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View Full Version : Sticky tires do nice things for the M3's handling.


Nick325xiT 5spd
04-11-2005, 07:44 AM
Thanks to Alex (BahnBaum) for this one!


http://www.nrubenstein.com/images/m3%20wheel%20lift%20small.jpg

SergioK
04-11-2005, 08:29 AM
Oh Wow! Check out your parking pass! :stickpoke :p

Nick325xiT 5spd
04-11-2005, 08:30 AM
Oh Wow! Check out your parking pass! :stickpoke :p
Needs giant pink fuzzy dice. :neener:

Plaz
04-11-2005, 08:40 AM
I see you took your V1 off the windshield. :p

Do you think that wheel would have come up with stock sways?

Nick325xiT 5spd
04-11-2005, 08:57 AM
I see you took your V1 off the windshield. :p

Do you think that wheel would have come up with stock sways?
Probably not. Although the issue is more one of running the OEM rear sway and a stiff front sway. GC front and OEM rear si the best compromis between responsiveness, and the need to get the power down that I've found.

JetBlack330i
04-11-2005, 09:04 AM
I don't get this... seems like you're priding yourself for having a stiff suspension and getting one wheel off the ground. Isn't all 4 wheels on the ground always better, even if it means a little leaning on one side? :dunno:

Nick325xiT 5spd
04-11-2005, 09:12 AM
I don't get this... seems like you're priding yourself for having a stiff suspension and getting one wheel off the ground. Isn't all 4 wheels on the ground always better, even if it means a little leaning on one side? :dunno:
No, because then the car would be very slow on the helm. The wheel is actually coming off of the ground because I'm running a relatively soft rear suspension.

There are basically three choices:
1) Sacrifice LOTS of front grip to keep both wheels on the ground (but slightly improve transitions).
2) Sacrifice LOTS of rear grip and lose the ability to keep the throttle planted in sweepers.
3) Drive the car as is, and enjoy the hell out of it.

e36M3r
04-11-2005, 10:53 AM
Sweet! :thumbup:

dawgbone
04-11-2005, 11:02 AM
No, because then the car would be very slow on the helm. The wheel is actually coming off of the ground because I'm running a relatively soft rear suspension.

There are basically three choices:
1) Sacrifice LOTS of front grip to keep both wheels on the ground (but slightly improve transitions).
2) Sacrifice LOTS of rear grip and lose the ability to keep the throttle planted in sweepers.
3) Drive the car as is, and enjoy the hell out of it.

I can't see THAT handling better than even stock..Keep on driving it if ya' like it...surely something will break...Going soft in the back won't necessarily help you throttle through turns if your front is set up incorrectly...

BahnBaum
04-11-2005, 11:06 AM
I can't see THAT handling better than even stock..Keep on driving it if ya' like it...surely something will break...Going soft in the back won't necessarily help you throttle through turns if your front is set up incorrectly...

Something always is breaking on Nick's car.

You can't argue with the fact, however, that Nick had the 5th fastest time out of 150 cars this past Sunday.

Alex

Nick325xiT 5spd
04-11-2005, 11:51 AM
I can't see THAT handling better than even stock..Keep on driving it if ya' like it...surely something will break...Going soft in the back won't necessarily help you throttle through turns if your front is set up incorrectly...
I guess you've never seen prepped Bimmers run an autox circuit. Most of them lift the wheel. It's not violent, and I hate to break it to you, but if you can't see that handling better than stock, then you really have no idea what you're talking about.

I could soften the front sway bar, but that would cost me a great deal in the slaloms, and it would make the car very hard to drive.

So, anyway, what would you suggest? Because I've probably tried it.

And Alex, what was the 4th car? I thought it was that B-Mod thing, and two Caterhams. Did I miss somethign in the results? :angel:

dawgbone
04-11-2005, 02:16 PM
I guess you've never seen prepped Bimmers run an autox circuit. Most of them lift the wheel. It's not violent, and I hate to break it to you, but if you can't see that handling better than stock, then you really have no idea what you're talking about.

I could soften the front sway bar, but that would cost me a great deal in the slaloms, and it would make the car very hard to drive.

So, anyway, what would you suggest? Because I've probably tried it.

