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-   -   How to check & replace your BMW front disc brakes and rotors (http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=266819)

bluebee 03-02-2008 01:19 AM

How to check & replace your BMW front disc brakes and rotors
 
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Can you guys give me quick advice on checking and replacing the pads and rotors on a 2001 BMW 525i that I bought recently from a friend?

The check brake light went on about a month ago. I read all I could on the topic, including the shop manual that came with the car. I tried the job near the end of the day today.

In the end, I failed to replace or fix anything.

But I learned a bunch. Since I felt this forum didn't have a complete how to (I couldn't find it anyway) that told me exactly what I needed to know, I'll write one up so everyone else doesn't have to experiment as much as I did.

When I post that writeup to this thread, I'll ask what else you'd do to improve the procedure for better success for everyone?

How's that sound as a starting point?

xaff 03-02-2008 01:22 AM

Step 1. WASH THAT CAR. Dude for crying out loud.. your wheels are really.. really dirty.

Step 2. Follow the step by step procedure. :

http://www.pelicanparts.com/bmw/tech...Brake_Pads.htm

bluebee 03-02-2008 01:54 AM

The first question is where is the best howto for checking & fixing brakes?
 
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The first question is where is the best howto for checking & fixing the brakes on a BMW 525i?

I found this by googling how to decipher my VIN to figure out what car I have:
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/

And, I found an old and outdated for my car BMW VIN decoder at:
http://www.bmwtips.com/tipsntricks/t...n_decoding.htm

That combination told me my new vehicle was a BMW 5-series E39 sedan, 525i USA model, 2001 model year, with the M54 engine, & an automatic transmission

Knowing this was an "E39" helped me decide on this bimmerfest forum to post my (failed so far) experience in checking & replacing the front brake pads.

Searching on all the permutations and combinations of "BMW E39 525i Brake Pads & Rotors Check & Replacement", I found a few not very helpful FAQs, for example:
http://www.bmwtips.com/tipsntricks/BrakeInfo/brakes.htm
and, unfortunately, only one even halfway decent how to, for example:
http://www.bmwtips.com/tipsntricks/C...gBrakePads.htm

Having never worked on this BMW before, I had to read up on even the simplest things, like how to jack the car up properly!
http://www.bmwtips.com/tipsntricks/jack/jack.htm

I still don't know where to get rotors and pads because the dealership is closed (I started around 7pm on Saturday), my Bay Area AutoZone had nothing, neither did the local Kragan. I was hoping to complete the job tomorrow (Sunday).

bluebee 03-02-2008 02:04 AM

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Quote:

Follow the step by step procedure
http://www.pelicanparts.com/bmw/tech...Brake_Pads.htm
Oh my! I searched and searched and had NOT uncovered that 'pelican parts' howto. Maybe because it's for a 3-series and I was searching for 5-series articles. Dunno if they would be the same or not.

I'm assuming you're suggesting the 3-series is the same procedure as the 5-series?

Either way, I will read it now and intersperse afterward my experiences with doing the brakes and getting nowwhere given the (inadequate) information I had found and given the Bentley manuals that come with the car!

Thank you for the helpful pelican link!

bluebee 03-02-2008 03:11 AM

Does it matter that I'm missing some rubber jack point holders?
 
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I noticed from the howto that I referenced that my new BMW is missing the jack point holders (rubber pads under the frame in four spots). All mine are missing. Why would they be missing and do you think it matters?

Anyway, following the previously referenced jack point article, I parked the bluebee bmw on a slight downslope; I then drove the bluebee bmw onto ramps to lift the front end; I then chocked the front and back of one rear wheel; this enabled me to get the jack onto the suggested front center rubber jack point; and then I was able to put jack stands on the two front side frame jack points (which seem to be missing their rubber pads).

bluebee 03-02-2008 03:33 AM

Is it just me or is it hard to find a 7mm hex wrench?
 
12 Attachment(s)
I had difficulty removing the five 17mm lug bolts holding on each front wheel. I tried multiple socket wrenches and used my feet until I could get them to budge.

However, that was nothing compared to what it took to get the 7mm caliper bolts out!

To remove the two 7mm caliper bolts, I needed to run to the store to get a wrench that fit! I tried three stores before I finally found a hex set that had a 7mm hex socket! I never did find 7mm allen (L-shaped) wrenches!

