335d vs 328

Originally Posted by OILPowered

I agree: sounds like a turbo issue. The delay you describe is not how the car was intended to run.

Here is one post I found that deals with the first turbo malfunctioning and a possible solution:

http://www.bimmerforums.co.uk/forum/...-fixed-t95801/

PL

Based on the testing I did today, I would say that the small turbo not working is the issue. 2500 rpm and it goes. So it is turbo lag, but of a non-normal aka broken nature. Shouldn't be too hard to get the dealer to fix it.

Thank you Pierre!

Originally Posted by ChasR

Based on the testing I did today, I would say that the small turbo not working is the issue. 2500 rpm and it goes. So it is turbo lag, but of a non-normal aka broken nature. Shouldn't be too hard to get the dealer to fix it.

Thank you Pierre!

Let us know how it goes. Good luck.

PL

Originally Posted by ChasR

Based on the testing I did today, I would say that the small turbo not working is the issue. 2500 rpm and it goes. So it is turbo lag, but of a non-normal aka broken nature. Shouldn't be too hard to get the dealer to fix it....

I found another thread for a similar problem: https://www.bmwland.co.uk/forums/vie...a5483&start=20

the following was the cause:

"the solenoid controls the actuators on the turbos and therefore the system of boost control...the originals are a known weak point hence they have been superseded by a new part from BMW!......it was the solenoid valves just to clear it up if anyone else has the issue!"


His car is a 2006 335d and they were also looking for vacuum line leaks but didn't find them.

PL

Your transmission may be trained to be in the economy shift mode from you babying the throttle all the time. Drive around aggressively in Regular for a few days really romping on the accelerator to try and remap the transmission, or leave it in DS, because i'm a diesle enthusiast I'm always babying the throttle for mileage, and am always impressed when i punch it. Diesels should be driven real hard several times/week to prevent carbon build up in turbos etc. just an idea.....

Haven't read all the posts but here's my $.02. #1 Is gearing. IMO the 328 is geared much lower than the diesel. As a result it can sometimes feel quicker in city traffic. #3 Weight. The 328 is a tad lighter which will contribute to the feeling that it's more responsive. #3 Steering in 328 is electric IIRC.

Personal experience is that the 328 is geared too low. Infact it sucks gas like virgin on prom night.I drove one while my diesel was having the recall work done and I couldn't believe how much gas I burned through.

Originally Posted by floydarogers

You do know that, unless it's in sport mode, it starts in 2nd gear? That's the main reason for the lag; I believe that some tip-in is also included in the throttle logic so that you're not continually barking the tires.

Do you know where I could read up on this in BMW literature? I do not doubt it is the case because I know a lot of German vehicles do this. I do find it strange though when accelerating from a dead stop to 65 mph cruising speeds I count 5 shifts all around 2200-2300 rpms and all noticeable both on the tach and feel of the car. Just a little surprised I'd be feeling the torque converter engaging so high in the rpms and well past the traffic light at that.

I've had my 335d for 7 months and noticed the sluggish pedal response immediately. I did not do anyhting until I got past the break in period. At this point I reset the pedal and it was better for a while.

I've since installed a Sprint Booster, best thing since sliced bread, for greatly improved throttle response. I had the D reflashed, dealers option, as I had a bad lighting board replaced and mileage dropped to 30 ish. I installed a Burger Chip and MPG returned to 36 on the highway. The Burger unit is easy to remove and replace. Check out European Car Mag for a good write up on 335d mods.

I got it back from the dealer today and as I expected, no problem found. I planned on chipping the car and installing a quaife, but if it won't leave the line decently, I may trade it for another car. I should have my g-meter back today or tomorrow and will collect some empirical data to see if it supports my seat of the pants feeling that the d is the slowest car to 20 mph (without torquing the tranny) that I've owned.

Originally Posted by ChasR

I got it back from the dealer today and as I expected, no problem found. I planned on chipping the car and installing a quaife, but if it won't leave the line decently, I may trade it for another car. I should have my g-meter back today or tomorrow and will collect some empirical data to see if it supports my seat of the pants feeling that the d is the slowest car to 20 mph (without torquing the tranny) that I've owned.

Don't care what the dealer says, this isn't typical. My car has no such delay as I'm sure most here don't either. It's unfortunate your dealer can't properly diagnose your car.

Originally Posted by OILPowered

Don't care what the dealer says, this isn't typical. My car has no such delay as I'm sure most here don't either. It's unfortunate your dealer can't properly diagnose your car.