And Alex, what was the 4th car? I thought it was that B-Mod thing, and two Caterhams. Did I miss somethign in the results? :angel:

Congrats on the times, it must have worked for you...I personally don't get too envolved with auto-xing parking lots..As I should have specified my jest..But that setup would be rediculous out on any high speed course...Most performance car manufacturer would frown at a vehicle that would do such a thing as lifting a wheel off of the ground..Stiff up front and saggy in the back is what you would exspect least out of a performance oriented car..I understand that your trying to dig for traction in low speed turns...It just doesn't look right in the picture...I wasn't trying to rag on you about it...as I agree with what you said...as long as you had fun..who really cares...it's a car..drive it how you want..

Nick325xiT 5spd
04-11-2005, 02:20 PM
Congrats on the times, it must have worked for you...I personally don't get too envolved with auto-xing parking lots..As I should have specified my jest..But that setup would be rediculous out on any high speed course...Most performance car manufacturer would frown at a vehicle that would do such a thing as lifting a wheel off of the ground..Stiff up front and saggy in the back is what you would exspect least out of a performance oriented car..I understand that your trying to dig for traction in low speed turns...It just doesn't look right in the picture...I wasn't trying to rag on you about it...as I agree with what you said...as long as you had fun..who really cares...it's a car..drive it how you want..
If you call TC Kline Racing, they'll tell you to run without a rear sway bar at all, no matter what sprigns you're running.

And I can tell you from personal experience that lifting a wheel is no big deal at all on a road course. The inside front on a BMW really doesn't do much no matter what.

elbert
04-11-2005, 02:21 PM
But that setup would be rediculous out on any high speed course...Most performance car manufacturer would frown at a vehicle that would do such a thing as lifting a wheel off of the ground

:dunno:

http://www.autotrend.com/pic/8943.jpg

JST
04-11-2005, 02:28 PM
:dunno:

http://www.autotrend.com/pic/8943.jpg

Must be an autocrosser.

sunnykk
04-11-2005, 03:00 PM
Just a comment.

This is my first BMW and I envy all you guys doing the race track. I am just enjoying the heck out of my 330i ZHP. Never have driven anything even remotely close to this. I have my thrills for now with the stock 330i ZHP. May be in the future I will understand all the intiricate details about racing in a race track and might require upgrades but for now I am happy with my stock 330i ZHP.

Sunny

JST
04-11-2005, 03:10 PM
Just a comment.

This is my first BMW and I envy all you guys doing the race track. I am just enjoying the heck out of my 330i ZHP. Never have driven anything even remotely close to this. I have my thrills for now with the stock 330i ZHP. May be in the future I will understand all the intiricate details about racing in a race track and might require upgrades but for now I am happy with my stock 330i ZHP.

Sunny

Your stock ZHP is a very well set-up car for the street and light autox/track use. Go out to an autocross and give it a shot, but be warned. You may become addicted, and end up like Nick, putting the tire dealer's kids through college.

Mr. The Edge
04-11-2005, 03:14 PM
Just a comment.

This is my first BMW and I envy all you guys doing the race track. I am just enjoying the heck out of my 330i ZHP. Never have driven anything even remotely close to this. I have my thrills for now with the stock 330i ZHP. May be in the future I will understand all the intiricate details about racing in a race track and might require upgrades but for now I am happy with my stock 330i ZHP.

Sunnythey're talking about autoX, not a race track :D

B-Mer
04-11-2005, 03:29 PM
Your stock ZHP is a very well set-up car for the street and light autox/track use. Go out to an autocross and give it a shot, but be warned. You may become addicted, and end up like Nick, putting the tire dealer's kids through college.

A good education never did anyone any bad. :rofl:

sunnykk
04-11-2005, 04:02 PM
Your stock ZHP is a very well set-up car for the street and light autox/track use. Go out to an autocross and give it a shot, but be warned. You may become addicted, and end up like Nick, putting the tire dealer's kids through college.

LOL. Gonna pass on the race track for now. I need to save money to make payments on this one (One expensive little toy)

Pinecone
04-16-2005, 11:21 AM
Let's see, how many racing picutres of BMWs have you seen since the CSLs in the early 70s that do NOT have the inside front wheel off the ground? Not many.

If every BMW racing team is doing it, and in all their testing have found it to be the fastest, maybe it is faster? :)