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X5 E70 (2007 - 2013)
E70 BMW X5 produced between 2007 and 2013. Discuss the E70 X5 with other BMW owners here.

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  #1  
Old 05-03-2011, 12:26 PM
MapleFarm MapleFarm is offline
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2011 Navigation DVD's for 2008 X5

Does anyone have any experience with the 2010 or 2011 two DVD set of navigation disks and how they work (same disk set for numerous 2006-2009 BMW's--the Professional Set)? I recently purchased them and can't enter any address for a location in the western U.S. from my home in PA. My BMW Center technical staff believes I should be able to enter an address for any location in the U.S. or Canada from my home in PA & get guidance. They even, under warranty, replaced the DVD drive in an attempt to "fix" the problem. It didn't fix anything. Next, the Center filed a PUMA case with BMW, and still nothing from the case after nearly 3 weeks.

The way the 2-disk set seems to work is---it's only possible to enter addresses for the eastern U.S. when disk 1 is in the drive. When disk 2 is in the drive I can enter a western U.S. address, but when I try to start guidance a message appears stating that "no guidance is available.

Without being able to get guidance from PA to get to a western U.S. destination makes the system essentially useless for me in traveling to the western U.S.. I can wait until I cross the Mississippi River to enter a western U.S. address (when disk 2 is in the drive), but how do I get guidance for the best route to the Mississippi River if I want to get to a NM location versus a OR destination (these would require different routes from my home in PA)?
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  #2  
Old 05-03-2011, 06:04 PM
c-dubmobile c-dubmobile is offline
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i feel your pain. the CIC based Nav is a POS. Hate the Disk 1 and 2s.....
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  #3  
Old 05-03-2011, 07:57 PM
apw2607 apw2607 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MapleFarm View Post
Does anyone have any experience with the 2010 or 2011 two DVD set of navigation disks and how they work (same disk set for numerous 2006-2009 BMW's--the Professional Set)? I recently purchased them and can't enter any address for a location in the western U.S. from my home in PA. My BMW Center technical staff believes I should be able to enter an address for any location in the U.S. or Canada from my home in PA & get guidance. They even, under warranty, replaced the DVD drive in an attempt to "fix" the problem. It didn't fix anything. Next, the Center filed a PUMA case with BMW, and still nothing from the case after nearly 3 weeks.

The way the 2-disk set seems to work is---it's only possible to enter addresses for the eastern U.S. when disk 1 is in the drive. When disk 2 is in the drive I can enter a western U.S. address, but when I try to start guidance a message appears stating that "no guidance is available.

Without being able to get guidance from PA to get to a western U.S. destination makes the system essentially useless for me in traveling to the western U.S.. I can wait until I cross the Mississippi River to enter a western U.S. address (when disk 2 is in the drive), but how do I get guidance for the best route to the Mississippi River if I want to get to a NM location versus a OR destination (these would require different routes from my home in PA)?
Don't think there's a fix. I would try and source a DVD from 2009 which included all NA on a single disk.
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  #4  
Old 05-03-2011, 08:23 PM
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quackbury quackbury is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MapleFarm View Post
Without being able to get guidance from PA to get to a western U.S. destination makes the system essentially useless for me in traveling to the western U.S.. I can wait until I cross the Mississippi River to enter a western U.S. address (when disk 2 is in the drive), but how do I get guidance for the best route to the Mississippi River if I want to get to a NM location versus a OR destination (these would require different routes from my home in PA)?
Really going out on a limb here with a wild guess..... maybe try a map?
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Current BMW's:
2014 535i MSport Space / Black, ZCW, ZDA, ZLP, ZLS, ZPP, H-K and 704
2014 328i Sport Wagon, Glacier / Black, ZSL, ZD2, ZD3, ZDH, ZLP, ZPP, ZTP, and H-K

Prior BMW's
2011 535ix MSport
2011 X5 35D
2008 ///M3 Vert
2008 X5 3.0
2007 X5 3.0
2006 X5 3.0
2006 550iA SP
2003 540iA M-Technic
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  #5  
Old 05-04-2011, 04:50 AM
MapleFarm MapleFarm is offline
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Are several of you saying that the navigation system is functioning as designed, despite the fact that the Center technicians believe it should be operating differently (like it did originally, but with a 2 disk map set)?

