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-   -   Wind noise or am I too picky? (http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=694162)

sfiermon 05-05-2013 06:08 AM

Wind noise or am I too picky?
 
Hi all

I have had my x3 almost a week and I love it. Best car I've ever owned. However, if I am driving on the highway and I turn my head to look out the driver window, I can hear some wind noise that seems to be coming from the rear window towards the top on the driver side. Just curious if others have noticed anything like this as well.


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The X Men 05-05-2013 06:42 AM

It's a common complaint among X3 owners, the X3 is not very well insulated. Some owners have been able to get the dealer to fix a wind related whistling noise, I am not sure if that's the case in your car.

Mr Mojo Risin 05-05-2013 09:44 AM

Wind noise or am I too picky?
 
My 2013 x3 is currently in the shop with the passenger side whistle being one of my complaints. I'll let you know what happens.

In my case it is clearly coming from the passenger mirror area. It's bizarre because you'd think both mirrors would cause the noise if the design was bad


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sfiermon 05-05-2013 12:26 PM

Wind noise or am I too picky?
 
I looked over my car with a flashlight in the garage. I found the following

Vertical piano black trim piece on outside rear driver side door was protruding out very slightly at the top. Possible cause of my wind noise. The passenger side trim didn't do this.

The front corner (very small) of one of the shadow line aluminum trim pieces was broken off and looked forced on. There was a small crease on the broken corner. The other side didn't have this.

The front of the passenger side roof rail wasn't seated as far down as the other creating a gap between the horizontal rubber trim and the roof rail.

Both mirrors exhibit the whistling also

I am going back to the dealer tomorrow asking them to reorder. What are my chances they will actually do this?!



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aberrant 05-05-2013 12:41 PM

You're going to ask to reorder the car? That seems a little extreme given that the flaws you found seem to be easily remedied.

sfiermon 05-05-2013 12:59 PM

Perhaps you are right. I am not sure they will do this but the level of work that is needed to fix these issues is more involved than you might think. There was one more issue on the interior...there is a rubber piece that sits just below the soft top/leather trim piece between the window and this piece. That rubber trim was installed uneven and half of it is above the leather so when you look across from the driver's seat, you notice it readily.

So, as I see it, this is what needs to happen on a week old car.

1. Order two side view mirrors, which do not come painted. Paint them to match Carbon Black (hopefully they do!). Also make sure that any gaskets/seals are done better than the mirrors on there right now.

2. Install/Order/Adjust the piano black trim piece along with the rubber piping around the driver's side rear door. I noticed that the rubber piping along the top of this window is also uneven when comparing a much better job done on the passenger side rear door.

3. For the roof rail on the passenger side, any tightening, replacement, or adjustment involves REMOVING the headliner on the inside as all access to the rails is performed from the interior.

4. For the rubber trim on the interior, remove the inside door panel to readjust.'

5. Order and replace the shadow line aluminum trim that is cracked.

Can all this be done? I'm sure of it...

Should it be done and will things go back 100% after the installations? Big unknown!!!

aberrant 05-05-2013 01:10 PM

Oh, I definitely hear ya. I'd be back at the dealer's with a service appointment as soon as I could. I'm just not sure they're going to replace an entire car over some road noise (subjective; they can always say, "tested, not reproducible") and some cosmetic errors. They'll probably try to fix as much as they can, as cheaply as they can. :(

Vortec4800 05-05-2013 01:39 PM

Your specific issues aside, wind noise is a common complaint on the X3. Some people think it's the elephant-ear mirrors making a bunch of noise coupled with the design of the rubber seals on the doors failing quickly and easily contributing to the noise. No matter what you do it will never go away, even if they replace the seals and it's quiet for a while the sound will be back in a few weeks.

The X Men 05-05-2013 02:06 PM

sfiermon, before you ask your dealer to upgrade your X3 to a X6 for free :) :) maybe you should ask the dealer to let you drive another X3 to compare the wind noise.

sfiermon 05-05-2013 02:09 PM

Yep. Test driving another x3 is on the list. I would also only expect another x3. There are at least 5 visible mistakes on the one I have. I think that's not cool. If service fixes it all...then great. I'll still be happy.

Another thing...I don't buy the perennial wind noise argument. There are several people that have never complained.

The X Men 05-05-2013 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sfiermon (Post 7565243)
Yep. Test driving another x3 is on the list. I would also only expect another x3. There are at least 5 visible mistakes on the one I have. I think that's not cool. If service fixes it all...then great. I'll still be happy.

Another thing...I don't buy the perennial wind noise argument. There are several people that have never complained.

Well everybody wind noise tolerance is different, heck, some people actually think our X3 is quiet on the highway, while I think its noisy. Every one of the X3 we test drove has some level of wind noise on the highway.
As far as getting another X3, I really don't think any of those problems you mentioned qualifies for the lemon law. If you haven't sign the paper work yet, then you might have been able to get a new car, but once the car is title to you, it gets much tougher after that.

IAS 05-05-2013 07:09 PM

it is a SUV, it has wind noise, every minivan, suv or SAV have more wind noise as compared to cars, so that is common is in this segment, the issue or complain should be the noise due to seals or side mirror, since SUVs and minivan have larger side mirrors they some time create whistling noise also, this could be due to many reasons, if it is a design issue it will be in every car and should be caught during testing. If we chose to buy SUV or any vehicles with higher roofline we have to deal with wind noise, with aero dynamic design it is minimised but styling prevents to go too much round edges.

jman103099 05-06-2013 05:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IAS (Post 7565732)
it is a SUV, it has wind noise, every minivan, suv or SAV have more wind noise as compared to cars, so that is common is in this segment, the issue or complain should be the noise due to seals or side mirror, since SUVs and minivan have larger side mirrors they some time create whistling noise also, this could be due to many reasons, if it is a design issue it will be in every car and should be caught during testing. If we chose to buy SUV or any vehicles with higher roofline we have to deal with wind noise, with aero dynamic design it is minimised but styling prevents to go too much round edges.

