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-   -   Better Audio without Premium Audio ? (http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=646273)

Ilan 09-17-2012 10:09 AM

Better Audio without Premium Audio ?
 
I didn't get Premium audio and I am sorry I didn't. Is there anything I can do to upgrade my audio system ? (better speakers maybe?). any recommendations ?

The X Men 09-17-2012 10:20 AM

Better speakers are a good start, maybe a better amp, digital proccess or a sub.

LukeS 09-17-2012 10:37 AM

I would console an aftermarket professional at a highend audio shop. Upgrading the AMP would be my first move or AMP/speakers at once. Upgrading the speakers alone will not do much of anything.
Hope this helps.

Ilan 09-17-2012 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The X Men (Post 7078901)
Better speakers are a good start, maybe a better amp, digital proccess or a sub.

Thanks, is there anyone who did custom audio upgrade in their F10 and can describe what they've done ?

The X Men 09-17-2012 11:00 AM

Here is a thread on a member who have upgraded his sound system:

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...t=audio+woofer

Technic 09-17-2012 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The X Men (Post 7078974)
Here is a thread on a member who have upgraded his sound system:

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...t=audio+woofer

That install does not apply here... that is the optional Top HiFi (Premium) sound system. OP's system is the standard HiFi.

Technic 09-17-2012 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ilan (Post 7078888)
I didn't get Premium audio and I am sorry I didn't. Is there anything I can do to upgrade my audio system ? (better speakers maybe?). any recommendations ?

Budget for this, please.

messiry 09-17-2012 12:11 PM

Hello everybody, i also have 535i with the base Audio system, and looking to upgrade my speakers, may be start by adding door tweeters, then add amplifier/speakers. any advise here. you can also check eurotuner on FB.

thanks
Khaled

Ilan 09-17-2012 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Technic (Post 7079042)
Budget for this, please.

I don't have a budget yet. I am guessing around 2k$.

chill535ix 09-17-2012 03:08 PM

bummer dude, premium audio rocks!

snj1013 09-17-2012 06:50 PM

http://www.bavariansoundwerks.com/ develops upgrades that are plug and play. Nothing yet for the F10 but they are supposed to be working on it.

djsilo 09-17-2012 07:18 PM

don't forget to put 2 12" subs in your trunk and a large capacitor to handle the current draw

LukeS 09-17-2012 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ilan (Post 7079228)
I don't have a budget yet. I am guessing around 2k$.

I never played with an F10 system before, but I would think you should be able to upgrade the existing Amp and add another amp to a 12" subwoofer for under 3K installed. I would think this will improve your sound considerably well beyond the premium sound option. To upgrade the stock speakers will probably be about 2K, but its worthless without upgrading the Amp supplying them. Maybe you will get some additional range with just speakers, but it will distort as you increase the volume if you don't match the speakers with a proper Amp.

Technic 09-18-2012 03:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ilan (Post 7079228)
I don't have a budget yet. I am guessing around 2k$.

I would start with a JBL MS-8 Logic7 DSP/8-channel amp and your OEM speakers.

There are 7-channels in your HiFi system, front/rear/underseat woofers/center speaker. The iDrive outputs analog, low level, balanced, flat signals to the OEM amp 7-channel amp. The OEM amp can be replaced directly (PnP) with the MS-8.

The only reason of suggesting the MS-8 is because of its Logic7, a slightly better automotive implementation of the OEM Logic7 in the OEM Premium Sound option of the F10 that you mentioned. Fundamentally, the MS-8 has a slightly higher power output (480W peak, 240W RMS at 2ohms) as the OEM Premium amp, but one less channel output (40W peak x 7 [2ohms], plus 70W peak x 2 [4ohms]). However, the main difference is that the MS-8 will auto-tune your system based on the cabin acoustics of your F10. And it is quite good at that, and it sounds better than the Premium sound just because you can set it up to your own particular taste with many more possible fine adjustments than the OEM system. For example, instead of just a 7-band EQ in the Premium you will have a 31-band EQ in the MS-8. And that is if you use it, 90% of the time the auto-tune will be more than enough tuning.

If you get an MS-8 then only get it brand new with warranty, or refurbished with warranty directly from JBL. They will support their product 100% directly.

