Uh-Oh...First 3 Series versus ATS Comparison Test

Originally Posted by dtc100

It is precisely voices from such forums that prompted BMW to make several changes of E90 design mid term. Don't read them if you are annoyed.

LOL. You're delusional.

Email BMW yourself. Stop polluting the F30 forum with anti-F30 threads. We don't want to see it or hear it any more. You don't care about the ATS. You have an agenda and an awful thread-spamming strategy that annoys legitimate F30 owners.

Stop it now.

BJ

Originally Posted by boltjaM3s

"...so the voice of many long-time 3 Series drivers can be heard by BMW..."

And that, my friends, is the agenda. The Cult Of E90 think that BMW is watching Bimmerfest, scouring threads for feedback. And they think that this forum filled with F30 owners is the place to sh-t all over our cars because....shh....big brother is watching and he's going to use the shrink-ray and restore the 3 Series back to E36 proportions.

dtc: Your agenda is pointless. All it is doing is aggravating otherwise-happy F30 owners. Stop. Stop now. You think you're quest is noble. It isn't. It's just annoying.

BJ

He doesn't know what his agenda is. He flops back and forth between whatever the FOTM is when compared with the 3 series. Buying a 2011 328i just before the superior model comes out will make you bitter. I am pretty sure he is just unhappy with his own car and comes here to make himself feel better.

Lmao. Dude bought a 2011 e90 and now he is bitter. Funny troll

Originally Posted by boltjaM3s

I'm active in a single thread whose subject matter specifically asks about opinions of the F30 by E90 owners and those familiar with both cars. For the most part, it's a bunch of my old friends and I having some fun as well as sharing our thoughts on both vehicles.

That's a lot different than multiple threads on the F30 board by people who don't own F30's, have no intention of owning F30's, and want to see the F30 fail. That's not cool.

BJ

I don't think anybody wants the F30 to fail. This is a F30 vs ATS thread and it seems like GM did a better job with the ATS when it comes to driving dynamics than BMW did with the F30. I don't understand why you are taking this so personal. I consider myself a potential F30 buyer. I also happen to like the ATS and upcoming GTI. At the end I will buy the BETTER car, I could care less if it has the roundel on its hood or not.

Originally Posted by justinnum1

Lmao. Dude bought a 2011 e90 and now he is bitter. Funny troll

Nothing wrong with the E90. If I was in the market for a new car I would consider it over the F30. It costs much less and provides better driving dynamics. Not everyone is going to pay 50K for the 328i when they can get a E90 or G37 for much, much less.

Originally Posted by LegendsNeverDie

Nothing wrong with the E90. If I was in the market for a new car I would consider it over the F30. It costs much less and provides better driving dynamics. Not everyone is going to pay 50K for the 328i when they can get a E90 or G37 for much, much less.

Not sure what you are talking about.

My car had a $43k sticker and I got it for $38k.

The F30 comes with far more standard equipment than the E90. F30 now has dual power seats with memory, fold down rear seats, dual automatic climate control-STANDARD at $36k. Equip an E90 in '11-12 and show me a price difference of more than $500-1000. I dare ya

I am by no means an F30 or even a BMW fanboy, but I do enjoy FACTS.

Originally Posted by Jamesonsviggen

Not sure what you are talking about.

My car had a $43k sticker and I got it for $38k.

The F30 comes with far more standard equipment than the E90. F30 now has dual power seats with memory, fold down rear seats, dual automatic climate control-STANDARD at $36k. Equip an E90 in '11-12 and show me a price difference of more than $500-1000. I dare ya

I am by no means an F30 or even a BMW fanboy, but I do enjoy FACTS.

He probably means the E90 is cheaper cause they're all used now.

The F30 328i is undoubtedly a lot more car for the money than an E90 328i. Unfortunately it lags in sound and steering feel, which are the two most favorite things I like about my BMW. 335i solves one of those, but at $53k it's serious money these days - I thought my ZHP was pricey at $45k.

Originally Posted by Chris90

He probably means the E90 is cheaper cause they're all used now.

The F30 328i is undoubtedly a lot more car for the money than an E90 328i. Unfortunately it lags in sound and steering feel, which are the two most favorite things I like about my BMW. 335i solves one of those, but at $53k it's serious money these days - I thought my ZHP was pricey at $45k.

We will let him chime in, but the way he worded it-made it sound like we were talking NEW cars.

The sound of the N20 is the biggest let down for me.

