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X5 E53 (1999 - 2006)
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  #1  
Old 09-14-2009, 10:56 PM
mrbenyong mrbenyong is offline
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Will the facelifted X5 carry the 3.0TT?

Will the facelifted X5 carry the 3.0TT? i certainly hope so!
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  #2  
Old 09-15-2009, 08:29 AM
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Probably. There were strong rumors that the X5 would get the 3.0TT in the 2008 MY, but my personal speculation is that they had issues getting rid of the heat generated by the 3.0TT. I think one purpose of the facelift was to facilitate additional cooling to avoid overheating issues the 3.0TT might have in an X5. I understand the cooling was marginal in the 3-series introduction, and the 3.0TT will be worked a lot harder, on average, in a 5,000 lb vehicle, generating an even larger heat output.
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  #3  
Old 09-15-2009, 11:30 AM
klu123 klu123 is offline
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No 3.0TT for 2010 X5 because of the overheating issue? I doesn't make any sense.

The same engine has been used in 335 since MY2007, 535 since MY2008, and X6 35i since MY2009. Could someone explain why the same engine could work in 335/535/X6, but not in X5? X5 and X6 weigh almost the same - about 5000lb, why the same engine will generate more heats than the other when moving virtually the same amount of mass?

Answer to the original question - I saw 2010 X5 pricing somewhere on X5 30i, 35d and 50i. If the source is reliable, that means - no 3.0 TT6 and the even more powerful 4.4 TT8 for 2010 X5.
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  #4  
Old 09-15-2009, 11:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klu123 View Post
No 3.0TT for 2010 X5 because of the overheating issue? I doesn't make any sense... I saw 2010 X5 pricing somewhere on X5 30i, 35d and 50i. If the source is reliable, that means - no 3.0 TT6 and the even more powerful 4.4 TT8 for 2010 X5.
In your original message you referred to the "facelifted" X5. The 2011 X5 is the facelift, not the 2010.
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  #5  
Old 09-15-2009, 11:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klu123 View Post
X5 and X6 weigh almost the same - about 5000lb, why the same engine will generate more heats than the other when moving virtually the same amount of mass?.
Take a look at the X6 front compared to the current X5 front.

When the X5 is facelifted to look like the X6, it will have the additional cooling flow/openings that the X6 currently has.
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  #6  
Old 09-15-2009, 11:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klu123 View Post
Could someone explain why the same engine could work in 335/535/X6, but not in X5?
http://forums.audiworld.com/showthread.php?p=17834938
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  #7  
Old 09-15-2009, 01:37 PM
Bigbadbull Bigbadbull is offline
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Over heating issues have long been solved by adding a second Oil cooler on the N54...
The big issue now is the HPFP failures ( constant issue even with the most modern version of the HPFP)and the more efficient with more powerful N55 twin scroll Turbo motor in the 5 gt...
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  #8  
Old 09-15-2009, 01:46 PM
klu123 klu123 is offline
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I knew overheating was a big issue to N54, obviously BMW has resolve this problem. I have a 2008 535 and have never seen it as a problem so far. So if BMW could solve this problem in 335/535/X6 35i, why can't they do it in X5?

Does BMW have to change the front opening to add more air flow to fix it? I can't believe. E70 was launched in the same year as E90 got N54. If BMW could solve the problem without changing E90's front, why can't they do it in E70? I still don't get it.
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  #9  
Old 09-15-2009, 01:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klu123 View Post
I knew overheating was a big issue to N54, obviously BMW has resolve this problem. I have a 2008 535 and have never seen it as a problem so far. So if BMW could solve this problem in 335/535/X6 35i, why can't they do it in X5?.
One last time.

First...

Weight:

335i 3,605
535i 3,703

X5 4,982
X6 4,894

X5 and X6 are much heavier and the engine will work harder (on average) and generate more heat to be removed by cooling systems.


Second...

Get rid of the excess heat via an oil cooler and better air flow through front bumper and grill.
Cooling airflow available:

Current X6 has styling which provides for a large airflow to an oil cooler.
Current X5 has styling which does not provide for a large airflow to an oil cooler

Facelifted X5 will have styling similar to the X6 and provide for a large airflow to an oil cooler.


You said "E70 was launched in the same year as E90 got N54. If BMW could solve the problem without changing E90's front, why can't they do it in E70? "

See the weight comparison under "firstly." Also note that the X5/X6 are rated to tow 6,000 lbs... therefore the X5/X6 must be able to do that without overheating.



