Welcome to Bimmerfest -- The #1 Online Community for BMW related information! Please enjoy the discussion forums below and share your experiences with the 200,000 current, new and past BMW owners. The forums are broken out by car model and into other special interest sections such as BMW European Delivery and a special forum to voice your questions to the many BMW dealers on the site to assist our members!

Please follow the links below to help get you started!

Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > The Best of Bimmerfest! > Ask-A-Dealer

Ask-A-Dealer
Talk to our team of BMW Client Advisors. Get all of your buying/financing/leasing questions answered here!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 10-01-2012, 09:45 AM
cmhsam cmhsam is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: USA
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 125
Mein Auto: 2013 M5 - 9/1 ED Pickup
F10 M5 Oil Pump Fix

Can a dealer post information related to this as it relates to updates? I took delivery of my M5 on 9/1 in Munich and its been sitting at the VPC pending fix of the oil pump. The service manager hasnt had any updates on what next steps are other than we are waiting for the oil pumps.

The lack of communication and service from BMW NA to resolve this issue is less than attractive for me to continue with BMW in the future. If I am being to difficult or my expectations are incorrect please let me know. I am paying on a car that I cannot drive/deliver and there is no end date in sight on resolution
Reply With Quote
Ads by Google
  #2  
Old 10-01-2012, 10:34 AM
chrischeung chrischeung is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Dallas, TX
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 7,008
Mein Auto: 2012 ActiveHybrid 7 SWB
In my experience, you will hear nothing, or next to nothing until it is basically fixed. The reason I think is that BMW doesn't want to set false expectations. Say the pumps were shipped out from Germany today, then you may expect a 1 week fix. But what if there was some logistics snafu? They sent the wrong part? Or some staff shortage at the VPC that delayed things?

I recommend that you have your CA keep following up on the status changes as the best remedy. If you feel there is any cause for reimbursement, best to take this up after you get your car. If you think that your case and its handling is the exception rather than the rule, then I recommend that you not get a BMW - I've had my cars in the shop numerous times, and it sometimes takes a week to get the smallest things diagnosed and correctly fixed (never had any money reimbursed). I'd doubt you would get much better results (on average) from Benz or Audi (not sure about Lexus). I don't know if I've ever seen playing the "I won't get another BMW in future" card do much practical good. BMW will usually let someone walk over treating them specially than anyone else. That's my experience from the boards.

In BMW's defense (some of that being excellent service from my dealer), they are apologetic and understanding, and do try and accomodate within their set parameters - like a loaner car. Anything out of those parameters is an unlikely exception.
__________________
2012 ActiveHybrid 750i ED

3/12 ED 7 - thread ID 610350
1/11 ED 6 - thread ID 5767556&postcount=175
4/10 ED 5 - thread ID 453501
5/08 ED 4 - thread ID 290679
3/07 ED 3 - thread ID 201013
3/06 ED 2 - thread ID 136454

Last edited by chrischeung; 10-01-2012 at 10:40 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10-01-2012, 10:36 AM
cmhsam cmhsam is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: USA
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 125
Mein Auto: 2013 M5 - 9/1 ED Pickup
Thank you for the feedback. It seems hard to think that BMW wouldn't communicate a resolution plan or timeline with the caveat that nothing is guaranteed. Not having answers from BMW or a clear path to resolution is not how I would want my flagship customers to perceive the brand
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 10-01-2012, 10:45 AM
chrischeung chrischeung is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Dallas, TX
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 7,008
Mein Auto: 2012 ActiveHybrid 7 SWB
I thought that there was a clear path to resolution. Updated pumps are being shipped to the VPC? Cars will be fixed then shipped out - perhaps in the order they arrived. I may have misread though. And cars at dealerships will be fixed there?

The "flagship customer" thing is also a myth from my experience. You'll get treated the same if you got a 1 series to a 7 series. An M5 oil pump won't get changed before that of a 128i. BMW's consistent in customer service across the brand, which is a big appeal. The differences will be if you get a Mini or Rolls Royce - then treatment will be different. If anything, a fault in a 3 series will get fixed faster than those of an M5. Usuallly because the issue is more common, and the expertise to fix it across a wider arrange of techs. My Hybrid7 always has to wait for a certain set of techs to be able to fix it. The other thing to consider is that the M5 is new - so not every tech may be trained yet to fix them, or it may be a very select few.
__________________
2012 ActiveHybrid 750i ED

