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7 Series - E65 / E66 (2002 - 2008)
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  #1  
Old 06-10-2010, 07:02 AM
7Max 7Max is offline
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745i - Burning oil

Hi Guys,

I know some cars burn oil and some do not. My car is doing 1 litre (1 quart) every 1000 kilometers (621. miles)

Is there anything it could be mechanically before I just accept that is how the car is?

Just went through the search function and some people said it be valve cover, others said it could be some oil separator valve.

Also saw many posts where BMW said a quart every 600 miles is normal!!

Anything else?

Last edited by 7Max; 06-10-2010 at 07:19 AM.
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  #2  
Old 06-10-2010, 07:53 AM
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USALEXUSBMW750 USALEXUSBMW750 is offline
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This is too much, usually it goes to 7k-8k before you put one liter if it was full 8.5 quart from the beginning
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  #3  
Old 06-10-2010, 10:58 AM
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patshah patshah is offline
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a couple quarts between oil changes is actually normal, but not 10-12 in your case.
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  #4  
Old 06-10-2010, 06:10 PM
kippk kippk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 7Max View Post
Hi Guys,

I know some cars burn oil and some do not. My car is doing 1 litre (1 quart) every 1000 kilometers (621. miles)

Is there anything it could be mechanically before I just accept that is how the car is?

Just went through the search function and some people said it be valve cover, others said it could be some oil separator valve.

Also saw many posts where BMW said a quart every 600 miles is normal!!

Anything else?
I recently had the same problem and still do to some extent after seeing blue smoke mainly after 10 minutes of idle and then revving the engine....puff puff, doh! Some said valve seals, piston rings, or Cyclonic Crankcase Vents (CCV). All costly mechanical fixes. I thought I'd give a change in lubrication a try and it seems to be helping significantly. Not a complete fix but very little smoke now one week doing this....
Purchased 1 quart of Lucas Stop Leak and went to Mobil 1 oil change place. I asked them to drain the oil, add 2 quarts Mobil full synthetic 5W50, then add the Lucas Stop Leak, then filled rest of way with the 5W50 to top off. After one week and about 500 miles driving the engine is much smoother and quieter, no change to mpg, and blue smoke almost non existent unless I try to generate it. The thicker oil provides increased "sealing" while the stop leak generates a chemical barrier buildup on the rings. I may still have to replace the CCV or valve seals but, as of now I bought some time hopefully for a while. I plan on reverting back to Castrol 5W30 before winter, but will still use 1 quart of Lucas Oil Stop Leak. I also went from using 89 octane to 93 to reduce engine temperature. No roller bearing ticking either. This is just my experience and is working well for me, experiment at your own risk. I have 166,000 miles so thicker oil aint goin' to hurt that old engine, especially in the summer. Good Luck PS....was getting 23 mpg best on highway, now getting 25...not bad for an old V8!!
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  #5  
Old 06-11-2010, 12:50 AM
7Max 7Max is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kippk View Post
I recently had the same problem and still do to some extent after seeing blue smoke mainly after 10 minutes of idle and then revving the engine....puff puff, doh! Some said valve seals, piston rings, or Cyclonic Crankcase Vents (CCV). All costly mechanical fixes. I thought I'd give a change in lubrication a try and it seems to be helping significantly. Not a complete fix but very little smoke now one week doing this....
Purchased 1 quart of Lucas Stop Leak and went to Mobil 1 oil change place. I asked them to drain the oil, add 2 quarts Mobil full synthetic 5W50, then add the Lucas Stop Leak, then filled rest of way with the 5W50 to top off. After one week and about 500 miles driving the engine is much smoother and quieter, no change to mpg, and blue smoke almost non existent unless I try to generate it. The thicker oil provides increased "sealing" while the stop leak generates a chemical barrier buildup on the rings. I may still have to replace the CCV or valve seals but, as of now I bought some time hopefully for a while. I plan on reverting back to Castrol 5W30 before winter, but will still use 1 quart of Lucas Oil Stop Leak. I also went from using 89 octane to 93 to reduce engine temperature. No roller bearing ticking either. This is just my experience and is working well for me, experiment at your own risk. I have 166,000 miles so thicker oil aint goin' to hurt that old engine, especially in the summer. Good Luck PS....was getting 23 mpg best on highway, now getting 25...not bad for an old V8!!
Ok thanks, Is there anyway to see if it is the ccv or valve seals or you just replace and hope it was that?

