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F10 / F11 (2011 - Current)
The new chapter in the highly successful story of the BMW 5 Series Sedan (F10) and wagon (F11)

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  #1  
Old 12-05-2010, 02:12 AM
blackhawk_pilot blackhawk_pilot is offline
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Is BMW fixing/improving production on the go?

My car goes into production next Monday (week 49), and I can't help but wonder if their QC department is tweaking glitches that are being reported on the go, or do they just wait till next year to address these. I'm inclined to think that perhaps 30% of faults reported are due to people reading forums and looking too much into it, sort of an excuse at times to actually find something wrong (no matter how perfect a piece of equipment is, if you look hard enough you'll alway find a glitch).
So, should I expect my car to come my way with most of these glitches fixed from the factory or what?

Last edited by blackhawk_pilot; 12-05-2010 at 02:17 AM.
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  #2  
Old 12-05-2010, 04:31 AM
sambb sambb is offline
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I would consider delaying your order/cancelling until the 2012 model, which may see improvements in QC and sportiness.
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  #3  
Old 12-05-2010, 05:09 AM
blackhawk_pilot blackhawk_pilot is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sambb View Post
I would consider delaying your order/cancelling until the 2012 model, which may see improvements in QC and sportiness.
WOW! Is the situation that bad????
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  #4  
Old 12-05-2010, 03:20 PM
dunccfp dunccfp is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackhawk_pilot View Post
WOW! Is the situation that bad????
No it's an uninformed remark.
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  #5  
Old 12-05-2010, 07:16 PM
sambb sambb is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackhawk_pilot View Post
WOW! Is the situation that bad????
Well, I dont know for sure, only BMW knows. But there are lots of issues in cars (generally) in the first year. Dont know if it applies to the f10.
I also would anticipate that BMW will respond to the sports sedan issue, based on reviews by car and driver and consumer reports of the f10.
Based on these 2 things, one may want to reconsider the car. On the other hand, if you really like the car, then you may be the ideal target and you should buy (provided you dont get scared off by first year model year issues).
One could also consider a short term lease, so one is not committed to the car. There are options.

I have driven the f10 about 700 miles, the longest stretch was a 350 mile highway drive. Haven;t had reliability issues in my family member's car, except some steering grind, which we haven't really gone to the dealer for.
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  #6  
Old 12-06-2010, 05:56 PM
Stanesq Stanesq is offline
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You say you don't like the car and bash it, but what about your boyfriend? Does he like driving the car?



Quote:
Originally Posted by sambb View Post
Well, I dont know for sure, only BMW knows. But there are lots of issues in cars (generally) in the first year. Dont know if it applies to the f10.
I also would anticipate that BMW will respond to the sports sedan issue, based on reviews by car and driver and consumer reports of the f10.
Based on these 2 things, one may want to reconsider the car. On the other hand, if you really like the car, then you may be the ideal target and you should buy (provided you dont get scared off by first year model year issues).
One could also consider a short term lease, so one is not committed to the car. There are options.

I have driven the f10 about 700 miles, the longest stretch was a 350 mile highway drive. Haven;t had reliability issues in my family member's car, except some steering grind, which we haven't really gone to the dealer for.
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  #7  
Old 12-05-2010, 07:17 PM
nosnoop nosnoop is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackhawk_pilot View Post
WOW! Is the situation that bad????
No, it is not bad at all.
And you can pretty much ignore whatever sambb posted here or in any other threads.
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  #8  
Old 12-05-2010, 07:18 PM
sambb sambb is offline
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Well, we dont have any data on how bad it is actually, but we do know that BMW quality ha slipped. I am not sure that there are stats on the f10 reliability, but there certainly have been problems reported here from steering, to pulling right, to grinding, and of course the handling issues as well. Those have been reported by others, not me.
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  #9  
Old 12-05-2010, 08:01 PM
marin222 marin222 is offline
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What a gool

Please stop posting. You know nothing since you don't even own a BMW. Take your opinions and comments to another forum. Btw, why are you on this anyway and posting so much. Don't you have better things in life.
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  #10  
Old 12-05-2010, 08:07 PM
marin222 marin222 is offline
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What a goof

Please stop posting. You know nothing since you don't even own a BMW. Take your opinions and comments to another forum. Btw, why are you on this anyway and posting so much. Don't you have better things in life.
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  #11  
Old 12-08-2010, 12:02 AM
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K-A K-A is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sambb View Post
Well, we dont have any data on how bad it is actually, but we do know that BMW quality ha slipped. I am not sure that there are stats on the f10 reliability, but there certainly have been problems reported here from steering, to pulling right, to grinding, and of course the handling issues as well. Those have been reported by others, not me.
Are you implying that the F10 is launching with more hiccups than the E60 did?

I didn't follow BMW much during the "Bangle Years", but I know that the early 2000's were a horrible quality period from most Euro Automakers . M-B in particular, had a hugely problematic launch of the W211 E-Class, and from what I understand, the early E60's were works in progresses in some respects themselves.

