Changing oil pan gasket

Well.. after further review and inspection... and, with some advice from you guys.. It looks like our '87 325is needs an oil pan gasket..

My son has a friend with an E30 who has some mechanical experience (and, an engine hoist), so they are going to try and tackle this, themselves.

So.. as near as I can tell from Googling, the hardest part of this job is getting clearance underneath, so you can actually remove the oil pan. Since his friend has a hoist, it seems that it's going to be easier to go up with the engine, rather than dropping the front suspension/subframe. Plus, it seems they may be able to avoid unbolting the oil pump, this way..

Any specific advice on changing the gasket? Cleaning surfaces? Using sealant (or not)? What about the oil pan bolts? Saw some that suggested using all new bolts? Would you just buy an oil pan gasket, or the whole lower end gasket kit (in case he runs into other issues)?

What is the biggest risk and/or usual problems that might come along with this repair?

Any and all advice appreciated... I'm not sure this is going to be worth me saving $300, but he wants to give it a shot..

Regards,
kyfdx

Just buy a Bentley E30 Manuel it will help and you can use it for many a projects.

Originally Posted by Tkaczuk

Just buy a Bentley E30 Manuel it will help and you can use it for many a projects.

Got one... It will help....

Amazingly... still need advice...

Some may say just pull the engine. Im not sure what the best way to do it is. You have a torc wrench? Possibly some new motor mounts to swap out while your at it. Read over the manual. If your insure you can handle the task maybe you should comtact a friend who's a mechanic and have them do the job. You don't have to take it to a shop. I alway have my car inspected by a friend who is certified to do them. Its very usefull and i pay him the 65 bucks instead of some shop becaue he's a friend. Also google it. Pelican and others i'm sure have diys on the job.

Oh! I would say buy the whole lower end gaskets. You can swap out some others while your at it. It they have never been done then its well worth it. Also check out of its leaking from around the engine meets the transmision that could be a Camshaft seal. That can mes up you clutch so take care of that right away if you see oil there. Good luck.

Why would anyone suggest using all new bolts?
These are not torque to yield bolts, surely...

Originally Posted by Nick323

Why would anyone suggest using all new bolts?
These are not torque to yield bolts, surely...

You should change the head bolts everytime you put a new head gasket on. Its basicaly the same consept. Less likely to snap a bolt next time your putting on a new gasket or replacing something where you would need to remove the pan.

Personally, i would pull the engine and do it out of the car, but it depends how confident they are, or how confident you are in them. I have done it many times before. However for your first time, and my first time, i used an engine hoist but just unbolted the two rubber engine mounts and lifted the engine a few inches with all hoses/wiring etc still attached. that was enough clearance for me. also, google what the bottom of an M20 engine looks like and you will see there is the oil pickup tube thing you need to weasel around. be carefull not to nick the crank etc with the pan on removal.

Overall, its not a hard job, its just time consuming and patience is something they will need. To be honest, id recommend just one of them doing it so they can focus, but i might be a nanna with that statement.

Originally Posted by Tkaczuk

Oh! I would say buy the whole lower end gaskets. You can swap out some others while your at it. It they have never been done then its well worth it. Also check out of its leaking from around the engine meets the transmision that could be a Crankshaft seal. That can mes up you clutch so take care of that right away if you see oil there. Good luck.

edited, but correct

Originally Posted by Nick323

Why would anyone suggest using all new bolts?
These are not torque to yield bolts, surely...

lets be honest, if its got 25 years under its belt now, is it really going to last another 25 years? id just use the same bolts again unless it was an anal project and/or i intended to keep it forever.

Without wanting to be anal, I would ask you to think about whether you want to learn how a fastener works and what it does
I am not being ridiculous, but sometimes we do not see the simplest things in perspective
The headbolts clamp a head onto a block with a gasket or sealant in-between. Quite a lot of force here that should remain stable. So some manufacturers use Head-bolts that are not only torqued to a value, but then also angled-up giving a head-bolt where the shank has streched marginally (there are values given to check this) to enable a firm, but equal clamping force with changes in temperature etc.
Some use headbolts that are toqued to a certain spec & can be re-used untill they go out of spec & others..
Your sump though is held against the block with far less force, that is not needed to be so consistent. So there is no reason for a manufacturer to specify that you should not re-use the bolts. Unless of course some gorilla has overtightened these in the past or that they are damaged in another way.
2 reasons, why I go into this diatribe:
1) To help us understand what we are doing
2) To save you money

Thanks for all of the advice..

They have a hoist, so unbolting the mounts and lifting a few inches is their plan.. I'm getting the whole lower end gasket set, so they'll have what they need, in case anything else pops up.. If they had to pull the whole engine out, I'd just send it to a shop. My son will just be a helper. His friend is the quasi-mechanic, who also owns an E30, and has the hoist and tools. He seems pretty confident. Plus, my son really wants to do this himself, which is a plus, I think... (18 yrs old)

I've found a few good DIY posts with pictures. It seems it's all about getting clearance to wiggle the pan out, with the issues being the oil pump and the pickup tube. I like the idea of lifting the engine, rather than messing with the front suspension and subframe.. seems like less to go wrong.

If it goes bad, I call a flatbed.... LOL

Again..thanks for all advice.. I'm paying attention!
kyfdx

A flex ratcheting 10mm box relieves some pain for the front pan bolts if you don't pull the subframe.

Originally Posted by Helmet Ludendor

A flex ratcheting 10mm box relieves some pain for the front pan bolts if you don't pull the subframe.

Thanks... If his friend doesn't have one, I'll acquire one before the repair..

Originally Posted by kyfdx

Thanks... If his friend doesn't have one, I'll acquire one before the repair..

id pretty much garentee he does. its a staple in pretty much any socket and ratchet set you can buy

Sears, Home Depot, Lowes, and Amazon. They all carry the tool. A set is nice to have. A few deep offset boxes are nice for exhaust work along with swivel socket set.

http://www.amazon.com/GearWrench-991.../dp/B000HBC7UI

I used one of these. It allows you to drop the subframe without worrying about having to remove the hood.

Sorry for the huge photo, I just hyperlinked it.

The hood is only for bolts away from off when its on...

True but getting it to line up is not always the easiest job. Plus is this tool is nice to have a round makes other jobs easy and I rent mine out.

Hey... I bought a flex-head, ratcheting 10mm box wrench.. I think that item there might be a little overkill for one repair job... ;-)

Originally Posted by kyfdx

Hey... I bought a flex-head, ratcheting 10mm box wrench.. I think that item there might be a little overkill for one repair job... ;-)

Maybe but I know enough 24V guys that have bounced their pan off a raised man hole or some other bump in the road.

It's payed for itself numerous times over. I rent mine out to locals for $25 a job.