3/12 ED 7 - thread ID 610350
1/11 ED 6 - thread ID 5767556&postcount=175
4/10 ED 5 - thread ID 453501
5/08 ED 4 - thread ID 290679
3/07 ED 3 - thread ID 201013
3/06 ED 2 - thread ID 136454

Last edited by chrischeung; 10-01-2012 at 10:49 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 10-01-2012, 10:46 AM
cmhsam cmhsam is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: USA
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 125
Mein Auto: 2013 M5 - 9/1 ED Pickup
There is no timeline associated with the fix. Just we will get back to you. Its been 1.5 weeks that we have been waiting. Their inability to provide a clear and concise process/workflow makes me question their desire to ensure the driving experience is as good as their customer experience.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 10-01-2012, 10:55 AM
chrischeung chrischeung is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Dallas, TX
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 7,008
Mein Auto: 2012 ActiveHybrid 7 SWB
Welcome to the world of large companies. Your issue is common. Think about those folks who had problems with their mortgages and tried to pin someone down to address their individual case. Large companies don't handle exceptions very well.

Getting what you are after may actually make the situation worse. To get a definitive answer, may involve taking those that are part of the solution out of their jobs, lengthening the fix time. I recommend asking BMW to making you whole after the fact as the best overall solution. But if others have insight and experiences, would love to find out.
__________________
2012 ActiveHybrid 750i ED

3/12 ED 7 - thread ID 610350
1/11 ED 6 - thread ID 5767556&postcount=175
4/10 ED 5 - thread ID 453501
5/08 ED 4 - thread ID 290679
3/07 ED 3 - thread ID 201013
3/06 ED 2 - thread ID 136454

Last edited by chrischeung; 10-01-2012 at 11:33 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 10-01-2012, 11:47 AM
cmhsam cmhsam is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: USA
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 125
Mein Auto: 2013 M5 - 9/1 ED Pickup
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrischeung View Post
Welcome to the world of large companies. Your issue is common. Think about those folks who had problems with their mortgages and tried to pin someone down to address their individual case. Large companies don't handle exceptions very well.

Getting what you are after may actually make the situation worse. To get a definitive answer, may involve taking those that are part of the solution out of their jobs, lengthening the fix time. I recommend asking BMW to making you whole after the fact as the best overall solution. But if others have insight and experiences, would love to find out.
I agree. I just want my car
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 10-01-2012, 06:33 PM
dkreidel's Avatar
dkreidel dkreidel is offline
Aviator
Location: OC CA + Bear Country Montana
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,673
Mein Auto: BMWs
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmhsam View Post
I agree. I just want my car
I don't believe taking an agressive position or becoming a thorn in BMW NA's side will get your car repaired any faster. As Chris points out, BMW is fair to a point and will expedite this to the best of their ability. I know; I have been a Tier 1 supplier to BMW AG and had first hand experience in how AG can apply pressure

It really is out of your control and you should try to not worry about how long the car is out of commission or how long since you've had an update. As the "victim" of numerous first year BMW SNAFU's I've learned to 1) expect issues and 2) know the car will be fixed.

I'm uncertain that M5 ownership would be considered a "flagship customer"; there are A LOT of $90-100K BMW's sold in the US.

dk
__________________
'13 X5M - carbon black over black • BBS SV • "it's our truck"
'13 X5 35i - alpine white over black • X5M wheels & tires • "it's our car"
'12 650 vert - alpine white over cinnamon • 6 speed manual • Mόnich delivery
'11 Z4 - mojave over beige • 6 speed manual • Mόnich delivery

...and a bunch of old English motorcycles

Last edited by dkreidel; 10-01-2012 at 06:35 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 10-01-2012, 06:39 PM
cmhsam cmhsam is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: USA
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 125
Mein Auto: 2013 M5 - 9/1 ED Pickup
Quote:
Originally Posted by dkreidel View Post

It really is out of your control and you should try to not worry about how long the car is out of commission or how long since you've had an update. As the "victim" of numerous first year BMW SNAFU's I've learned to 1) expect issues and 2) know the car will be fixed.


dk
While I see your POV I have to respectfully disagree. I will worry about how long my car is out of commission. It is an asset that I am paying a significant amount of money to own and every day that goes by where I am unable to drive the car as a result of this recall is money that I am paying for an asset/service that I cannot use. Although I do agree with your comment about "expecting issues" I also have to stand firm as a consumer and expect that when issues arise that they will be treated properly. Not communicating with your customers when the majority of your 2013 M5/M6 fleet is grounded is not what I consider good business. I am not expecting them to have an immediate fix but at least communicate with your customers.