Be forwarned if you are reading this to do your very first BMW 5-series brake job!

bluebee 03-02-2008 03:56 AM

12 Attachment(s)
Removing the caliper spring was an interesting manipulative act.

After contemplating my enemy, screwdrivering the spring in the middle to pull it up and then needlenosing the hole grips out seemed to be the best way to remove the spring.

Then it was time to pry the caliper off. Since I was working the right front side, there was no brake sensor so I skipped that step.

The prying seems to be upward being best to get the caliper off. The Bentley shop manuals that come with the car say to open the master cylinder brake reservoir but when I looked in the hood I didn't find it so I skipped that step. It was only way later that I found it hidden under an air intake!

For those of you following this procedure to do it yourself, take a moment to locate the brake master cylinder in the engine compartment as noted in the Bentleys.

Once I had the caliper off, I hung it on the shock springs to that the brake lines wouldn't be stressed unduly.

To keep the disc brakes from closing up on me, I put a borrowed disc brake spreader into the jaws of the caliper and screwed it a bit to prevent them from snapping shut by accident while I had my hands in there.

Now I was ready to take some measurements!

bluebee 03-02-2008 04:14 AM

Anyone know what an allowable warpage for a rotor is?
 
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The first thing I noticed was there was no grease on either the spring or on the two 7mm caliper bolts. Checking the shop manual that came with the car, it says not to grease them. I wonder how they slide without being greased. Anyway, I decided to clean them with brake cleaner but it didn't really do much. I don't know what you guys do so you can suggest something here.

Moving on to the measurements......

Checking the rotors with my fingernail, they seemed to be in good shape with respect to smoothness. My fingernail didn't catch too much on any particular grooves and all were smooth. So the rotor passed the smoothness test.

I borrowed a mic to see how fat the rotors were......

I checked ten places just like the Bentley manual said. Pretty much all were in the .760 to 0.777 inch range which seems a bit small for the specification (0.800 inches). I wonder how they got so thin as they seemed in good shape otherwise.

Checking for warps, I borrowed a dial gage. Hooking it to keep it from wandering was problematic so I ended up vicegripping it to the spring and letting it hang down onto the rotor as I spun the rotor by hand from the lug bolts placed back in the lug holes.

I checked in a few concentric circles and all were within 0.002 or 0.003 inch. I didn't see a warpage spec in the Bentleys that came with the car. Did I miss that? It didn't seem to be in the brake section (page 340).

bluebee 03-02-2008 04:25 AM

Where would you recommend I get the necessary parts?
 
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So there I am. I got a ride to the local Kragan who had the rear brake pads in stock in ceramic but not the fronts nor any of the two sensors. I think these pads for a 525i are semimetallic so I declined the ceramics. What would you use for totally sedate driving? Ceramic or semimetallic?

Anyway, I was able to make it to AutoZone by closing time on Saturday but they didn't have anything in stock, not the rears, not the fronts, nor either of the two sensors.

I could have ordered the parts for about $55 at Kragen for the pads and about $25 for the sensors - or I could have ordered them at AutoZone for about $35 but they wouldn't be in by tomorrow and I was hoping to finish this job by then.

Do you know where we should get parts? I'm new to BMW so I don't know where you guys go for parts. I assume nobody goes to the dealer unless they have to. Is there a lower-priced dealer we can go to like we have for other makes? Or do they all do the horrid mark ups that my local dealership seems to.

Anyeay, I did find, by googling, a parts list at realoem.com
12 FRONT BRAKE PAD WEAR SENSOR 1 34352229018 $18.41

11 FRONT BRAKE PADS ASBESTOS-FREE JURID 187 1 34116761280 $102.39 See MH 0027571

bluebee 03-02-2008 04:51 AM

What would you suggest to get the parts by tomorrow?
 
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So, here I am, 4am, on Sunday, and no Bluebee BMW!
1) Do you agree I need the following four parts?
01 BRAKE DISC, VENTILATED 296X22 2 34116767061 $107.69

11 REPAIR KIT, BRAKE PADS ASBESTOS-FREE JURID 187 1 34116761280 $102.39 See MH 0027571

12 BRAKE PAD WEAR SENSOR 1 34352229018 $18.41

13 NEVER SEEZ COMPOUND 100G 1 83239407830

2) WHERE would you get these four parts on a Sunday morning?

