Bimmerfest - BMW Forums

Bimmerfest - BMW Forums (http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/index.php)
-   E90/E91/E92/E93 (2006 - 2013) (http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=99)
-   -   Can you actually repair nailed RFTs? (http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=663028)

bwind 12-09-2012 02:40 AM

Can you actually repair nailed RFTs?
 
I have a nail in one of my tires as seen in the picture.

After googling, I read that RTFs can be repaired but a local tire shop and Pepboys (and my dealership) say RTFs can only be replaced.

Who's saying the truth? The location of the nail/screw seems to be a safe location to be plugged...

And if fixable, where should I go?

Zooks527 12-09-2012 02:45 AM

If the tire has not lost pressure (so that you haven't been running on the sidewall support), RFTs are as patchable as any other tire, especially for a puncture located that cleanly in the center of the tread. They become unsafe to repair if they've been run while flat, and as there's no way for the shop to tell if you have done so, many will not take your word for it and accept the liability.

Regarding where, I haven't a clue for anyplace in CA. Perhaps if you mention your city, someone may know a place that will do it. I would think there must be some independent out there who will do so.

bwind 12-09-2012 03:07 AM

Thanks much for the quick response! It's much clearer now!

I did get low tire pressure warning.. without knowing it was actually that nail doing it because all 4 tires were showing as low in my TPMS, I just put air in from gas station, but the sign came back up the next day. So I went to the dealership and they found a nail in on of the tires.

So I've been running a bit with the sign on - not completely flat but with lower than usual pressure.

Does that mean I have to replace the tire now?

SilverX3 12-09-2012 04:04 AM

Can repair only if nail not on side wall

aleks001 12-09-2012 04:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bwind (Post 7238841)
Thanks much for the quick response! It's much clearer now!

I did get low tire pressure warning.. without knowing it was actually that nail doing it because all 4 tires were showing as low in my TPMS, I just put air in from gas station, but the sign came back up the next day. So I went to the dealership and they found a nail in on of the tires.

So I've been running a bit with the sign on - not completely flat but with lower than usual pressure.

Does that mean I have to replace the tire now?

You can defiantly repair, it's only an issue if your Tyre was completely flat and you were driving on it or the nail is in the sidewall.

Zooks527 12-09-2012 04:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bwind (Post 7238841)
So I've been running a bit with the sign on - not completely flat but with lower than usual pressure.

Does that mean I have to replace the tire now?

So, now you're in the grey area.

You can nominally run 50 miles at 50 mph at zero indicated pressure. If you do that, the tire is toast.

Your tire pressure light comes on at something like 10% below normal, so, say 29 psi. If you were running at 25 psi or so for 20 miles or so at 30 mph around town, my guess (note: *guess*) is that you'd be OK. Two 50 mile round-trips to work at 10 psi on the highway at 65 mph, not so.

x3brian 12-09-2012 04:42 AM

^^^^spot on.

Go to America's tire out here in California and they will let you know (they have patched my RFT before).

As long as the nail is straight in the top tread and not the side wall you are fine to repair. I got 40k more miles out of my oem bridgestones after patching. Just add air to your tire...do not drive with the low pressure light on. It will degrade the strength of the sidewall and then the tire shop will not repair. They will recommend replacement

CALWATERBOY 12-09-2012 05:04 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by bwind (Post 7238833)
I have a nail in one of my tires as seen in the picture.

After googling, I read that RTFs can be repaired but a local tire shop and Pepboys (and my dealership) say RTFs can only be replaced.

Who's saying the truth? The location of the nail/screw seems to be a safe location to be plugged...

And if fixable, where should I go?


Picture?

What picture?

There's no picture here.



Run, don't walk, to your nearest O'Rielly's or Napa Auto Parts for a flat repair kit. It's nothing to ream a nail hole & insert a plug - your tire will see a long and fruitful life so long as it's not a sidewall jab.

Attachment 352437

Zooks527 12-09-2012 05:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CALWATERBOY (Post 7238872)

Picture?

What picture?

There's no picture here.

Huh. There was when I first looked at the thread, but, yup, it's gone.

It was a clean hit in the tread, in the first line of tread after the edge set. Clean spot for a repair.

Leekay07 12-09-2012 07:00 AM

My extra tire warranty states on RFT they replace the tire for any kind of puncture.


Run flat tyre repair
Run flat tyres are built with reinforced inner walls, and are designed to continue running, even after a puncture. Run flat tyres have traditionally been impossible to repair, leaving customers with an expensive repair bill, as new tyres can cost as much as 200.