Does anyone have the part numbers please for an 04 745i?
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  #6  
Old 06-11-2010, 05:06 AM
kippk kippk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 7Max View Post
Ok thanks, Is there anyway to see if it is the ccv or valve seals or you just replace and hope it was that?

Does anyone have the part numbers please for an 04 745i?
I was told to have the compression checked. If all in "green zone", then it must be the CCV. The dealer said not that difficult (expensive) to check, but, not cheap to replace due to location. Now, someone else replied to a post and said it was a 10 minute job???? I'm going to have the CCV checked on my next oil change and will replace if bad. I'll post a new thread when I have it fixed and give you the problem and cost to fix.
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  #7  
Old 06-11-2010, 07:12 AM
Keif Keif is offline
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Yep, the CCV valves are very easy to replace, they are in a terrible position on the older 740's / E38's, but on our 745/750/E65/E66's, they are right up front on top of both valve covers, very easy to get to, and very easy to replace. I did mine already.

In this video the driver's side CCV is the round thing just to the left of my hand (I'm taking out the spark plug boot/coil on the driver's side closest to the front of the car).

The driver's side CCV is the round thing just below the very middle of this picture...
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KW v3's, blue angel eyes, 8000K headlights & HID fogs, rebuilt alternator & mounting bracket gasket, sunroof seal, CCVs, plugs, sway bar bushings, timing & valve cover gaskets, valve stem seals, guibo joint, mechatronic sealing sleeve, trans fluid, sanded headlights...

Last edited by Keif; 06-11-2010 at 07:16 AM.
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  #8  
Old 06-11-2010, 01:43 PM
kippk kippk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keif View Post
Yep, the CCV valves are very easy to replace, they are in a terrible position on the older 740's / E38's, but on our 745/750/E65/E66's, they are right up front on top of both valve covers, very easy to get to, and very easy to replace. I did mine already.

In this video the driver's side CCV is the round thing just to the left of my hand (I'm taking out the spark plug boot/coil on the driver's side closest to the front of the car).

The driver's side CCV is the round thing just below the very middle of this picture...
I really appreciate that. The dealer has 2 in stock for about 30 buck a piece. I'll change them and see if that has an effect on the oil burning after idle. Thanks again for your explanation on this!!!
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  #9  
Old 06-11-2010, 02:40 PM
Keif Keif is offline
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With a BMWCCA discount you should be able to get closer to $20 on those (see #13 here). Or, when the dealer tells you $30, step back and say "wait, I found a place online with those for around $20, are you sure about that?" It's worked for me in the past. Yes, I'm a cheap bastard. =]
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  #10  
Old 06-11-2010, 05:32 PM
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Seven11 Seven11 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keif View Post
With a BMWCCA discount you should be able to get closer to $20 on those (see #13 here). Or, when the dealer tells you $30, step back and say "wait, I found a place online with those for around $20, are you sure about that?" It's worked for me in the past. Yes, I'm a cheap bastard. =]
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  #11  
Old 06-14-2010, 12:25 PM
kippk kippk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keif View Post
With a BMWCCA discount you should be able to get closer to $20 on those (see #13 here). Or, when the dealer tells you $30, step back and say "wait, I found a place online with those for around $20, are you sure about that?" It's worked for me in the past. Yes, I'm a cheap bastard. =]
Yeah Buddy!! just picked up two CCV valves at 21.00 bucks ea. The RealOEM.com comparison did me well....thanks!! I'm installing them tonight and see if that helps too. The new oil viscosity and stop leak has improved oil burning drastically, but, I'm hoping this is the root cause to the problem. I'm keeping an eye on consumption and we'll see. Thanks again Keif!
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  #12  
Old 08-09-2010, 04:08 PM
elk5432 elk5432 is offline
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Hey,

