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Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > BMW Model Discussions > X Series > X3 F25 (2011 - current)

X3 F25 (2011 - current)
The latest X3 brings some added style and some new features to the BMW SUV family. Talk about the new F25 now!

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  #1  
Old 02-21-2012, 01:27 PM
joebry joebry is offline
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Is the acceleration hesitation still a problem on the 2012 X3

I have read several threads about the BMW X3's acceleration hesitation. Is this hesitation on the 2012 X3's?

Other than driving in the 'sport' mode, are there any other reasonable suggestions?

Also, is this problem on other manufacturer's cars?
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  #2  
Old 02-21-2012, 01:35 PM
j3ff j3ff is offline
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i don't perceive the hesitation, and in fact, like most automatics, the car wants to creep forward when stopped, and requires a foot on the brake to keep it stopped. except for rentals, i've only driven manuals since 1970, so perhaps i'm not the most sensitive to automatic transmission nuances. mine is a 2012 x3 35i, picked up late jan pcd. if you want gentle acceleration, it will deliver that. if you want vigorous acceleration, it will deliver that. i find it quite simple to get the response i want with the proper pressure on the accelerator.
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  #3  
Old 02-21-2012, 02:12 PM
index2020 index2020 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joebry View Post
I have read several threads about the BMW X3's acceleration hesitation. Is this hesitation on the 2012 X3's?

Other than driving in the 'sport' mode, are there any other reasonable suggestions?

Also, is this problem on other manufacturer's cars?
Yes - it exists (I have a 2012 X3 28i; Jan production). It takes some getting used to and after the first week I haven't noticed it. My take is that the power-train computer tries its best to keep RPM less than 2,000 and rapidly changes gears as the X3 accelerates from dead stop. In my view it quickly becomes a non-issue. Sport mode helps.

Perhaps it's not an issue on the 35i...? I don't know...

Regards,

Last edited by index2020; 02-21-2012 at 02:13 PM.
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  #4  
Old 02-21-2012, 04:57 PM
Early fessed Early fessed is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joebry View Post

Also, is this problem on other manufacturer's cars?
My Q5 had a nonlinear throttle and a hesitation. The hesitation was really frustrating, as it felt like the car shifted into second too early. Engine speed dropped too low, making acceleration uneven. This issue was the main reason I bought my X3 3.5i after only 18 months with the Audi.

My X3 has the nonlinear throttle (seems to be becoming quite common), which takes a little getting used to. The only issue now is when I drive my wife's car with its linear throttle - too many aggressive starts for my wife's taste
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  #5  
Old 02-21-2012, 05:59 PM
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lbjgh lbjgh is online now
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I drive an older car where the throttle opens in direct relation to how hard I press the accelerator pedal. The x3 provides what feels like 85% of what your foot calls for. I'm hoping the driver experience control will mitigate this programing fault. The only solution I've read is to mash the throttle as you pull away. Alternatively you can drive like you are "driving miss Daisy".

Last edited by lbjgh; 02-21-2012 at 06:01 PM.
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  #6  
Old 02-22-2012, 07:27 AM
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ngcreese ngcreese is offline
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I have an 07 X3, that felt anemic in terms of acceleration, when I first got it.

Resetting the tranny, so that it could learn my habits made all the difference in the world. Since the learning mode lasts for 1000 miles. My guess is, the first time the tranny was "trained" the SUV was probably being broken in, where people have a tendency to drive very light.

A tranny reset, to tune-in the shift pattern and a refresh of the engine's spark plugs and pre-cat O2-senors, to bring back the engine's max torque, really changed my perspective on the X3... big time.

For you guys I'm guessing your mileage is too low to truly warrant a spark plug/sensor tune up. However, if you haven't reset the tranny, post-breakin period... you'll probably be presently surprised if you do.
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  #7  
Old 02-22-2012, 07:58 AM
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lbjgh lbjgh is online now
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How do you 'reset' the transmission? How does the transmission learn driving habits? enquiring minds would like to know...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ngcreese View Post
I have an 07 X3, that felt anemic in terms of acceleration, when I first got it.

Resetting the tranny, so that it could learn my habits made all the difference in the world. Since the learning mode lasts for 1000 miles. My guess is, the first time the tranny was "trained" the SUV was probably being broken in, where people have a tendency to drive very light.

A tranny reset, to tune-in the shift pattern and a refresh of the engine's spark plugs and pre-cat O2-senors, to bring back the engine's max torque, really changed my perspective on the X3... big time.

