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-   -   Argument with my dealer (http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=649752)

pointandgo 10-03-2012 06:31 PM

Argument with my dealer
 
I've had my '11 E90 for over a year and it has less than 10K miles...5K now (I'm retired). The "service-based indicator" does not yet indicate an oil change yet...about 1k to go. I'm not an "oil freak" and have a lease.

As an aside, my oil level hasn't changed at all...still showing FULL!

My dealer called me today URGING ME to come in for an oil change. I asked them why, since the service-based indicator said otherwise. They gave some rather "fuzzy" explanation...saying that the oil should be changed after one year. OK. I asked them if they would re-set the service indicator. "Fuzzy" explanation again!

Nevertheless, I made an appointment with them and will MAKE SURE they re-set the service indicator.

BMW dealers must have some financial incentive from BMW NA to do this work!

Since they are QUITE FAR AWAY from me, I also insisted that they do the oil change while I wait...I DON'T WANT a loaner, and want the service done promptly. They "guaranteed" this. We'll see how it goes.

All this seems quite contrary to what other 'festers have reported: Oil changes done "under" the service based indicator were either refused, or the service indicator wasn't re-set!

Strange how different dealers treat this.

laser 10-03-2012 07:19 PM

BMW recommends and you get free an annual oil change regardless of the mileage. Most folks like this. I do.

No reset of the mileage based oil change schedule means you get more oil changes (free) not fewer. Most people like this. I do too.

Any dealer will do this if you are too far away from your selling dealer.

I see where you might feel inconvenienced by this but hey .... worse things can happen!

Nordic_Kat 10-03-2012 07:54 PM

Must be some sort of re-think on BMWNA's part:

I put about 6500-7000 on my car per year. My oil change history is as follows:

Car in service date: 8/15/2009
First Oil Change (at dealership): 8/02/2010 - 6768 mi
Second Oil Change (at dealership): 4/19/2011- 11459 mi (when car was at dealership for warranty issue)
Third Oil change (at Indy at my expense) no reset: 4/04/2012 - 18908 mi
Fourth Oil Change while car at dealership for annual safety inspection- no reset:8/20/2012 - 21900 mi

Now here is the interesting part: There is about 2900 miles left on the service counter on 8/20/2012. My SA tells me to make sure and come back in when my service counter expires for another oil change. Hmmm. That's only ~3000 miles. Certainly very short of the 15000 mile intervals they "advise". I look at him quizzically. "Huh? So, you are telling me that you'll do another oil change in 3000 miles?"

Here is his explanation - obviously tailored to the Houston (oil patch) market: "Well it's this way. We have a lot of customers that get sent on out of country assignments and so their cars don't get driven much, but then they come home and their car needs maintenance so yeah, bring it on in and we'll do another oil change."

It seems rather frivolous, but gee, if it's part of my "pre-paid" maintenance, why wouldn't I?

pointandgo 10-03-2012 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nordic_Kat (Post 7112347)
Must be some sort of re-think on BMWNA's part:

I put about 6500-7000 on my car per year. My oil change history is as follows:

Car in service date: 8/15/2009
First Oil Change (at dealership): 8/02/2010 - 6768 mi
Second Oil Change (at dealership): 4/19/2011- 11459 mi (when car was at dealership for warranty issue)
Third Oil change (at Indy at my expense) no reset: 4/04/2012 - 18908 mi
Fourth Oil Change while car at dealership for annual safety inspection- no reset:8/20/2012 - 21900 mi

Now here is the interesting part: There is about 2900 miles left on the service counter on 8/20/2012. My SA tells me to make sure and come back in when my service counter expires for another oil change. Hmmm. That's only ~3000 miles. Certainly very short of the 15000 mile intervals they "advise". I look at him quizzically. "Huh? So, you are telling me that you'll do another oil change in 3000 miles?"

Here is his explanation - obviously tailored to the Houston (oil patch) market: "Well it's this way. We have a lot of customers that get sent on out of country assignments and so their cars don't get driven much, but then they come home and their car needs maintenance so yeah, bring it on in and we'll do another oil change."

