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Road and Track: BMW 328i(e90) vs. BMW 328i(F30)

50K views 253 replies 47 participants last post by  Kayani_1 
#1 ·



Progress is often a compromise. In the case of the BMW 3-series, that compromise is between the "sport" and "sedan" sides of the car's personality: quick reflexes and driver feedback versus comfort, speed, and isolation. While it's no secret that the Three is an industry standard***8212;most carmakers willingly admit to using it as the sport-sedan benchmark***8212;the gap between BMW and its competition has never been smaller.

So why are we looking at two BMWs? Because their differences are telling. First, the nameplate that everyone once loved is still amazing but no longer as universally adored, and a lot of people are wondering why. Second, if you examine where the 3-series is going, you learn something about the industry that follows it.

Marc Urbano
The maroon car here is a 2008 328i***8212;six cylinders, 230 hp. Its basic shell, known as the E90 chassis, was sold from 2006***8211;2011. The red one is a 2012 328i***8212;four cylinders, 240 hp, Sport package (a necessity, as the standard 328i suspension is Camry-cushy). Its platform, designated F30, debuted for 2012. Both of our test cars have manual transmissions, because duh. We decided against the 335i because the 328i is BMW's volume model, and besides, it's the one we'd buy with our own money. Also, the model's recent switch to a four-cylinder pays enormous dividends in EPA fuel-economy testing. More on that later.

It's obvious that these are similar cars. The F30 is prettier, especially next to this pre-face-lift E90, with the latter's milk-mustache grille and awkward taillights. The new Three's extra length pays off in a roomier back seat. Then again, we piled four six-footers into the E90, and each was comfortable enough to spend an hour or two in the car. To what end that extra space?

Our old 328i's base seat and steering wheel aren't as comfortable as this new car's sport-package setup, but all of its interior materials feel a full class more expensive than the new car's. And that's everywhere, from the switchgear to the center console to the glove box. In back, the difference is more pronounced, where the new car feels rental-car grade. Its trunk space is bigger on paper but no more usable.

On rough roads, the F30 Sport-pack rides better than the non-Sport E90, likely thanks to its adaptive suspension. The F30 also seems quieter at first, but the racket transmitted from front-end bumps is surprising, and at highway speeds, the sunroof produces too much wind noise to leave open. Neither is a problem on the old car.

The new car's electrically assisted power steering is quite good (and, thanks to software updates, will likely get better), but it's not great, and when it occasionally communicates what the chassis is doing, it tells you what just happened. The E90's hydraulic steering, by contrast, tells you what's about to happen. That's an important distinction as you're approaching the limits of a car's suspension: "Dude, you're sideways" is a different thing from "Don't feed in any more throttle, because your rear tires are about to break traction."

So far, it's a toss-up. But then we come to the engine. The E90's musical straight-six dominates the experience from the second you start it, the cabin buzzing with excitement from idle to redline. You feel the engine's subtle vibes in the shifter and row the gears just for the fun of it.

That just doesn't happen in the F30. BMW's N20 is an extraordinarily well-behaved turbo four, but even the best four can't compete with a world-class six. The Bavarians wisely isolated the cabin from the four-cylinder's noise and vibration, but the resulting disconnect turns this BMW into more of a BmW. Motor is no longer this car's true middle name. The four is acoustically absent under 6000 rpm, then comes alive with a satisfying, purposeful snarl, albeit one that only lasts for a thousand revs. With the acoustic reward largely absent, you find yourself keeping rpm low and riding the wave of turbo torque.

In terms of real-world speed, the two cars are evenly matched, posting identical results on the 5-to-60-mph rolling-start test, where the naturally aspirated six's instant response beats the four's turbo lag. On the conventional 0***8211;60 run, the more powerful four-banger is 0.4 second quicker***8212;and as speeds increase, the new car pulls ever farther ahead. Add to that its enormous 6-mpg EPA-combined-rating bonus, and it seems like the downsized turbo engine, with its direct injection and auto stop/start system, finally pulls a big lead on the old car.

Not so fast. In real-world driving, we observed a gain of less than 1.5 mpg. At that rate, all of the new car's expensive technology would save a tank (roughly 17.5 gallons) of fuel every 10,000 miles. Is that trade-off worth it?