I know, as one company gets much better, others in competition must follow. M-B's newest offerings have improved dramatically, and the new E-Class has been virtually perfect, relative to what a German automakers tech-savvy first MY Luxo car would normally be, before. Even Jaguar has been making large strides towards improving (thanks to Ford, we'll see what Tata does).

On the flip side, as these tech features keep dominating cars, and cars get more complex, there are more things that can break, and that will cost more to fix.
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Last edited by K-A; 12-08-2010 at 12:04 AM.
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  #12  
Old 12-05-2010, 07:24 PM
Rafa Rafa is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nosnoop View Post
No, it is not bad at all.
And you can pretty much ignore whatever sambb posted here or in any other threads.
+1. sambb's mission in life seems to be badmouthing all things BMW. Read as many posts as you can in as many threads as are of interest to you, and judge for yourself.
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  #13  
Old 12-05-2010, 02:46 PM
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B-1 Pilot B-1 Pilot is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sambb View Post
I would consider delaying your order/cancelling until the 2012 model, which may see improvements in QC and sportiness.
Seriously WTF? It's one thing to keep espousing your view (one that is not shared in its extreme by anyone else on this forum)
its another to tell a guy he should cancel his order... you are just trying to cause problems, and its disgusting.


Blackhawk, check out the reviews from people who have owned the car for 1000-4000 miles and read their reviews... All but the a couple with the unfortunate DHP-ARS block issue are very, very happy with their cars.

Most of the valuable critiques come from what I would call "BMW Advocates." People who know the brand well, know how to drive well, and can give objective praise and criticism. These people give great reviews because they not only appreciate the good in the vehicle, but can also see areas for future improvement.

The other thing I look at as what car they are coming from... last version 5 owners inevitably have some reason to not like the new one (when the true reason is usually centered around their pocketbook), and 3-series owners find the F10 too big.

Remember that your car come with a robust warranty, your in Germany (I assume), and all that really matters is if it fits you
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  #14  
Old 12-05-2010, 04:44 AM
tdepetra tdepetra is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackhawk_pilot View Post
My car goes into production next Monday (week 49), and I can't help but wonder if their QC department is tweaking glitches that are being reported on the go, or do they just wait till next year to address these. I'm inclined to think that perhaps 30% of faults reported are due to people reading forums and looking too much into it, sort of an excuse at times to actually find something wrong (no matter how perfect a piece of equipment is, if you look hard enough you'll alway find a glitch).
So, should I expect my car to come my way with most of these glitches fixed from the factory or what?
I think some problems were corrected with September builds. My 535 X drive was one of the first dozen or two made in September for USA shipment and has been a zero defect car after nearly 5,000 miles. It is a non-sport model.
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  #15  
Old 12-05-2010, 05:19 AM
pharding pharding is offline
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No, it is not that bad. The September builds definitely have the steering issues fixed. The number of problems has been grossly over-stated IMO. BMW makes QC changes on a rolling basis. They take it as far as making changes at the VPC if a fix is identified to QC problem. BMW is extremely conscientious about addressing QC issues. I personally do not see how they could be better at doing this. This is one of the reasons that I buy BMW's. My fully optioned 550i has been problem free except for one minor problem. My car has comfort access and it had one bad sensor in the door handle. The fit and finish of my 550i has been amazing also. Including my constructive criticisms, I am extremely happy with my 550i. It is a great car today.

I personally believe that BMW will address Sports concerns. However the big question is "when?". I doubt that it would be at anything other than a model year change or possibly with the LCI. It may be never for the F10. Everything that BMW does is carefully evaluated and tested to the Nth Degree. They listen to what the auto magazines have to say and what BMW Enthusiasts post here and elsewhere. However ultimately they decide what is best and when to implement it. When the E60 came out there were many constructive criticisms along with the usual destructive criticisms. I was amazed at how many constructive criticisms were addressed with the F10. I am currently on BMW number 4 for me personally plus my son has a 330. I am amazed about BMW's commitment to quality control and customer satisfaction while building very innovative automobiles with the inherent risks that comes with that. Given the complexity of today's automobiles, in my opinion they are finest manufacturer of anything in the world. BMW is absolutely amazing.
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Last edited by pharding; 12-05-2010 at 06:44 AM.
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  #16  
Old 12-05-2010, 06:18 AM
kocsis kocsis is offline
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With all my carping and philosophizing, I agree with pharding. Great car today.
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  #17  
Old 12-05-2010, 06:52 AM
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I am awaiting my first BMW to be delivered in January in SC. I have read all the threads on this forum and others and firmly believe that Pharding is absolutely correct. I have moved to BMW for the inherent characteristics of the car itself as well as BMW's fantastic reputation among those who know and understand cars. Read or listen to the evaluation of the new 5 series in Automobile Magazine. So, yes, BMW makes necessary changes along the way. We will all love and completely enjoy our cars. Of course as with any complex machine there may be a small glitch or two, but BMW will strive 100% to make it right.