For you guys I'm guessing your mileage is too low to truly warrant a spark plug/sensor tune up. However, if you haven't reset the tranny, post-breakin period... you'll probably be presently surprised if you do.
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  #8  
Old 02-22-2012, 08:33 AM
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bren bren is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lbjgh View Post
How do you 'reset' the transmission? How does the transmission learn driving habits? enquiring minds would like to know...
Disconnect the battery = resets the computer.

The f25 issue isn't the transmission like it was/is on the older models. There is a delay programmed into the drive by wire.
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  #9  
Old 02-22-2012, 08:35 AM
j3ff j3ff is offline
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i think the dealer just reflashes the ecu so that it will have an "open mind" to relearn your driving habits.
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  #10  
Old 02-22-2012, 09:01 AM
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ngcreese ngcreese is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lbjgh View Post
How do you 'reset' the transmission? How does the transmission learn driving habits? enquiring minds would like to know...
Here's some links to the tranny reset procedure for push button start BMWs.
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=261285
http://forums.5series.net/topic/4001...moother-shift/

I had to adapt the procedure for my X3 with the turn key ignition. But it wasn't a big deal.

These BMWs have adaptive shift transmissions to more tailor the car to your driving habits. Remember these cars' throttle control are drive-by-wire which opens up the ability to record how much and how fast a person presses on the accelerator pedal. When you reset the tranny, it goes (back) into a generic shift pattern, from which it is learning how you press on the gas pedal to accelerate to a desired speed and what you do, once you get to that speed.

How we accelerate when we buy a brand new car, with 2 miles on the odometer is way different from how we accelerate when the same car is through the break in period, some 10 to 15K miles later...

Hope this helps
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  #11  
Old 02-22-2012, 05:03 PM
Early fessed Early fessed is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bren View Post
Disconnect the battery = resets the computer.

The f25 issue isn't the transmission like it was/is on the older models. There is a delay programmed into the drive by wire.
Maybe it's me, but I don't sense a delay. It just feels like I'm pressing the gas pedal casually and getting less acceleration than expected because of the nonlinear behavior. I expect 25% throttle but get 10%. If I gun it, then it responds quickly.
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  #12  
Old 02-22-2012, 05:21 PM
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Ya that's the design flaw that people are talking about.

I found a product to fix the problem but it is not available for the F25 yet.

Here is the sales pitch from the website:

Quote:
There are quite a few misconceptions on how Sprint Booster operates. Many in the Euro, Domestic and Import Tuner market are sceptical when it comes to a product that makes the claim to fix or improve something. The truth is, the tuner market has had its heart broken many times with products that talk a good game but fail to deliver. The most successful line of Sprint Boosters has been the euro cars (BMW, Porsche, Mercedes-Benz...). For year people in that genre have been crying out for improved throttle response, because it was just brutal and this is where our product was born. The manufacturer patented the product, invested a great deal of time and resources in R&D and began to expand the Sprint Booster products line up. The decision was made to enter the domestic market with Jeep, Trucks and modern muscle cars: our products really hit home. In Japanese Import Cars, our hottest selling Sprint Boosters have been for the Nissan/Infiniti (350z / G35) + 370z / G37), the Hyundai Genesis, Mitsubishi EVO X/Ralliart... As more and more people have tried the product they have reported back to us valuable feedback as well as questions. From this we have taken the time to draft together a quick FAQ in an attempt to shine light on myths or misconceptions about the product:
I have seen this before, isn't this just like xyz throttle controller product from xyz company?

Sprint Booster is a patented product. No one has invested the amount of time and resources we have to enhance the electronic drive-by-wire system. It is protected by a Greek patent (GR1005429) as well as an international patent application (PCT WO2007066155).

Second, Sprint Booster is far more advanced than people think. The circuitry inside Sprint Booster is continuously monitoring pedal travel or in other words, what the driver is doing with his foot. It analyses angular change, rate of change etc... Using that information, Sprint Booster is far more effective at providing the right amount of throttle inputs that are inline with what the driver is demanding. This applies to partial and WOT situations.
I can get a tune. Why would I waste my time with Sprint Booster?

The best way to answer this question goes back to how our product works. If you step on the pedal, a Sprint Booster is providing your ECU with a very accurate interpretation of what you want in regards to throttle. While tuning systems can modify your throttle maps to change thresholds, it's very hard to get just the right amount of throttle response in certain situations, which ultimately means more tuning to get it right. With Sprint Booster, there are 2 levels of throttle response that we have created from months of R&D on each platform. We engineered it to provide you with a very fluid response regardless of transmission type. Getting back to tuning: A Sprint Booster is not a tuner. It's simply a plug and play modification that takes 5 minutes to install that connects to your pedal connector. No wires to deal with, nothing complicated. Just plug and play. This is likely to be the easiest throttle controller to operate and setup. It measures your inputs and translates a modified signal more in line with your expectations. This product works well with tuning software that do not change the stock throttle maps.
Is Sprint Booster Safe and will this hurt my car?

