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-   -   **Consolidated RFT Failures/Issues Thread** (http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=518954)

trevdean 02-05-2011 10:59 AM

**Consolidated RFT Failures/Issues Thread**
 
Guys I was dismayed to find a bubble or protrusion in the sidewall of my RFT this morning. The sensor is not on in the vehicle and I cannot notice any performance degradation, but it is certainly visible. I don't have my digital camera otherwise I would include a photo. Recommendations welcome, do I keep driving it or take it in, from what i have read there is no repairing them, just replacing. Bummer...I felt a pothole last week but didn't think it was that bad?

highyo 02-05-2011 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trevdean (Post 5826923)
Guys I was dismayed to find a bubble or protrusion in the sidewall of my RFT this morning. The sensor is not on in the vehicle and I cannot notice any performance degradation, but it is certainly visible. I don't have my digital camera otherwise I would include a photo. Recommendations welcome, do I keep driving it or take it in, from what i have read there is no repairing them, just replacing. Bummer...I felt a pothole last week but didn't think it was that bad?

get it swapped. it will get bigger and bigger. hope you have the insurance....

trevdean 02-05-2011 11:09 AM

Argh! No insurance, thought it was a waste of money. Never had run flats before. What a bummer. 3500 miles. Can u replace one tire only without jeopardizing performance?

bfv 02-05-2011 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trevdean (Post 5826951)
Argh! No insurance, thought it was a waste of money. Never had run flats before. What a bummer. 3500 miles. Can u replace one tire only without jeopardizing performance?

What's the tire size? 17"/18"/19"20"??

trevdean 02-05-2011 11:53 AM

19 inch, m sport wheel.

bfv 02-05-2011 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trevdean (Post 5827031)
19 inch, m sport wheel.

Replacement with a new tire is ideal....highly recommend an insurance after you fix it.

Needsdecaf 02-05-2011 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trevdean (Post 5826951)
Argh! No insurance, thought it was a waste of money. Never had run flats before. What a bummer. 3500 miles. Can u replace one tire only without jeopardizing performance?


Check the DVD in your glove compartment. Yes, you do have insurance...comes with the car.

1HOT BMR 02-05-2011 01:39 PM

What brand is your tire? I think it happens to Good Years more than Michelins. You do have insurance if your tire is a Good Year - BMW will not replace it but a Good Year store will. I read the Good Year insurance someone posted a while back and it clearly states that road hazards are covered :thumbup:

highyo 02-05-2011 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Needsdecaf (Post 5827071)
Check the DVD in your glove compartment. Yes, you do have insurance...comes with the car.

what comes with the car? tire insurance?

GHOST PROTOCOL 02-05-2011 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trevdean (Post 5826951)
Argh! No insurance, thought it was a waste of money. Never had run flats before. What a bummer. 3500 miles. Can u replace one tire only without jeopardizing performance?

FYI: It is not a run flat tire issue. Rather, it is a low profile tire issue. When you selected the M sport package, you got the 19 inch rims instead of the 18 inch rims. The tires on both the 18 and 19 inch rims are low profile, but the tires on the 19 inch rims are low profile to a greater degree. Therefore, you are more at risk to road hazards. Several months ago, BMW updated its website and now advises that your are at risk to road hazards when using the low profile tires. No such warning is given for the 17 inch rims because the tires used on those rims are not low profile.

bfv 02-05-2011 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CRMESQ (Post 5827474)
FYI: It is not a run flat tire issue. Rather, it is a low profile tire issue. When you selected the M sport package, you got the 19 inch rims instead of the 18 inch rims. The tires on both the 18 and 19 inch rims are low profile, but the tires on the 19 inch rims are low profile to a greater degree. Therefore, you are more at risk to road hazards. Several months ago, BMW updated its website and now advises that your are at risk to road hazards when using the low profile tires. No such warning is given for the 17 inch rims because the tires used on those rims are not low profile.