3) Do you know what supplement "jurid 187" and notes "MH 0027571" and Supplement "296X22" all mean?

4) Also, would you replace the rotor?

5) Do you know where I can get warp specs for the rotor?

I drive slowly so I do not stress the brakes (I hardly ever use them).
The 2001 525i has about 75K miles on it (almost all from the previous owner).

6) Would you also replace the wheel bearings if you replaced the rotor?

7) What kind of grease do you use to lube this and WHAT do you lube anyway? Here is what the Kragan guys sold me for three dollars (pic).
Where do I put it? I supposed it goes on the back of the plate which I suppose comes with the pad. And maybe on the spring.

I'm sorry but I'm getting very sleepy and must go to sleep. I will check in the morning when I awake. I hope there's no earthquake because my BlueBee is still on jacks stands.

Pleasant dreams.

mmm635 03-02-2008 07:01 AM

1) Do you agree I need the following four parts?
01 BRAKE DISC, VENTILATED 296X22 2 34116767061 $107.69

11 REPAIR KIT, BRAKE PADS ASBESTOS-FREE JURID 187 1 34116761280 $102.39 See MH 0027571

12 BRAKE PAD WEAR SENSOR 1 34352229018 $18.41

13 NEVER SEEZ COMPOUND 100G 1 83239407830

Rotor is correct, I would opt for some better pads like Axxis ultimates, sensor does not need to be replaced unless the warning came on or you could hear then scraping. Get a good synthetic lubricant for the guide bolts the caliper slides on. Honestly, I would not get those parts froma a local store unless they have the OEM parts to choose from.

2) WHERE would you get these four parts on a Sunday morning?

Difficult to advise since I am not familiar with there you live.


3) Do you know what supplement "jurid 187" and notes "MH 0027571" and Supplement "296X22" all mean?

Don't worry about that. 296 is the diameter and 22 is the thickness of the rotor. 187 is the pad shape designation.


4) Also, would you replace the rotor?

Yes.

5) Do you know where I can get warp specs for the rotor?

They are either warped or not. You can get the runout specs on the hat of the rotor. Just get some cleaner and something a little abrasive and the numbers will appear on the side.

I drive slowly so I do not stress the brakes (I hardly ever use them).
The 2001 525i has about 75K miles on it (almost all from the previous owner).

6) Would you also replace the wheel bearings if you replaced the rotor?

Don't replace unless you can hear a definite noise/humming coming from each side while driving in the opposite direction. Right direction indicates bad left bearing and Left direction indicates bad left wheel bearing.


7) What kind of grease do you use to lube this and WHAT do you lube anyway? Here is what the Kragan guys sold me for three dollars (pic).
Where do I put it? I supposed it goes on the back of the plate which I suppose comes with the pad. And maybe on the spring.

I use permatex Brake disc Quiet - It works quite well. It is more of a glue than grease. The grease should be used on the guide bolts (synthetic), anti-seize should be used on the rotor bolt, lugs, and on face of hub, and the Permatex disc brake quiet should be applied to the back of the pads. What they gave you will work just fine.

The trick to using the Disc Brake Quiet is to apply it in the shape of the contact point. On the outer pad it will look like a U shape and on the inner pad it will be circular where the piston makes contact. Use th old pads as a template. You need to apply some of the synthetic lubricant to the tracks on the carrier in which the ends of the pads set - they can bind over time. Once the pads are set into position and the caliper is back on, do not lubricate the spring - it is not necessary. Once the assembly is back together, open the driver's door and stick your foot on the brake pedal and slowly depress it. This will allow the pads to make the proper contact with the rotor, thus allowing the Permatex Disc Brake Quiet to dry with the pads in the proper position. This reduces the chance of improper seating, thus brake squeal down the road. Allow the Permatex to dry for a while before you start driving the car.

Most importantly, you need to bed in the new brakes. Go to dave Zeckenhausen's website and read up on the procedure. Don't skip out on this process.

MMME30W 03-02-2008 07:17 AM

I just did my E46 brakes; they look very similar to the E39. If it helps, the thread is here:

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...ighlight=brake

Also, the E46 Brake DIY is here:

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...t=40523&page=2

bluebee 03-02-2008 10:41 AM

5 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by mmm635 (Post 3053222)
I would opt for some better pads like Axxis ultimates ... I would not get those parts from a a local store unless they have the OEM parts to choose from.