I agree. My car is a beast. When I take it on the track, in stock form, it brings out its racing nature. Its anything but slow.

PL

Without torquing the transmission the 0-10 time is 0.65 secs, 0-20 in 1.25 secs. My 1996 Suburban (7.4 L) does 0-10 in0 .4. Saturn Ion in 0.57 Secs. So, to 10, the d is the slowest vehicle I've tested to 10 mph, due to the pause between pressing the pedal and anything happening. Torquing the transmission is a completely different matter though. The d recorded 0-10 in a best of .27 seconds, the fastest of all the vehicles I've tested, which include a 350z, E28 M5, 330ci. At 82 degrees F, with the AC on, torquing it up, 0-60 came in 6.15 sec, the quarter in 14.62 @ 94.2. Without torquing and the AC off, the times were 0-60 in 6.43, quarter in 14.82 @ 95.2 mph (the AC slows even a torque monster).

In the end, my seat of the pant's full second turns out to be more like 4 tenths of a second when tested. I'll live with that and proceed with a remap and the quaife. Perhaps the remap will change the throttle response.

What does "torquing the transmission" mean? Are you putting it in neutral and timing an automatic while it sets up and you gun the throttle? Do you have it in manual mode under the DS program?

PL

Originally Posted by Pierre Louis

What does "torquing the transmission" mean? Are you putting it in neutral and timing an automatic while it sets up and you gun the throttle? Do you have it in manual mode under the DS program?

Torqueing means putting on the brakes, revving the engine while holding the car still, then releasing the brakes to launch.

Originally Posted by floydarogers

Torqueing means putting on the brakes, revving the engine while holding the car still, then releasing the brakes to launch.

Yeah, basically causing the engine to load up some and therefore build up some boost.

As far as the comment of the remap, I recall the car I rode in with the JDB(?) being even more instant in throttle response than my car. That though was 1-2 years ago and my memory is not all that great.

Interesting. I've noticed that my 335d has a higher "idle speed" than my old E320 CDI seemed to have, so it may be torquing itself a little. It does want to "go off the line" a bit more than other cars when at a stop light, but not by much. My old CDI wasn't very fast "off the line" but built up steam very well. I would say it was very fast from 5-60 mph.

The 335d is likely faster than an M3 of similar specs in certain circumstances, but not in 0-20 mph (the spec for the more powerful 335d is curiously omitted, but the Acceleration 80 - 120 km/h in 4th/5th gear for the 330d is compared):

Acceleration 80 - 120 km/h in 4th/5th gear (in s): 4.8/6.1 for a 330d
Acceleration 80 - 120 km/h in 4th/5th gear (in s) 4.9/6.0 [4.2/5.2] for an M3
[Values in brackets are referring to the BMW M3 Coupé with M DCT Drivelogic]

If you look closely at these European specs, which list the 330d and M3 as very similar in mid-range acceleration, you might understand the appeal of the 335d with "normal driving" or "how the rest of us drive." If you are mostly driving the "stop light grand prix" then maybe the 335d is not the car for you.

See:

http://www.bmw.com/com/en/newvehicle...ical_data.html for the latest 330d, 335d etc.
http://www.bmw.com/com/en/newvehicle...ical_data.html for the latest M3 data.

PL

Just a higher idle will not do it, you actually need the load against the motor for the boost to be able to build up.

Made another run with the AC off, DSC off, transmission in DS: 0-60 in 5.95, 1/4 in 14.35 @ 96.3 mph

Originally Posted by ChasR

Made another run with the AC off, DSC off, transmission in DS: 0-60 in 5.95, 1/4 in 14.35 @ 96.3 mph

I would try different launch techniques. Car & Driver tested 0-60 in 5.7s and 1/4 in 14.2s. Some people are getting 14s flat in stock cars.

Originally Posted by ChasR

Made another run with the AC off, DSC off, transmission in DS: 0-60 in 5.95, 1/4 in 14.35 @ 96.3 mph

That's about right. Motor Trend got 0-60 in 5.8 seconds and the 1/4 mile in 14.2 seconds at 98.1 mph.

See http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...t/viewall.html

Others have gotten even better, but BMW quotes 0-60 at 6.0 seconds on this car.

PL

Actually I got a great launch, with 0-10 in .27 seconds. It had a full tank of gas and a 225 lb driver. Temp was 73 degrees. In the article on the Evolve website they had one car do 0-60 in 5.7 and another in 5.6, but the temp was 43 degrees.