If I dont make my car payment on time I can guarantee that BMWFS will hold me accountable. Therefore I am asking for the same courtesy when its BMW thats got the issue.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 10-01-2012, 09:26 PM
Jon Shafer's Avatar
Jon Shafer Jon Shafer is offline
Admin • Owner • Enthusiast
Bimmerfest Founder
Location: Santa Barbara
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 14,173
Mein Auto: E92 M3 Cp
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmhsam View Post
Can a dealer post information related to this as it relates to updates? I took delivery of my M5 on 9/1 in Munich and its been sitting at the VPC pending fix of the oil pump. The service manager hasnt had any updates on what next steps are other than we are waiting for the oil pumps.

The lack of communication and service from BMW NA to resolve this issue is less than attractive for me to continue with BMW in the future. If I am being to difficult or my expectations are incorrect please let me know. I am paying on a car that I cannot drive/deliver and there is no end date in sight on resolution
I'll be more than happy to contribute information I can glean from my own experiences, but I am wondering first what your dealer has told you? I generally don't like to meddle in other dealers' business... Since I sold 10 M5s and have my own concerned customers to take care of I do have a vested interest, but kindly post what you've already been told so I can either affirm or refute based on what I have been able to gather...

Also, where is you car right now at this very moment?

__________________
Order your new BMW Today! • BMW SANTA BARBARA • jshafer@sbautogroup.com


Serving the BMW Online Community Since 1995 • The BIMMERFEST "Internet Special"
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 10-01-2012, 09:53 PM
schnell525 schnell525 is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Niebelungenland
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,095
Mein Auto: 2012 BMW 550xi
Are the folks at BMW worrying about the lemon clock ticking away?
__________________
12 550xi
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 10-02-2012, 05:01 PM
cmhsam cmhsam is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: USA
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 125
Mein Auto: 2013 M5 - 9/1 ED Pickup
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Shafer View Post
I'll be more than happy to contribute information I can glean from my own experiences, but I am wondering first what your dealer has told you? I generally don't like to meddle in other dealers' business... Since I sold 10 M5s and have my own concerned customers to take care of I do have a vested interest, but kindly post what you've already been told so I can either affirm or refute based on what I have been able to gather...

Also, where is you car right now at this very moment?

Jon,

My CA and SA are excellent and tried to get as much as they can. Unfortunately they have been told nothing. My car is currently at the VPC in New Jersey pending release to the dealer upon resolution of this issue. I called the VPC today and was told that they wont get parts until mid October. The customers at the VPC are low priority for BMW. My dealer service team didnt even know that parts had already started being sent out for fixes. Any info would help.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 10-02-2012, 05:29 PM
Jon Shafer's Avatar
Jon Shafer Jon Shafer is offline
Admin • Owner • Enthusiast
Bimmerfest Founder
Location: Santa Barbara
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 14,173
Mein Auto: E92 M3 Cp
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmhsam View Post
Jon,

My CA and SA are excellent and tried to get as much as they can. Unfortunately they have been told nothing. My car is currently at the VPC in New Jersey pending release to the dealer upon resolution of this issue. I called the VPC today and was told that they wont get parts until mid October. The customers at the VPC are low priority for BMW. My dealer service team didnt even know that parts had already started being sent out for fixes. Any info would help.
Tomorrow our BMW Factory Rep will be at the dealership, and I have plans to discuss this with him. I will report back with the results. I know that some forum members are claiming they've been told that the repairs will be made at VDC. I have seen or heard nothing to support that, and I have been keeping my eyes peeled... Standard Operating Procedure would be for dealer to repair and not VDC, so that is counter-intuitive...
__________________
Order your new BMW Today! • BMW SANTA BARBARA • jshafer@sbautogroup.com


Serving the BMW Online Community Since 1995 • The BIMMERFEST "Internet Special"
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 10-02-2012, 10:03 AM
ard ard is online now
Resident Curmudgeon
Location: CA
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 8,703
Mein Auto: '12 X5 35d/E39M5/996TTX50
1. Dont expect dealers to post a DAMN thing of any utility. Other than 'retail platitudes'...