BTW, I do still use and own maps and also own a couple of Garmin GPS units for back up purposes and use in vehicles without navigation. I also have a 2009 Nav disk (single disk for entire U.S.) that will work in the system. What I wanted was maps in the Nav to reflect 2011 roads, etc.

It was apparently my naive belief that in using an updated map disk the navigation system should continue to operate the way it did when I purchased the vehicle. I haven't "upgraded anything," I simply am trying to use maps that have been updated.

Thanks for your comments. Any other thoughts?
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  #6  
Old 05-04-2011, 05:15 AM
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quackbury quackbury is offline
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Okay, being SLIGHTLY more constructive...

Did you buy the disks from a dealer, or from eBay, etc.? IIRC the LCI was in 2009, and the Nav was switched over to the new version - different graphics, algorythms, manufacturer (I forget if they shifted from NavTeq to TeleAtlas or vice versa, but you can do a search). Then in MY 2011 they did away with the DVD's entirely and the map data was stored to the HD.

I am guessing the post-LCI disks may be totally incompatible with yoru pre-LCI vehicle. If that's true (and it's just a guess) the dealer should have known that and not sold you discs that don't work. But crap like that does happen (just ask all the early E9X M3 owners whose dealers willed their DCT's with the wrong tranny fluid....) OTOH if you bought the disks on eBay, it's very unlikely the seller will assume any responsibility.

Good chance the above "guess" is totally wrong, since your initial post seems to indicate the system works fine for finding addresses in the Eastern US. So what you would have to do is use Google Maps (or even - shudder - a paper map) to figure out where you want to cross the Mississippi, use the first disc to get you there, then swap for the second disc. Heck, AAA will plan your route for free with a Trip Tiq. That would be inconvenient, but is it really THAT big of a deal?
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Current BMW's:
2014 535i MSport Space / Black, ZCW, ZDA, ZLP, ZLS, ZPP, H-K and 704
2014 328i Sport Wagon, Glacier / Black, ZSL, ZD2, ZD3, ZDH, ZLP, ZPP, ZTP, and H-K

Prior BMW's
2011 535ix MSport
2011 X5 35D
2008 ///M3 Vert
2008 X5 3.0
2007 X5 3.0
2006 X5 3.0
2006 550iA SP
2003 540iA M-Technic
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  #7  
Old 05-04-2011, 09:02 PM
apw2607 apw2607 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quackbury View Post
Okay, being SLIGHTLY more constructive...

Did you buy the disks from a dealer, or from eBay, etc.? IIRC the LCI was in 2009, and the Nav was switched over to the new version - different graphics, algorythms, manufacturer (I forget if they shifted from NavTeq to TeleAtlas or vice versa, but you can do a search). Then in MY 2011 they did away with the DVD's entirely and the map data was stored to the HD.

I am guessing the post-LCI disks may be totally incompatible with yoru pre-LCI vehicle. If that's true (and it's just a guess) the dealer should have known that and not sold you discs that don't work. But crap like that does happen (just ask all the early E9X M3 owners whose dealers willed their DCT's with the wrong tranny fluid....) OTOH if you bought the disks on eBay, it's very unlikely the seller will assume any responsibility.

Good chance the above "guess" is totally wrong, since your initial post seems to indicate the system works fine for finding addresses in the Eastern US. So what you would have to do is use Google Maps (or even - shudder - a paper map) to figure out where you want to cross the Mississippi, use the first disc to get you there, then swap for the second disc. Heck, AAA will plan your route for free with a Trip Tiq. That would be inconvenient, but is it really THAT big of a deal?
Not sure what your talking about when you say post lci disks ?

