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-   -   X1 Lease Looks Fishy (http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=663984)

X1_Buyer 12-13-2012 11:17 PM

X1 Lease Looks Fishy
 
Can anyone help me do a sanity check on this lease? It looks WRONG.

Term = 36 mos.
MF = .00125
Residual = 59%
Tax = 8.38% (on lease payment, not car value)
Acquisition Fee = $725
Fees, MSRP, negotiated price all shown in image below.

My calcs show $554/mo -- not $618. What am I missing? (Or how am I being taken?)

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8224/8...6bd626ed71.jpg

Ex-One 12-14-2012 07:09 AM

I've never done a lease but are their finance fees?

vbbuilt 12-14-2012 07:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by X1_Buyer (Post 7248991)
Can anyone help me do a sanity check on this lease? It looks WRONG.

Term = 36 mos.
MF = .00125
Residual = 59%
Tax = 8.38% (on lease payment, not car value)
Acquisition Fee = $725
Fees, MSRP, negotiated price all shown in image below.

My calcs show $554/mo -- not $618. What am I missing? (Or how am I being taken?)

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8224/8...6bd626ed71.jpg

Didn't you ask the dealership to explain it to you?

Curious, only 12K miles per year? You must not drive very much. I easly put at least 20K a year on my rides. :)

Vince.

nospam 12-14-2012 08:18 AM

Which is why you shouldn't lease Vince.

mrbelk 12-14-2012 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by X1_Buyer (Post 7248991)
Can anyone help me do a sanity check on this lease? It looks WRONG.

Term = 36 mos.
MF = .00125
Residual = 59%
Tax = 8.38% (on lease payment, not car value)
Acquisition Fee = $725
Fees, MSRP, negotiated price all shown in image below.

My calcs show $554/mo -- not $618. What am I missing? (Or how am I being taken?)

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8224/8...6bd626ed71.jpg

It looks to me like they added the sales tax for the entire vehicle into the capitalized cost rather than having the sales tax be paid on each payment. It's the first line item after the "SmartChoice" price.

-MrB

X1_Buyer 12-14-2012 10:29 AM

Thanks for the comments. Yes, I've been trying to get the dealer to explain but the CA is not the sharpest and the finance manager is never available.

The finance fee is $725 and there are title/reg fees but they don't get it to $619. Perhaps they are double-counting tax. If so, it feels like they're trying to take me.

For completeness, I should have shown my calc...

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8359/8...f4fa2c5175.jpg

Thanks for the input!

36Joules 12-14-2012 11:48 AM

Ask them for the "Dealer Disclosure" page. This is a 1 page summary of all the lease details. Breaks down every fee, every profit, all taxes, all residual information, all doc fees and other administration fees. Much more detail than the minimal information they've apparently provided you. Don't sign until your numbers match theirs and you're satisfied.

dgkfl 12-14-2012 03:58 PM

I think that your suspicion that the difference is related to how the tax is calculated is correct. I believe some states tax only the monthly payment, some tax the entire total lease payment up front (meaning the tax must either be paid upfront or rolled into the amount financed), and a few states actually tax the entire capitalized cost up front (which it looks to me to be happening in the dealer's calculation). I don't know what your state does, but get that straight and you will probably have found the issue.

fb88 12-16-2012 10:06 PM

The chart you figured is for purchase option. How do you know what MF was used in the lease calculation in the original chart?

vic 12-17-2012 10:34 AM

Yes, the chart you show is for the purchase option, and clearly shows tax on the entire amount of the vehicle, not simply on the monthly payment. My hunch is that the dealer's lease calculation is double-taxing you (adding monthly tax based on a selling price that already includes taxes). If you clarify the tax situation, the payment discrepancy should go away.

iamgort 01-09-2013 08:40 AM

Hi all, I am brand new here and registered as I am considering an X1 as well. I figured I'd post in here rather than start a new thread. Here is a lease breakdown I was just given by a dealer, I was hoping to get a look over by the experts. Thank you in advance.

This is for a 2013 x1 xdrive28i, listing says: PREMIUM PKG , COLD WEATHER PKG , TECHNOLOGY PKG. Alpine white with sand beige interior

With is for a 36 month with 10K/year. Purchasing state is Virginia.

Selling Price 36,845.00
Discount 1,500.00
Rebate 750.00
Adjusted Price 34,595.00
Fuel Surcharge 58.00




Total Purchase 34,653.00

Trade Allowance
Trade Difference 34,653.00

Processing Fee 198.00
Tax .00

Non Tax Fees 1,264.00
Net Price 36,115.00
Trade Payoff
Balance 36,115.00

When I asked about estimated $ per thousand on the monthly payment if I rolled the upfront cost into the lease and was told it was $30 per thousand.

vic 01-09-2013 09:47 AM

The thing that sticks out to me most is the "Non Tax Fees" of $1,264.00. What exactly are those fees? I've never paid anything remotely close to that. Also, a few important factors are missing. The residual is non-negotiable, but should be included. The money factor is negotiable and must be included to determine the quality of the lease deal. Finally, what is the monthly payment?

iamgort 01-09-2013 09:53 AM

The monthly with me paying the first months payment and taxes up front is 487. I have sent a reply to ask about the residual and money factor. Thank you!

vic 01-09-2013 10:23 AM

In most states, taxes for leases are not paid up front, but rather with each monthly payment, and only on the amount of the payment. Illinois is a notable exception, as they require that taxes on the entire selling price of the car be paid up front. Perhaps Virginia is similar. You may want to look that up.

Regarding the "Non Tax Fees", this may include the acquisition fee and some type of dealer fee, which may be legit, but I would want to know exactly what they are.

iamgort 01-09-2013 10:41 AM

Thanks, Vic. Will check on the VA sales tax and post back once I hear the answer from the dealer. Actually forgot to tell the dealer I'd be registering in VA as the dealer is just over the river in Maryland.

spicytofu 01-10-2013 06:58 AM

In MD, we pay all the taxes on the full price of the vehicle. It will be rolled into your monthly payments. Since you are registering in VA, it should be VA tax rates, which is you are just taxed on the depreciation of the vehicle. It is possible they are taxing you with MD taxes.

Leekay07 01-13-2013 03:51 AM

My residule is the same I put 6k down when I bought it incase I wanted to trade up should I get my promotion thats been promised so I ponied up the money to keep my payment at 340 with 12,000 miles a year for 3 years.


My wife never drive that far more like 8k a year but shes finding every reason to take this Bimmer :)

Which is really good

SilverX3 01-13-2013 12:17 PM

Cars are cheap in the US

If I have that deal I jump

emPoWaH 01-13-2013 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by X1_Buyer (Post 7248991)
Can anyone help me do a sanity check on this lease? It looks WRONG.

Term = 36 mos.
MF = .00125
Residual = 59%
Tax = 8.38% (on lease payment, not car value)
Acquisition Fee = $725
Fees, MSRP, negotiated price all shown in image below.

My calcs show $554/mo -- not $618. What am I missing? (Or how am I being taken?)

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8224/8...6bd626ed71.jpg

If it's $0 due at lease signing, then not only are they rolling in your bank fee and registration fees, but also your first month's payment. Try doing it again but divide the total depreciation by 35 months instead of 36 months.


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