Nope. Our decision was unanimous: We liked the old car better, if only by a slight margin. And later, when we hopped into a post-face-lift, Sport-package-equipped E90 328i, it was game over for the F30. No contest.

As a premium luxury vehicle with all manner of tech gizmos, the new 328i might equal***8212;or better***8212;the old. But for driving enthusiasts, the E90 remains the benchmark. The F30 might be bigger and prettier, but to us, it's not necessarily better.
http://www.roadandtrack.com/go/news/new-cars/go-news-new-cars-bmw-328i-vs-bmw-328i-65-1-roa0813
 
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#2 ·
You have now posted this twice in the last few minutes despite it being posted by others in other threads and someone posted the exact same topic a few down from this one.

This begins to appear troll'ish.
 
#5 ·
Interesting read. Thanks for posting. :)
 
#7 ·
Since I was driving a 2003 E46 325i, sport package, 5-speed, for 150,000 miles, I compared it to what I wanted to buy, a 2013 F30 320i, sport package, 6-speed, and I've been delighted from mile ten on the odometer. It had nine miles on the odo when I picked it up. No comparison, really. BNW knows what they are doing!
 
#9 ·
yeah this article is not helping me LOL

My LCI E90 lease is almost up, and I am seriously debating whether to keep it or lease a 320i. Normally I would lease a new model, but the E90 imho is still better. I test drove 328i M Pack with Sport Auto and although it was fantastic, I still prefer the hydraulic steering. If they put the 8 speed ZF inside LCI E90 there would be no contest imho.
 
#13 ·
I6 for life!:drive:
 
#15 · (Edited)
Once 2 & 3 year old CPO F30's become affordable to the F30 knockers they will all mysteriously disappear.

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I don't think price has anything to do with it. I could of bought 2 F30's with the price I paid for my M3. It's that BMW screwed up the BMW 'feel' and is now trying to be what Lexus used to be.
 
#19 ·
From your comments sounds like an M3 was wasted on you.

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What are you, 15 years old? 16? Did mommy and daddy buy you your car? Wish you could afford an M3, but can't? Work hard, and you'll be able to afford one. Learn some manners. You're a very rude human being. Onto the ignore list. No time for people like you. You belong on the other forum, not here.

I figure that I should be a pretty good judge (albeit, biased) as I currently own an E90 and an F30.

So there......
I'd like to hear how you feel. I have had extensive time behind both vehicles.
 
#22 ·
Not if you are not sharing the specifics.

Tires are the single largest component affecting braking performance. If you have square 225 all seasons on your F30 and wider/grippier tires on the E90-that right there ruins the comparison. The F30 is saddled 9x out of 10 with LOW ROLLING RESISTANCE tires from the factory. Great for MPG, not much else.

The other factor is the pads. The Sport/Base/Lux, all have low dust pads. But they also give up initial bite which really affects confidence. The MSport has standard Euro pads, more confidence but tons of dust. I have seen 2-3 mag tests now of MSports and they do not complain of braking and have shown 108-109ft from 60, a great result. But I did see a test of non MSport pads and all season tires in 225's that mention a very unBMW like long stopping distance from 70-0.

Facts...The cars have not really increased in weight from the E90 and brake components are just as large. If you have a poor braking F30 compared to your E90, it's in the pads and tires. Blame it on everyone's obsession with MPG and god forbid needing to clean your wheels.
 
#21 ·
Can somebody explain to me how it is possible that the F30 goes 0-100 in 14.4 vs E90 at 16.4. Then the 1/4 mile speed is F30 14.3 @ 100 mph and the E90 is 14.7 @ 96 mph. How can the F30 be two seconds faster than the E90 in the 0-100 and then only .4 seconds faster in the 1/4 mile at almost the same mph as the 0-100 test. What am I missing? How is this possible? I know testing can be finicky, but this big of a discrepancy?
 
#23 · (Edited)
Look at the numbers.

0-100 is not the same as 1/4 mile.

The F30 just so happens to his 100mph in the 1/4, but the E90 did not. So it takes an E90 longer to hit 100mph than it does to hit 1/4 mile.

Make more sense now?

The oddity is how can the F30 do 0-100 in 14.4 but take 14.3 to hit 100 in the 1/4, that means their numbers are a bit off. Those two should be the same. It should 0-100 in 14.3 and 1/4 of 14.3@100.
 