Have you had any luck trying to figure out why you're burning so much oil? I'm burning about 1 quart for every 600 miles right now (2003 745i 55k miles). My mechanic can't find a single thing wrong with the car. I'm nervous that this oil is going to be fouling something up eventually.

I have no other symptoms that I'm aware of. I think my car occasionally blows white smoke (I catch a glimpse of a cloud in the rear view mirror), but neither I, nor my mechanic, have been unable to duplicate this. Can't even be sure that the white puff comes from my car.

Eugene

Quote:
Originally Posted by 7Max View Post
Hi Guys,

I know some cars burn oil and some do not. My car is doing 1 litre (1 quart) every 1000 kilometers (621. miles)

Is there anything it could be mechanically before I just accept that is how the car is?

Just went through the search function and some people said it be valve cover, others said it could be some oil separator valve.

Also saw many posts where BMW said a quart every 600 miles is normal!!

Anything else?
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  #13  
Old 08-10-2010, 07:57 AM
kippk kippk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elk5432 View Post
Hey,

Have you had any luck trying to figure out why you're burning so much oil? I'm burning about 1 quart for every 600 miles right now (2003 745i 55k miles). My mechanic can't find a single thing wrong with the car. I'm nervous that this oil is going to be fouling something up eventually.

I have no other symptoms that I'm aware of. I think my car occasionally blows white smoke (I catch a glimpse of a cloud in the rear view mirror), but neither I, nor my mechanic, have been unable to duplicate this. Can't even be sure that the white puff comes from my car.

Eugene
Okay, here's what I did. First, I upgraded oil viscosity to 5W50 with an oil change and included one quart bottle of Lucas Oil Stop Leak. Within 2 weeks oil consumption began to fall and reduced smoking after extended idle. Then, With Keifs help, I installed 2 new CCV valves to allow better breathing of crankcase. The old ones didnt look that bad but it looks like a sensitive bladder that allows air into crankcase when needed. VERY easy to replace and there are two of them....see thread.

It's been about 2 months and my oil consumption has dropped back to normal of 1 quart every 10,000 miles. The Lucas Stop Leak Product is primary reason I'm sure, but the CCV valves helped too I think. I'm switching to 0W40 this fall for the winter and will revert back to 5W50 in summer. Some say too heavy but it works. Also, you need a thicker oil to allow the Lucas chemistry to increase the film thickness on the rings and time to expand and seal the valve seals. All I can tell you is these two inexpensive things took me from a car that was beginning to go downhill fast with burning oil and smoking at idle back to absolutely no problem at all. One quart every 5-10,000 is about normal but every 600 is NOT!! The Lucas Stop Leak had something most likely to solving the problem and if I had to guess I think it brought the valve seals back to life. I will continue to use one quart of this every oil change and just give it to the MOBIL ONE guys at the oil change place to add before filling with new 5W50 or 0W40....both full synthetic that they have in stock. I reset my service light manually with the help from another thread in here you can do a search. It works!! Good Luck and please let me know how you come out. I had an 02 prior to my 04 but this is first time I now have 172,000 miles...still luvin' it.
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  #14  
Old 08-10-2010, 11:04 AM
elk5432 elk5432 is offline
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I live in 100+ degree heat for the better part of 8 months, not sure I should switch to a heavier oil.

Honestly, I'm really fearful of using additives on a relatively low milage engine. I'm concerned that the additive will build up in the engine or cause other problems while at the same time covering up a real problem that could be fixed. Maybe if I had closer to 100k and was considering a future tear down I would use something to extend the life of the current seals, but not at 55k.