The guys got a CCC nav system.

From 2010 BMW use tele atlas and for north America there across 2 disks
Prior to that the map data was provided by navteq and all north america was on a single disk.

The routing algorithms are different and the Poi info ... But graphics etc remain the same. This is a function of the CCC operating system, not the nav disk.

Anyway, the nav system will only be able to navigate to a destination if the address is on the current disk in the CCC drive.

Just buy a old 2009 DVD on eBay. I'm pretty certain 2009.1 was the last of the navteq disks. Part number is 65 90 2 147 677
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  #8  
Old 05-04-2011, 09:22 PM
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quackbury quackbury is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apw2607 View Post
Not sure what your talking about when you say post lci disks ?
Well, that makes 2 of us

My 2007 and 2008 had single-DVD Navs, with the "old" graphics.

I "thought" BMW refreshed the interior in 2009 (may have been 2010) and had a different graphics set (the same as on my 2011), but still had the data on DVD's. That would be consistent with your comment that BMW went to a 2 DVD setup, provided by Tele Atlas instead of NavTeq.

AFAIK the nav data is now stored on the HDD of the 2011's and 2012's.

I was suggesting that the OP had possibly purchased a set of DVD's that was incompatible with his nav - e.g. the TeleAtlas DVD's would not work properly with his NavTeq based system, even though they were both CCC. If he bought the DVD's from a dealer, they should refund his $$$ for selling him an incompatible part, but if he bought from eBay he is SOL.

Does that make any more sense?
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Current BMW's:
2014 535i MSport Space / Black, ZCW, ZDA, ZLP, ZLS, ZPP, H-K and 704
2014 328i Sport Wagon, Glacier / Black, ZSL, ZD2, ZD3, ZDH, ZLP, ZPP, ZTP, and H-K

Prior BMW's
2011 535ix MSport
2011 X5 35D
2008 ///M3 Vert
2008 X5 3.0
2007 X5 3.0
2006 X5 3.0
2006 550iA SP
2003 540iA M-Technic
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  #9  
Old 05-04-2011, 11:12 PM
ChuckGr ChuckGr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quackbury View Post
AFAIK the nav data is now stored on the HDD of the 2011's and 2012's.
It is the same on 2010's also.

Chuck
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  #10  
Old 05-05-2011, 03:32 PM
apw2607 apw2607 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quackbury View Post
Well, that makes 2 of us

My 2007 and 2008 had single-DVD Navs, with the "old" graphics.

I "thought" BMW refreshed the interior in 2009 (may have been 2010) and had a different graphics set (the same as on my 2011), but still had the data on DVD's. That would be consistent with your comment that BMW went to a 2 DVD setup, provided by Tele Atlas instead of NavTeq.

AFAIK the nav data is now stored on the HDD of the 2011's and 2012's.

I was suggesting that the OP had possibly purchased a set of DVD's that was incompatible with his nav - e.g. the TeleAtlas DVD's would not work properly with his NavTeq based system, even though they were both CCC. If he bought the DVD's from a dealer, they should refund his $$$ for selling him an incompatible part, but if he bought from eBay he is SOL.

Does that make any more sense?
No.

In 2010 BMW introduced the CIC idrive to the x5. Hard drive based for map data

2009 and earlier uses the CCC idrive with map data stored on a DVD.

The fact the map supplier changed has no bearing, so long as one purchases the correct DVD for either CIC or CCC idrive systems.
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  #11  
Old 05-05-2011, 10:35 PM
ard ard is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apw2607 View Post
No.

In 2010 BMW introduced the CIC idrive to the x5. Hard drive based for map data

2009 and earlier uses the CCC idrive with map data stored on a DVD.

The fact the map supplier changed has no bearing, so long as one purchases the correct DVD for either CIC or CCC idrive systems.
True.