It seems rather frivolous, but gee, if it's part of my "pre-paid" maintenance, why wouldn't I?

Kat,
Interesting...then we hear all the posts from members who get turned away because their "service-based" indicators don't indicate the need for an oil change. Oh well... INCONSISTENT application of the oil change rules!! Some dealers are more "flexible" than others. Imagine the "cost" of oil to a dealer who buys oil by the "drum." No need to *iss off customers, but we've seen plenty of examples (posts) of dealers who have done this...including a recent post by a Canadian fester.

The odd thing about my dealer call to me today is that they were virtually "scolding" me about my failure to bring my car in for the oil change...in spite of my inquiry about the service-based requirement that indicates that I don't have to. Strange.

I for one, have some faith in synthetic oil...and as reported, at about 5K my oil level is FULL. I must have GREAT cylinder rings. I may keep this IL6 forever!!

Michael Schott 10-04-2012 05:38 AM

It may be dealer dependent. My experience with my 2011 328 is they changed the oil after 1 year even though the car only had about 10K miles as this is the normal procedure. When I hit 15K miles they changed it again as the service indicator said it was time. No questions asked, they just did the service. I have zero complaints about this. If they come to me in December when the car is two years old and want to change the oil once again, I'll happily comply.

bmwrocks 10-04-2012 06:17 AM

More broken record data points...My dealer (Fields) changed mine for free under the 1 year rule (was actually 15 months and about 10k miles on the odo) in late August. No reset because they said they don't reset yearly changes. Told me to come back when service indicator says so for another one at which time they will reset. Time frame will be about 6 months and 3k miles. Gotta love it.

haskindm 10-04-2012 06:23 AM

Let me get this straight. You are upset with the dealer/BMW because they want to give you an oil change at no charge? Surely you understand that changing the oil once per year is the absolute minimum. Short trip driving is the absolute most severe condition to which you can subject your car. Moisture accumulates in the oil that does not get evaporated by the heat of a nice long drive. If you took your car on a long trip now you might even see your oil level drop fairly quickly as a good percentage of your oil is now water. I understand that you are leasing the car, but have a care for the poor sod that buys your car when you are done with it, especially if it costs you nothing!

omaralt 10-04-2012 06:28 AM

yes, you should be very upset at BMW. the nerve of those people! they want to give you a free oil change! really.. and you should definitely insist on prompt service and no wait time, since you do have a 328 and your retired; so i'm sure you have many places to go.. i guess they are right about BMW drivers :)

Joe in Dublin 10-04-2012 06:35 AM

Dont be lazy. Have the oil changed. Another car to avoid when he returns it....:)

Yeoman 10-04-2012 06:37 AM

The BMW oil change interval is 15K miles OR 1 year, whichever comes first. I don't know why this is so hard to understand.

laser 10-04-2012 06:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yeoman (Post 7112920)
The BMW oil change interval is 15K miles OR 1 year, whichever comes first. I don't know why this is so hard to understand.

It's hard to understand because it can be BOTH.

Oil change at the 1 year mark and then again at 15,000 miles.

cwinter 10-04-2012 07:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by laser (Post 7112939)
It's hard to understand because it can be BOTH.

Oil change at the 1 year mark and then again at 15,000 miles.

That's not how "OR" works... :)

An oil change is performed at 15k miles (+/- some miles depending on CBS) OR after 1 year. Once the oil change is done, this starts over. I don't see how that is hard to understand? :dunno:

Of course, we had enough indication that some dealers approach this differently and give you flak if the CBS counter isn't right at 0 miles, blah blah blah. However, the BMW wording here seems quite clear.

vst335is 10-04-2012 07:44 AM

It's a waste of time changing the oil unless is every 15,000 miles. You are not helping the engine, you are just wasting your time. The dealerships to meet performance quotas each month so they recommend you to come visit them :) some people change their bmw oil frequently cause they believe is good, they care for their car but in reality you are wasting your time.

Lufthansa 10-04-2012 07:51 AM

At my 2nd yearly oil change, the dealer also replaced my wiper blades and cabin air filter. Also - they reset the computer each time.