2. "Flagship customer"??? Ha Ha. there are plenty flagship customers, if you get unhappy they'll jsut replace you. I am 100% serioius.'

3. BMW may not work faster, and being a thorn may not get your car faster, but it will CERTAINLY result in your getting compensated for your losses.

4. Once BMW has taken the cars 'out of service' the lemon clock begins. What is uncertain is the OPs specific situation where the car is being held in the EU prior to USA delievery. Customers with cars in the US that were told to "stop driving" will have slam-dunk lemon claims once the time limit is reached- and should press claims with BMWNA only offering to forfeit future lemon claims due to this one defect if BMW provides significant compensation. And not 'one months lease payment'

5. BMWNA and their dealer network is working diligently to calm the public and owners and put the very best spin on this that they can...you can be sure of that. Oh, and a few folks are trying to get parts out. Also remember that they will ge preference to production lines, as THIS is where the real (read corporate valuation) value lies. Not with 'flagship customers'

A
__________________
Keep it as simple as possible...but no simpler.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 10-02-2012, 05:30 PM
cmhsam cmhsam is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: USA
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 125
Mein Auto: 2013 M5 - 9/1 ED Pickup
Thanks. Looking forward to hearing what you have to report
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 10-04-2012, 04:11 PM
Jon Shafer's Avatar
Jon Shafer Jon Shafer is offline
Admin • Owner • Enthusiast
Bimmerfest Founder
Location: Santa Barbara
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 14,173
Mein Auto: E92 M3 Cp
Dealers will shortly begin receiving the replacement oil pumps, and vehicles will be repaired at BMW Centers (contrary to rumor in some BMW forums which said they would be done at the VDC).

Sold cars will receive top priority. Not much else to report. I have the part numbers, but that would be superfluous to post. Your factory-authorized BMW retailer will be able to take good care of you, and this whole Oil Pump debacle will be but a small footnote to the story of F10 M5 ten years from now.

__________________
Order your new BMW Today! • BMW SANTA BARBARA • jshafer@sbautogroup.com


Serving the BMW Online Community Since 1995 • The BIMMERFEST "Internet Special"
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 10-06-2012, 11:03 PM
LongBeachBMW LongBeachBMW is offline
Past Sponsor
Location: Long Beach
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 23
Mein Auto: BMW M3 Coupe
One of my ordered M5's was delivered a few days before the recall issue. Car was brought in on the first day of the recall. Oil pump was received on friday, Oct 5, and customer picked up his car later in the day. Was in Service for 2 weeks. Customer was very happy to get his car back for the weekend.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 10-06-2012, 11:25 PM
Kar Don Kar Don is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Cricket City
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 1,686
Mein Auto: E70 & F04
oil pumps have arrived at my dealer... M5s and M6s were rollin out the door.
__________________
2008 Mercedes-Benz CLS550 Iridium Silver/Black Leather -- P2/321/881 (leasetraded 1/10)
2002 BMW 325i --Topaz Blue/Natural Brown Leather --SP/PP/HK/CWP/Bi-xenon (Sold 9/06)
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 10-07-2012, 04:24 PM
cmhsam cmhsam is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: USA
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 125
Mein Auto: 2013 M5 - 9/1 ED Pickup
Thanks for all the info. My car had the pump changed at the VPC. I am supposed to take redelivery any day now. The transport left the NJ Port Saturday around noon. It's about a 12 hour drive from port to dealer. ,averaging 55mph. The BMW Dealer system shows my car ETA to dealer 10/8. What's the likelihood of that happening?
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 10-12-2012, 11:41 PM
schnell525 schnell525 is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Niebelungenland
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,095
Mein Auto: 2012 BMW 550xi
I find it a bit odd that BMW comes across portrayed in this thread as take it or screw you....basically that's been said. I haven't seen this from BMW. The local dealer owner has a lot riding on his reputation. BMW corporate may try to hide and say "we'll just replace you." however some dealers expecially in smaller markets can really get burned by this attitude.

I've heard of BMW taking care of it's M5 owners with taking care of payments with 5 series as their loaners. The "Flagship" customers IMO, and I've seen this in action do get attention and they dealerships do make an attempt to help the customer. If someone wants to get arrogant, it only takes a couple letters from a lawyer to make things firm up a bit.

It's all in the realationship with the customer. I think most dealers keep this in mind. If you have a cusomter on average that buys or leases 1 or maybe even 2 cars a year is taken care of. Large markets that have 3+ BMW dealers might have a bit of a hubris complex, but in smaller towns it gets around how your service and sales are.