#24 ·
I think I get it, but how can the E90 make up so much time in the 1/4 mile? If it takes it 16.4 to get to 100 mph in one test, how can it get to 96 mph in the 1/4 mile so much faster? I know my math may be fuzzy, but it seems like it is getting to 96 mph almost 1.5 seconds faster in this test? I can't wrap my head around the discrepancy, both tests are basically 0-100 drag races no?
 
#25 ·
It's in the gearing. The gearing is well matched to the E90's powertrain and so it crosses the 1320 in a decent time of under 15 seconds. But it takes a fair bit longer to reach 100mph, this may not only be gearing, but the gearing itself might require an additional shift to reach 100mph that the F30 does not.
 
#26 ·
The data is also clearly from different runs. Runs from different locations, conditions, tracks, etc. are not directly comparable.

As already pointed out, distance/time is additionally very different from speed/time.

Finally, the E90 may have hooked up very well in its 1/4 run. If the E90's initial distance traveled is a good amount quicker at the beginning of the 1/4 this translates into surprisingly faster total elapsed time over distance. In this circumstance the faster car catches up and overtakes it, but the better hooked up car will make a very impressive showing. This is one reason why trap speed is the best indicator of power being put to the rear wheels by a car, not elapsed 1/4 mile time. It is a bit counter-intuitive.
 
#28 ·
The data is also clearly from different runs. Runs from different locations, conditions, tracks, etc. are not directly comparable.

As already pointed out, distance/time is additionally very different from speed/time.

Finally, the E90 may have hooked up very well in its 1/4 run. If the E90's initial distance traveled is a good amount quicker at the beginning of the 1/4 this translates into surprisingly faster total elapsed time over distance. In this circumstance the faster car catches up and overtakes it, but the better hooked up car will make a very impressive showing. This is one reason why trap speed is the best indicator of power being put to the rear wheels by a car, not elapsed 1/4 mile time. It is a bit counter-intuitive.
Yep, for example other F30 328s, such as some 8spd autos had quicker ETs at 13.8-13.9 but with much lower traps of 98mph. That indicates as you said, a car that is better hooking up as wheel spin has a way of inflating trap speeds.

I'm a noob when it comes to drag racing and how tests are setup. I understand that testing can vary widely depending on conditions and other factors. The data just looked really off to me between those two tests. Thanks for the explanations guys.
Drag racing is very interesting-at first. It gets boring real quick lol.
 
#27 ·
I'm a noob when it comes to drag racing and how tests are setup. I understand that testing can vary widely depending on conditions and other factors. The data just looked really off to me between those two tests. Thanks for the explanations guys.
 
#56 ·
2 E46 M3's

1 E90 M Sport 6MT

1 E92 M Sport 6MT

F30 330d M Sport

Berk! As soon as you play the I have an M3 card you think it automatically gives you credibility on the F30 forum.

Sent from BimmerApp mobile app
Oh the irony... Aren't you doing the very thing yourself by mentioning your past cars? Having owned all these cars gives you more authority over the other people's opinions?
 
#35 · (Edited)
-=Hot|Ice=-;7694401 (re: current owner of both E90 and F30) I'd like to hear how you feel. I have had extensive time behind both vehicles.[/QUOTE said:
To be honest, I am disappointed with the F30. I've had it for two months now and put on about 2,400 miles, including one 670 mile highway trip.

The F30 rides very nicely and is more forgiving over road imperfections. The stereo is a definite improvement over the E90 stereo - my favourite feature being that it can play WAV files from USB flash drives). I won't make any comments about esthetics, as I'll choose performance over styling any day and don't really give a hoot about car shape, light shape, new headlights, etc., etc.

My E90 and F30 are both equipped with optional sports suspension ($1,500 and $400 respectively) and the E90 has the Luxury package as well. I guess I should not have expected a $400 suspension mod to perform as well as a $1,500 one. My guess is that the latter purchase was likely just a lowering of the vehicle, whereas the former more likely included performance shocks &/or springs &/or sway bars. There is absolutely no comparison in terms of handling. My E90 can take street corners at wonderful speeds with virtually no lean and I usually accelerate into corners just for the fun of it. I've had to slow the F30 down around the same corners as it simply does not handle as well. It does not have the road feel that the E90 does and if I had to compare it to another vehicle, I'd say that its road feel is similar to that of a Lexus ES 350, a car that almost put me to sleep when I test drove it a few years ago.