So, is spending money on tire/wheel insurance advisable when you have 17" all season RFTs? I plan to have them on 528i and wonder spending $1000 for 3 year is worth....I live in NYC so meeting pothole is a possibility at every block:eeps:

SANguru 02-05-2011 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CRMESQ (Post 5827474)
FYI: It is not a run flat tire issue. Rather, it is a low profile tire issue. When you selected the M sport package, you got the 19 inch rims instead of the 18 inch rims. The tires on both the 18 and 19 inch rims are low profile, but the tires on the 19 inch rims are low profile to a greater degree. Therefore, you are more at risk to road hazards. Several months ago, BMW updated its website and now advises that your are at risk to road hazards when using the low profile tires. No such warning is given for the 17 inch rims because the tires used on those rims are not low profile.

it's very much a RFT issue. If you look at an RFT design, where the stiffer sidewall meets the lip is the weakest link on the tires. Normal high performance tires don't have this.

to the OP, a bubble forms essentially when there is a crack/split in the sidewall. It is unsafe to drive on it and I would have it replaced ASAP as the integrity of the tire is severely compromised.

Needsdecaf 02-05-2011 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by highyo (Post 5827270)
what comes with the car? tire insurance?

Yup.

Check your glovebox. There should be a CD in there. Each tire has some type of warranty. The Goodyear, for sure, covers road hazzards.

GHOST PROTOCOL 02-05-2011 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bfv (Post 5827482)
So, is spending money on tire/wheel insurance advisable when you have 17" all season RFTs? I plan to have them on 528i and wonder spending $1000 for 3 year is worth....I live in NYC so meeting pothole is a possibility at every block:eeps:

In my opinion, it is not worth the money. We have a 2006 Three Series with 16 inch rims and non low profile tires, but they are fun flats. We have never had a problem in five years and that vehicle has been driven hard on some very bad roads. In short, the tires on the 16 inch rims are not low profile and they can take more of a beating on the roadway, unlike the low profile tires. The 17 inch rims on the Five Series do not use low profile tires and should not pose a problem.

jpointe 02-05-2011 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Needsdecaf (Post 5827506)
Yup.

Check your glovebox. There should be a CD in there. Each tire has some type of warranty. The Goodyear, for sure, covers road hazzards.

That said, would the additional insurance that doesn't come with the car be more relevant for rim damage as opposed to tire damage, since the latter type of damage is covered by the tire's warranty? Are wheel insurance options out there that only cover the wheel and not the tire? If so, perhaps this is a way to be adequately protected (both with respect to wheels and tires) while minimizing extra cost.

Rafa 02-05-2011 05:09 PM

How long after going over a pothole will the bubble form? Is it always on the outside of the tire or is it advisable to check the inside wall periodically?

Please reply if you know the answer; your response is appreciated.

GHOST PROTOCOL 02-05-2011 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SANguru (Post 5827502)
it's very much a RFT issue. If you look at an RFT design, where the stiffer sidewall meets the lip is the weakest link on the tires. Normal high performance tires don't have this.

to the OP, a bubble forms essentially when there is a crack/split in the sidewall. It is unsafe to drive on it and I would have it replaced ASAP as the integrity of the tire is severely compromised.

I respectfully disagree. The inability for tires on 18 & 19 inch rims to hold up is rooted in them being low profile, not run flat. We have 16 inch rims with run flat tires on our 2006 Three Series. In the past five years that vehicle has been driven very hard on some very bad roads and we have never had a problem. We also had a 2004 Jaguar S Type with 17 inch rims with non run flat tires and never had a problem. On the other hand, we also had a 2008 Jaguar S Type with 18 inch rims and non run flat tires, but they were low profile. Once the first winter hit, we went through about 8 low profile non run flat tires in the first several weeks of January 2009. We changed to 17 inch rims with non low profile tires and never had another problem.

simonjb 02-05-2011 06:37 PM

Same thing......
 
Same thing happened to me. I ended up with two bubbles on the same tire after hitting a big pothole at night. Rim looks ok. Getting it replaced on Tuesday.

1HOT BMR 02-05-2011 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CRMESQ (Post 5827525)
I respectfully disagree. The inability for tires on 18 & 19 inch rims to hold up is rooted in them being low profile, not run flat. We have 16 inch rims with run flat tires on our 2006 Three Series. In the past five years that vehicle has been driven very hard on some very bad roads and we have never had a problem. We also had a 2004 Jaguar S Type with 17 inch rims with non run flat tires and never had a problem. On the other hand, we also had a 2008 Jaguar S Type with 18 inch rims and non run flat tires, but they were low profile. Once the first winter hit, we went through about 8 low profile non run flat tires in the first several weeks of January 2009. We changed to 17 inch rims with non low profile tires and never had another problem.

