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Old 11-25-2012, 10:03 AM
Jamesonsviggen Jamesonsviggen is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Michigan
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,259
Mein Auto: '98 M E36/7:'06 Saab 9-5
Originally Posted by beden1 View Post
GM already did the ZR1 which is $30K more than the ZO6. I actually preferred my ZO6 because it was more of a seat of your pants sports car, but the ZR1 on paper is hard to beat.

Not what I was saying, that is not an example.

The platform and tooling was established nearly a decade before the Zr1 came about. The money in the Zr1 over the Z06 is carbon fiber and hardware. It's not in the development of the vehicle where the money is built in for the higher MSRP of the base car that could allow for tooling changes and material in a proper interior.

Look at the Viper. It had a comical interior too. Now that its been redesigned, they made interior a priority while also allowing for a higher MSRP.
Originally Posted by beden1 View Post
From what I can tell from spending time in that forum, the 993 enthusiasts feel the air cooled Porsches were the last real Porsches. The 997.2 owners know better.

The same conversations are happening over there between the 997.2 and the new 991 models. The 991 models are considered to be softer like the F30.
That is the scenario I am describing, it's another analogy that applies to F30 debates we are seeing exhausted here.

Originally Posted by av98 View Post
I wouldn't **** on any other forums as its a waste of time unless you have something constructive worth adding to the threads. It's like a whining kid without actually telling people why they are whining and what they want.

As an E46 ZHP owner that will go with an ED F30 probably by the 3rd year of it's existence in 2014, we just wanted to get back the whole package feel of what BMW used to make and perfected with specific lines of their cars. Now if they released an E46 M3 sedan with the steering rack of the ZHP or later model E46's then that would be a great benchmark. Yes, I will keep my ZHP and add the F30.

I don't disagree with your assessment of the E36/7 but it also had it's shortcomings when it came to refinement. There were lots of rattles and misc parts that would brake over time in the interior/exterior. The E36/7 removed the LSD unless it was an M line, but it did add the DSC/ABS management that sync'd with each other, enhancing the driving dynamics. So you can't say it was a pure sports car. If you want something like that you would have to go as far back as the E21 or an AW11 MR2 like my car (no power steering, brakes, abs, lsd, suspension nannies and it's MR).

I think the most important point that the MT reviewer missed is how versatile the F30 is for the modern times. Compared to the ATS and Merc, none of them can switch to the modes- eco, sport, comfort, sport+ like a swiss army knife. Yes, it's rubbery, but that can be fixed with the BMW M Performance suspension parts.
My M-Roadster has a cheap interior, but it's held up well. It's also got 77k on it's original brakes and original clutch. Some of those components point to being over built.

You have to understand, my M Roadster is brought up only as an example of how silly it is to come into other forums to poop on the newer car while putting the older one on a pedestal.

Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=- View Post
Please stop comparing a modified car to a stock car. He can slap on a turbo charger and leave you in his dust. Your point is moot.
See above.

Also, do you know what it takes to add forced induction to a 911? Slap on a Turbo? lol. Very tight-hard engines to work on. To properly turbo one is $10-20k, or the cost of my Roadster and what I have in. Meanwhile, my blower was a bolt on kit I installed with hand tools inside of a weekend, all for $1800 in used components because they made so many that they are available used. The amount of 2nd hand NA-911 Turbo kits out there, let alone 2nd hand and they will still require engine out install and still cost tons of money.

My car may be modified, but it's girly, so it washes out.

E36/7: Dinan/RMS stage 2+ blower@11-16lbs of BOOST! 18" BBS LM's, too much more to list
F30: 6mt, SOLD

'06 Saab 9-5 wagon 5mt LSD, clipped turbo, 19psi, 400ft lbs of tq
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