That said, I am one who is looking forward to the F10 and its more luxury character than some of you want. I have a Corvette to play with in the warmer months. The F10 will be a daily driver and a car to take on long trips with my wife. I want excellent handling and reasonable performance. The 535i X drive I ordered will fit my needs perfectly. So, to me, it is the sweet spot that other brands have not found. Others are either too soft or too much like a race car.
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  #18  
Old 12-05-2010, 08:25 AM
jsf1993 jsf1993 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eyesight1 View Post
I am awaiting my first BMW to be delivered in January in SC. I have read all the threads on this forum and others and firmly believe that Pharding is absolutely correct. I have moved to BMW for the inherent characteristics of the car itself as well as BMW's fantastic reputation among those who know and understand cars. Read or listen to the evaluation of the new 5 series in Automobile Magazine. So, yes, BMW makes necessary changes along the way. We will all love and completely enjoy our cars. Of course as with any complex machine there may be a small glitch or two, but BMW will strive 100% to make it right.

That said, I am one who is looking forward to the F10 and its more luxury character than some of you want. I have a Corvette to play with in the warmer months. The F10 will be a daily driver and a car to take on long trips with my wife. I want excellent handling and reasonable performance. The 535i X drive I ordered will fit my needs perfectly. So, to me, it is the sweet spot that other brands have not found. Others are either too soft or too much like a race car.
As a 2011 535i X-drive owner, I am completely confident that you'll be thrilled with your new car. It's a fantastic automobile and my car has been problem free from day 1. By the way, it was built during the week of September 20.
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  #19  
Old 12-05-2010, 12:30 PM
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GHOST PROTOCOL GHOST PROTOCOL is offline
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Originally Posted by jsf1993 View Post
As a 2011 535i X-drive owner, I am completely confident that you'll be thrilled with your new car. It's a fantastic automobile and my car has been problem free from day 1. By the way, it was built during the week of September 20.
+1 Week 37 build 535i x drive.
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  #20  
Old 12-05-2010, 07:32 AM
mujjuman mujjuman is offline
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F10 would be a great hwy cruiser
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  #21  
Old 12-05-2010, 11:25 AM
schnell525 schnell525 is offline
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i had a new 2010 MB E350 that i was not happy with. first year models always have problems, and my MB was not living up to expectations, so it went away.

i looked heavily at getting an F10 a couple months ago--great car. but, having come off a first model with problems, i decided that i didn't want to jump back in. i think the 2012 models should have the kinks ironed out. first year roll out betas are just turning out to be too much of a headache IMO.
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  #22  
Old 12-05-2010, 11:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schnell525 View Post
i had a new 2010 MB E350 that i was not happy with. first year models always have problems, and my MB was not living up to expectations, so it went away.

i looked heavily at getting an F10 a couple months ago--great car. but, having come off a first model with problems, i decided that i didn't want to jump back in. i think the 2012 models should have the kinks ironed out. first year roll out betas are just turning out to be too much of a headache IMO.
My base 535i was built on 8/17. The only issue I had was a slightly mis-aligned sunroof panel and funny, the horns needed to be replaced -- it's going in to swap them out next week. Absolutely zero problems otherwise so far and I don't expect any.

Could it be your MB just wan't the car you thought it would be? I found it underwhelming when I test drove it. Quiet ride but seriousy underperforming in relation to the F10, IMO
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  #23  
Old 12-05-2010, 02:57 PM
marin222 marin222 is offline
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I wonder if SAMBB even owns a BMW? I find it very irritating to have anyone tell another member to cancel their order. This is my first BMW and I ordered the car 4 weeks ago 535i fully loaded with all the options in Graphite. After ordering I read the posts and have been astonished by the repeats of the same complaints. Those that are constantly complaining should stay off the forum and just not buy the car. NO CAR WILL BE PERFECT. Every car has pros and cons and from what I can tell the car is almost there on everything. It might not have the drive that some sport enthusiasts want so they should either setlle for all of the other positives or go shop for another car. Let's give it a break. For a new member like me I find it amazing that there is so much focus on some of the weaknesses over and over and over again.....

Last edited by marin222; 12-05-2010 at 03:09 PM.
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  #24  
Old 12-05-2010, 03:09 PM
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markl53 markl53 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marin222 View Post
I wonder if SAMBB even owns a BMW> I find it very irritating to have anyone tell another member to cancel their order.
Sambb does not own an F10, he states that a "family member" has one. I'm not sure what his agenda is, but it is becoming a nuisance. Is constant thread disruption a cause for banishment from the forums?
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  #25  
Old 12-05-2010, 05:18 PM
SANguru SANguru is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markl53 View Post
Sambb does not own an F10, he states that a "family member" has one. I'm not sure what his agenda is, but it is becoming a nuisance. Is constant thread disruption a cause for banishment from the forums?
I'm not sure if he's even old enough to drive by himself. Typical troll.
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