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-   -   280whp 540i (http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=636206)

e39540iv8 07-30-2012 12:42 PM

280whp 540i
 
Has anybody ever gotten about 280whp from a 540i without a SC. I'm surprised at alot of people getting around 260whp stock from 540is. I was wondering if around 280whp was possible. I know dyno numbers vary and rarely tell the whole story but let's assume the same car on the same dyno.

LalaRay 07-30-2012 01:26 PM

280whp out of a stock 282hp car? Doubt it...

e39540iv8 07-30-2012 01:46 PM

Remember though at 282hp you'd be at ~230whp stock and most of the searches I've made and the results I've found are 245-260whp for stock 540is even some with 244k miles on the clock. Maybe they were underestimated from factory by BMW. I know dyno results vary but I've seen a consistency in results from stock 540i dynos as claimed by owners. So my question is what mods are required to get to around 280whp without FI. I'm sure it's possible, while this isn't a new engine there must be some potential.

LalaRay 07-30-2012 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by e39540iv8 (Post 6980846)
Remember though at 282hp you'd be at ~230whp stock and most of the searches I've made and the results I've found are 245-260whp for stock 540is even some with 244k miles on the clock. Maybe they were underestimated from factory by BMW. I know dyno results vary but I've seen a consistency in results from stock 540i dynos as claimed by owners. So my question is what mods are required to get to around 280whp without FI. I'm sure it's possible, while this isn't a new engine there must be some potential.

mk how do you figure that at 282 crank hp you would only be getting 230 to the wheels ?

Plus with a supercharger you would make well over 280whp... actually more like 360ish.... which is truly faster than a stock e39 M5. But aside from FI i dont know what to tell you besides maybe headers, intake with a tune,underdrive pulleys..... :dunno:

JimLev 07-30-2012 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by e39540iv8 (Post 6980682)
Has anybody ever gotten about 280whp from a 540i without a SC. I'm surprised at alot of people getting around 260whp stock from 540is. I was wondering if around 280whp was possible. I know dyno numbers vary and rarely tell the whole story but let's assume the same car on the same dyno.

Without a S/C or forced induction, sure.
I friend has a Dinan S/C on his 98 540, he gets 400 HP to the rear wheels.
I'm at 410 RWHP for a lot less $$$ than the price of a S/C.

http://home.comcast.net/~jimlev/Skunkworks/SW8.JPG

e39540iv8 07-30-2012 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LalaRay (Post 6980888)
mk how do you figure that at 282 crank hp you would only be getting 230 to the wheels ?

Plus with a supercharger you would make well over 280whp... actually more like 360ish.... which is truly faster than a stock e39 M5. But aside from FI i dont know what to tell you besides maybe headers, intake with a tune,underdrive pulleys..... :dunno:

How much whp is 282 crank HP then? I calculated 18% lose but again, the actual dynos from 540i owners would suggest ~250whp stock for the 540i.

How much do you think a quality set of headers, intake, pulley and tune net?

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimLev (Post 6980896)
Without a S/C or forced induction, sure.
I friend has a Dinan S/C on his 98 540, he gets 400 HP to the rear wheels.
I'm at 410 RWHP for a lot less $$$ than the price of a S/C.

http://home.comcast.net/~jimlev/Skunkworks/SW8.JPG

That's awesome. What have you done to the car?

eparayno 07-30-2012 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LalaRay (Post 6980888)
mk how do you figure that at 282 crank hp you would only be getting 230 to the wheels ?

Plus with a supercharger you would make well over 280whp... actually more like 360ish.... which is truly faster than a stock e39 M5. But aside from FI i dont know what to tell you besides maybe headers, intake with a tune,underdrive pulleys..... :dunno:

He's saying that BMW engines power production was underrated, meaning they made more power than what it says on paper.

15-20% drivetrain loss would equal 238-224 HP to the wheels. Since a lot of 540i owners are putting down 260 HP to the wheels that proves the underrated HP numbers. Which would mean those that dyno'd 260 to the wheels have 299-312 crank HP.

LalaRay 07-30-2012 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by e39540iv8 (Post 6980901)
How much do you think a quality set of headers, intake, pulley and tune net?

um how much ? lls... you dont wanna know :thumbdwn:

http://www.turnermotorsport.com/p-34...er-system.aspx
http://www.turnermotorsport.com/p-13...e-1-pro5r.aspx
http://aakmotorsports.com/under-drive-pulleys.aspx


Quote:

Originally Posted by eparayno (Post 6980912)
He's saying that BMW engines power production was underrated, meaning they made more power than what it says on paper.

15-20% drivetrain loss would equal 238-224 HP to the wheels. Since a lot of 540i owners are putting down 260 HP to the wheels that proves the underrated HP numbers. Which would mean those that dyno'd 260 to the wheels have 299-312 crank HP.

i know what he is saying.

dunne44 07-30-2012 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimLev (Post 6980896)
Without a S/C or forced induction, sure.
I friend has a Dinan S/C on his 98 540, he gets 400 HP to the rear wheels.
I'm at 410 RWHP for a lot less $$$ than the price of a S/C.

http://home.comcast.net/~jimlev/Skunkworks/SW8.JPG

Cocaine is a hell-of-a drug

1BadE39 07-30-2012 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimLev (Post 6980896)
Without a S/C or forced induction, sure.
I friend has a Dinan S/C on his 98 540, he gets 400 HP to the rear wheels.
I'm at 410 RWHP for a lot less $$$ than the price of a S/C.

http://home.comcast.net/~jimlev/Skunkworks/SW8.JPG

OMG filthy pornography!

e39540iv8 07-30-2012 05:53 PM

Nitrous system right?