If properly installed, yes Sprint Booster is very safe. Safety is something we take very seriously. This is why we subjected our product to ultra high TUV SUD testing which some would argue is the highest technical testing standard in the world. Sprint Booster has passed successfully the TUV tests (TUV SUD Automotive) and it is certified with European Conformity type approval (E.C. type approval mark no. e24031712) with regard to Directive 72/245/EEC as last amended by Directive 2006/28/EC. The e-mark is printed on each device. More information about TUV can be found on the USA TUV website.
Where is Sprint Booster manufactured?

Sprint Booster is 100% made in Europe
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No catch. With the Sprint Booster product line we offer a 30 day trial. If you don't like the product for whatever reason. RETURN IT and get your money back immediately. We are serious about our brand and customer service.
Will my dealership void my warranty or know I did something to my throttle response?

No, Sprint Booster is not reflashing or modifying your car's ECU or Subsystems. It simply translates your throttle pedal inputs. In a sense restoring that traditional cable system feel to your throttle. Sprint Booster can be uninstalled at any time should you feel uncomfortable bringing your car into the dealership. Furthermore, with sprint booster installed, it cannot be detected by any diagnostic tool. In fact, our product works so well, that a several North American dealerships that are now currently selling our product.
How does the Sprint Booster work?

The Sprint Booster is engineered to enhance the driving experience by providing increased acceleration time (eliminating delay) on drive-by-wire cars by continuously measuring and converting the digital signal and providing the ECM (Electronic Control Module) with a new and altered signal for much quicker response. The Sprint Booster improves response, increases pedal input sensitivity and delivers more impressive off the line performance you can really feel.
Is the Sprint Booster easy to install?

It is a simple plug-n-play installation that takes just a few minutes and delivers instant response throughout the power band, making accelerating and rev matching incredibly more fun.
Is there a Sprint Booster available for my car?

Sprint Booster is application-specific and available for a number of popular high-performance makes and models. Check out our list of application on the left.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Early fessed View Post
Maybe it's me, but I don't sense a delay. It just feels like I'm pressing the gas pedal casually and getting less acceleration than expected because of the nonlinear behavior. I expect 25% throttle but get 10%. If I gun it, then it responds quickly.

Last edited by lbjgh; 02-22-2012 at 05:24 PM.
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  #13  
Old 02-22-2012, 05:59 PM
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bren bren is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Early fessed View Post
Maybe it's me, but I don't sense a delay. It just feels like I'm pressing the gas pedal casually and getting less acceleration than expected because of the nonlinear behavior. I expect 25% throttle but get 10%. If I gun it, then it responds quickly.
Call it what you will, in practice it feels like the throttle cable (if it had one) isn't properly adjusted. Maybe "non-linear" is the best way to put it.

I think folks who DD the x3 will adapt and not notice it as much as others who only casually drive it.

The funny thing is, it actually drives in a way like my smg m3 - where to be smooth from a stop you have to first feed in light throttle and wait for the clutch slip to be taken up by the hydraulics.

Last edited by bren; 02-22-2012 at 06:01 PM.
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  #14  
Old 02-23-2012, 04:37 PM
cotandem cotandem is offline
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We just picked up our 2012 28i two weeks ago, trading in our 2007 X3. In my opinion, the difference between the two cars is huge. The 2007 had an ongoing jerky/inconsistent acceleration from a stop despite software updates, "relearning" our driver input etc. Thus my number one concern was that this issue is fixed in the 2012 X3. Happy to report, that at least in our vehicle the acceleration is smooth and consistent. Further, the ride quality over bumps and rough roads are light years better in the 2012. Just my 2 cents....
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Old 02-24-2012, 09:02 PM
steined steined is offline
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In my opinion, yes they still need to do some work on the calibration.

I can only imagine that the poor souls who get Auto Start/Stop in the 2013 X3 will suffer even more... I can see offering this as an option, or even allowing one to activate it, but requring one to deactivate it after every start on a supposedly driver oriented vehicle is crazy. I am SOOOOOO glad we got a 2012. We wouldn't have purchased the X3 with that feature. Even KIA allows you to buy auto start/stop or not buy it in an option package. BMW likes to make money on every other option, why not charge for this1?
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  #16  
Old 02-25-2012, 04:51 AM
j3ff j3ff is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steined View Post
In my opinion, yes they still need to do some work on the calibration.