Also, I can't figure out where the hell the oil is going. My idle is smooth and there is no smoke coming out the back. There is the occasional white puff I see in the rear view mirror that I'm not even sure is coming from my car and have been unable to duplicate.


Quote:
Originally Posted by kippk View Post
Okay, here's what I did. First, I upgraded oil viscosity to 5W50 with an oil change and included one quart bottle of Lucas Oil Stop Leak. Within 2 weeks oil consumption began to fall and reduced smoking after extended idle. Then, With Keifs help, I installed 2 new CCV valves to allow better breathing of crankcase. The old ones didnt look that bad but it looks like a sensitive bladder that allows air into crankcase when needed. VERY easy to replace and there are two of them....see thread.

It's been about 2 months and my oil consumption has dropped back to normal of 1 quart every 10,000 miles. The Lucas Stop Leak Product is primary reason I'm sure, but the CCV valves helped too I think. I'm switching to 0W40 this fall for the winter and will revert back to 5W50 in summer. Some say too heavy but it works. Also, you need a thicker oil to allow the Lucas chemistry to increase the film thickness on the rings and time to expand and seal the valve seals. All I can tell you is these two inexpensive things took me from a car that was beginning to go downhill fast with burning oil and smoking at idle back to absolutely no problem at all. One quart every 5-10,000 is about normal but every 600 is NOT!! The Lucas Stop Leak had something most likely to solving the problem and if I had to guess I think it brought the valve seals back to life. I will continue to use one quart of this every oil change and just give it to the MOBIL ONE guys at the oil change place to add before filling with new 5W50 or 0W40....both full synthetic that they have in stock. I reset my service light manually with the help from another thread in here you can do a search. It works!! Good Luck and please let me know how you come out. I had an 02 prior to my 04 but this is first time I now have 172,000 miles...still luvin' it.
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  #15  
Old 08-10-2010, 08:29 AM
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USALEXUSBMW750 USALEXUSBMW750 is offline
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for winter go not higher then 0w30 for summer 0w40 good
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  #16  
Old 08-10-2010, 09:36 AM
kippk kippk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by USALEXUSBMW750 View Post
for winter go not higher then 0w30 for summer 0w40 good
This guy is trying to stop major oil leakage in an 02. Why would you recommend going LIGHTER viscosity than mfg. recommendation of 5W30?? That makes no sense.

If you don't use a heavier oil, the Stop Leak will not be able to form the film buildup on the rings to seal them up. I'm just saying this worked for my and I am a lubrication specialist in the oil industry. My test of using 5W50 has worked very well for me this summer and oil consumption has dropped to nil by doing what I did. Put in thinner oil and you will probably use 1 quart every 300 miles.
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  #17  
Old 08-10-2010, 10:20 AM
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csmeance csmeance is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kippk View Post
I recently had the same problem and still do to some extent after seeing blue smoke mainly after 10 minutes of idle and then revving the engine....puff puff, doh! Some said valve seals, piston rings, or Cyclonic Crankcase Vents (CCV). All costly mechanical fixes. I thought I'd give a change in lubrication a try and it seems to be helping significantly. Not a complete fix but very little smoke now one week doing this....
Purchased 1 quart of Lucas Stop Leak and went to Mobil 1 oil change place. I asked them to drain the oil, add 2 quarts Mobil full synthetic 5W50, then add the Lucas Stop Leak, then filled rest of way with the 5W50 to top off. After one week and about 500 miles driving the engine is much smoother and quieter, no change to mpg, and blue smoke almost non existent unless I try to generate it. The thicker oil provides increased "sealing" while the stop leak generates a chemical barrier buildup on the rings. I may still have to replace the CCV or valve seals but, as of now I bought some time hopefully for a while. I plan on reverting back to Castrol 5W30 before winter, but will still use 1 quart of Lucas Oil Stop Leak. I also went from using 89 octane to 93 to reduce engine temperature. No roller bearing ticking either. This is just my experience and is working well for me, experiment at your own risk. I have 166,000 miles so thicker oil aint goin' to hurt that old engine, especially in the summer. Good Luck PS....was getting 23 mpg best on highway, now getting 25...not bad for an old V8!!
Be careful with the lucas stop leak, that stuff can clog up oil channels and such over time!
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  #18  
Old 08-10-2010, 01:16 PM
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USALEXUSBMW750 USALEXUSBMW750 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kippk View Post
This guy is trying to stop major oil leakage in an 02. Why would you recommend going LIGHTER viscosity than mfg. recommendation of 5W30?? That makes no sense.