Two further comments... the data FOR the CIC system CAN be obtained from BMW in a 3 DVD set...BUT the data is loaded from these ONTO the hard drive CIC system and then accessed by the algorithm on the hard drive.

And the data supplier makes ALL the difference.
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  #12  
Old 05-06-2011, 09:32 AM
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quackbury quackbury is offline
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Okay, I am totally completely confused.

I think it is established that the 2009 and earler models used a CCC system with the data stored on one DVD. The system/software and the DVD were both supplied by Navteq. From 2010 the X5 uses a CIC system with the data stored on the hard drive. The system / software and the data are both supplied by Tele Atlas. There are conflicting posts in this thread as to whether the Tele Atlas data comes on 2 or 3 DVD's. In a 2010 or newer, the data must be downloaded from the DVD to the hard drive.

The OP stated he purchased a 2-DVD set (presumably manufactured by Tele Atlas) for use on his CCC (Navteq) system.

I interpret the various posts in this thread as saying that the CCC system will only work with the CCC data (on a single DVD), not with the multi-DVD CIC data. (This sounds a little at odds with the OP's statement that the CIC disks will get him as far as the Mississippi, but not across it.)

If my interpretation is correct (and I am still not sure of that), had the OP bought his CIC data disks from the dealer, he should be able to get a refund because the parts guy made a mistake. OTOH if he bought them fro eBay, he is SOL because the mistake was the buyer's, not the seller's.

Is that accurate, or am I still confused?
__________________


Current BMW's:
2014 535i MSport Space / Black, ZCW, ZDA, ZLP, ZLS, ZPP, H-K and 704
2014 328i Sport Wagon, Glacier / Black, ZSL, ZD2, ZD3, ZDH, ZLP, ZPP, ZTP, and H-K

Prior BMW's
2011 535ix MSport
2011 X5 35D
2008 ///M3 Vert
2008 X5 3.0
2007 X5 3.0
2006 X5 3.0
2006 550iA SP
2003 540iA M-Technic

Last edited by quackbury; 05-06-2011 at 09:34 AM.
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  #13  
Old 05-06-2011, 10:38 AM
ard ard is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quackbury View Post
Okay, I am totally completely confused.

I think it is established that the 2009 and earler models used a CCC system with the data stored on one DVD. The system/software and the DVD were both supplied by Navteq. From 2010 the X5 uses a CIC system with the data stored on the hard drive. The system / software and the data are both supplied by Tele Atlas. There are conflicting posts in this thread as to whether the Tele Atlas data comes on 2 or 3 DVD's. In a 2010 or newer, the data must be downloaded from the DVD to the hard drive.

The OP stated he purchased a 2-DVD set (presumably manufactured by Tele Atlas) for use on his CCC (Navteq) system.

I interpret the various posts in this thread as saying that the CCC system will only work with the CCC data (on a single DVD), not with the multi-DVD CIC data. (This sounds a little at odds with the OP's statement that the CIC disks will get him as far as the Mississippi, but not across it.)

If my interpretation is correct (and I am still not sure of that), had the OP bought his CIC data disks from the dealer, he should be able to get a refund because the parts guy made a mistake. OTOH if he bought them fro eBay, he is SOL because the mistake was the buyer's, not the seller's.

Is that accurate, or am I still confused?
1. The older CCC system accesses data that resides on the DVD. This can be a one or two DVD set. The newest maps are two DVDs.

2. The newer CIC system accesses data that is on the hard drive. Data GETS ONTO the hard drive via two paths:

a. Uploaded at the dealership with an FSC code
b. Uploaded at your house from a special 3-DVD data set plus the same FSC code.

So the CCC dvd data disc is incompatible with the CIC system (and vice versa).

The CCC system can use mulitple iterations of the map data that might be one or two DVDs and might be nav tec or teleatlas

The CIC system ONLY uses the crappy teleatlas data (since this system came about after BMW made the switch)

Confusing?

