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-   -   clunk between 1st and second (http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=633333)

aturkinside 07-15-2012 08:14 PM

clunk between 1st and second
 
I have an '04 X3 3.0 automatic and at 1/5 throttle at around 10mph (1800 rpms) i get this clunking/shudder from underneath the car. I can't pinpoint exactly where but have to say it's more towards the front. I had the flex disc replaced with a genuine BMW one and it hasn't changed anything. The center bearing also looked fine. It's more noticeable in traffic because it only happens between first and second. If I go a little faster it's not as noticeable but happens quicker. It also doesn't happen when the car is cold.

I've been having a ton of acceleration issues with regards to pinging and hesitation so I have changed the plugs and the coilpacks, replaced my valve cover, reprogrammed at the dealer, cleaned the throttle body, cleaned the maf, checked intake boot for cracks, changed all four o2 sensors, and just put in some Lucas fuel conditioner but haven't completely solved the hesitation. These are the things I have done but my main issue is the clunk between first and second. Could this be related to the pinging hesitation? The pinging happens between 2500-4000 rpms. I'm suspecting the fuel injectors.

mlukas161 07-16-2012 05:40 PM

What grade fuel do you use? Have you tried other gas stations?
May be a clogged fuel filter... Just a guess.

aturkinside 07-16-2012 08:17 PM

I always put super in. I have to admit I have always been buying gas from the same Delta by my house. Just the other day I put ultra 93 from Sunoco along with the Lucas but tbh it hasn't made a difference. Would a clogged fuel filter give a symptom like that?

mlukas161 07-16-2012 08:38 PM

I'm not 100% sure. But whenever I hear pinging and /or hesitation, it makes me think something fuel line related. Fuel filters do clog and restrict the flow of fuel. However, they are also a pain to access in the x3-- they are inside the fuel tank.

aturkinside 07-16-2012 09:21 PM

I guess I'll try it out. After all, ff's are scheduled for every 100k? I'm at 97k+. This is the only writeup with pics I found http://blog.bavauto.com/wp-content/u...regulator1.pdf. I'll take some pics when I do it once I can figure out the correct part number I need. Thanks.

murderland 07-16-2012 11:56 PM

i get a clunk too, every time i switch from Drive to Reverse or Reverse to Drive, there's a clunk/clank sound from the left front right after i start moving after the direction change.

i'm thinking it might be the brakes

Wongway 07-17-2012 12:05 AM

I used to get a clunk shifting from drive to reverse and back again. Stopped doing that for me once I found this site and started doing regular transmission fluid changes.

vince217 07-17-2012 06:46 AM

are your tires all the same brand and model?

aturkinside 07-17-2012 07:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by murderland (Post 6955870)
i get a clunk too, every time i switch from Drive to Reverse or Reverse to Drive, there's a clunk/clank sound from the left front right after i start moving after the direction change.

i'm thinking it might be the brakes

It wouldnt hurt to visually inspect the flex disc.

Quote:

are your tires all the same brand and model?
yes all the same with factory staggered setup. it does pull to the left even after i had a recent alignment.

silentbob 07-17-2012 10:14 PM

I had a clunk shifting from first to second at low speeds/light throttle, post transmission fluid change. I just live with it.

vince217 07-18-2012 06:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aturkinside (Post 6956130)

yes all the same with factory staggered setup. it does pull to the left even after i had a recent alignment.

were they all replaced at the same time, or are the front / rears newer than the other?

DBU 07-18-2012 11:38 AM

Transmission re-set
 
With respect to the transmission clunk, have you tried to re-set it? It is quite simple:

1) get in the car and turn the ignition on, but do not actually start the car.
2) press the accelerator to the floor as far as it will go. Keep it there for about one minute (I forget the minimum time required)
3) release accelerator pedal, turn ignition off.
4) start the car and see if your problem hasn't gone away.

Some folks report hearing a slight noise from the tranny during this procedure, but I haven't heard that myself. This procedure is widely circulated on the E60 forum, but I haven't seen it here (nor have I looked very hard).

What this does, is that it re-sets the "learned behavior" the tranny has acquired from your driving style. You are now back to factory spec, but the tranny will learn again and adjust to your driving style over time. In my case, I find the vehicle being more preppy after a reset, kind of half way between "D" and "SD" in shift points etc etc.

A couple of weeks ago, I test drove (and later purchased) a 2007 X3si. The car had been on the dealer's lot for a while and it had the original battery. It had to be jump started before the test drive. I immediately noticed that the tranny wouldn't shift gear and there was no "SD" mode. Also, the yellow light (gear symbol with exclamation point inside) was on. Returning to the dealer lot, I suggested a tranny reset to the sales person. He had no idea what I was talking about. After the above procedure, we took the car out again and it shifted like a dream. I believe the low battery/jump start spooked the tranny electronics and it just needed all that funky data cleaned out.

mlukas161 07-18-2012 12:00 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by silentbob (Post 6957781)
I had a clunk shifting from first to second at low speeds/light throttle, post transmission fluid change. I just live with it.

I'm starting to think that it might be the Tension Strut. See the attached photo of the Tension Strut hanging by the ball joint. There is a large rubber bushing that can go bad and cause clunking as well as what feels like a warped rotor, especially under braking. This is a very common problem with e39 5 series cars that have a similar suspension setup.

I replaced mine last year and it was not very fun. I used some DIYs from the X5 boards.
I'll try to attach some links.