The fit and finish is excellent and definitely a step above the E90. I'd rate the stock E90 stereo as a 3/10 (I'm very fussy) and the F30 at 5-6/30, so definitely an improvement. I upgrade all of my cars' stereos, so I am basing this observation on memory. I like the remote's trunk opening feature, but couldn't BMW have included a closing feature as is evident on the X3 (oops...straying from the topic)?

I am searching for a solution to the handling issues and will hopefully get that resolved shortly. Whether it's going to be tires, shocks, springs or sway bars, I don't know. BMW offered to put in the M suspension (shocks and springs) for a mere $4,000......that ain't gonna happen, but I will keep on reading this forum and hopefully come up with a definitive solution (or improvement) for significantly less than that.

Gas consumption (Imperial gallons): The E90 averages 25 MPG in the city and 35-37 MPG on the highway. The F30 gets 29 MPG in the city and well over 40 MPG on the highway. I drove 335 highway miles recently in ECO mode at 120 km/hr. (74.57 MPH) with the A/C on and the Stop/Start feature disabled. I got an amazing 47 MPG! I have no complaints about that!

I hope that I've been of help....

Roberta
 
#36 ·
^I sill want to know what the wheels/tires and suspension setup is like between the two cars of yours. Your CDN F30 is a bit different than what we are offered in the US, such as your $400 sport suspension, I want to figure out what you have.
 
#57 ·
I am not a technical person and, to be honest, don't know very much about cars - I just know what feels right to me. The F30 has P225/45R18 all season run-flat tires with 2,400 miles on them and the E90 has 205/55R16 summer tires have been driven for 65,000 miles. The sport suspension is listed as item #704 in the BMW spec sheet. Certain features are standard up here, such as leather, heated seats, heavy duty battery and a few other things......none of which affect handling and ride......unless leatherette makes you itch.

BMW.ca has a downloadable PDF with all of the specs.

http://www.bmw.ca/ca/en/newvehicles...hared/pdf/3series_limousine_catalogue_CAE.pdf

I'm sure the differences between the U.S. and Cdn versions are mostly cosmetic and weather-related. Does the Sport Line in the U.S. come with the same suspension as the other two lines? It does up here.
 
#37 ·
Sounds like trolls are fighting each other in this thread.


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#38 ·
i've driven a few E90s, and I think the only real advantage is the steering is a little better. I don't think its even a lot better like these magazines keep saying.

but they write these articles just to get views. all around the F30 is better at almost everything. the new engine is much more powerful. the torque alone makes it feel a lot more powerful.

And i think they are smoking crack when they are talking about the interior. the F30 interior is much much better than the E90 interior. I remember getting into a friends 2006 325i e90 which was the first year it came out, and most of us were like, wow this car drives a lot better than our cars, but this interior is not "luxury" ( i was driving a TSX at the time..)
 
#41 · (Edited)
I have mixed feelings about this. On one hand I appreciate the added refinement of the F30, on the other I appreciate the E90 having an I6 all around. My main beef regarding the F30 is that as a car that's ultimately about more "refinement" than the E90, it would have been nice for BMW to truly showcase that inside the car where the F30's biggest faults lie (interior). The drive of the F30 I think is superb and overall dynamically I'd rather have one than the E90 as the F30 simply *drives* more refined and luxuriously. And I for one think that it carries over distinct BMW driver-to-road connections well enough considering the added drive coddling (again, I wish interior coddling would be added to that).

We get this kicking and screaming on the F10 boards, but one thing the F10 has going for it is an unquestioned, vast refinement/luxury/high-class edge over the E60 it replaced. The interior alone appears and feels several generations newer to me. At the same time, the F10 went much further above from the E60 in weighted/coddling/luxury drive than the F30 did the E90. Which also means the F10 sacrifices more brute-connectivity to the road from the E60 than the F30 does from the E90 (which despite what many purists feel, I believe is a great thing for the segment the F10 is in, as it goes up several notches from the E60 in "high-classness" and pure luxury). I also believe the F30 did a great thing considering the segment it is in, as it caters to more needs than going all-out in just one, and it didn't get much if any heavier than the E90, and didn't go from Yin to Yang. It simply dialed back in one aspect to heavy up on another, yet not fully sacrificing on any.
 
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