The OEM speakers are quite good if the OEM amp is replaced with aftermarket, much better if they are powered and auto-tuned by the MS-8. If you are not interested in a trunk sub then I may suggest then to replace only the underseat OEM woofers at first with a pair of Jehnerts XE-200 and a separate amp just for them (XD200/2). The XE-200 are direct replacements of the OEM woofers.

The rest of the OEM speakers can stay powered by the MS-8.

That should cost some $1100 plus labor. Leaving $900 or so for component speakers if you want to just replace the whole system up to the iDrive; no need to run new wires. The 4" mids in the F10 are of the shallow variety -40-45mm depth max- so there are no that many choices out there. There is a Jehnert 3-way BMW custom set (component set and the XE-200, all direct fit), Focal KRS/VRS will fit easily with adapters, others will require custom jobs.

This should give you some ideas.

Ilan 09-18-2012 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Technic (Post 7080580)
I would start with a JBL MS-8 Logic7 DSP/8-channel amp and your OEM speakers.

There are 7-channels in your HiFi system, front/rear/underseat woofers/center speaker. The iDrive outputs analog, low level, balanced, flat signals to the OEM amp 7-channel amp. The OEM amp can be replaced directly (PnP) with the MS-8.

The only reason of suggesting the MS-8 is because of its Logic7, a slightly better automotive implementation of the OEM Logic7 in the OEM Premium Sound option of the F10 that you mentioned. Fundamentally, the MS-8 has a slightly higher power output (480W peak, 240W RMS at 2ohms) as the OEM Premium amp, but one less channel output (40W peak x 7 [2ohms], plus 70W peak x 2 [4ohms]). However, the main difference is that the MS-8 will auto-tune your system based on the cabin acoustics of your F10. And it is quite good at that, and it sounds better than the Premium sound just because you can set it up to your own particular taste with many more possible fine adjustments than the OEM system. For example, instead of just a 7-band EQ in the Premium you will have a 31-band EQ in the MS-8. And that is if you use it, 90% of the time the auto-tune will be more than enough tuning.

If you get an MS-8 then only get it brand new with warranty, or refurbished with warranty directly from JBL. They will support their product 100% directly.

The OEM speakers are quite good if the OEM amp is replaced with aftermarket, much better if they are powered and auto-tuned by the MS-8. If you are not interested in a trunk sub then I may suggest then to replace only the underseat OEM woofers at first with a pair of Jehnerts XE-200 and a separate amp just for them (XD200/2). The XE-200 are direct replacements of the OEM woofers.

The rest of the OEM speakers can stay powered by the MS-8.

That should cost some $1100 plus labor. Leaving $900 or so for component speakers if you want to just replace the whole system up to the iDrive; no need to run new wires. The 4" mids in the F10 are of the shallow variety -40-45mm depth max- so there are no that many choices out there. There is a Jehnert 3-way BMW custom set (component set and the XE-200, all direct fit), Focal KRS/VRS will fit easily with adapters, others will require custom jobs.

This should give you some ideas.

Thanks , Technic and Lukes. I think I'll look into upgrading the amp first. where is the original amp in the F10 ? do they need to rewire or just take out the amp and replace it ?

Technic 09-18-2012 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ilan (Post 7081265)
Thanks , Technic and Lukes. I think I'll look into upgrading the amp first. where is the original amp in the F10 ? do they need to rewire or just take out the amp and replace it ?

Please PM for a HiFi harness detais for an aftermarket amp or processor PnP replacement of the OEM amp. No OEM wires to cut, splice or tapped.

messiry 09-18-2012 11:30 AM

hello guys, thank you for your posts. i have the basic audio system, with 6 speakers, and looking to upgrade my system too. i have one point, i dont have the 2 tweeters in the doors, do you know by chance if these tweeters can be add.
thank you

Technic 09-18-2012 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by messiry (Post 7081427)
hello guys, thank you for your posts. i have the basic audio system, with 6 speakers, and looking to upgrade my system too. i have one point, i dont have the 2 tweeters in the doors, do you know by chance if these tweeters can be add.
thank you

Yes.

You need to get the OEM tweeter grills inserts, item 13:

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/diagrams/t/f/314.png

Cover, mirror baseplate, left P/N 51337275779
Cover, mirror baseplate, right P/N 51337275780

I cannot respond to your PM as you do not have enough posts to activate the feature. Regardless, I do not ship to Dubai sorry.

messiry 09-18-2012 11:42 PM

Many thanks technic. appreciate your support. i will try to check with my dealer or any online BMW parts. just to confirm, the wires for the tweeters are there and no need to extend new cable, am I right? which tweeters to you recommend.
thank you again.

