little benefit by doing that, but I saved well over 3k. Its really more than just the price too, its about being fair. I might even buy from a more expensive dealer if they admitted the existence of the factory money, and said they don't pay it out. But acting like it doesn't exist is just not fair.

If more people bought from other dealers, maybe they'd learn and at least give fair deals. It makes you wonder about other things, like service, price for parts, etc. I'm not looking for everything at cost, just be fair about it.