Sorry

A



Edit: OP has a 2008 vehicle. using the 2010 or 2011 data set does not change the fact that he has a system that accesses data from the DISC. Hence the issue with 'splitting routing across maps'. OP is not using CIC system and cannot use CIC maps.

Last edited by ard; 05-06-2011 at 10:40 AM.
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  #14  
Old 05-06-2011, 11:39 AM
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quackbury quackbury is offline
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Originally Posted by ard View Post
Confusing?
My head hurts. Is it cocktail hour yet?
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Current BMW's:
2014 535i MSport Space / Black, ZCW, ZDA, ZLP, ZLS, ZPP, H-K and 704
2014 328i Sport Wagon, Glacier / Black, ZSL, ZD2, ZD3, ZDH, ZLP, ZPP, ZTP, and H-K

Prior BMW's
2011 535ix MSport
2011 X5 35D
2008 ///M3 Vert
2008 X5 3.0
2007 X5 3.0
2006 X5 3.0
2006 550iA SP
2003 540iA M-Technic
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  #15  
Old 05-06-2011, 04:25 PM
apw2607 apw2607 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quackbury View Post
Okay, I am totally completely confused.

I think it is established that the 2009 and earler models used a CCC system with the data stored on one DVD. The system/software and the DVD were both supplied by Navteq. From 2010 the X5 uses a CIC system with the data stored on the hard drive. The system / software and the data are both supplied by Tele Atlas. There are conflicting posts in this thread as to whether the Tele Atlas data comes on 2 or 3 DVD's. In a 2010 or newer, the data must be downloaded from the DVD to the hard drive.

The OP stated he purchased a 2-DVD set (presumably manufactured by Tele Atlas) for use on his CCC (Navteq) system.

I interpret the various posts in this thread as saying that the CCC system will only work with the CCC data (on a single DVD), not with the multi-DVD CIC data. (This sounds a little at odds with the OP's statement that the CIC disks will get him as far as the Mississippi, but not across it.)

If my interpretation is correct (and I am still not sure of that), had the OP bought his CIC data disks from the dealer, he should be able to get a refund because the parts guy made a mistake. OTOH if he bought them fro eBay, he is SOL because the mistake was the buyer's, not the seller's.

Is that accurate, or am I still confused?
There no such thing as a CCC navteq system. Map data providers are just that. Providing map data to the Nav system. Youre comments regarding loading data in the CIC are although accurate don't really help out the OP since his car is CCC based.
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  #16  
Old 05-06-2011, 06:59 PM
ard ard is online now
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Originally Posted by apw2607 View Post
There no such thing as a CCC navteq system. .

First, settle down.

Second, I am pretty sure the original data discs for the CCC systems had navteq maps data.

Or are you somehome splitting hairs that someone called the system a "navteq" system and this is technically wrong?
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  #17  
Old 05-06-2011, 07:52 PM
ChuckGr ChuckGr is offline
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Is there a place on the BMW website or elsewhere on the internet where you see what what versions of CIC are available? Also where can we get the part number of the DVD for those versions? My 2010 X5 35d shows version 1.4.6 Road Map North America Premium 2009-2.
Chuck
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  #18  
Old 05-06-2011, 07:54 PM
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quackbury quackbury is offline
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No worries, ard. Some folks just can't articulate no matter how hard they try. I was trying to understand what seemed like contradictory posts, but I've now gotten to the point where I simply don't GAS any more.

I had assumed (maybe incorrectly) that there were three components to the system: Hardware (drive unit, physical interface to screen and iDrive, etc.), data (on the DVD's and updatable by purchasing a new DVD), and software (algorythms that read the data and figure out the fastest / shortest / most efficient route to get you where you want to be). I had assumed (again maybe incorrectly) that the 2009 and earlier cars had different software than the 2010 and later. How else could you explain all the "crazy Ivan's" the newer systems generate? My guess was that BMW was sourcing the system software from the same vendor who was supplying the data DVD's, so that the early cars had Navteq software and the current cars have Tele Atlas. Seemed logical at the time. But I've lost interest in learning the answer.