I am new to BMW and do not know WHERE to get good prices on good parts.

I figured if Kragen and AutoZone sold equivalent pads, they must be "OK" for an average owner (which is what I am). They'd get sued every day if they didn't sell OEM equivalents - right?

I also figured that the BMW dealership here in San Jose would take huge price advantage of me, having heard quite a few Stevenscreek price & service horror stories from my friends and coworkers who helped me make this new buying decision to own my own BMW (instead of always riding with them).

Since I have the whole thing apart, I'm TODAY in the market for pads and rotors -- so I do appreciate any advice as to where to get good parts at a good price today (Sunday) if possible!

BTW, thanks for the related E36 hock.net and less useful but still interesting E39 Zeckhouzen tutorials!

I've included the shrunkified PDFs of the more related hock.net E36 brake tutorial below (shrunk and broken up to < 500 KB) for others to reference should the web sites go down).

The reason I did all this work was that it was extremely difficult, very surprisingly, for me to find what I needed for the E39 to do my first brake job. I still don't have what I need even though I've read more than a dozen threads on the topic. Each provides a snippet or two of additional necessary information, while repeating all the rest. I'm trying to collect for others into this one thread what I've found that's useful.

bluebee 03-02-2008 11:42 AM

There are many brake tutorials, not very many for the E39, and none have all the deta
 
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So far, I've seen scores of brake tutorials, almost none of which are complete, but, almost all are usable. Most are not for the E39, but, after having done the removal, I see a lot is similar only after the fact (which isn't the point).

But, of course, a lot might be different, e.g., torques, parts, procedures, etc.

Anyway, here is a set of decent ones (given the caveats above).

Replacing rotors for an E36 (presumably similar for an E39):
http://www.bimmerdiy.com/diy/e36brakesystem/

Replacing front pads for an unspecified BMW:
http://m3.madrussian.net/diy_front_brake_pads.shtml

(lots more from that site):
http://m3.madrussian.net/diy.shtml

Replacing pads for an E46:
http://www.e46fanatics.com/howto/how...hp?howto_id=29

Ben Carufel 03-02-2008 11:52 AM

You are not going to find the parts you need today.

Sorry to tell you that, but it's the truth.

Your best bet is to order the rotors you need from someone like Pelican Parts or BMAParts.com. Order the proper pads as well (Axxis Ultimates are a good choice).

Once they arrive (BMA is in Glendale, Los Angeles, so you should have your parts by Tuesday) you can complete the job correctly.

bluebee 03-02-2008 06:03 PM

Basic question now is what to get and where for how much?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ben Carufel (Post 3053722)
Your best bet is to order the rotors you need from someone like Pelican Parts or BMAParts.com. Order the proper pads as well (Axxis Ultimates are a good choice).

I've resigned myself to this fact that Kragen and AutoZone don't have standard brakes, rotors, and sensors in stock. Sigh.

And, I'll never go to that local San Jose BMW dealership based on what I know about them from my friends. So I'm gonna order tomorrow the basic replacement for my E39 from somewhere else other than what is convenient.

Are *these* the preferred brands for normal OEM-style street driving:
Rotors = Brembo
Pads = Axxis Ultimates

Note: I don't race; I don't want to race; I just drive; so stock OEM is fine for me unless (and only unless) I can get better for less money; otherwise, stock OEM is just fine.

Are these preferred suppliers in *price-lowest* for *stock OEM* parts?
Pelican (CA) 888-280-7799 http://www.pelicanparts.com
BMAParts (CA) 888-262-3911 http://www.bmaparts.com
Bavauto (NH) (800-535-2002) http://www.bavauto.com
OemBimmerParts (TX) (210-445-7090)http://www.oembimmerparts.com
Circle BMW (NJ) 732-440-1238 http://www.circlebmw.com
Crevier BMW (CA) 800-309-2318 http://www.crevierbmw.com
Pacific BMW (CA) 800-542-9634 http://www.pacificbmw.com
RealOEM (unknown location?) (phone?) http://www.realoem.com/bmw
BMWfans (unknown location?) (phone?) www.bmwfans.info
Zeckhausen (NJ) 800-222-8893 www.zeckhausen.com

Any others for stock OEM parts or equiv?