Ace535i 09-19-2012 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Technic (Post 7080580)
I would start with a JBL MS-8 Logic7 DSP/8-channel amp and your OEM speakers.

There are 7-channels in your HiFi system, front/rear/underseat woofers/center speaker. The iDrive outputs analog, low level, balanced, flat signals to the OEM amp 7-channel amp. The OEM amp can be replaced directly (PnP) with the MS-8.

The only reason of suggesting the MS-8 is because of its Logic7, a slightly better automotive implementation of the OEM Logic7 in the OEM Premium Sound option of the F10 that you mentioned. Fundamentally, the MS-8 has a slightly higher power output (480W peak, 240W RMS at 2ohms) as the OEM Premium amp, but one less channel output (40W peak x 7 [2ohms], plus 70W peak x 2 [4ohms]). However, the main difference is that the MS-8 will auto-tune your system based on the cabin acoustics of your F10. And it is quite good at that, and it sounds better than the Premium sound just because you can set it up to your own particular taste with many more possible fine adjustments than the OEM system. For example, instead of just a 7-band EQ in the Premium you will have a 31-band EQ in the MS-8. And that is if you use it, 90% of the time the auto-tune will be more than enough tuning.

If you get an MS-8 then only get it brand new with warranty, or refurbished with warranty directly from JBL. They will support their product 100% directly.

The OEM speakers are quite good if the OEM amp is replaced with aftermarket, much better if they are powered and auto-tuned by the MS-8. If you are not interested in a trunk sub then I may suggest then to replace only the underseat OEM woofers at first with a pair of Jehnerts XE-200 and a separate amp just for them (XD200/2). The XE-200 are direct replacements of the OEM woofers.

The rest of the OEM speakers can stay powered by the MS-8.

That should cost some $1100 plus labor. Leaving $900 or so for component speakers if you want to just replace the whole system up to the iDrive; no need to run new wires. The 4" mids in the F10 are of the shallow variety -40-45mm depth max- so there are no that many choices out there. There is a Jehnert 3-way BMW custom set (component set and the XE-200, all direct fit), Focal KRS/VRS will fit easily with adapters, others will require custom jobs.

This should give you some ideas.


Is the ease of installation the same for the 5-, 6-, and 7-series lines?

Technic 09-19-2012 02:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by messiry (Post 7082721)
Many thanks technic. appreciate your support. i will try to check with my dealer or any online BMW parts. just to confirm, the wires for the tweeters are there and no need to extend new cable, am I right? which tweeters to you recommend.
thank you again.

There are no OEM speaker wires present when there is no OEM speakers fitted from factory.

Get an aftermarket component set instead of separate tweeters with OEM mids. You want them to match. See my post above.

Technic 09-19-2012 02:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ace535i (Post 7082734)
Is the ease of installation the same for the 5-, 6-, and 7-series lines?

As long as the OEM system in the F-Series is HiFi, yes.

Top HiFi, no.

miamiboyca 09-19-2012 07:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ilan (Post 7078888)
I didn't get Premium audio and I am sorry I didn't. Is there anything I can do to upgrade my audio system ? (better speakers maybe?). any recommendations ?

So I have a question for the OP, when you say you want to upgrade what is it that you are looking to upgrade?

To be more specific...
Is the quality not very good?
Do you need more power/volume?
Are you trying to add some functionality that is not currently available?

I ask not because I know ANYTHING about sound systems, but because I want to understand the problem. Also because I am getting a F10 without the upgraded audi and am not a little concerned... :(

PS... I don't want any trouble Technic :angel:

Ace535i 09-19-2012 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Technic (Post 7082767)
As long as the OEM system in the F-Series is HiFi, yes.

Top HiFi, no.

I'm sorry but I don't understand what you mean by Top HiFi.

Technic 09-19-2012 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ace535i (Post 7083213)
I'm sorry but I don't understand what you mean by Top HiFi.

Top HiFi is BMW-speak for Logic7, Harman Kardon, Premium, Individual Audio or Bang & Olufsen sound systems.

Those systems use the MOST fiber optics network as input to the OEM amp. So it is quite complex/costly to replace the OEM amp with aftermarket equipment unless a MOST converter or coding to HiFi (where the iDrive outputs change from MOST to analog) is used.


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