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E90/E91/E92/E93 (2006 - 2013)
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  #26  
Old 01-22-2005, 12:42 PM
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dynosor dynosor is online now
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What about competitors HP numbers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jalli
or they could just be putting it in there for bragging rights... look even our base model has a 3.0 liter engine...

It is not surprising to me at all that the US would get a 3 liter in both cars. The reason is that competition from other brands is so tough here .

The same people who would want a bigger number for displacement would want a bigger number for power, compared to competitors. All this silliness, when the only thing that really matters is real world everyday driving performance.
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  #27  
Old 01-23-2005, 02:25 AM
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dynosor dynosor is online now
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2.5 it is....

http://www.germancarfans.com/news.cf...eng/bmw/1.html

Spec sheet on page 12


"Six-cylinder with extra-light magnesium crankcase.
Developing maximum output of 190 kW/258 bhp, the six-cylinder in the top-of-the-range model outperforms its predecessor by a significant 20 kW/27 bhp. Maximum torque of 300 Nm (221 lb-ft) comes consistently between 2,500 and 4,000 rpm. This is the most powerful and lightest six-cylinder in its segment.
To reduce the weight of the engine to an absolute minimum, BMW is using magnesium for the first time in volume production, with weight down by 30 per cent versus aluminium. Both the crankcase as well as the crankshaft bearings and the cylinder head cover are all made of this sophisticated ultra-light material.

Another new feature in the six-cylinder is VALVETRONIC masterminding the opening times and lift of the intake valves infinitely as a function of the gas pedal position. The result is even more efficient use of the fuel injected into the engine, with engine response being even more spontaneous than before. This technology comes hand-in-hand with double-VANOS variable camshaft adjustment for the intake and outlet valves. The new BMW 330i accelerates to 100 km/h in 6.3 seconds and its top speed is limited to 250 km/h or 155 mph. Fuel consumption in the composite EU cycle is 8.7 litres/100 km equal to 32.5 mpg Imp.

The BMW 325i is also making its debut in spring 2005: Maximum output is 160 kW/218 bhp at 6,500 rpm, maximum torque 250 Nm/184 lb-ft between 2,750 and 4,250 rpm. Engine displacement, as the model designation indicates, is 2.5 litres. "

Last edited by dynosor; 01-23-2005 at 02:35 AM.
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  #28  
Old 01-24-2005, 07:48 AM
DaveH DaveH is offline
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I don't know if you guys have looked closely at the numbers and the shape of the curves, but the specs on the new E90 "325" engine is about the same as the current 330i in the E46-but with a better (flatter) torque curve.

FYI:
KW x 1.3410 = Hp
N-m x 0.7376 = Lb-ft

If you look at the curves side-by-side (Alex Baumann, can you post these?) for the E46 330, the E90 325 and the E90 330, you will see a progression in engine power and consistancy. The older engines, especially the ZHP, had peaks and valleys in the torque which felt like a "hole" in the power output.

I don't know why you think the new 325 is "detuned". It is clearly an improvement over the current 3.0L engine available today. The newer engines are also 22lbs. lighter. I would be very interested to hear more about the fuel injection system (Alex?) on the new cars. These published engine numbers are extraordinary accomplishments in power output
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  #29  
Old 01-24-2005, 10:30 AM
andy_thomas andy_thomas is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveH
I don't know why you think the new 325 is "detuned". It is clearly an improvement over the current 3.0L engine available today. The newer engines are also 22lbs. lighter.
Peak power for the "detuned" engine (that's if it turns out to be a 3-litre, and who knows?) is 40 bhp below the 255 bhp version, and 40 lb-ft down also. That sounds like detuning to me.

The outgoing engine has a higher peak than our mystery 215 bhp/184 lb-ft engine, and more power. As you say, it is heavier too. But the comments about detuning are only about the two new engines in isolation. The new Valvetronic units have very little to do with the old; this is not the comparison being made (not intentionally, anyway).