I can only imagine that the poor souls who get Auto Start/Stop in the 2013 X3 will suffer even more... I can see offering this as an option, or even allowing one to activate it, but requring one to deactivate it after every start on a supposedly driver oriented vehicle is crazy. I am SOOOOOO glad we got a 2012. We wouldn't have purchased the X3 with that feature. Even KIA allows you to buy auto start/stop or not buy it in an option package. BMW likes to make money on every other option, why not charge for this1?
so they can show better mileage numbers for both regulatory and marketing purposes.
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Old 02-25-2012, 04:58 AM
joebry joebry is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steined View Post
In my opinion, yes they still need to do some work on the calibration.

I can only imagine that the poor souls who get Auto Start/Stop in the 2013 X3 will suffer even more... I can see offering this as an option, or even allowing one to activate it, but requring one to deactivate it after every start on a supposedly driver oriented vehicle is crazy. I am SOOOOOO glad we got a 2012. We wouldn't have purchased the X3 with that feature. Even KIA allows you to buy auto start/stop or not buy it in an option package. BMW likes to make money on every other option, why not charge for this1?
Here is a link to the feature you mention. I did not know what it was so I searched for it and found this. This, IMO, is taking fuel conservation to the point of absurdity. Even with this acceleration hesitation and as much as I like my 525, I will take a look around at other cars. This start/stop thing wold drive me batty, and maybe to another brand of car.

With some of the new features, I will have to unlearn my current driving habits. Too many times I depend on the power in my 525 to get into small gaps in traffic, pass a car when there is an opening to pass, and other times I need instant response. I will be scared to do this with the acceleration hesitation.

http://www.bmw.com/com/en/insights/t...tart_stop.html
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Old 02-25-2012, 05:49 AM
Clivem2 Clivem2 is offline
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Start / Stop isn't so bad and in some situations it's good. Also it's good with diesels as the BMW ones don't have the smoothest tick-over though they are smooth over about 1,200 rpm.
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Old 02-25-2012, 12:37 PM
j3ff j3ff is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joebry View Post

With some of the new features, I will have to unlearn my current driving habits. Too many times I depend on the power in my 525 to get into small gaps in traffic, pass a car when there is an opening to pass, and other times I need instant response. I will be scared to do this with the acceleration hesitation.
i don't think you will be scared in those situations. first, those who complain about this hesitation are talking about accelerating from a stop, or sometimes re-accelerating after slowing down. i haven't heard anyone say they detect this, e.g., when moving in traffic and accelerating to pass. second, i've had my x3 35i for about a month, and i don't perceive any hesitation. your foot learns to do what is necessary, in the same fashion that you adjust to different engagement points with the clutch on varying manual transmission vehicles.
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Last edited by j3ff; 02-25-2012 at 12:38 PM.
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Old 06-20-2012, 06:32 AM
j_mac j_mac is offline
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My 2012 X3 just arrived and the hesitation is quite obvious. Not sure what the solution is yet? Anyone got any ideas?
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Old 06-20-2012, 07:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j_mac View Post
My 2012 X3 just arrived and the hesitation is quite obvious. Not sure what the solution is yet? Anyone got any ideas?
Your 2012 just arrived? They have been making the 2013's for several months now...
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Old 06-20-2012, 09:10 AM
joebry joebry is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Me530 View Post
Your 2012 just arrived? They have been making the 2013's for several months now...
I wonder if he really has a 2013. My 2013 got here about the 5th or 6th of May and it sho don't have no acceleration hesitation. You better be careful when you press the accelerator and ready to go and go fast. There may be a nanosecond hesitation but you don't worry about it. This thing has got power and it is only a 28i.
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Old 06-20-2012, 11:43 AM
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Uhhhh

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Quote:
Originally Posted by steined View Post
In my opinion, yes they still need to do some work on the calibration.

I can only imagine that the poor souls who get Auto Start/Stop in the 2013 X3 will suffer even more... I can see offering this as an option, or even allowing one to activate it, but requring one to deactivate it after every start on a supposedly driver oriented vehicle is crazy. I am SOOOOOO glad we got a 2012. We wouldn't have purchased the X3 with that feature. Even KIA allows you to buy auto start/stop or not buy it in an option package. BMW likes to make money on every other option, why not charge for this1?
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Old 06-20-2012, 07:04 PM
Wabbajack Wabbajack is offline
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My 2013 35i that I have had two weeks now totally hesitates sometimes. I am already in the habit of disabling the auto start/stop thing when I turn on the car so that's never a factor. I have found that I have to drive around in Sport mode if I don't want to experience the hesitation upon acceleration. It's super annoying and I'm not very happy about it. It is nothing like my 2011 335i. Not a bit. And I'm getting 6 mpg less so far.
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Old 06-20-2012, 08:07 PM
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Wabbajack, it sounds like your car has another unrelated fault. Are you using quality fuel?
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