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-   -   G37 Sport 6MT - what am I missing? (http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=666805)

bmw_or_audi 12-29-2012 02:43 PM

G37 Sport 6MT - what am I missing?
 
I have been in the market for quite a while now (too long) for an A4 or a 328i. Just for the heck of it, I checked out some specs and prices for the G37 Sport 6MT, as they sometimes offer incredible discounts when a model near its end.

A car buying service promises a price of about $36K (about $6800 off MSRP, without any negotiations). I glanced over the list of standard features and they seem to have grown quite a bit since last time I checked them out:
  • Navigation
  • Backup camera & sonar
  • Xenons
  • Sport suspention
  • 12-way power seats
  • Power tilt and telescopic steering
  • High end stereo
  • Intelligent Key
  • Voice recognition
  • USB, bluetooth, XM, etc.
  • 60K B2B warranty
Oh, and 328Hp and outstanding handling, and very good reliability.

To get a similarly equipped 4-banger 328i, you are looking at about $47-48K street price.
  • Some lows of the G37 Sport: it is looking a little dated and it has never been able to compete on looks with the pretty ones, inside and outside.
  • Biggest low: awful gas mileage for the manual, partly due to a mystifying choice of a close-ratio gear box (why with such a powerful engine?)

I can't see anything that offers the same kind of bang for the buck in terms of performance and practicality. If very long commutes/mpgs are not an issue, it seems like an irresistible package for self-proclaimed enthusiasts.

Yes, yes, it is not the most refined in looks, both inside and outside, but it still is easy on the eyes and build quality and materials are very high. Yes, it is getting old and it may not be the most refined, but it is still a very well performing and yet civilized ride.

What am I missing? Maybe BJ is more right than he thinks. Is it all about the badge and the magazine fueled myths of telepathic steering, magical voodoo qualities, etc.?

What am I not seeing in the $11-12K + Tax price difference?

justinnum1 12-29-2012 02:51 PM

After driving them both, if you can't tell the difference than the BMW is not right for you.

bmw_or_audi 12-29-2012 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by justinnum1 (Post 7277940)
After driving them both, if you can't tell the difference than the BMW is not right for you.

I have not driven it. I just now checked out the specs on line. So no decisions yet. But I am hoping someone can tell me more than mentioning mythical qualities, je ne sais quois, etc.

dtc100 12-29-2012 03:06 PM

Instead, why not wait and see what the Q50 is about?

Zeichen311 12-29-2012 03:10 PM

I think you summed it up pretty well in your first post. The G37 was always a close contender for the 3 Series crown and if memory serves, it even edged the E90 in a magazine test or two. It's going to come down to whether or not you like it.

"Mythical qualities" and je ne sais quoi are not mythical and most importantly, not exclusive to BMW. How a car feels--the total driving experience--is more than the sum of the spec sheets and the price tag, and is often what decides comparison tests.

One thing I do recall about the G is that both reviewers and regular car-folk tend to love or hate Nissan's V6 powerplants. They are powerful but somewhat uneven: Some variants are very good, others more coarse and unrefined. (I honestly don't know how the current iteration ranks.) This has hurt the Infinitis in a number of comparison tests, especially when stacked alongside BMW's glass-smooth inline sixes.

hans007 12-29-2012 03:14 PM

the G37 has a lot more standard equipment.

but the VQ real world MPG is horrible. i had a first gen G35 coupe and in reality the current one is not much different as the engine is more or less the same (the new one is the VQ37HR , "high revving" and .2L bigger than the original 3.5L 280hp). that said, the 3.7 is a little coarse compared to the 3.5.