This is a lot like the post on the "other" forum. OP shows up, makes 2 posts and disappears. No sense wasting any more of our time on the subject.
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Current BMW's:
2014 535i MSport Space / Black, ZCW, ZDA, ZLP, ZLS, ZPP, H-K and 704
2014 328i Sport Wagon, Glacier / Black, ZSL, ZD2, ZD3, ZDH, ZLP, ZPP, ZTP, and H-K

Prior BMW's
2011 535ix MSport
2011 X5 35D
2008 ///M3 Vert
2008 X5 3.0
2007 X5 3.0
2006 X5 3.0
2006 550iA SP
2003 540iA M-Technic

Last edited by quackbury; 05-06-2011 at 08:10 PM.
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  #19  
Old 05-09-2011, 03:53 PM
MapleFarm MapleFarm is offline
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Thank you all for your comments.

Returning the DVDs to the dealer is not an issue. They will refund my purchase price, if I so desire.

I do understand that the system in my 2008 X5 is the CCC version. My initial annoyance was that the service staff at the dealership indicated, on more than one occasion, that I should be able to insert the eastern disk and enter an address for the somewhere in the western U.S. and get guidance. Having built computers and worked with DVD drives I wasn't surprised that when I tried to do what the dealership personnel said would work, it would not work. When the dealership picked up the SAV and replaced the DVD drive under warranty to try to make the 2 disk map system work like the 1 disk map system had worked, I began to wonder and doubt myself about how the DVD based system worked. Thus my initial post. Evidently, the system worked correctly with the 2-disk set with the original DVD drive and continued to work correctly with the replaced DVD drive.

I also am quite disturbed that when the dealership submitted the PUMA case that they didn't immediately get a response that the system was operating normally with the 2-disk set. Are BMW engineers so dense as to not know how a DVD drive operates?

Truely, I'm floored that more customers haven't complained about the way the 2010 and 2011 2-disk map sets function in 2006-2009 cars. I've talked to the service manager at a second dealership and he was also clueless about the way the 2-disk set functioned. My dealership is a larger dealership (sold ca. 450 new BMWs in 2010) and they were "brain dead" concerning the way the 2-disk set of maps worked in 2006-2009 cars. What gives????

BTW, I do own a 2009 map disk.
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  #20  
Old 05-09-2011, 05:27 PM
ard ard is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MapleFarm View Post

I also am quite disturbed that when the dealership submitted the PUMA case that they didn't immediately get a response that the system was operating normally with the 2-disk set. Are BMW engineers so dense as to not know how a DVD drive operates?

Truely, I'm floored that more customers haven't complained about the way the 2010 and 2011 2-disk map sets function in 2006-2009 cars. I've talked to the service manager at a second dealership and he was also clueless about the way the 2-disk set functioned. My dealership is a larger dealership (sold ca. 450 new BMWs in 2010) and they were "brain dead" concerning the way the 2-disk set of maps worked in 2006-2009 cars. What gives????
I know...it's one thing to have bad engineering or poor user interfaces, or weird and glitchy operating characteristics...but for a company to not know THEIR OWN PRODUCTS is inexcusable.

But herein lies the painful truth: BWMs total blind eye on these 'electronic systems' issues is precisely WHY they have crappy electronic systems: it isn't a corporate priority!

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  #21  
Old 05-09-2011, 06:16 PM
rick chi-town-2 rick chi-town-2 is offline
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My head hurts. Is it cocktail hour yet?
yes
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  #22  
Old 07-15-2012, 08:24 PM
Stillwater Stillwater is offline
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I'm fedup with the quality of the NAV system and maps at my X5 2008, always have my good old Garmin GPS in the car to be used when I really want to get faster and safer from one place to another.

Does anyone know of a new/updated single DVD map?
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