JimLev 07-30-2012 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by e39540iv8 (Post 6981252)
Nitrous system right?

Right, 2 stage w/water methanol injection, under drive pulleys, Dinan CAI w/engine software and M5 diff.

geargrinder 07-30-2012 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by e39540iv8 (Post 6980682)
Has anybody ever gotten about 280whp from a 540i without a SC. I'm surprised at alot of people getting around 260whp stock from 540is. I was wondering if around 280whp was possible. I know dyno numbers vary and rarely tell the whole story but let's assume the same car on the same dyno.

Everything is possible and that seems like a low bar so I'm sure somebody has. But it's tough to get lots of cheap HP from N/A motors. Especially w motors like BMW's where there's often not a ton of HP left on the table. Some but not a ton.

If you really wanted to try for max non-SC hp on an M62 I'm sure you could do more than 280... (Nitrous excepted... whole different story) I'm just guessing her as a novice to the platform admittedly... But the kind of list I'd imagine would be:

Prob going non-VANOS (less driveable but more braggable on the dyno).
Gnarly cams (again non-VANOS for more peak tune).
Possibly gucci valve job, depending on if there are gains to be had / room for oversize
Port/polish/extrude-hone as much of intake as you can
Big ass throttle body and supporting intake (not to be confused with cheap-ass CAI's).
Very good headers and exhaust.
Perhaps upgraded injectors & raised FP for better atomization
If your budget is sky high, fine balance all the internals for higher redline

And of course custom tune to match all of above since the car won't run for isht after you do that....

But that's real quality engine building stuff.

And in the end you'd be basically trying to homebrew a S62. So whats the point really.

If you're talking off the shelf ricey "CAI + flash + catback", no that's not getting you much on this motor...

I like the idea of a nice low pressure SC setup though. That is an entirely different story and is definitely on my "maybe someday" list...

bricas45 07-30-2012 07:23 PM

I put down 289rwhp and 303rwft-lbs naturally aspirated. Had the following mods...

Dinan CAI, MAF, TB, intake manifold, stage 5 tune

Headers, 100cell cats, Eisenmann race

Evosport power pulleys

bricas45 07-30-2012 07:39 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Dyno runs before and after header install.

GreenTiger 07-31-2012 12:53 AM

Nice Bricas. So +17 torque and +19 HP. What headers are you using?

LalaRay 07-31-2012 01:03 AM

LOOK if ya want more power this is how ya gotta do it.

http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/...0721121428.jpg

aspensilver540 07-31-2012 03:51 AM

It's a combination of

1. Many dynos are a bit optimistic. Customers like good numbers, dyno owners like happy customers. This skews the numbers up.
2. BMW underrated the car from the factory

So probably no 282whp stock, but hey just hook up some sick NOS like Jim :wow:

bricas45 07-31-2012 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King540i (Post 6981927)
Nice Bricas. So +17 torque and +19 HP. What headers are you using?

They are made by Tiger at A1 muffler in Santa Anna CA. They run about $1300.

If you check out my really long supercharger build thread there are photos of them. Mine are ceramic coated as well.

e39540iv8 07-31-2012 08:41 AM

OK so how much would I be looking at for a cheap SC build. Again guys I'm not looking to blow the Auto box and the internals at 400whp on this engine. I just want modest gains and to keep it reliable. I don't think 280-320whp would blow the box or the motor. I'm willing to go SC and I guess I might be able to get ~320whp with that but what are the prices like. I'm not looking to spend too much and I know that's contradictory to making power since you gotta pay to play but I'm just trying to get as much as I can out of a small budget.

LalaRay 07-31-2012 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bricas45 (Post 6982237)
They are made by Tiger at A1 muffler in Santa Anna CA. They run about $1300.

If you check out my really long supercharger build thread there are photos of them. Mine are ceramic coated as well.

made for the 540? i might do these..

e39540iv8 07-31-2012 10:20 AM

How much would a nitrous system cost me? I'm thinking I'm not using it all the time but when I need to I could. What parts would I need for something like that?

bricas45 07-31-2012 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LalaRay (Post 6982280)
made for the 540? i might do these..

They were actually made for the M5 but the m62 and s62 have exact external dimensions and share exhaust manifolds with the non-vanos m62. It is a big job to do these and suggest pulling the motor out to make sure you get all bolts tight, may want to do clutch if you have a manual, and the rear main at the same time. Also, they will not directly bolt up to the rest of your exhaust. Exhaust will have to be custom made at the very least a connection from headers to cats.

The car sounds like a pure bread race car with the headers, high flow cats and muffler set up you will not be disappointed. The power increase was dramatic. I think the benefits are far greater for those like mine with vanos...this removes the pre-cats as well.

bricas45 07-31-2012 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by e39540iv8 (Post 6982454)
How much would a nitrous system cost me? I'm thinking I'm not using it all the time but when I need to I could. What parts would I need for something like that?

I think state side it runs just under $1000 for the kit. I am not sure what that would be in Oz.

eparayno 07-31-2012 10:36 AM

Great NA numbers Bricas. Goes to show how huge of a bottleneck the stock headers are. M54 guys dyno'd 15-20ish HP increase with just headers, no cats or high flow cats and the stock exhaust piping on the E46. Would you happen to have a side by side pic of the stockers and A1 headers?


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