My e83 X3 never exibited such wind noise. Maybe the exterior mirrors were smaller, but the old X3 was much better insulated.

sfiermon 05-06-2013 06:49 AM

Thanks for all the feedback. I looked around the entire car. There are definitely build issues with how the roofrails, rubber gaskets, and trim pieces were assembled on my car. I don't think that there is a systemic issue and this is most likely a one off. Hopefully, my dealer can fix everything but I am starting to lay the seed of a new car in case of other issues uncovered along the way...

Liverman 05-06-2013 07:18 AM

sfiermon, you really do have issues that BMW needs to address for you. Those pieces should not be like that.

It would be great if BMW tested each car over the same test track with a battery of calibrated microphones inside to detect noises. Until then we are left with our individual perceptions of our experiences...

My new F25 X3 is significantly quieter than my '05 E83. I am pretty sensitive to car noises (ask my wife) and I am not detecting an issue that bothers me.

We drove the car ~250 miles yesterday in a combination of mountain roads, open interstate (higher speeds than 75 mph, but I will not document exactly how high :) - let's just say I stretched her legs a bit), urban interstate and urban surface roads. I did not notice a wind noise or road noise problem. No significant or persistant whistling noises. There were fairly high winds yesterday afternoon on the way back and I did not experience a wind noise or handling issue due to the gusty crosswinds between Colorado Springs and Denver.

Yes we had the sound system on, so the correct statement was that any noise from wind, etc., was not so loud as to interfere with the enjoyment of the audio (folk on the way home, classical on the way there).

This is not to dispute that any one of you does or does not have an issue wth your car, just that I am not having a problem with my car (at this time).

wpattison 05-06-2013 07:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jman103099 (Post 7566237)
My e83 X3 never exibited such wind noise. Maybe the exterior mirrors were smaller, but the old X3 was much better insulated.

And here we illustrate just how subjective this issue is - my old e83 X3 had a ton of wind noise, and my current f25 X3 seems much better insulated... ;)

sfiermon 05-06-2013 07:43 AM

While wind noise is subjective. I understand that. However, visible gaps, mis-aligned rubber gaskets, and differences on passenger and driver sides...are not. I feel I have several legs to stand on with the dealer. Thus far...they have been very accommodating.

wpattison 05-06-2013 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sfiermon (Post 7566444)
While wind noise is subjective. I understand that. However, visible gaps, mis-aligned rubber gaskets, and differences on passenger and driver sides...are not. I feel I have several legs to stand on with the dealer. Thus far...they have been very accommodating.

Completely agree with you - I wasn't addressing your issues. Wind noise is a symptom of build quality issues with your X3. I wish you the very best in getting them resolved.

guyver626 05-06-2013 07:55 AM

Wind noise or am I too picky?
 
Can u provide pics of the issues? I want to compare to my car. Thanks.


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The X Men 05-06-2013 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sfiermon (Post 7566444)
While wind noise is subjective. I understand that. However, visible gaps, mis-aligned rubber gaskets, and differences on passenger and driver sides...are not. I feel I have several legs to stand on with the dealer. Thus far...they have been very accommodating.

I disagree, gaps and alignment are subjective as well. Unless you take some pictures of those gaps and alignmnet problems and post it, there is no way to tell if they are valid issues or they fall within the factory tolarance. As far as wind noise, on the highway, the X3 is not the most quietest car in the world. Once a while, you will hear some whistling when a burst of cross wind hit the car, it should not be continuous. I would say if you hear whistling all the time continuously, then you have a seal problem.

sfiermon 05-06-2013 08:46 AM

I hear whistling ALL the time and the rear window wind noise outside of that whistling is also constant. Kind of like when you have the window very slightly cracked. If I accepted the wind noise, then fine...I wouldn't ever look for these annoying things. I completely agree with the fact that an SUV creates more noise than a sedan. However, our other car is an Infiniti JX (X5 size). That car has ZERO whistling and annoying wind noise.

We aren't talking about he wooshing...we are talking about things outside of that "tolerance"

sfiermon 05-06-2013 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by guyver626 (Post 7566476)
Can u provide pics of the issues? I want to compare to my car. Thanks.


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Sure...let me work on that...

The X Men 05-06-2013 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sfiermon (Post 7566605)
I hear whistling ALL the time and the rear window wind noise outside of that whistling is also constant. Kind of like when you have the window very slightly cracked. If I accepted the wind noise, then fine...I wouldn't ever look for these annoying things. I completely agree with the fact that an SUV creates more noise than a sedan. However, our other car is an Infiniti JX (X5 size). That car has ZERO whistling and annoying wind noise.

We aren't talking about he wooshing...we are talking about things outside of that "tolerance"

If it sounds like your window is open when it is not, and the problem is constant, then you have a case with the dealer. A couple of owners had missing seals in the side mirror assembly which cause the wind noise.

Good Luck

sfiermon 05-06-2013 11:40 AM

2 Attachment(s)
Here are the pics...first up...the roof rails

sfiermon 05-06-2013 11:41 AM

2 Attachment(s)
Next one...the front end of the rubber gaskets on front door...


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