07 650i Convertible Top Unlocked Alarm Problem

I think its more than just Top UP or DOWN. The top goes through multiple steps to go UP/DOWN. When you press the button to go down it has to drop the windows, unlock the top, wait for it to pop up, then open the back trunk area, wait for it to open, then go through about three phases to bring the top down into the trunk area. That requires a lot of sensors. I think the issue, mentioned here a few times, is the tolerance of these sensors. They are way too sensitive and probably like the to protect the top and motor from exerting to much pressure.

Another interesting point, I used to never put the car through the car wash. Always hand washed. This started happening a week after when someone pushed up against the top while trying to clean the top. I think he may have torqued something.

Does anyone know how to access the ECU without going to the dealer? I'd like to monitor the log when this happens.

Also, would be nice to be able to monitor the sensors and figure out which one is fluctuating the most while driving around down. The ones that fluctuate are probably in need of replacement.

Originally Posted by Nitrogen

I wonder if there is a way to bypass, jumper or fool the sensors to work.
I bet there is.

There is a top control module that reads 11 different segments (steps) from 2 sensors during the top opening/closing. I think it would be very difficult to trick the control module into thinking those 11 steps occurred.

Originally Posted by bradhs

I think its more than just Top UP or DOWN. The top goes through multiple steps to go UP/DOWN. When you press the button to go down it has to drop the windows, unlock the top, wait for it to pop up, then open the back trunk area, wait for it to open, then go through about three phases to bring the top down into the trunk area. That requires a lot of sensors. I think the issue, mentioned here a few times, is the tolerance of these sensors. They are way too sensitive and probably like the to protect the top and motor from exerting to much pressure.

There is nothing in this world that will convince me this process could occur without eliminating the one sensor that causes the problem for everyone. We don't need to isolate which sensor it is, we know the culprit, it is the angle rotation sensor in the back frame joint. Because it monitors the top in such narrow segments it gets thrown off way to easy.

This is the way I would design this to occur...using the KISS principal. Not the FUBAR principal that the BMW engineers have utilized.

When you press the button, drop the windows, open the boot, unlock the top latch, then start the lowering process. Once the top hits the point where it hits the sensor that shows it is fully lowered into the boot, drop the boot and raise the windows, lock the boot. Knowing what happens in-between when it is fully up and fully down is useless, nothing happens in that time except the top motor pulls or pushes the top up/down. If something goes wrong and it doesn't go the to bottom, it doesn't hit that sensor, so the boot stays up, etc.

The Boseman10 worked for me. I have an 07 that I purchased in Jan. Went to a garage that specializes in BMW and German cars. They told me it would take a full day to tear apart the back seat and get to the switches to perform the update as prescribed by BMW. I told them I would set up a time. Then out of sheer frustration I went back to the internet and found this thread. Walked out to my garage, pushed on the post and the light went out. I was so excited I drove back to the garage and showed them how to fix it. This was after they charged me $95 to diagnose the problem. Thanks for finding this fix.

Dan

Originally Posted by Dane8303

The Boseman10 worked for me. I have an 07 that I purchased in Jan. Went to a garage that specializes in BMW and German cars. They told me it would take a full day to tear apart the back seat and get to the switches to perform the update as prescribed by BMW. I told them I would set up a time. Then out of sheer frustration I went back to the internet and found this thread. Walked out to my garage, pushed on the post and the light went out. I was so excited I drove back to the garage and showed them how to fix it. This was after they charged me $95 to diagnose the problem. Thanks for finding this fix.

Dan

Very nice... the power of a great internet forum. It would have been nice to see the looks on their faces... so, did they refund your diagnosis fee?

Not only did they NOT refund my diagnosis fee but I figured I would have them change the oil and they would be cool about it and give me a discount due to all of this and they charged me FULL price. $135.00. The owner was not there but the manager and techs were so I figured they would give me a deal but I was wrong. It is what I would have done if I was the manager or owner.

Dan,

Originally Posted by Dane8303

Not only did they NOT refund my diagnosis fee but I figured I would have them change the oil and they would be cool about it and give me a discount due to all of this and they charged me FULL price. $135.00. The owner was not there but the manager and techs were so I figured they would give me a deal but I was wrong. It is what I would have done if I was the manager or owner.

Dan,

Oh well, I guess you can take your business elsewhere. But before you do, you should drop off your invoice charging them for teaching them how to do the Boesman fix...