Those customers looking for a run flat tyre repair have been told in the past that it isn't possible, as it was too difficult for tyre fitters to tell if the side tyre wall had been damaged. With standard tyres, a tyre fitter was able to spot the damage in the side walls through creases which showed up. With the reinforced run flat tyres this become more difficult, and traditionally the advice was to completely replace the tyre.

Sidewall damage caused by driving a tyre for more than 50 miles, or over the recommended speed with a puncture is difficult to spot, but drivers who have developed s low puncture and have not driven the car with a puncture would argue that they should have their tyres repaired as there is no way there could be any side wall damage.

For their own safety, tyre fitters could not take their word for it, from fear that they may be dealing with someone looking to save money by not having to buy a new tyre.

In the last year both Michelin and Bridgestone have announced that it is possible to carry out a run flat tyre repair, assuming the tyre is no damaged.
The tyres will be checked for heat build up caused by driving a run flat punctured tyre for more than 100 miles, or over 50mph. BMW also claim that a tyre which has been run too long with a puncture will start to show a build up of balls of rubber inside

jakobv84 12-09-2012 09:44 AM

I had my RFT repaired after nail in it and sounds like your situation. Runs just fine.

GarySL 12-09-2012 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jakobv84 (Post 7239175)
I had my RFT repaired after nail in it and sounds like your situation. Runs just fine.

X2 for me & never drove on either at zero pressure.

Tom K. 12-09-2012 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jakobv84 (Post 7239175)
I had my RFT repaired after nail in it and sounds like your situation. Runs just fine.

Same here. I carry a small 12 volt compressor so that I can re-inflate a tire (RFT or regular) as neessary to get to a repair facility.

OP, find a good tire shop that sells RFTs and they should be able to repair it for you.

Tom

bwind 12-10-2012 08:17 AM

Thanks everyone. Looks like Continental banned any repair on their RFTs. Bridgestone, etc. RfTs can be repaired, though.

So I am replacing the tire but at least saving $80 compared to what dealer was trying to charge...

The X Men 12-10-2012 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bwind (Post 7240681)
Thanks everyone. Looks like Continental banned any repair on their RFTs. Bridgestone, etc. RfTs can be repaired, though.

So I am replacing the tire but at least saving $80 compared to what dealer was trying to charge...

My wife just got her Continental procontact runflat patched last month for $20. She used a local chain tire store and she even bought tire insurance from the tire store for $200 covering all 4 tires. You need to call around a bit to find someone who will do the job.

pointandgo 12-10-2012 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bwind (Post 7238833)
I have a nail in one of my tires as seen in the picture.

After googling, I read that RTFs can be repaired but a local tire shop and Pepboys (and my dealership) say RTFs can only be replaced.

Who's saying the truth? The location of the nail/screw seems to be a safe location to be plugged...

And if fixable, where should I go?

bwind,
You don't indicate what BRAND of runflat tire that you have...Bridgestone? You should seek out a tire dealer according to the brand of RF tire that you have as our OE tires (Bridgestone, Conti, Michelin, GY) each have different repair procedures and limits).

Don't bother bringing your car to your BMW dealer as they DO NOT repair RF tires as a policy, even though their tire suppliers generally recommend it!

Your tire may be repairable UNDER CERTAIN CONDITIONS depending on the amount of time that you ran on it (flat) and the condition of the tire's interior. This is why you need to bring it to a tire dealer that carries the brand of RF tire that you have.

Salvator 12-10-2012 06:37 PM

I plugged one of mine with the reamer / sticky plug... No issues, tire worked fine until I replaced it due to wear... :thumbup:

-=Hot|Ice=- 12-10-2012 06:43 PM

Can you? Of course. Should you? No. By patching the tire, you're changing the structure of the tire.

Salvator 12-10-2012 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=- (Post 7241808)
Can you? Of course. Should you? No. By patching the tire, you're changing the structure of the tire.

It my understanding that this is a concern if you are routinely exceeding 100mph... Plugging the tires kills the speed rating... In most of the US, probably not a concern, IMO. However, if it concern for you, by all means replace the tire for peace of mind! :thumbup:

pointandgo 12-11-2012 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Salvator (Post 7241817)
It my understanding that this is a concern if you are routinely exceeding 100mph... Plugging the tires kills the speed rating... In most of the US, probably not a concern, IMO. However, if it concern for you, by all means replace the tire for peace of mind! :thumbup:

Not one tire manufacturer recommends "plugging" a tire and several states are moving to make such repairs illegal. Internal patches are recommended. Nearly every tire manufacturer reduces the tire's original speed limit after a tire has been repaired. Their policies vary.

brandt2025 12-11-2012 05:48 PM

Hmmm, you mean to tell me that tire manufacturers want you to buy a new tire as opposed to repairing your existing one? Seems legit... LOL

As far as states moving to make repairs illegal, I wonder if the manufacturers are lobbying to get these laws passed...

