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JG
05-01-2005, 08:46 AM
I didn't think there were any crash test results out yet for the X3.

I came across this page at the NHTSA - 25MPH frontal crash tests for a 2004 X3 3.0i

http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/database/nrd-11/asp/TestTableDetails.asp?LJC=5154

If nothing else - the images are fascinating.

You can download a very large 30Mbyte 460 page report in Acrobat format which contains all the still photos at the end.

The end of report photos of 2, 3 and 6 year old passengers are a bit odd. However I am not sure of the exact nature of what is being simulated? Makes you wonder about the settings for the passenger side occupant detector.

I am looking through the report to see if I can make any sense of the results. There are definite differences between passenger and driver in some of the numbers.

The report even indicates the dealer and purchase price. This was an early vehicle 3/5/04.

There are videos in AVI format. The rear passenger in video 1 gets quite a throw forward. There are 25 or so videos. I didn't realize they chalked all the dummies up to track where body parts impacted.

The videos raise a few questions. Where are the other air bags? My 2005 came with front airbags for driver and passenger, incl. occupant detector, side thorax airbags for driver and front passenger, and HPS head airbag system, front and rear. Were the last two not available - or options in 2004?

Look at the pounding the rear passenger takes in video 7 ouch! In video 13 the driver bag deploys considerably sooner than the passenger.

Note to self: check that head restraint is at the correct level! :eek: and get some kneepads...........

Video 10 shows the suspension from below.

Video 17 shows in real time - (25MPH looks pretty fast in real time)

Shame to see a nice vehicle like that damaged.

What do they do with them after the tests? It doesn't look like that much damage. The testing agency and vehicle are in Wisconsin - so if you are buying a used 2004 black X3 - check for chalk dust!

smokeminside
05-01-2005, 05:19 PM
they don't use a stripped vehicle...the one tested has the power seat controls. Perhaps the options matter when checking a vehicle's performance? :dunno:

Either way, interesting stuff.....the knee impact is scary. I'm tall, and my knees are already close to the dash :eeps:

SARAFIL
05-01-2005, 06:18 PM
they don't use a stripped vehicle...the one tested has the power seat controls. Perhaps the options matter when checking a vehicle's performance? :dunno:

Either way, interesting stuff.....the knee impact is scary. I'm tall, and my knees are already close to the dash :eeps:

These agencies normally buy a car off of a dealer's lot to make sure they don't get cars from the manufacturer that have been rigged. In this case, that car looks like one of the early demos that all dealers got-- a X3 3.0 6-speed in Black Sapphire with Tan leather.

torzeck
05-05-2005, 01:35 AM
so that probably contributes to the knee impact and rear passengers really moving.

smokeminside
05-05-2005, 06:50 AM
Sarafil and Torzeck....always learning stuff here... :thumbup:

pipo
05-05-2005, 10:08 AM
so that probably contributes to the knee impact and rear passengers really moving.

For some reason, it looks like the front passengers are unbelted and the rear passenger is belted and sitting in the middle position.

JG
05-05-2005, 08:00 PM
For some reason, it looks like the front passengers are unbelted and the rear passenger is belted and sitting in the middle position.

I assume now that the test is 25mph (unbelted front - belted rear) for frontal impact - with the main intent to test the front airbags.

It is still odd to me the, other standard airbags are not part of the test.

Also if you look at the acrobat file you will see lots of other photos of various aged children sitting in the front seat in various positions.

Other photos are shown where they rotate the vehicle 360 degrees - I assume to simulate fluid loss.

Hopefully we will get a simplified rating soon and not what appears to be raw data from a testing agency.

pipo
05-05-2005, 09:56 PM
I assume now that the test is 25mph (unbelted front - belted rear) for frontal impact - with the main intent to test the front airbags.

It is still odd to me the, other standard airbags are not part of the test.

Also if you look at the acrobat file you will see lots of other photos of various aged children sitting in the front seat in various positions.

Other photos are shown where they rotate the vehicle 360 degrees - I assume to simulate fluid loss.

Hopefully we will get a simplified rating soon and not what appears to be raw data from a testing agency.

I read that the belted rear dummy was included only for "research and development" and not part of the official test.

The other airbags probably wouldn't deploy in a 25mph frontal crash (I don't believe they were disabled; there was just no trigger impact for the side or head bags).

I believe the child dummies were used to test the seat sensor that disables the front airbag unless the passenger weighs more than the programmed threshold weight. I'm not sure what else the testers were up to with the child dummies, especially the photos that show them with their chins taped to the dashboard. Perhaps to test dummy impacts when unbelted kids are riding in the front perched on the seat close to the dash? Didn't have time to read the whole 460 page report!

From what I could glean from the test data, the unbelted front dummies fared well, receiving impacts well under the maximum permissible levels.