I agree with Sanguru above, it is a RFT issue. I've had low profile tires on my cars for years - 18 and 19in - and I've hit potholes that have destroyed the rim yet the tires have never developed bubbles on the side. I have mounted the same tires on new rims with no issues - I use Pirelli PZeros on my cars - except my new 550 of course, but that will change as soon as I bust the first one :D

Beemersn 02-05-2011 07:18 PM

I had a bubble on my E60 non RFT Conti sports tire. Didn't have any on the E93, E60 530 or E85 (all with RFT and and sports package).

My dealer replaced both front tires under my tire/wheel insurance. I believe this is best $ 1000 I spent on my M5. So far I have got 4 tires replaced and have 3 years more left on the warranty.

SANguru 02-05-2011 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CRMESQ (Post 5827525)
I respectfully disagree. The inability for tires on 18 & 19 inch rims to hold up is rooted in them being low profile, not run flat. We have 16 inch rims with run flat tires on our 2006 Three Series. In the past five years that vehicle has been driven very hard on some very bad roads and we have never had a problem. We also had a 2004 Jaguar S Type with 17 inch rims with non run flat tires and never had a problem. On the other hand, we also had a 2008 Jaguar S Type with 18 inch rims and non run flat tires, but they were low profile. Once the first winter hit, we went through about 8 low profile non run flat tires in the first several weeks of January 2009. We changed to 17 inch rims with non low profile tires and never had another problem.

There was a bulletin on the bridgestone RE050 RFT's a couple years back regardless of tire size. Even 328 with 17's on higher profile tires will crack if you hit large enough pot hole. Dunlops also had issues. Driving a car hard and on rough roads will not cause bubbles but impact with potholes regardless of tire profile will.

I've hit some pretty bad potholes in my Fcar with Pirelli P-Zero corsas with no bubbles even on 30 series tires up front.. the bridgestones and dunlops were a different story.

GHOST PROTOCOL 02-06-2011 10:17 AM

I guess we will have to agree to disagree. My research into the tire failure issue (sidewall bubbles) leads to the conclusion that the issue has to do with the tires being low profile. BMW has "come clean" on the issue and now acknowledges the problems associated with low profile tires (look at BMW's web site and the foot notes that they have inserted regarding the risks associated with low profile tires). If the problem were rooted in the tires being run flats, rather than low profile, why would BMW issue warnings on their web site for the risks associated with using low profile tires, but not include warnings regarding the run flats? BMW is now, in all probability, issuing the warnings to avoid liability (they are notifying customers of the risks and if the customers choose the low profile tires they are now assuming the risks) and BMW is issuing the warnings to motivate customers to buy their tire insurance (again they are disclosing the problem). If in fact the problems with the tires had to do with the tires being run flats, rather than the tires being low profile, or if in fact the problems with the tires had to do with a combination of both factors (run flat and low profile), I would have to believe that BMW would issue warnings for both reasons. It just would not be logical for BMW to issue a warning on the low profile issue, but to omit a warning on the run flat issue. Think about it. If BMW is attempting to avoid liability by issuing a warning in connection with the low profile tires and make money on tire insurance, why would they not issue a run flat warning to potentially avoid further liability and to make even more money on the tire insurance (they could then target customers who purchase the 528 which comes with the 17 inch rims with tires that are run flats, but not low profile).

highyo 02-06-2011 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Needsdecaf (Post 5827506)
Yup.

Check your glovebox. There should be a CD in there. Each tire has some type of warranty. The Goodyear, for sure, covers road hazzards.

so you're saying that the tire and wheel insurance is a complete waste of money?

Sophisto 02-07-2011 01:37 AM

@crmesq
 
There are not so many bubbles on sidewalls of ordinary tires.
So it seems it is a combination of factors; low profile gives a greater chance of damage and the construction of RFT's is more suspectable to sidewall bubbles.
Personnally I think it is more easy to make money on RFT tires than it is on donut wheels in the trunk. With or without insurance.
I would love to have a simple spare in my car.

anthony@empireleasing 02-07-2011 08:36 AM

i think it will be tough to get insured after the initial month owning the vehicle...also this is def a run flat issue not sure what tire you have but they all pretty much either bubble due to being too rigid on tread or burst due to being to rigid on sidewall...i know they have their pros...but bmw is def using this to sell insurance and to make tons of cash of those who dont have it. Here in nyc the pot holes are deep enough to swim in. most people selling tire insurance get dropped because of the amount of claims generated in nyc.


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