For these part numbers:
(Front) Brake disc, 296x22, ventilated P/N 34-11-6-767-061
(Front) Inner hex bolt, M8x14, P/N 34-21-1-161-806
(Front) Repair kit, brake pads asbestos-free JURID 187 shape, P/N 34-11-6-761-280
(Front) Brake pad wear sensor, P/N 34-35-2-229-018
Never seez compound, 100grams, P/N 83-23-9-407-830

(Rear) Brake pad wear sensor, P/N 34-35-1-163-066
(Rear) Repair kit, brake pads, asbestos-free, TEXTAR T4071, P/N 34-21-6-761-281
(Rear) Brake disc, ventilated, 298x20, P/N 34-21-6-767-060
(Rear) Inner hex bolt, M8x14, P/N 34-21-1-161-806


BTW, while looking up parts, I find the word "Saloon" used to describe my car on some of these sites. I looked up saloon here, and even did a www.freetranslation.com on it and it doesn't mean anything other than saloon. What does saloon mean with respect to a BMW?
*******>********>























spydrz 03-02-2008 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bluebee (Post 3054407)
I've resigned myself to this fact that Kragen and AutoZone don't have standard brakes, rotors, and sensors in stock. Sigh.

And, I'll never go to that local San Jose BMW dealership based on what I know about them from my friends. So I'm gonna order tomorrow the basic replacement for my E39 from somewhere else other than what is convenient.

Are *these* the preferred brands for normal OEM-style street driving:
Rotors = Brembo
Pads = Axxis Ultimates

Note: I don't race; I don't want to race; I just drive; so stock OEM is fine for me unless (and only unless) I can get better for less money; otherwise, stock OEM is just fine.

Are these preferred suppliers in *price-lowest* for *stock OEM* parts?
Pelican (CA) 888-280-7799 http://www.pelicanparts.com
BMAParts (CA) 888-262-3911 http://www.bmaparts.com
Bavauto (NH) (800-535-2002) http://www.bavauto.com
OemBimmerParts (TX) (210-445-7090)http://www.oembimmerparts.com
Circle BMW (NJ) 732-440-1238 http://www.circlebmw.com
Crevier BMW (CA) 800-309-2318 http://www.crevierbmw.com
Pacific BMW (CA) 800-542-9634 http://www.pacificbmw.com
RealOEM (unknown location?) (phone?) http://www.realoem.com/bmw
BMWfans (unknown location?) (phone?) www.bmwfans.info
Zeckhausen (NJ) 800-222-8893 www.zeckhausen.com

Any others for stock OEM parts or equiv?

For these part numbers:
(Front) Brake disc, 296x22, ventilated P/N 34-11-6-767-061
(Front) Inner hex bolt, M8x14, P/N 34-21-1-161-806
(Front) Repair kit, brake pads asbestos-free JURID 187 shape, P/N 34-11-6-761-280
(Front) Brake pad wear sensor, P/N 34-35-2-229-018
Never seez compound, 100grams, P/N 83-23-9-407-830

(Rear) Brake pad wear sensor, P/N 34-35-1-163-066
(Rear) Repair kit, brake pads, asbestos-free, TEXTAR T4071, P/N 34-21-6-761-281
(Rear) Brake disc, ventilated, 298x20, P/N 34-21-6-767-060
(Rear) Inner hex bolt, M8x14, P/N 34-21-1-161-806


BTW, while looking up parts, I find the word "Saloon" used to describe my car on some of these sites. I looked up saloon here, and even did a www.freetranslation.com on it and it doesn't mean anything other than saloon. What does saloon mean with respect to a BMW?
*******>********>























"Saloon" is the UK term for a sedan. I don't know why. Same reason they use the term bonnet for a hood, and a hood is a convertible top.
Also try parts.crownauto.com for these pieces.

MMME30W 03-02-2008 06:49 PM

www.turnermotorsports.com

MatWiz 03-02-2008 06:49 PM

What Ben told you in post #15, because they are in CA and you need it ASAP.

Otherwise, and next time, from zeckhausen.

Get the Axxis pads.
Get whatever oem rotors Pelican or BMA is selling you.

mw

Crutzy 03-03-2008 04:09 PM

What strikes me as very interesting is very few people seem to check disk runout!
You, of all people, have checked your runout.
Amazing. Simply amazing.
I'll bet nobody can find anyone else who has posted a screenshot of them checking runout!
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/att...5&d=1204456414
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/att...5&d=1204456414

bluebee 03-03-2008 05:15 PM

Does ceramic buy me anything over semi-metallic given I drive normally?
 