now i've got a 328i right now. its probably got 270hp (if you believe the dynos edmunds did vs the ATS which i think most of us do). Now I haven't owned a G35 in a long time, but I have a friend who has an 08 G35 (same body style as current with the older engine) and i wouldnt' say it feel significantly different. the interior also feels cheaper. these 2nd gen G sedans have much much nicer interiors than the first gen, but i'd still say they are quite a bit worse than say a 3 series or A4 (don't buy the A4, really dont)

that said, the G37 is a good car, it'll be super reliable (my friends has never had a problem) and for the japanese makes it has by far the best driving feel. if anything given its old and has hydraulic steering it might feel better to you. it will get horrible MPG tho. i live in los angeles. when I had a G35 i probably got lik e16mpg with a 5AT. my friend gets maybe 17mpg in his 5AT 2008. im not sure itll be a huge difference with the stick and the slightly newer engine (which still doesnt have direct injection or really any sort of fuel saving tech). i've got a new 328i and its only got 950 miles on it and i get about 21-22 average in los angeles and i've heard it gets much better. oh and also the "bose" in the G37 is barely high end.

also the leather in the infiniti's isn't really very good, it will warp pretty fast. you will notice the side bolsters on those seats look crushed after like 6 months. the G is a good car, but it is old looking. the platform is exactly the same one they released in 2003 with a reskin (the FM platform was not updated for the current G, wheelbase etc are all the same) so its riding on some old bones. I mean i would probalby not buy an E90 today either given the F30 is out just for that.

So yeah, good value, but then again the Q50 will be out soon. I guess i'd say decide how much your money is worth, in the end the BMW will probably only be $4-5k more and probably have much better residuals if you aren't keeping the car forever.

g37to335i 12-29-2012 03:27 PM

I have a G37,2013 m sport 335i and X5. I had the G37 since 2010 then bought the 2011 X5 in early 2011. The X5 is what convinced me to get the 335i this year. That says a lot about the 3er. I have the G37 for a couple more months but I will be letting go of her shortly. The odd thing is I find the 335i to be hardcore sport compared to the G. The exhaust note is always audible, the chassis is stiffer, the seats are way more sporty. My wife even exclaimed how the car is not for her since she thought something was wrong with it due to the exhaust note. Poor girl:)

My 335i msport was worth about 18k more than my loaded 2010 G37xs (up to the navigation package) but hopefully this will answer your question. If you were to ask me if the 18k is worth it, I would say yes. due to the extra refinement, more tech, the power train which is amazing in the 3er, better gas mileage, better interior, looks etc. I also got 6k off the 3er.
Wait for the Q50

vonmayr 12-29-2012 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmw_or_audi (Post 7277928)
I have been in the market for quite a while now (too long) for an A4 or a 328i. Just for the heck of it, I checked out some specs and prices for the G37 Sport 6MT, as they sometimes offer incredible discounts when a model near its end.

A car buying service promises a price of about $36K (about $6800 off MSRP, without any negotiations). I glanced over the list of standard features and they seem to have grown quite a bit since last time I checked them out:
  • Navigation
  • Backup camera & sonar
  • Xenons
  • Sport suspention
  • 12-way power seats
  • Power tilt and telescopic steering
  • High end stereo
  • Intelligent Key
  • Voice recognition
  • USB, bluetooth, XM, etc.
  • 60K B2B warranty
Oh, and 328Hp and outstanding handling, and very good reliability.

To get a similarly equipped 4-banger 328i, you are looking at about $47-48K street price.
  • Some lows of the G37 Sport: it is looking a little dated and it has never been able to compete on looks with the pretty ones, inside and outside.
  • Biggest low: awful gas mileage for the manual, partly due to a mystifying choice of a close-ratio gear box (why with such a powerful engine?)

I can't see anything that offers the same kind of bang for the buck in terms of performance and practicality. If very long commutes/mpgs are not an issue, it seems like an irresistible package for self-proclaimed enthusiasts.

Yes, yes, it is not the most refined in looks, both inside and outside, but it still is easy on the eyes and build quality and materials are very high. Yes, it is getting old and it may not be the most refined, but it is still a very well performing and yet civilized ride.