Lufthansa 10-04-2012 07:54 AM

...and they changed the brake fluid and did a 'scope' (just looked up the service order).

ERdiesel 10-04-2012 08:45 AM

Wow, thought I heard it all as far as the whining and complaining in these threads, but now someone complaining about a dealer insisting on giving a free oil change and annual service? This takes the cake.

The bottom line is that you're leasing the car, therefore you DO NOT own it. It is in the dealer's best interest to ensure the leased car is properly maintained according to BMW's service guidelines so that when the car is returned, there's a higher likelihood that the car is in as best a shape as possible for resale. That is probably why the dealer is insistent on having you bring it in for the yearly oil change. Perfectly understandable in my opinion.

vst335is 10-04-2012 09:39 AM

If I don't have to do it, I rather do something else with my time....but everybody is different :)

CALWATERBOY 10-04-2012 09:41 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lufthansa (Post 7113085)
...and they changed the brake fluid and did a 'scope' (just looked up the service order).


When questioned, my SA had to admit the "scope" was a guy scrolling through iDrive.

Wow. What excellent service.

Attachment 344322

Tom K. 10-04-2012 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pointandgo (Post 7112185)
I've had my '11 E90 for over a year and it has less than 10K miles...5K now (I'm retired). The "service-based indicator" does not yet indicate an oil change yet...about 1k to go.

What is the date indicated for the next change?

I ask as both my '07 & '08 Bimmers have the date programmed for TWO year intervals, but as everyone has posted, BMW recommends (and provides) a change at least yearly. Apparently the two year interval is the case in Europe where the fuel is felt to be of higher (lower sulphur?) quality.

A couple of years ago, BMWNA tried to change the policy for free changes to two years instead of one unless the mileage was very low, but they soon abandoned that idea when owners pointed out the ONE year recommendation in the Service/Warranty manual.

At any rate, you've paid for your "free" service in the price of the car, why not take advantage of it?

Tom

Michael Schott 10-04-2012 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cwinter (Post 7113039)
That's not how "OR" works... :)

An oil change is performed at 15k miles (+/- some miles depending on CBS) OR after 1 year. Once the oil change is done, this starts over. I don't see how that is hard to understand? :dunno:

Of course, we had enough indication that some dealers approach this differently and give you flak if the CBS counter isn't right at 0 miles, blah blah blah. However, the BMW wording here seems quite clear.

Not in my most recent case. Changed at 1 year (about 10K miles) and again at 15K miles 6 months later. Covered by warranty.

55 10-04-2012 11:20 AM

Synthetic or not things get old. After one year the oil must have lost some qualities just because of the age. It is like tires are to be replaced after 5-6 years even if the mileage is low. Any fluid has an expiratin date. I think it makes sense that they want to do it.

matts335 10-04-2012 12:02 PM

Part of the confusion is due to BMW changing their policy at one point, then changing back. They originally had the roughly 15,000 mile (computer determined) mileage limit, or 1 year, whichever comes first. Then they sent out some memo or bulletin (which i think was posted on here somewhere) saying they were dropping the free annual changes. They got so much flak that they changed back (presumably sending out an overriding second memo/notice), once again paying for annual changes. That would explain why some people said their dealers turned them away for an annual change.

The other part of the confusion is that some dealers apparent reset the "clock" after the free annual change, some do not. I have 23,000 miles and have only received the annual changes (drive about 6,000 miles/yr.). Obviously, they must have reset my indicator after my oil changes. Well, they must have at least once reset my indicator...maybe not every time.

It seems stupid to not reset, otherwise they could be changing the oil again in a couple thousand miles (as in Kat's case apparently)...which is truly a waste. I believe this is why they tried to eliminate the free annual changes.

cwinter 10-04-2012 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Schott (Post 7113525)
Not in my most recent case. Changed at 1 year (about 10K miles) and again at 15K miles 6 months later. Covered by warranty.

