BMW dealer wrecks M5 and won't pay for damage

Originally Posted by 02 330Ci

Wow, can you imaging fixing that damage with $2,500? Sure trying to get diminished value might be difficult but at least be reasonable on how much to fix? You have parts and labor, I suppose the dealership thought they could fix it so the extra for labor would have been less overhead for them. I have to ask though with that force required to snap that strut and collapse the tower what other pieces are bent or bowed, not just to the human eye but can be measured with the right tools?

Originally Posted by anE934fun

And how do you know this? You don't even know the extent of damage. If there is no frame damage, the car can likely be repaired to same as new condition. You can easily run through $30 large on just parts and labor on the M5 (with no frame work). Absent a repair estimate from a BMW-certified collision repair shop, it is all pure conjecture.

That is my question exactly, if the frame is bent, even imperceptible to the human eye it will make repairs harder.

Originally Posted by 02 330Ci

That is my question exactly, if the frame is bent, even imperceptible to the human eye it will make repairs harder.

Nobody officially quoted the guy only $2,500 for repairs. That was just something someone said off handedly.

If it's repaired by a BMW Certified Collision Repair Center, which is where it is now, I think they'll be capable of repairing any frame damage if there even is any. It's the suspension the took the hit.

Originally Posted by hpowders

Nope. Recently I filed a BBB claim against a Porsche dealer and won. Deceptive advertising.

And so what did you win? A pat on the back? A free test drive? Or???? I don't see a 911 Turbo in your Avatar.

Originally Posted by 02 330Ci

That is my question exactly, if the frame is bent, even imperceptible to the human eye it will make repairs harder.

Any of the items in this diagram ( http://www.realoem.com/bmw/partgrp.d...07&hg=41&fg=10 ) can be replaced with no impact to the chassis or handling of the car. Everything can be aligned to the exact measurement before being spot-welded in place. Yes, there is a diminished value due to the accident. If Texas bars recovery of diminished value, that is a beef with Texas.

anE934fun, it's all the guys like you here that make me proud to be a member of Bimmerfest.

Originally Posted by anE934fun

And so what did you win? A pat on the back? A free test drive? Or???? I don't see a 911 Turbo in your Avatar.

Satisfaction.

And of course the knowledge that if they ever have a car I want, there is no way they are ever going to sell it to me.

This thread is one massive flame-fest.

Someone broke someone else's toy. Their insurance will fix it up. Done.

If the toy's owner wants to go for a bit more ("my toy isn't as good fixed up, gimme money"), then fine, that's what lawyers are for. Otherwise, a bit of "don't go here, they'll break your toys" publicity is in order.

In any case: done.

I'm wondering when the mods are going to get around to moving it either to General BMW or Dealer Feedback.

Originally Posted by tturedraider

I'm wondering when the mods are going to get around to moving it either to General BMW or Dealer Feedback.

What did they tell you when you clicked on the "Report to Mod" icon on the upper right corner of any of the posts in this thread?


Regards

1bimmerguy:

It's simply that the dealer, while in a position of trust, abused and damaged the OP's property. The OP has the right to react to this betrayal of trust any way he sees fit. Should he now trust the dealer to fix his car? Wouldn't he be a fool not to take it somewhere else? How in the world do you expect him to trust the dealer to fix the car properly? You may still trust the dealer, but the dealer hasn't betrayed your trust.

To a far, far, far less significant degree I've had dealers betray my trust before, but the good ones made it right before I could even blurt out a negative word. My Audi dealer gave me a free 60k maintenance(~$450) because I had a check engine light within a minute from leaving the dealership. My Mercedes dealer took 20% (~$200) off my bill when he needed an extra day to get my service done. Both times I would have been unhappy with the service, but each time they honestly explained what went wrong and compensated me for my troubles. What about the dealers who didn't make right? Let's put it this way, I'll never buy a Lincoln again.

BTW, why are you quoting "tturedraider" from Bimmerfest over at the M5Board?

Originally Posted by tturedraider

anE934fun, it's all the guys like you here that make me proud to be a member of Bimmerfest.

Thank you for the kind words. I count you too as a member of the group here on Bimmerfest that make me proud to be a member.

Originally Posted by DnA Diesel

What did they tell you when you clicked on the "Report to Mod" icon on the upper right corner of any of the posts in this thread?


Regards

Do they (the mods) tell you anything? I haven't reported any thread, so I don't know what the feedback loop is like.

Originally Posted by DnA Diesel

What did they tell you when you clicked on the "Report to Mod" icon on the upper right corner of any of the posts in this thread?

I haven't reported anything. So far there's been nothing in this thread to report.


Regards

Originally Posted by anE934fun

Do they (the mods) tell you anything? I haven't reported any thread, so I don't know what the feedback loop is like.

You don't get any feedback, at least when what you're reporting is spam. I think that's all I've ever reported.

I agree with pilotman that bad things happen in life; however, this problem should not have occurred. My M3 milage fell a bunch at the time I picked up my M3 after a 1200 mile service. Gotta be related to a "fun drive". Seems if you have an M you need to stay for service work to monitor events. I saw a Poesche 911 was wrapped around a tree on a test drive by a mechanic after an oil change. Bad things happen but many are avoidable.

Originally Posted by dalekressin

I agree with pilotman that bad things happen in life; however, this problem should not have occurred. My M3 milage fell a bunch at the time I picked up my M3 after a 1200 mile service. Gotta be related to a "fun drive". Seems if you have an M you need to stay for service work to monitor events. I saw a Poesche 911 was wrapped around a tree on a test drive by a mechanic after an oil change. Bad things happen but many are avoidable.