Small markets, such as areas with 150-200K populations or less, and extrapolate that to those that whom can afford BMWs--these are customers that are both loyal to the dealership on end, and the dealership is loyal to them. A dis-satisfied customer can have a large effect.

I do feel in some areas of the country that "Flagship" customers do have a standing. Run into a few people at the grocery store, and just a conversation starts up about cars--the information moves fast.

I've had pretty good luck with BMW compared to my other German cars. In my area, the closest Lexus dealership (yuck) is about 70 miles away. They'll pick up and drop-off your car with a loaner while it's being serviced. Maybe larger centers can say "meh" to customers, but if you do buy cars often, they do pay attention.

I have great service from sales, to service, to parts. I think these guys and gals (and a lot of BMW dealerships) do care about their customers and don't write them off as "too bad."
__________________
12 550xi
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 10-13-2012, 05:45 AM
chrischeung chrischeung is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Dallas, TX
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 7,008
Mein Auto: 2012 ActiveHybrid 7 SWB
Your comments are correct, but sadly apply to almost any industry. The way companies react has been driven by the market and customer - not by the vendor. They can no longer afford to provide the service level often deemed desirable. Look at any large bank, department store, etc. - low margins have driven high touch service out the window. We may get technological solutions in the future, that allow personalization, but the personal high touch service of old has gone the way of the dodo in most large markets. Once a big player hits a small market, expect small players to get wiped out.
__________________
2012 ActiveHybrid 750i ED

3/12 ED 7 - thread ID 610350
1/11 ED 6 - thread ID 5767556&postcount=175
4/10 ED 5 - thread ID 453501
5/08 ED 4 - thread ID 290679
3/07 ED 3 - thread ID 201013
3/06 ED 2 - thread ID 136454
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 10-13-2012, 06:10 AM
dalekressin's Avatar
dalekressin dalekressin is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Oshkosh Wisconsin
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 5,993
Mein Auto: 2010 M3
The good news is the OP's car and others will be fixed regardless of the percieved communication shortfalls. The other good news is that you have purchased a great luxury sport sedan.
Enjoy the ride, drop your worries and move forward.
__________________
94 530i sold (That was difficult for me)
01 530i >144,500+ miles SOLD
06 330XI winter's especially fun drive (SOLD)
10 M3 Sedan (sweet)
13 Nissan GT-R Black Edition
13 Porsche Cayenne Diesel

BMWCCA 4215
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 10-16-2012, 07:30 PM
quackbury's Avatar
quackbury quackbury is offline
///Monkeyazz Duck
Location: Not In Kansas Any More
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,181
Mein Auto: 535iX M Sport; 328i Wagon
Wow. I wonder if "flagship customers" get their own personalized crying towel, hopefully personalized with the ///M logo and their own VIN.

I wonder how many more BMW's I need to buy before I qualify for the same treatment?

Sent from my HTC Inspire using BimmerApp
__________________


Current BMW's:
2014 328i Sport Wagon, Glacier / Black, ZSL, ZD2, ZD3, ZDH, ZLP, ZPP, ZTP, and H-K
2011 535xi M Sport TiAg / Black, ZPP, ZP2, ZCV, ZCW, ZDA, 2TB, 6NR, 465, 5DL, and a Partridge in a Pear Tree

Prior BMW's
2011 X5 35D
2008 ///M3 Vert
2008 X5 3.0
2007 X5 3.0
2006 X5 3.0
2006 550iA SP
2003 540iA M-Sport
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 10-16-2012, 10:28 PM
Jon Shafer's Avatar
Jon Shafer Jon Shafer is offline
Admin • Owner • Enthusiast
Bimmerfest Founder
Location: Santa Barbara
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 14,173
Mein Auto: E92 M3 Cp
Repair strategy has switched to VDC install as of today officially. Purportedly, Buyers affected by this will be offered a day of M Driving School gratis.
__________________
Order your new BMW Today! • BMW SANTA BARBARA • jshafer@sbautogroup.com


Serving the BMW Online Community Since 1995 • The BIMMERFEST "Internet Special"
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Forum Navigation
Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > The Best of Bimmerfest! > Ask-A-Dealer
Today's Posts Search
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On



Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 05:08 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
© 2001-2011 performanceIX, Inc. All Rights Reserved .: guidelines .:. privacy .:. terms