Front brakes warped, steering wheel vibration upon braking

This problem with steering shudderingwhilst braking is a common and known problem on e38 seven series and it is caused by worn thrust arm bushes, People keep replacing disk rotors but it is NOT the answer to this problem

Well, it's back at the BMW service to have the factory tech rep Jim Morror to investigate.
I told the service advisor about looking into the bushings and he mentioned that they have already looked at all the suspension components and found nothing out of the ordinary.
I asked him about the "bedding" process and he mentioned that BMW does not do anything other than put on new rotors and pads. They also recommend the customer to not brake hard for the 1st 300 miles as well. Which I obeyed the 1st 3 times.

Steve

Originally Posted by PETER NEWMAN

This problem with steering shudderingwhilst braking is a common and known problem on e38 seven series and it is caused by worn thrust arm bushes, People keep replacing disk rotors but it is NOT the answer to this problem

Except the OP has an e60 5 series and the problem goes away when the rotors and pads are replaced....for a while.

If it were a bushing problem it would not magically heal itself when the rotors were replaced.

I had THE SAME vibrations that you describe a while back. I went as far as installing new brake rotors/pads and still the vibration was there. Took it back to Stevens Creek BMW and they told me my rotors are warpped, literally 1 months after I installed the new ones ! So i decide to take it to Fremont BMW and they diagnose for me. Turns out is was my Lower right control arm (it was bent) that was causing the vibration when braking. $900 Later and a new control arm, and no more vibration.

Well, here's the latest.
The SA called me yesterday and said that Jim Morror (BMW Factory Tech Rep) said that he's seen this issue before and it was caused by the right/passenger hub.
They are going to replace both front rotors/pad and right/passenger's hub. Don't know the details on why that hub or what was wrong with it yet. Will ask when my car is completed and I pick it up.
Personally, I don't think it's anything outside of the brakes. I think it's just to fact of the new brakes not going through the "break-in"/"bedding" process correctly or even executed before I pick it up. But this is "BMW's process".

To the OP: When you had your wheels powder coated, did they cover the inside area of the wheel where it contacts the wheel hub? If so, remove any paint/powder coat on this contact point - it's preventing the rotor/hub from transferring heat to the wheel to dissapate.

I had a similar issue this past summer, going through 3 sets of rotors in 3 months and going crazy trying to figure out the cause, until we narrowed it down to my OEM front wheels which had been refinished over the prior winter... the wheel shop had painted over the contact surface resulting in both a really tight fit to the hub, and also preventing adequate heat dissapation from the rotors to the wheel. The SA at the dealer carefully removed the paint from the contact surface and no issues since (it's been over 6 months).

May not be your issue, but worth a look.

Originally Posted by PimoX3

To the OP: When you had your wheels powder coated, did they cover the inside area of the wheel where it contacts the wheel hub? If so, remove any paint/powder coat on this contact point - it's preventing the rotor/hub from transferring heat to the wheel to dissapate.

I had a similar issue this past summer, going through 3 sets of rotors in 3 months and going crazy trying to figure out the cause, until we narrowed it down to my OEM front wheels which had been refinished over the prior winter... the wheel shop had painted over the contact surface resulting in both a really tight fit to the hub, and also preventing adequate heat dissapation from the rotors to the wheel. The SA at the dealer carefully removed the paint from the contact surface and no issues since (it's been over 6 months).

May not be your issue, but worth a look.

Interesting conclusion. Will look into this and check the wheels.

Originally Posted by socal28

Interesting conclusion. Will look into this and check the wheels.

Doesn't look like the inside of my wheels where it mounts has any paint or coating.

Got my car back today.
They basically installed new rotors, pads and hubs on both front sides. BMW factory regional rep mentioned that some e60's had experienced this same issue and it was the hubs that was not rotating true.
We'll see if this fixes it.

My suggestion is to replace Calipers and Brake hoses. If the caliper doesn't release the pressure fast enough (sticking) so the pads stay in contact with the rotors longer, it could cause more heat and after awhile overheat and warp the rotors. Looking the the color of your rotors the blueish red tint on them is an indication they are overheating. Also replace the brake hoses (if your car has them) that's goes to calipers. Inside the brake hose is a valve, if it gets stuck the pressure doesn't release and same effect can occur.

just have them resurfaced and it should fix the problem

7 Months later ? LOL. Just kidding..

So guys here's my update for what it's worth. I continue to have my pad deposit problem when running OEM pads and anything less than a race pad. I don't run a race pad all the time because the car sounds like a garbage truck from the brake noise.