Originally Posted by Dane8303

Not only did they NOT refund my diagnosis fee but I figured I would have them change the oil and they would be cool about it and give me a discount due to all of this and they charged me FULL price. $135.00. The owner was not there but the manager and techs were so I figured they would give me a deal but I was wrong. It is what I would have done if I was the manager or owner.

Dan,

It is too bad you didn't find the fix earlier!

But I don't agree about the diagnosis fee, that is why they tell you up front that you have to pay that. If you did a lot of business with them it would be something that as an owner I would probably work out a deal (half back or something) out of goodwill, but they did take up shop time at your request.

Originally Posted by Dane8303

Not only did they NOT refund my diagnosis fee but I figured I would have them change the oil and they would be cool about it and give me a discount due to all of this and they charged me FULL price. $135.00. The owner was not there but the manager and techs were so I figured they would give me a deal but I was wrong. It is what I would have done if I was the manager or owner.

Dan,

Still cheaper than the $190.00 I paid at a dealer for an oil change.

Wouldn't it be nice if the people that fix these cars for a living actually followed the forums and learned from the customers too.

That's what we do in my industry.

Add another satisfied customer with the fix....walked out to car pushed on the bar and BAM light went off and all is good in BMW land... LOVE THIS FORUM!!!

Originally Posted by boesman10

I live in FL and with the summer heat kicking in I have had this issue now a few times over the past few months (just got my '07 650i Convertible 5 months ago).
I have read many threads and info from other places, and found a workaround for this issue that I have not seen posted anywhere else (at least it works for me).
I've had this happen to me just this morning again (car was parked in the airport garage for a week, and after taking the red-eye back from San Francisco, I could not open the trunk, and noticed the "red convertible top blinking light" problem - last thing you want at 7am after an overnight flight.

So I did what I've now sucessfully done over the past month when this happened, the the light stops blinking right away, and things are back to normal.

So this is what I do (old school):

There's a bar (not the kind you're thinking about) with an elbow that runs behind the canvas in the back pivot point in the convertible top (forgive me - I don't know the technical terms), but the first pic shows what this looks like on the drivers side. I have drawn the approx location of where this bar lies with a red dot indicating the pivot point where the faulty sensor lies.

All I do when I run into this problem is to apply a little pressue to that pivot point with my hand (as indicated by the red dot in the pic) and the red blinking light stops blinking, and things are back to normal (shown in the second attachhment). I normally push the pivot point down towards the body of the car - not a lot of pressure is needed at all. To quantify, if you press hard enough to break an egg, it's to hard. All it needs is a gentle nudge for the sensor to engage (is my guess).

I'm assuming in my case the problem lies with the sensor on the driver side, because I never had to do this on the passenger side, but it may be that in some cases one will have to do this on the passenger side as opposed to the driver side (as shown in the third attachment).

Let me know if this helps anyone else.

This works fine for me, so I'm not planning on taking the car in for this to be fixed, since it does not look as if the successrate in addressing this is that high (and I can't do without the car for two days, and it's out of warrantee anyway).

worked like a charm...
thanks boesman

Wow, just wow... I was considering the purchase of a 650i Convertible in the summer of 2010, and because of the top issues I passed and went the Lexus route. Now that I have re-read this post, and an apparent fix is known, I am considering a 650i convertible again.

its not exactly a permanent fix.... if its a censor issue it ll prolly come up again, but i ve had the car for less than 3 weeks and its happened twice.... from what ive read so far i dont think there is a permanent fix... also im one of those people that WILL not take the car to the stealership unless I cannot fix it myself, (my 2003 350Z has been to the stealership once for recall)

Originally Posted by bigdatty817

its not exactly a permanent fix.... if its a censor issue it ll prolly come up again, but i ve had the car for less than 3 weeks and its happened twice.... from what ive read so far i dont think there is a permanent fix... also im one of those people that WILL not take the car to the stealership unless I cannot fix it myself, (my 2003 350Z has been to the stealership once for recall)

Well, my main concern when I was looking in '10 was getting stuck somewhere with the windows down and/or top down, and having to take it to the dealer... knowing what we know now, just pushing that area and its fixed..for the moment.. is ALOT better than the previous option.

Long story short, I had this issue in for service 3 times last year. The last time fixed it, they had to install sensors backwards from the service guide. It happened today right after I picked up my car for broken TPM sensor. I just came to this forum, tried the "push in the bar" solution.

It instantly made the light stop. I lowered the top fine. Then I raised it again and it stops about 2 inches short of closed, so now it's WORSE. I have to keep it down now until I can get it back into them. This is just great.