If you don't use a heavier oil, the Stop Leak will not be able to form the film buildup on the rings to seal them up. I'm just saying this worked for my and I am a lubrication specialist in the oil industry. My test of using 5W50 has worked very well for me this summer and oil consumption has dropped to nil by doing what I did. Put in thinner oil and you will probably use 1 quart every 300 miles.
Ok, if you can find in the USA 5w30 with BMW service then use it , Mobil1 0w30 and Castrol 0w30 from regular USA store compatible with original bmw original oil characteristic , also if your engine leaking viscosity of oil will not help you much
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  #19  
Old 09-14-2010, 11:43 AM
elk5432 elk5432 is offline
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I've posted this on a few other threads but just wanted to make sure all of them were covered:

I've been lurking on this board for a while looking for people who has experienced similar problems. Figured it would be good to share my experience with trying to solve these
issues in case anyone finds it helpful.

First Job -

Issues:
This solved my occasional rough starting (RPM would bounce in the low range occasionally when idle, like it was struggling, then
it would just go away after I hit the gas). It even sometimes just turned off at a stop if the rpm dipped low enough on the studder.
It stopped the car from occasionally bogging down on take off (the car would just studder when I hit the gas from a stop, then take off).
It stopped the car from throwing up the "drive moderately" error.
It stopped the car from occasionally starting to emit a lout whistle noise, usually after starting the car up after a short trip. The noise would go away after I turned the car off and back on.

My car had always burned a bit of oil but before this job I didn't think it was abnormal.


Parts:
11127547058 Repair kit, pressure regulating valve
11617547185 Vent Pipe
11617547186 Vent Pipe



Second Job (about 5 months later) -

Issues:
I noticed my car was burning through about 1 quart of oil every 600 miles. I had no other problems except I thought there was a chance
my car was pushing out a white cloud of smoke occasionally (I was never 100% it was coming from my car until I managed to see it). It
was time for an oil change so I brought my car in to the mechanic and mentioned that it was burning a lot of oil. He had one of his other
techs do the oil change and ran the codes and came back with nothing. Nor could the get it to belch smoke. I took it home disappointed
still concerned there was something wrong.

Four days later, the "check emission" fault came on my idrive screen (this has never happened in the past). I brought it back and we ran
the codes while the car was idling. At some point we noticed some white smoke coming across the car. So at least now we knew for sure
where the oil was magically disappearing to.

Parts:
11727553101 x 2 Valve
11727506214 x 2 Valve Gasket
11727508268 x 1 Suction pipe hoses
11727556959 x 1 PRESSURE HOSE ASSY
11617521181 x 2 Gasket Steel
11727508270 x 1 PRESSURE HOSE ASSY


While all the parts above were changed, the only part that showed a problem was one of the valves P/N: 11727553101.
Car started up, the "check emission" light is cleared (Error code was something about 'Slot 2 Bank 2, Secondary Air Insufficient' so I'm guessing the bad
valve made it come up). 'Valve' in this case is #8 in this picture:
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...11&fg=50&hl=10

End result, problem still not fixed! Car still spits out white smoke.