Quote:

What strikes me as very interesting is very few people seem to check disk runout!
I checked the warpage (0.002 to 0.0025 inches) but I couldn't find the specifications for the maximum!

By the way Pacific BMW is out of the running because they don't do shipping (someone did mention that but it only sank in today when I called).

Likewise, EuroParts has ceramic pads for almost the same price as semimetallic (I don't know the exact spelling but they didn't carry Axxis; they had "PBR Ultimates" for the front and "Miley" for the back pads). Likewise, PelicanParts didn't have Axxis either.

QUESTION: Given the price is the same and given I'll never race ever (I drive normally) - would you recommend the ceramics or the semi-metallics?

I'm assuming from what I've read that this is the distinction (please correct where I guess wrong):

SEMI-METALLIC: "OE" (original equipment)
CERAMIC: After market

SEMI-METALLIC: Very slightly cheaper (but only by a couple of dollars)
CERAMIC: Almost the same price (at least at Europarts & Pelican Parts)

SEMI-METALLIC: Not as fade resistant (but then again, I don't race)
CERAMIC: Fade resistant so good for frequent high speed braking)

SEMI-METALLIC: Softer so longer-lasting and better on the rotors
CERAMIC: Harder (I'm guessing) so may "chew" up rotors (I read that)

SEMI-METALLIC: Dusty (I read that somewhere)
CERAMIC: Less dusty (but what has that got to do with braking?)

SEMI-METALLIC: Quieter (I'm guessing based on what EuroParts said)
CERAMIC: Noisier (again, what has that got to do with braking?)

Overall, I'm confused.
If the ceramics were more expensive, the choice would be easy (go with the semi-metallics as OE); but given the price is about the same, that makes the choice harder.

Does ceramic buy me anything over semi-metallic given I drive normally?

bluebee 03-03-2008 08:59 PM

The BMW dealerships are 2x the price of the parts houses
 
5 Attachment(s)
I was only able to contact a half-dozen suppliers but what I found was that Crevier and the local BMW were 2x the prices for the same quality than the other bimmerfest suggested suppliers for front and rear pads, rotors, and sensors.

Here's a cut and paste from my spreadsheet, bearing in mind some (like EuroParts) quoted Brembo rotors while others (like Bavarian) quoted ATE; likewise with the pads where some (like AllEuro) quoted Textor while others (like Pelican) quoted Jurid, while others (like Europarts) quoted PBR Ultimates, and others (like Bavarian) quoted Pagid, etc.

All in all, since what I want is as close to OE as possible, I'll go with the best price from the set below (I'm still waiting on the answer to the ceramics vs semimetallic that I posed above though - since ceramics are essentially the same price as semimetallic).
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/att...0&d=1204604833
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/att...2&d=1204604863

Ben Carufel 03-03-2008 10:04 PM

OH. MY. GOD.

With all due respect -- are you an engineer with tons of time on your hands??

I have *never* seen anyone turn a brake job into an hours-long research experiment.

In all honesty, I am torn between wanting to respect you and wanting to ridicule you.

I'm going to go with respect, because you have the tenacity of no mortal I've ever encountered...

:)

94is 03-03-2008 10:29 PM

Dear God. :rofl:

bluebee 03-03-2008 11:11 PM

Quote:

I have *never* seen anyone turn a brake job into an hours-long research experiment.
Hi Ben,
I've never done this job before so it behooves me to make the right moves. Since I don't have the intuition you guys have (e.g., you intuitively know whether you want CERAMIC or SEMI-METALLIC pads), I have to research or ask (which is just another way of researching).

You guys have helped me a lot so far and I appreciate that help.

BTW, I'm a program manager. I analyze and organize projects much more complicated than a brake job for a living. Almost all of them go wrong in some way or another as we're always working things that have never before been done. In the post mortems, we find, in general, the mistakes were simple to predict, if only we knew enough ahead of time what simple things to look for.

I'm just trying to simplify a brake job given the variables handed to me, one of which is finding a good supplier (given the cost difference between any two suppliers is over 100%!

I'm still wavering on getting CERAMIC vs SEMI-METALLIC if anyone can tell me what the difference for a sedate driver might be (it's not cost).


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