I'm done.

Last edited by Penguin; 09-15-2009 at 02:17 PM.
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  #10  
Old 09-16-2009, 08:33 AM
AndreyATC AndreyATC is offline
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X6 also has larger intercooler than 335i, 535i, which probably is going to X5 as well
So yes, it might need additional openings for oil cooler and FMIC
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  #11  
Old 09-16-2009, 08:43 AM
klu123 klu123 is offline
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What you said might be true, but can't BMW simply make the same styling change to accomplish the same goal in MY2009?

By comparing the front of X5 and X6, I found X6's upper opening (the benchmark dual-kidney) is about the same size as X5's, so are the between-kidneys-and-bumper grill and the on-bumper grill in the center. The only difference is - the two side openings on the bumper in X6 are bigger. I guess those are where the extra airflows come from. But to most, it's a hardly noticeable styling change, not necessarily qualified as a mid-life facelift. Why can't BMW do it in 2009?
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  #12  
Old 09-16-2009, 10:39 AM
ard ard is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klu123 View Post
What you said might be true, but can't BMW simply make the same styling change to accomplish the same goal in MY2009?

By comparing the front of X5 and X6, I found X6's upper opening (the benchmark dual-kidney) is about the same size as X5's, so are the between-kidneys-and-bumper grill and the on-bumper grill in the center. The only difference is - the two side openings on the bumper in X6 are bigger. I guess those are where the extra airflows come from. But to most, it's a hardly noticeable styling change, not necessarily qualified as a mid-life facelift. Why can't BMW do it in 2009?
Are you guys REALLY discussing this in a vacuum, with the sole consideration being some concept of "cooling" without taking into account marketing, cannibalization of other prodcuts, development costs, production tooling, production costs, supplier management, etc, etc????

Oh, the reason they can't do it in 2009 is that 2009 is over. The reason they cant do it in 2010 is that, oh, same reason- 2010 is over too! (Tooling is done, documentation done, parts ordered, etc, etc)
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  #13  
Old 09-16-2009, 01:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klu123 View Post
Why can't BMW do it in 2009?

That's an entirely different question, and is a business, not technical, question.


I merely made a technical case as to why the TT engine availability is probably tied to the facelift availability.
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  #14  
Old 09-16-2009, 02:19 PM
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NetSpySD NetSpySD is offline
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X6 - has 3.5, 5.0, Diesel, Hybrid and M

A rediculous amount of power plants for one vehicle. No wonder reliability is a question.
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  #15  
Old 09-16-2009, 02:28 PM
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NetSpySD NetSpySD is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klu123 View Post
What you said might be true, but can't BMW simply make the same styling change to accomplish the same goal in MY2009?

By comparing the front of X5 and X6, I found X6's upper opening (the benchmark dual-kidney) is about the same size as X5's, so are the between-kidneys-and-bumper grill and the on-bumper grill in the center. The only difference is - the two side openings on the bumper in X6 are bigger. I guess those are where the extra airflows come from. But to most, it's a hardly noticeable styling change, not necessarily qualified as a mid-life facelift. Why can't BMW do it in 2009?
It is not that they can't. They certainly can.

However, your priorities may not be in line with theirs. A new minor change to a front grill may seem trivial. However it is not. It involves a lot of people to make one change, test the part, have suppliers meet the demand, etc. You can't just trade out parts whilly nilly. It will come back to bite you.
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  #16  
Old 11-30-2009, 02:49 AM
mrbenyong mrbenyong is offline
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they can, they just havent. the engine goes into the 5gt and 7 n they are very heavy too.
x5m has a bigger engine and turbo and intercooler. soooooo there is no excuse. just marketing for the x6.
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  #17  
Old 11-30-2009, 06:41 AM
UncleJ UncleJ is offline
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What about the HPFP failures in this engine? They don't seem to have a real handle on that yet and until they do it would be difficult to justify a purchase if you were looking at a failure every 10K miles or so, even if they do warranty it.
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  #18  
Old 11-30-2009, 10:53 PM
zibawala zibawala is offline
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I think they will put same 335N55 in X5, 535, 335, along with 4.4TTV8.
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  #19  
Old 12-07-2009, 07:45 PM
mrbenyong mrbenyong is offline
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Originally Posted by zibawala View Post
I think they will put same 335N55 in X5, 535, 335, along with 4.4TTV8.
yup unless they wanna get whooped by audi n porcshe again
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