What am I missing? Maybe BJ is more right than he thinks. Is it all about the badge and the magazine fueled myths of telepathic steering, magical voodoo qualities, etc.?

What am I not seeing in the $11-12K + Tax price difference?

I looked long and hard at the G - it was the last contender for the reasons that you mention - long standard equipment list, great pricing, 6MT. Decent handling. The engine is strong and willing but needs revs to be happy. I went with the 335 for the handling, the glass smooth engine and power delivery from down low, the lack of Noise/Vibration/Harshness that the BMW provides that the G37 does not. And its the last model year, which will always bring discount pricing as well. A few other intangibles also weighed in, like dealer service hours, etc. I decided that for me, the 335 was worth the premium in price. It is an individual decision, and you need to drive both to decide. Its really not a bad position to be in - either car will probably make you very happy and take care of you well. There is no "bad choice" - just the "right choice" for you in your situation.

Good luck with your decision!

SD Z4MR 12-29-2012 04:15 PM

When we were shopping for a car in January last year we had narrowed it down to either a BMW 335i Sedan or an Infiniti G37 Sport 6MT Sedan. (Note that the 300 HP 335i is more on par with the 328 HP G37 than a 240 HP 328i.) (I should also mention that I didn't own my Z4 M roadster at that time.)

We had already driven a 335i Sedan (and the 335is Coupe) the previous weekend and went to drive the G37. We liked everything about it, it had more standard equipment, and it was about $10,000 cheaper than a comparably equipped 335i Sedan. But it didn't seem quite as refined. The engine seemed harsher, the manual transmission wasn't as smooth, and it didn't handle as well. Just to be sure we literally drove from the Infiniti dealer back to BMW dealer and drove the 335i Sedan again.

There was just no comparison. The BMW was simply a better driving car. The engine was smoother and felt more powerful, the transmission was more precise, and it just handled way better than the G37. There was no doubt in our minds that the BMW was the better choice and the additional price was totally worth it. Of course, one thing led to another and we switched from a 335i Sedan to a 335i Coupe and then decided that we loved the 335is Coupe so much, that it was the car we really wanted so we chose that. Deciding to do Euro Delivery brought the price down to about what we would have paid for a 335i Sedan with regular delivery.

Bottom line, comparing the two cars on paper doesn't do justice to either one. You really have to drive them to understand the difference. If you test drive a G37 back-to-back with a comparably equipped 335i and you either can't tell the difference or you think the G37 is a better car, by all means, buy it. Of course, if you think the additional cost is just too high, the G37 is not a bad compromise.

SD Z4MR 12-29-2012 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmw_or_audi (Post 7277928)
Oh, and 328Hp and outstanding handling, and very good reliability.

To get a similarly equipped 4-banger 328i, you are looking at about $47-48K street price.

Going back and reading your OP, I just have to point out a couple of things:

The G37 doesn't offer outstanding handling compared to a BMW 3 Series. The handling may be OK, but the handling of a 3 Series is superior. The only thing a G37 has over a 3 Series is a limited slip differential, but in spite of that it still falls short.

You say "4-banger" like it's 1970. This is 2012 (almost 2013) and "4-banger's" are not the four cylinder of your father, they are now turbocharged and offer far more power, refinement, and fuel efficiency than those old cast-iron block carbureted 4s. Smaller engines are the way all manufacturers are now going and dismissing them by labeling with a derivative decades-old label is way off base.

justinnum1 12-29-2012 04:47 PM

some mags have the 328 at 0-60 in 5.6 seconds....only a few tenths off the 328.

g37to335i 12-29-2012 04:52 PM

The G 37 does the quarter in 13.5@103-5mph. 0-60 is debatable but I have seen 5s, per MT although the one they tested was AT. The G37s handling may be a notch lower but it's still very very good. Definitely not a dismissible option.