Here's my process:

Run a high performance street pad until I can't stand the vibrations any longer (usually about 4-5 weeks). I then install my hawk blue pads to "clean the pad deposits" off. I go down the road and make some aggressive stops, similar to bedding in pads. Then install the street pads back on. I then Do it all over again after 4-5 weeks.

Until someone is selling their used brembos.....

So even with new hubs and brakes you still having pad deposits problems? I wond

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Sorry..i wonder if tech clean with wire brush the caliper brack

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Or applying too much anti-seize?missing air brake ducs? I think proper bedding procedure is not been follow and your braking style is most at blame. Sudden hard braking and pressing pedal for long time no time to cool off the pad

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Clean and lube the caliper mounting pins after having the rotors turned. same thing happened to me on my e39; went thru a set of new rotors and pads, and had the 2nd set warp and need turning before the autozone guy said you need to scrub & clean the pins, spray out the holes on the calipers, then spread some caliper pin lube on the pins before mounting the calipers back on. Did that, and voila!!! no more warping or vibration issues when braking; its been 30k mi so far/ $22 to turn the rotors @ Autozone and $2 for the little packet of lube. Definitely an "Easy Button" moment. Unfortunately, ended up with a 2nd set of brake pads with only 2000 mi on them..........

I went through 2 rotors and 1 set of pads on my 07 525xi... on the third try I had both front control arms replaced $$ along with just the rotors (pads were still meaty). Got about 3k miles on them so far and I have to say the car brakes like if I just pulled out of the showroom floor. Have them check the arms, as this (In my opinion) aids in the warping of the rotors.
Hope this helps!

Hi. Did you resolve your problem with shaking steering wheel?
I've got the same problem with my e60. Replaced the discs 3 times now. Twice by BMW but the shaking comes back after about 1.500 miles. Last month went for new lower trust arms as many members were blaming bushings on them. The old ones look like there is nothing wrong with them. At the same time had to machine down the discs as they were warped again. I though that it was it but now after a 1k miles its starting again.

I had a same problem with my 2004 530i. I listen to the board and just changed my thrust arm on both front side with meyle HD this past weekend. No more vibration while breaking.

Did you see any damage to your old thrust arms, bushings? Were they the straight or the twisted ones you replaced?
After I replaced them there was no vibrating for about 1000miles.

The don't look like there is anything wrong with them.

Originally Posted by vojtek

Did you see any damage to your old thrust arms, bushings? Were they the straight or the twisted ones you replaced?
After I replaced them there was no vibrating for about 1000miles.

No I didn't see any damages with my eyes; little movement on my rubber bushing when I moved with my hand and ball joint was very loose.

All:

This is my own personal experience and opinion. The brakes on this car are undersized for spirited driving and or track use. Keep in mind I do completely understand that this car is not made as a track car, etc. However I do wonder what would happen if you would be driving this car on the autobahn @ 100+ and came up on a car that was going much slower and had to actually use the brakes. Do this more than once per 30 minutes and the rotors have pad deposits (as some would say warped rotors). I do agree that my driving style is part of this problem and having a JB4, with other mods attributes to this issue LOL.

Latest for me..

I have had my car at the dealer for this issue no less than 3 X's. They always claimed that the front end was in perfect working order. I begged to differ. I finally had enough when the car wouldn't track straight anymore, of course strangely enough it was out of warranty. Hmm... I went ahead and replaced everything in the front end. I found out that there were bushings and ball joints that were bad. After replacement I can say that I have now gone 5 weeks without steering wheel vibration.

Just some more information on this thread.

Just curious but I did not see any posts on proper wheel lug torque. I had a similar issue after BMW did a front brake job. I had vibration after a few hundred miles. They did replace the rotors. However I made sure the wheels were torqued properly 88 ft/lbs.

The rotors are soft that is why they wear as the pads wear. Torque is a big deal so make sure they are properly torqued and with a calibrated wrench.