And doesn't 215 bhp/184 lb-ft sound a bit highly strung for a lazy 3-litre? Especially a BMW? The torque/litre figure is very old-hat, even if it has a plateau...
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  #30  
Old 01-24-2005, 10:47 AM
numbersguy numbersguy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveH
I don't know why you think the new 325 is "detuned". It is clearly an improvement over the current 3.0L engine available today.
I mean detuned in relation to the 330i version of the new 3 liter. Because that version has much greater torque and horsepower and it shares its design with the 325i version I assumed that the higher output version represented a development target for BMW and the lesser version was an adaptation of it. That is also suggested by the use of the 3 liter motor in the 325i for the US market only.
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  #31  
Old 01-24-2005, 11:51 AM
DaveH DaveH is offline
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The E90 engines will be 2.5L and 3.0L according to the enclosed Spec sheet from you know who:

http://www.autospies.com/images/1-20...ifications.pdf

By the way, I also read in the BMW Interior section that the E90 will be able to house 19" run flats on 199 cast aluminum and 179 2-piece Star spoke rims. 225/35 tires on the front and 255/30 on the rears will be factory approved on the 3 series. The sport seats in the ZSP package will also have the adjustable side bolster like the M3

http://www.autospies.com/images/1-20...ccessories.pdf
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  #32  
Old 01-24-2005, 11:58 AM
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Rob325_in_AZ Rob325_in_AZ is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveH
The E90 engines will be 2.5L and 3.0L according to the enclosed Spec sheet from you know who:
[/url]
It seems this controversy won't go away until the first ones arrive here
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  #33  
Old 01-24-2005, 06:45 PM
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dynosor dynosor is online now
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Not a dyno plot

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveH
If you look at the curves side-by-side (Alex Baumann, can you post these?) for the E46 330, the E90 325 and the E90 330, you will see a progression in engine power and consistancy. The older engines, especially the ZHP, had peaks and valleys in the torque which felt like a "hole" in the power output.

The graph shown at
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/att...chmentid=43063
is not a plot taken directly from a dyno. It is a graph with only a few data points from the spec. The curve may very well have dips in it that have not been shown.

Real dyno plots are never completely smooth and ripple-free.

Last edited by dynosor; 01-24-2005 at 06:48 PM.
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  #34  
Old 01-25-2005, 06:40 AM
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kyfdx kyfdx is offline
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This really bugs me...

and, I'm not sure why..but...

I really think the U.S. market E90 325i will have the 2.5 litre engine.. And, it has nothing to do with the nomenclature..

Why the heck would they bother to put a 3.0 litre engine in the 325i for the U.S. market, if it has the same torque/horsepower as the 2.5 litre engine that is available in every other market?

Logic will prevail.. I think..

Note.. I'm not betting on this applying to the new engines in the 525i.. since it is a heavier car.. And, if it uses a 3.0 litre, I'll guess that the horsepower/torque stats won't be the same as the 2.5 litre.

regards,
kyfdx
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  #35  
Old 01-28-2005, 12:23 PM
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(sorry, this is mostly a repost)

Canadiandriver.com new preview also confirms the 3.0L in 325i rumor, and it also says the difference in the two 3.0L engines is intake and software.

Quote:
In Canada, we'll receive two 3 Series sedans for a mid-year introduction (early summer). The 325i is powered by a 3.0-litre engine with a new magnesium crankshaft making 215-horsepower and 185 lb.-ft. of torque. Like all BMW six-cylinder engines, it's an inline cylinder configuration mounted longitudinally.

The 330i (which we drove at the press introduction) is equipped with the same 3.0 litre engine, but with a different intake and computer management system. It makes 255-horsepower and 220 lb.-ft torque.
http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/pw/06_bmw_3.htm
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Last edited by Chris90; 01-28-2005 at 12:28 PM.
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