This is true. At the risk of repeating what's already been said, the dealership has the responsibility of making the owner "right". Not right by the dealership's standards or right by the owner's standards, but by the standards of the Texas Board of Insurance. Fix the car completely so it was as if the accident didn't happen and there will be some diminished value, as well. Not enough for the owner to take a lavish trip to Europe, but there is some formula that will make it better.

Originally Posted by RBinDC

Back in 1970 I owned a 911 and was rear-ended. I recall seeing an article citing a court case in which a Porsche owner was granted more than the cost of repairs because the Porsche was determined by the judge to be a "special" vehicle - not just run-of-the mill Ford. Surely an M5 would also fall into that category. I'll bet there is some additional case law supporting that finding.

Now the problem is that this happened in Texas - California where I lived. Texas is a Republican, pro-business, state. It wouldn't surprise me if it has weak consumer protection laws. One reason (among many) why I would never live there.

Sigh. Not to turn this into a political thread, but you clearly have a misunderstanding about Texas. I grew up in California and moved to Texas when I was in my 30s. I now have a pretty decent understanding of how the Texas Board of Insurance based on my employment of the last few years and I can say that your assessment couldn't be farther from the truth. Texas protects their citizens. They just do a better job than California of trying to not protect them from their own stupidity.






Oh, and thanks HACK... I @ your "show up with your lawyer friend" comment.

Originally Posted by dunderhi

1bimmerguy:

[I]It's simply that the dealer, while in a position of trust, abused and damaged the OP's property. [/I] The OP has the right to react to this betrayal of trust any way he sees fit. Should he now trust the dealer to fix his car? Wouldn't he be a fool not to take it somewhere else? How in the world do you expect him to trust the dealer to fix the car properly? You may still trust the dealer, but the dealer hasn't betrayed your trust.

To a far, far, far less significant degree I've had dealers betray my trust before, but the good ones made it right before I could even blurt out a negative word. My Audi dealer gave me a free 60k maintenance(~$450) because I had a check engine light within a minute from leaving the dealership. My Mercedes dealer took 20% (~$200) off my bill when he needed an extra day to get my service done. Both times I would have been unhappy with the service, but each time they honestly explained what went wrong and compensated me for my troubles. What about the dealers who didn't make right? Let's put it this way, I'll never buy a Lincoln again.

BTW, why are you quoting "tturedraider" from Bimmerfest over at the M5Board?

It's also that we don't know the whole truth in this matter and never will. I don't see a reason to distrust the M5 owner but something does not smell right in this whole scenario.

Originally Posted by ffej

Sigh. Not to turn this into a political thread, but you clearly have a misunderstanding about Texas. I grew up in California and moved to Texas when I was in my 30s. I now have a pretty decent understanding of how the Texas Board of Insurance based on my employment of the last few years and I can say that your assessment couldn't be farther from the truth. Texas protects their citizens. They just do a better job than California of trying to not protect them from their own stupidity.

Point well taken. I will admit to not knowing how Texas protects its consumers. Apparently you do and I respect that.

I will say that the Texas electric power restructuring is more innovative that what I see here in the Northeast/Middle Atlantic. (I'm an electric power consultant).

Originally Posted by Michael Schott

It's also that we don't know the whole truth in this matter and never will. I don't see a reason to distrust the M5 owner but something does not smell right in this whole scenario.

Like what?

Yeah. Like what? You work for BMW management?

FYI:

Lets get something straight.

The OP had NO OBLIGATION to allow the dealer to fix the car. None. Period.

As soon as the car came to a halt after impact, the dealer had an obligation to inform the owner of the 'loss' or 'event' or whatever. And ask what the owner wanted to do next

The OP gave the car to the dealer to do one thing and that was service the car.... the dealer has no further authority nor right.

People seem to miss this fact- seem to be blaming the OP for taking it elsewhere.

The concept of "you should have worked with us and let us fix it" is BS.

tturedraider- If you valet parked your car and they crashed it, would you let them fix it? WHY NOT? Shouldn't you be reasonable and work with the dealer???? Just because they are a bmw dealer does not change this fact that the OP had no obligation to allow them to do a thing. You (and others) seem to be making a BIG deal of this, and it has no legal foundation.

A

Originally Posted by ard

As soon as the car came to a halt after impact, ...

A

Wow, that got me thinking. After the vehicle came to a halt why didn't the mechanic call the police to report the accident? Why did he flee the accident scene without reporting it to the police? Why didn't the dealer call the police to report the accident when the mechanic returned with the damaged property?

Originally Posted by dunderhi

Wow, that got me thinking. After the vehicle came to a halt why didn't the mechanic call the police to report the accident? Why did he flee the accident scene without reporting it to the police? Why didn't the dealer call the police to report the accident when the mechanic returned with the damaged property?

Perhaps because leaving the scene of an accident when property damage exceeds a certain value is a felony.

Originally Posted by RBinDC

Like what?

The half baked, after the fact, "crash scene investigation" of curbs and skid marks makes me think the OP must be wound tighter than a 30 day clock.

The best thing that ever happened to the "crash" dealer was when the OP opted to have the car trucked to a different body shop. (That will muddy up the waters.)

Lastly, I apologize for posting on this brainless thread which should have a "stake driven into its heart".

Originally Posted by hpowders

Yeah. Like what? You work for BMW management?

hp, you crack me up.

Originally Posted by RBinDC

Like what?

We only have one side of the story. That's all. On the internet things frequently get blown way out of proportion. If what the M5 owner claims is 100% true then the dealer is totally in the wrong and should get in trouble for their lies and deceit. But it would be nice to have a balanced perspective in a situation such as this.