All that said, I'd also love to see complete and comprehensive crash test results in more digestible form. :banghead:

juliefiis
03-17-2006, 06:13 PM
I was in a very minor accident which most refer to as "kissing bumpers" - I hit a car in front of me at less than 5mph in bumper-to-bumper freeway traffic while in my 2006 X3 3.0i (born 11/18/05). There was only a scratch on my bumper and on the rear bumper of the car I hit. The impace was frontal only, no diagonal thrust or direction at all, HOWEVER my driver side airbag AND BOTH SIDE CURTAIN AIRBAGS deployed!!

Dealer claims bags deployed as designs, however their technical literature provided to the insurance inspector indicates otherwise. We (myself and insurance rep) accept the driver bag coming out since they deploy based on deceleration and impact and not based on speed, however the side bags deploying is troubling. Now waiting for factory rep to come inspect the car b/c we suspect there is a problem with sensors or other mechanisms involved in triggering the bags. meanwhile, car inoperable and could be 2 weeks or more before it is repaired and returned to me. Insurance rep has been awesome but BMW has been fairly apathetic and discourteous which I find quite disheartening after plunking down almost $50k for a fully loaded vehicle.

Anyone else have suspicious airbag deployments?

Brent P
03-18-2006, 09:24 AM
One thing I noticed is that the driver seat position is farther forward than it would be for a normal driver, and thus the dummy's knees are far closer to the dash than normal, as is the dummy's upper body in relation to the steering wheel.

I sat in our X3 (I'm 6'1" with 35" inseam), and my knees are five inches away from the dash bulkhead at my optimum setting (4" when I move forward to create more room for rear passengers). The dummy's knees look 2" away from the bulkhead at most. There is also no way my hands come close to being as close to the steering wheel as the dummy's do when my arms are in a similar position. What it looks like to me is the dummy is in typical "bad driver position", rather than proper driving position, and this will definitely create worse leg and upper body injuries.

Godot
03-18-2006, 09:29 AM
I was in a very minor accident which most refer to as "kissing bumpers" - I hit a car in front of me at less than 5mph in bumper-to-bumper freeway traffic while in my 2006 X3 3.0i (born 11/18/05). There was only a scratch on my bumper and on the rear bumper of the car I hit. The impace was frontal only, no diagonal thrust or direction at all, HOWEVER my driver side airbag AND BOTH SIDE CURTAIN AIRBAGS deployed!!

Dealer claims bags deployed as designs, however their technical literature provided to the insurance inspector indicates otherwise. We (myself and insurance rep) accept the driver bag coming out since they deploy based on deceleration and impact and not based on speed, however the side bags deploying is troubling. Now waiting for factory rep to come inspect the car b/c we suspect there is a problem with sensors or other mechanisms involved in triggering the bags. meanwhile, car inoperable and could be 2 weeks or more before it is repaired and returned to me. Insurance rep has been awesome but BMW has been fairly apathetic and discourteous which I find quite disheartening after plunking down almost $50k for a fully loaded vehicle.

Anyone else have suspicious airbag deployments?

I used to be in the insurance field, and did handle a few interesting airbag cases. Including side airbags being deployed when they were not supposed to. It all depends on the mechanics of the accident itself. Even though you are involved in a frontal impact, the actual impact itself is still felt throughout the entire vehicle. Even something as small as 5mph can set off airbags and other features (seatbelt tensioners etc) for safety, including side ones. Even though the impact itself is a frontal impact, it also depends on where the impact occured (ie. slightly off centre, although you mentioned it was head on).

One of my most interesting cases I was investigating was a hit and run where our insured's vehicle was parked at night. They claimed it was a hit and run, however the airbag was deployed. No matter how much we tried we could not get a straight answer from the manufacturer as to where or not the airbag would deploy with the vehicle in park, ignition turned off, and no occupant in the vehicle.

Since the claim amount was under $5,000 it was not persued any further, the claim was paid as the legal battle would have been into the $20K and above range, not worth it.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that regardless of the incident and what deployed (or in some situations not), the manufacturer is probably going to stand behind their vehicle, since in an accident there are tooo many variables to take into account, and there is no way to re-create the EXACT situation all over again.

Godot
03-18-2006, 09:34 AM
One thing I noticed is that the driver seat position is farther forward than it would be for a normal driver, and thus the dummy's knees are far closer to the dash than normal, as is the dummy's upper body in relation to the steering wheel.

I sat in our X3 (I'm 6'1" with 35" inseam), and my knees are five inches away from the dash bulkhead at my optimum setting (4" when I move forward to create more room for rear passengers). The dummy's knees look 2" away from the bulkhead at most. There is also no way my hands come close to being as close to the steering wheel as the dummy's do when my arms are in a similar position. What it looks like to me is the dummy is in typical "bad driver position", rather than proper driving position, and this will definitely create worse leg and upper body injuries.


Typically for most crash tests they will assume the worst case senarios. ie kids jumping up and down unbelted in the back seat, bad driving positions etc. to attempt to re-create the most serious of injuries. When driving (unless my grand mother is in the car with me only to try to hide the speedometer from her) I can't think of any time I have been in "perfect" driving position. They typically try to re-create a relaxed position that is going into a startled position (tensing up towards the moment of impact). Thus your feet planted against the floor/brake pedal.