Interesting but likely either a mistake by the dealer, meaning BMW didn't end up paying for it or they fudged the numbers and got money for it when they shouldn't. Could also be that they changed the oil and did not reset the indicator, leading to the indicator still being set by 15k miles.

Whatever the reason, it is pretty clear how it should work but apparently not clear enough to get a uniform answer from dealers across the nation. Which is really baffling to be honest. :rofl:

tturedraider 10-04-2012 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pointandgo (Post 7112185)
I've had my '11 E90 for over a year and it has less than 10K miles...5K now (I'm retired). The "service-based indicator" does not yet indicate an oil change yet...about 1k to go. I'm not an "oil freak" and have a lease.

As an aside, my oil level hasn't changed at all...still showing FULL!

My dealer called me today URGING ME to come in for an oil change. I asked them why, since the service-based indicator said otherwise. They gave some rather "fuzzy" explanation...saying that the oil should be changed after one year. OK. I asked them if they would re-set the service indicator. "Fuzzy" explanation again!

Nevertheless, I made an appointment with them and will MAKE SURE they re-set the service indicator.

BMW dealers must have some financial incentive from BMW NA to do this work!

Since they are QUITE FAR AWAY from me, I also insisted that they do the oil change while I wait...I DON'T WANT a loaner, and want the service done promptly. They "guaranteed" this. We'll see how it goes.

All this seems quite contrary to what other 'festers have reported: Oil changes done "under" the service based indicator were either refused, or the service indicator wasn't re-set!

Strange how different dealers treat this.

Dealers are paid by BMWNA for service/maintenance work, just as they are for warranty work.

Quote:

Originally Posted by laser (Post 7112280)
BMW recommends and you get free an annual oil change regardless of the mileage. Most folks like this. I do.

No reset of the mileage based oil change schedule means you get more oil changes (free) not fewer. Most people like this. I do too.

Any dealer will do this if you are too far away from your selling dealer.

I see where you might feel inconvenienced by this but hey .... worse things can happen!

In about December of 2010 BMWNA issued a new policy for low mileage oil changes. The new policy is 18 months between changes for cars that are driven fewer than 6,000 miles a year. So, a driver who drives 7,000 miles in a year would get an annual oil change. A driver who drives 5,900 miles in a year would get a low mileage oil change at 18 months.


Dealers file "claims" with BMWNA to receive payment for the work they perform and there is some flexibility. That is why the "rules" are not hard and fast. But, a dealer who does work outside the BMWNA guidelines risks not getting reimbursed. That is why some dealers are more flexible than others.

NoI4plz 10-04-2012 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nordic_Kat (Post 7112347)
Must be some sort of re-think on BMWNA's part:

I put about 6500-7000 on my car per year. My oil change history is as follows:

Car in service date: 8/15/2009
First Oil Change (at dealership): 8/02/2010 - 6768 mi
Second Oil Change (at dealership): 4/19/2011- 11459 mi (when car was at dealership for warranty issue)
Third Oil change (at Indy at my expense) no reset: 4/04/2012 - 18908 mi
Fourth Oil Change while car at dealership for annual safety inspection- no reset:8/20/2012 - 21900 mi

Now here is the interesting part: There is about 2900 miles left on the service counter on 8/20/2012. My SA tells me to make sure and come back in when my service counter expires for another oil change. Hmmm. That's only ~3000 miles. Certainly very short of the 15000 mile intervals they "advise". I look at him quizzically. "Huh? So, you are telling me that you'll do another oil change in 3000 miles?"

Here is his explanation - obviously tailored to the Houston (oil patch) market: "Well it's this way. We have a lot of customers that get sent on out of country assignments and so their cars don't get driven much, but then they come home and their car needs maintenance so yeah, bring it on in and we'll do another oil change."

It seems rather frivolous, but gee, if it's part of my "pre-paid" maintenance, why wouldn't I?

Off topic question here, but after your Indy oil change, did your CBS system reflect the brand new oil hence increase the CBS by a lot? If so then what's the point of the CBS, an automatic way of what I do for my dd after an oil change (reset trip A to count upto 3k for my next oil change)?


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