I have to add that the G37 is old tech now, it's long in the tooth and is about to be replaced next year. I got it at a time when value was a huge adv in its favor. It had better tech the 3er back then but now, nothing beats the 3er, both the 328 and 335i in terms of what it has to offer as a wholesome package. I would admit the so called "4 banger" holds its own against the 3.7l v6. As the above poster said, we are talking fractions of a second here. Throw twisties into the mix and I doubt the G will beat the 328i

Ilovemycar 12-29-2012 05:01 PM

It's been a few years since I test drove an MT G37S, as well as my friend's older AT G35. I'm not kidding, with the G37S, I was bored after having test driven numerous BMWs. I think it was really the feel of the MT as well as steering in particular that I much preferred with BMW. There were some posts by a track instructor saying that the G's can pretty much equal (or at least come darn close) to 3ers on the track, implying that it was a serious value. But for my "personal feel" while driving it, really, bored! lol.

Personally, I think it does look sharp and sporty, and I like the aggressive sounds it makes.

The one detraction that may slip some potential buyers is how little space there is in the rear, particularly the headroom. I'm only of average stature, and my head just about hits the rear windshield. In my friend's G35 that I mentioned, I've asked him to please warn me before hitting speed bumps, because my head does actually hit the windshield just about every time, not enough to hurt the head or anything, but I'm afraid of badly biting my tongue while speaking. That's how little headroom there is, or at least was.

The E92 is surprisingly spacious in the rear for a coupe. It is far, far more comfortable than the A5/S5 or G35/37.

g37to335i 12-29-2012 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ilovemycar (Post 7278160)
But for my "personal feel" while driving it, really, bored! lol.


.

Boring?

brkf 12-29-2012 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmw_or_audi (Post 7277928)
I have been in the market for quite a while now (too long) for an A4 or a 328i. Just for the heck of it, I checked out some specs and prices for the G37 Sport 6MT, as they sometimes offer incredible discounts when a model near its end.

A car buying service promises a price of about $36K (about $6800 off MSRP, without any negotiations). I glanced over the list of standard features and they seem to have grown quite a bit since last time I checked them out:
  • Navigation
  • Backup camera & sonar
  • Xenons
  • Sport suspention
  • 12-way power seats
  • Power tilt and telescopic steering
  • High end stereo
  • Intelligent Key
  • Voice recognition
  • USB, bluetooth, XM, etc.
  • 60K B2B warranty
Oh, and 328Hp and outstanding handling, and very good reliability.

To get a similarly equipped 4-banger 328i, you are looking at about $47-48K street price.
  • Some lows of the G37 Sport: it is looking a little dated and it has never been able to compete on looks with the pretty ones, inside and outside.
  • Biggest low: awful gas mileage for the manual, partly due to a mystifying choice of a close-ratio gear box (why with such a powerful engine?)

I can't see anything that offers the same kind of bang for the buck in terms of performance and practicality. If very long commutes/mpgs are not an issue, it seems like an irresistible package for self-proclaimed enthusiasts.

Yes, yes, it is not the most refined in looks, both inside and outside, but it still is easy on the eyes and build quality and materials are very high. Yes, it is getting old and it may not be the most refined, but it is still a very well performing and yet civilized ride.

What am I missing? Maybe BJ is more right than he thinks. Is it all about the badge and the magazine fueled myths of telepathic steering, magical voodoo qualities, etc.?

What am I not seeing in the $11-12K + Tax price difference?

I see the value for sure. But the engine/drivetrain is quite coarse and the car is very big (and a bit dated as the new one is coming out next year).

If you want entry lux with all the trimmings and don't mind it a bit rougher than a 3, the G37 is a fantastic deal and a really well built car. It's got better space in back than my F30, better leather, the better NA VQ engine (sorry not a fan of the N20/N55 engines), better materials, way better build quality in general, and the manufacturer is better in terms of long term reliability.