Third Fix (few days later) -

Engine Oil Flush (BG product) as well as a fuel system flush to clean out all the carb build up (hopefully). Added Lucas Engine Oil Stop
leak to see what happens. This was done just to deal with the problem of the smoke and oil burning. Not really something I consider a 'fix'.

Have been driving the car for three weeks now. Haven't noticed any white smoke as of yet. Still not sure what I'm going to end up doing in the long run.

I've been told it could be the valve seals or piston rings. Each job around $2500 (cheaper if done at the same time), give or take (this is after shopping around).

Eugene
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  #20  
Old 09-14-2010, 12:35 PM
kippk kippk is offline
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I have 178,000 miles on my 04 745i. Began burning oil especially noticeable after a long idle an hitting the gas pedal. Also, burned oil quickly on highway trips. From some help in the forums I first went for the cheap fix and changed CCV valve. cheap and super easy to replace. No noticeable effect to oil burning. Here's what I did after some other advice I found online.

Purchase one quart bottle of LUCAS STOP LEAK at Auto Zone or the like. Bring with you to Mobil 1 oil change store. Replace old oil with 5W50 Mobil 1 adding the LUCAS STOP LEAK after the 4th quart then continue to fill and top off oil. The heavier oil viscosity will not reduce leakage per se, however, provides a medium for the STOP LEAK to do its job without total blow by.

After about 2 weeks of driving with the Mobil 1/Stop Leak combination in the crankcase, oil burning slowly stopped. It's been about 13,000 miles now and I'm back to adding 1 quart or so makeup every oil change. The Lucas product somehow helps the valves re seal or it builds a sealing layer on the piston rings. Not sure, but I know it worked for me. Heading into winter now and I am going to 0W40 and 1 quart of the Stop Leak. Back to the 5W50 next summer as it did the job for me this summer. I'm serious though, the car can idle for 20 minutes now and when I hit the gas.... no cloud of smoke. Moving forward, I'm somewhat experimenting, but, anything to improve an engine with 176K can't hurt.

This is only my personal experience and much lower cost option before investing in a ring/valve job. Good luck with your baby.
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  #21  
Old 09-14-2010, 04:51 PM
klob25 klob25 is offline
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Nice information.

The work smoke has been talk about here

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho....php?p=5055784

I would not use LUCAS STOP LEAK - No disrespect kippk, This is stuff is like a heavy glue and can sludge up later on.

I would use this Liqui-Moly Engine Oil Resealer - as it soften up the seal and does not make the oil really "heavy" blocking oil channels. I have used it on my wife BMW after an oil change, spark plugs change, air filter change and the white smoke stopped.

Hope this helps !
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  #22  
Old 09-14-2010, 08:25 PM
johndade johndade is offline
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Do you notice this smoke when your driving or when its idling?
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  #23  
Old 09-14-2010, 11:46 PM
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7_up 7_up is offline
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I used lucas oil (never used the lucas stop leak) its really good i used that in my diesel engine and it worked really good. I never tried it in my cars but it sounds good that its working.. I would put a gallon of Lucas with the oil change (in the diesel).
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  #24  
Old 09-15-2010, 08:30 AM
elk5432 elk5432 is offline
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In my case, haven't seen smoke at all at idle or driving since since switching to the heavier oil and Lucas Oil Stop Leak. Before it used to smoke at idle after it warmed up, but not much.

Again, I stress that I don't think Lucas Oil is a good solution for a low mileage motor (in my opinion). You're usually better off finding out whatever is causing the smoke and fixing it. It's a band-aid that will last who knows how long. On high mileage motors though, it is probably the more cost effective solution assuming you've done all the cheaper work.

Eugene
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Old 09-15-2010, 09:32 AM
irokdastar383 irokdastar383 is offline
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try going to a higher weight oil first before putting lucas in there. also take you car to any mechanic and have him put it on a lift and take off the plastics under the engine. look for oil spills. maybe you have a leak somewhere .
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