TXFred 12-11-2012 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zooks527 (Post 7238836)
They become unsafe to repair if they've been run while flat, and as there's no way for the shop to tell if you have done so, many will not take your word for it and accept the liability.

I'm going to take issue with this, based on my expertise.

My qualifications:
1. I think I know what I'm talking about.

I've had the distinct pleasure of destroying a run-flat tire. This was less than a week after I got my 335i. I had a nail in the right rear, and before I could get it repaired, I had an emergency. As a result of this, I had to drive 7 miles at about 90mph, on a flat run-flat.

(In hindsight, I should have taken two minutes to fire up the air compressor and re-inflate the tire. But bad things were happening, and I was panicked.)

Later, I took the car in to Discount Tire to have it patched, and the damage was very obvious. The inside of the tire was filled with what looked like black ball bearings. These were composed of rubber dust that had reformed into little balls as the tire rotated. The inside of the sidewalls was visibly damaged, with a crack running the entire way around each sidewall. This was the source of the dust.

From the outside, the tire looked just fine.

Seeing the damage, Discount Tire quite correctly refused to re-mount the tire. I bought a new one.

The point of this is, if you drive on your run-flat fast enough or long enough to damage it, the damage will be obvious when the tire is dismounted for repair.

Frederic

pointandgo 12-11-2012 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brandt2025 (Post 7243927)
Hmmm, you mean to tell me that tire manufacturers want you to buy a new tire as opposed to repairing your existing one? Seems legit... LOL

As far as states moving to make repairs illegal, I wonder if the manufacturers are lobbying to get these laws passed...

NO...they just want you to repair it properly. There is no "conspiracy." In the event of a nail puncture the tire should be removed from the rim and inspected internally for additional damage...then cleaned out...buffed with a grinding wheel, and an internal patch (with "pull-through plug" installed). Some punctures create considerable internal damage to the tire...undetected unless it is dismounted (thus plug repairs not recommended as the tire is not removed for inspection).

Tire manufacturers don't recommend "plugs" because they don't want to get sued into oblivion. Yes, they're THAT BAD. BTW, the Independent Tire Dealer's Assn. is lobbying for the "anti-tire plug laws" not the tire manufacturers. The tire dealers want to "clean up" their act and promote safe tire repair practices.

pointandgo 12-11-2012 06:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TXFred (Post 7243963)
I'm going to take issue with this, based on my expertise.

My qualifications:
1. I think I know what I'm talking about.

I've had the distinct pleasure of destroying a run-flat tire. This was less than a week after I got my 335i. I had a nail in the right rear, and before I could get it repaired, I had an emergency. As a result of this, I had to drive 7 miles at about 90mph, on a flat run-flat.

(In hindsight, I should have taken two minutes to fire up the air compressor and re-inflate the tire. But bad things were happening, and I was panicked.)

Later, I took the car in to Discount Tire to have it patched, and the damage was very obvious. The inside of the tire was filled with what looked like black ball bearings. These were composed of rubber dust that had reformed into little balls as the tire rotated. The inside of the sidewalls was visibly damaged, with a crack running the entire way around each sidewall. This was the source of the dust.

From the outside, the tire looked just fine.

Seeing the damage, Discount Tire quite correctly refused to re-mount the tire. I bought a new one.

The point of this is, if you drive on your run-flat fast enough or long enough to damage it, the damage will be obvious when the tire is dismounted for repair.

Frederic

TXFred,

Well stated.
There CERTAINLY is a way for a professional tire shop to determine if a tire has been damaged beyond the repair limit as you've pointed out. IT MUST BE DISMOUNTED and inspected. THIS is exactly the problem with "plug" repairs. All tires have a thin layer (about 1mm) of butyl rubber...the "inner liner" on the interior of the tire...the critical defense against air leakage. If this gets damaged from underinflation, the integrity of whole tire is compromised, consequently the necessity to inspect the interior of the tire.

spicytofu 12-12-2012 06:49 AM

right now i have a nail, dead center on one of my tires. I always carry a compressor and I just pump air into it once the light comes on. The warning wont come back for another month or 2 and I just fill again. Been lazy to get it repaired. I guess I will patch it when I get a chance.


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:23 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
© 2001-2011 performanceIX, Inc. All Rights Reserved .: guidelines .:. privacy .:. terms