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...hlight=tension

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...70&hg=31&fg=05

http://www.xoutpost.com/articles/x5/...mw-x5-e53.html

http://www.xoutpost.com/bmw-sav-foru...6756491-a.html

aturkinside 07-18-2012 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vince217 (Post 6958123)
were they all replaced at the same time, or are the front / rears newer than the other?

I dont have that information. I bought it used. After a little experimenting though it doesnt seem like the clunk/stutter happens when I'm turning under light acceleration between first and second.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DBU
With respect to the transmission clunk, have you tried to re-set it??

I have tried that also, but I only held it down for about 45 seconds after reading somewhere that I should hold it down for 30 but I didn't hear any click or anything. I'll try it again.


Quote:

Originally Posted by mlukas161
I'm starting to think that it might be the Tension Strut. See the attached photo of the Tension Strut hanging by the ball joint. There is a large rubber bushing that can go bad and cause clunking as well as what feels like a warped rotor, especially under braking. This is a very common problem with e39 5 series cars that have a similar suspension setup.

Can this be visually inspected to see if it is bad? I wouldn't know what a good versus a bad one looked like.

mlukas161 07-18-2012 07:43 PM

You can't really visually inspect it. You could climb under the vehicle and grab the tension strut and shake it vigorously. I was able to diagnose mine that way. It would make the same clunk that was audible when driving.

aturkinside 07-22-2012 03:51 PM

I had my cousin in the backseat the other day while driving around and he notices the clunk right under his seat. So is this the rear differential? What mechanisms of the differential are prone to failure at ~100kmi which can create the symptoms I am having? I have also made a correlation of my clunking to my pinging. The faster the rpms go the faster the clunking becomes which sounds more like pinging.

I also did the "potential actuator fix" here http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=566880

But it made no difference at all..

aturkinside 07-22-2012 03:56 PM

....also I noticed my transfer case bushing seems worn out

dadadave 02-12-2013 06:17 PM

Did you ever resolve this issue?

My '05 X3 with 115k miles was fine, but after a recent state inspection where they changed the rear tires and replaced several emissions related components (to the tune of $2100) my car is now experiencing the same issues. 2 or 3 hard jerks between 1-2 and 2-3 and a shudder (like driving on rumble strips) in higher gears. Seems normal from a cold start but gets worse as it warms up. Also, hitting a bump seems to start the shuddering and I have to let off the gas to smooth it out again.

I had the shop who did the work flash a new shift program based on a SIB but it didn't fix it. They don't seem interesting in tracking this issue down. Based on other posts I'm thinking its either an alignment issue or coil packs (given that it happens more when warmed up).

Any insight would be great. Thanks. :thumbup:

aturkinside 02-12-2013 08:55 PM

Yes. The major part of the clunking was excessive transfer case fluid wear. I had it changed for about $170 including fluid and labor. And I still had a very slight bump between first and second only I could notice but was completely gone after I replaced all four tires keeping a stock staggered setup.

Ishniknork 02-12-2013 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aturkinside (Post 7377857)
Yes. The major part of the clunking was excessive transfer case fluid wear. I had it changed for about $170 including fluid and labor. And I still had a very slight bump between first and second only I could notice but was completely gone after I replaced all four tires keeping a stock staggered setup.

What tires did you get? I have the stock staggered 114 rims and am using Dunlop Direzza DZ101's at the moment. Apparently the original tires that came on my X3, Dunlop Sport SP 01's, aren't available any more.

dadadave 02-13-2013 07:26 AM

Thanks for the reply Turk. I hope my issue is that simple! Got an appt tomorrow at the dealership so fingers crossed.

aturkinside 02-13-2013 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ishniknork (Post 7378030)
What tires did you get? I have the stock staggered 114 rims and am using Dunlop Direzza DZ101's at the moment. Apparently the original tires that came on my X3, Dunlop Sport SP 01's, aren't available any more.

235/50ZR-18 Hankook Ventus V4 ES H105 for the front and
255/45ZR-18 Hankook Ventus V4 ES H105 for the rear.

I got em from tirerack. At the time it was free shipping and a $50 promotional cash card. Had them delivered to a local tire installer.

dadadave,

At the time my car had no codes with a simple acttron scanner but the european indy shop by my house found a code through a more detailed diagnostic that showed a code which translated to "excessive transfer case fluid wear". I forgot what the code was I think it started with a V and a number.

Supercourse 02-13-2013 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aturkinside (Post 7379528)
....... I forgot what the code was I think it started with a V and a number.

Probably 54C6. See: http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=419069

If your 2004 had never had the fluid changed, it would still be the original fill of ATF Dexron III, so way past time for a change to the proprietary fluid that became available sometime in 2005.

dukedkt442 02-13-2013 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aturkinside (Post 7377857)
Yes. The major part of the clunking was excessive transfer case fluid wear. I had it changed for about $170 including fluid and labor. And I still had a very slight bump between first and second only I could notice but was completely gone after I replaced all four tires keeping a stock staggered setup.

Was that price from the dealer? The dealer I bought mine from charges $130 to do the job.

aturkinside 02-13-2013 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dukedkt442
Was that price from the dealer? The dealer I bought mine from charges $130 to do the job.

No that was my total bill for diagnosing and replacing the oil.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Supercourse
Probably 54C6. See: http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=419069

If your 2004 had never had the fluid changed, it would still be the original fill of ATF Dexron III, so way past time for a change to the proprietary fluid that became available sometime in 2005.

Yea. The xdrive fluid was introduced after 04. dadadave's 05 could possibly still have the old fluid.


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