Originally Posted by spooner30

Long story short, I had this issue in for service 3 times last year. The last time fixed it, they had to install sensors backwards from the service guide. It happened today right after I picked up my car for broken TPM sensor. I just came to this forum, tried the "push in the bar" solution.

It instantly made the light stop. I lowered the top fine. Then I raised it again and it stops about 2 inches short of closed, so now it's WORSE. I have to keep it down now until I can get it back into them. This is just great.

So aorry to hear that this keeps happening. Funny thing it never happened on my 04 but happened with my 08, go figure. But since they did the bracket modification on mine, I never had the issue again so I am luckly so far. But it's a shame though that you have a car like this and have to dread opening your top because you never know if it's going to go back up or get stuck!

Thanks man. It's bizarre. I just wrote a nastygram to BMW USA.

Funny thing, out of pure rage and frustration, I just went back to the car, started it up (top was now down from before), put it up, and it closed.

Just wanted to thank Bosman10 for his fix. My husband and I were going to dinner and the top would not go down and the error message was illuminated. After dinner I searched the site and found this fix. Works like a charm. My husband doesnt' even know I fixed it!!!! Thanks!

you Rock dude, your method works like a charm. thanks a million.

Originally Posted by boesman10

I live in FL and with the summer heat kicking in I have had this issue now a few times over the past few months (just got my '07 650i Convertible 5 months ago).
I have read many threads and info from other places, and found a workaround for this issue that I have not seen posted anywhere else (at least it works for me).
I've had this happen to me just this morning again (car was parked in the airport garage for a week, and after taking the red-eye back from San Francisco, I could not open the trunk, and noticed the "red convertible top blinking light" problem - last thing you want at 7am after an overnight flight.

So I did what I've now sucessfully done over the past month when this happened, the the light stops blinking right away, and things are back to normal.

So this is what I do (old school):

There's a bar (not the kind you're thinking about) with an elbow that runs behind the canvas in the back pivot point in the convertible top (forgive me - I don't know the technical terms), but the first pic shows what this looks like on the drivers side. I have drawn the approx location of where this bar lies with a red dot indicating the pivot point where the faulty sensor lies.

All I do when I run into this problem is to apply a little pressue to that pivot point with my hand (as indicated by the red dot in the pic) and the red blinking light stops blinking, and things are back to normal (shown in the second attachhment). I normally push the pivot point down towards the body of the car - not a lot of pressure is needed at all. To quantify, if you press hard enough to break an egg, it's to hard. All it needs is a gentle nudge for the sensor to engage (is my guess).

I'm assuming in my case the problem lies with the sensor on the driver side, because I never had to do this on the passenger side, but it may be that in some cases one will have to do this on the passenger side as opposed to the driver side (as shown in the third attachment).

Let me know if this helps anyone else.

This works fine for me, so I'm not planning on taking the car in for this to be fixed, since it does not look as if the successrate in addressing this is that high (and I can't do without the car for two days, and it's out of warrantee anyway).

Woo Hoo............Aug 2004 build and not one top related issue yet. Top goes up and down atleast twice a day everyday too.

This thread will come in handy tho' when it finally hits me.

Got a couple of false "top not locked" error messages last week when my baby had to sit in the scorching sun last week - took ten seconds to do the boesman fix both times it happened. No further issues and many thanks again for the fix.

Originally Posted by All-Or-Nothing

Woo Hoo............Aug 2004 build and not one top related issue yet. Top goes up and down atleast twice a day everyday too.

This thread will come in handy tho' when it finally hits me.

tsk tsk, you are tempting fate by saying it out loud!!!!

Funny, such a simple solution, Boesman10 is a superstar board member and barely ever comes on to the board (8 posts total). I vote him as the convertible owners MVP member!

Originally Posted by bigdatty817

worked like a charm...
thanks boesman

Can you tell me the location or send pictures of the said pivot point as i have the error, roof not locked on my dash.

Thanks

You should read the entire thread for lots of good info on the issue - the legendary Boesman fix with pictures is post #120 about the middle of this thread. Should work - good luck.

My 04 finally gave in to the error code, but also popped up with other codes all together. Power Networking Fault, RPM gauge stops working then working again. Anyone experience these along with the Top Lock Error code. My car was sent back to the dealership for 2 recalls, smg module reprogramming and battery cover. Could the tech screw something up while working on the recalls? Also, my CV error code comes on mostly after car wash or rain