If the G were 200 lbs lighter and a bit shorter, I'd get one over a 3 series. In 10 years I've had 4 BMWs, so it's not like I'm opposed to BMW. For me the driving feel was the only reason I opted for it again over the Infiniti. On paper everything else is better or close to the same with the G. But in a series of S curves the 3 still does a pretty good dance (though the EPS of the F30 is so bad it will be easy for Infiniti to eclipse it in the next gen version of the G).

Ilovemycar 12-29-2012 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by g37to335i (Post 7278170)
Boring?

Yes, that's what I said. I was coming off many BMW test drives, including 128, 135, 328, 335, M3, besides competing Audis, etc. If it was the first car I test drove during that time, I wouldn't be surprised if I was blown away.

I'm not knocking the car, I mentioned the instructor's input for a reason. The intent behind my post was to reaffirm what some of the posters were saying: Ya gotta drive 'em to find out if it's worth it to you! Big price difference after all. Master of the Obvious.

g37to335i 12-29-2012 05:36 PM

I have driven the E90 328i loaner back to back with my G37, boring would not be the word I would choose but beauty is in the eye of the beholder after all.

To the OP, this thread has no merit being as long as the ATS thread. The G37 can hold its own in this class, it's certainly not boring. The biggest drawback it has is its not worth mentioning at this stage, it's a dying breed and is being replaced in a year. I would let it go, as an owner of one, it may have some few merits over the 328i but the same can be said about a camaro 1LE. If you look at it as a whole, the G37 is not worth it in 2013, in 2009 yes it may have been a big deal.

eazy 12-29-2012 06:01 PM

I Infiniti is a good car the problem I have with it is that the engine is very busy & rough at high rpm's. Due to Infiniti's new stupid naming policy the next G is now going to be called the Q50

Jamesonsviggen 12-29-2012 06:59 PM

The n20 is surprisingly close 6mt to 6mt performance. Look at top gear acceleration for example. The G traps about 3-4mph faster though.

G is the bang for the buck champ right now. Drive them both. That is what it will come down to.

boltjaM3s 12-29-2012 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmw_or_audi (Post 7277928)

What am I missing? Maybe BJ is more right than he thinks. Is it all about the badge and the magazine fueled myths of telepathic steering, magical voodoo qualities, etc.?

I try to keep it simple. It's not a BMW. So if you're in this segment and you're going to take on BMW you damned well better have something fantastic to offer.

That's why so many other brands fail here. Infiniti makes a car in this segment because it feels it has to, not because they have something fantastic to offer. Acura, Audi, Lexus, now Cadillac, they all do the same thing, they all follow the blueprint, they all make something that should sell on paper, and they all wind up way behind. It's not a BMW. That's your answer.

BJ

CALWATERBOY 12-29-2012 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmw_or_audi (Post 7277928)
What am I not seeing in the $11-12K + Tax price difference?


Nothing! If you like it, go ahead....make yer day.

OTOH, how would you know without drive time? Let that be your decider.

av98 12-29-2012 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmw_or_audi (Post 7277928)
I have been in the market for quite a while now (too long) for an A4 or a 328i. Just for the heck of it, I checked out some specs and prices for the G37 Sport 6MT, as they sometimes offer incredible discounts when a model near its end.

A car buying service promises a price of about $36K (about $6800 off MSRP, without any negotiations). I glanced over the list of standard features and they seem to have grown quite a bit since last time I checked them out:
  • Navigation
  • Backup camera & sonar
  • Xenons
  • Sport suspention
  • 12-way power seats
  • Power tilt and telescopic steering
  • High end stereo
  • Intelligent Key
  • Voice recognition
  • USB, bluetooth, XM, etc.
  • 60K B2B warranty
Oh, and 328Hp and outstanding handling, and very good reliability.

To get a similarly equipped 4-banger 328i, you are looking at about $47-48K street price.
  • Some lows of the G37 Sport: it is looking a little dated and it has never been able to compete on looks with the pretty ones, inside and outside.
  • Biggest low: awful gas mileage for the manual, partly due to a mystifying choice of a close-ratio gear box (why with such a powerful engine?)

I can't see anything that offers the same kind of bang for the buck in terms of performance and practicality. If very long commutes/mpgs are not an issue, it seems like an irresistible package for self-proclaimed enthusiasts.

Yes, yes, it is not the most refined in looks, both inside and outside, but it still is easy on the eyes and build quality and materials are very high. Yes, it is getting old and it may not be the most refined, but it is still a very well performing and yet civilized ride.

What am I missing? Maybe BJ is more right than he thinks. Is it all about the badge and the magazine fueled myths of telepathic steering, magical voodoo qualities, etc.?

What am I not seeing in the $11-12K + Tax price difference?

You are basically paying for an over-priced 370Z GT type car which isn't nimble but designed for fast off the line acceleration and long endurance type high speed runs; target American muscle cars. The close ratio gear box is due to the fast straight line acceleration it's designed for on the lower gears then taller high speed for the higher gears. The outgoing G37 is also much heavier in terms of the car's chassis but not structurally stiff as needed for lateral G forces; hence it feels like a boat compared to an E46, E9x or F3x.

If you don't like the immediate response during quick maneuvers that the BMWs excel at then the G37 is the car for you. But if you like immediate connectivity to the road that the BMWs & Porsches feeds back, stay away from the G37.

krash 12-30-2012 12:23 AM

I think the biggest knock against the Infiniti G right now is that it's at the end of its product life cycle.

Infiniti is going to release a completely new design for the G next year.

So if you go with the G, you'll be stuck with a car that is basically out-of-date. This doesn't matter to some, but for me, it's a huge factor.

I just won't buy a car that I know is being completely redesigned a year later, including a BMW. If the F30 was at the end of its life cycle, I'd stay away from that too.

Again, not an issue for some, but it's a deal breaker for me.

reytran 12-30-2012 01:18 AM

If you comparing the price at 47-48k, its the price the manual G Coupe IPL - 348hp.

My personal opinion about G coupe.
Pros:
Interior: I dont know why people complain about interior. My 09 650i interior completely outdated compare to infiniti EX and FX (same year). I always wanna pursuade my fiance to get an infiniti SUV with beige interior.
Exhaust note: my 08 G37S with sport muffler (its an original factory option) sounds amazing. You can hear the down gear sound with the stock muffler. My 650i with sport package factory exhaust note cant compare with the G coupe. (Not anymore after I installed the M6 Eisenmann Race)
Sounds: bose all the way with ipod connection and touch screen as original equipment.
Mod: its always fun if you are into mod a japanese car.


Cons:
Handling, you definitely need an after market swaybar (hotkisch or smth i forgot), lower spring and throw in some spacers.
Steering. I've had 08 G37S before, its sucked. Too light for me, I can tell its no feeling. My cousin Honda Accord coupe has way better handling feel. I get bored of driving it after a year.
Trunk space: that coupe has smaller trunk space then my cabrio. 1 golf bag, full.
Exterior: She doesnt have sexy back. Seriously.

Conclusion, for me, if between 328i and G37S, I would definitely go for the G. I like big coupe. About redesign, there are tons of G35 never looks outdated, it was released in 2002. I know infiniti is not bmw. But 328i is not M3 either. A full option G37S coupe compare to base 328i at the same priceprice.

shicobico 12-30-2012 04:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by justinnum1 (Post 7277940)
After driving them both, if you can't tell the difference than the BMW is not right for you.


I think I can try and make this statement sound a bit nicer than my friend Justin did. :rofl:


"After driving them both, if you can't tell the difference, then the BMW price premium is not justified for you."


In other words, just because other people say it is better, doesn't mean that it actually is. Driving experiences are very subjective. A 10k price difference is not. Go with your gut (just don't make any long term commitments). :)


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