But I am going to be taking care of that with a free exhaust from Roque Engineering(my car is the development vehicle being used) and perhaps an intake as well. Around 8-10whp from the exhaust will be nice too. I am still waiting to see dynos that prove if intakes on the N20 do anything other than noise.

Originally Posted by LegendsNeverDie

I don't think anybody wants the F30 to fail. This is a F30 vs ATS thread and it seems like GM did a better job with the ATS when it comes to driving dynamics than BMW did with the F30. I don't understand why you are taking this so personal. I consider myself a potential F30 buyer. I also happen to like the ATS and upcoming GTI. At the end I will buy the BETTER car, I could care less if it has the roundel on its hood or not.

The operative words here - seems like, which does not necessarily have one whit to do with reality. And right now "seems like" is the only thing you have to go on.

Read the compro in the November 2012 issue of Road & Track. Two things surprised me.

1. The 328i won this on points by a much larger margin than I expected. The video reviews by C&D and MT indicated that it was much closer.

2. They were able to coax 5.4sec out of the 328i on 0-60. That's the fastest 0-60 reported time yet that I've seen.

Originally Posted by jlukja

Read the compro in the November 2012 issue of Road & Track. Two things surprised me.

1. The 328i won this on points by a much larger margin than I expected. The video reviews by C&D and MT indicated that it was much closer.

2. They were able to coax 5.4sec out of the 328i on 0-60. That's the fastest 0-60 reported time yet that I've seen.

None of this matters.

We've had 100 "the 3 Series killer is coming and it's a Cadillac!" threads in the past three months, about 20,000 responses and here's what we found out:

No BMW owner is interested in jumping to Cadillac. In fact, only 1 lonely person says he is going to take a test drive, and it's just to kill time so he can run up his post count.

Let this die. The ATS already has.

BJ

Originally Posted by boltjaM3s

None of this matters.

We've had 100 "the 3 Series killer is coming and it's a Cadillac!" threads in the past three months, about 20,000 responses and here's what we found out:

No BMW owner is interested in jumping to Cadillac. In fact, only 1 lonely person says he is going to take a test drive, and it's just to kill time so he can run up his post count.

Let this die. The ATS already has.


BJ

If and when the opportunity presents itself I will definitely test drive an ATS. I test drove a CTS-V on both road and track and was very impressed. GM's magnetic shock technology is amazing.


CA

Originally Posted by boltjaM3s

None of this matters.

We've had 100 "the 3 Series killer is coming and it's a Cadillac!" threads in the past three months, about 20,000 responses and here's what we found out:

No BMW owner is interested in jumping to Cadillac. In fact, only 1 lonely person says he is going to take a test drive, and it's just to kill time so he can run up his post count.

Let this die. The ATS already has.

BJ

Whether this repeated statement is a joke, or serious, it is getting old. A very good percentage of the new ATS drivers now are either present or past BMW drivers, if you read those ATS forums. I at one time agreed that ATS would take a big bite out of the CTS sales, from the initial posts however, most CTS drivers actually do not like the smaller size of the ATS, while German car drivers prefer the nimble ATS size over the CTS.

Originally Posted by dtc100

Whether this repeated statement is a joke, or serious, it is getting old. A very good percentage of the new ATS drivers now are either present or past BMW drivers, if you read those ATS forums. I at one time agreed that ATS would take a big bite out of the CTS sales, from the initial posts however, most CTS drivers actually do not like the smaller size of the ATS, while German car drivers prefer the nimble ATS size over the CTS.

Well and a good percentage people believe the Fed and government can solve our economic problems. That doesn't make them right correct?

I am with the notion, go test drive the ATS, and if you like it better than the F30 buy/lease it. Personally I wouldn't be caught dead with a GM product.

Let me tell you why that is and this is the last post I am going to say on this topic. When the Buick Enclave came out I had a chance to drive it and loved it. However we had the 4.8i X5 and dare I say with the issues I had with that SUV I seriously was thinking the next SUV will be the Enclave. My enthusiasm carried over to where I recommended it to 3 different friends, two buying it. This was during the 2009, middle of the recession and both these guys, wanted to go with a GM product to "help out".

Long story short both have had nothing but issues, one of the SUV spending almost a month for a complete electrical system rebuild. That is not the worse part. The worse is I drove one to SC and gave my friend the X5 as it has 7 seats and I need the capacity. That thing with about 17,000 miles on it had a weird noise coming out of the dash, the transmission was not smooth at all, acceleration, was lacking, and the interior showed a lot more ware and tear than any car at 17k miles has a right to. In other words it was nothing like when it was new when I test drove it. yes I did have issues with the 4.8i X5 but when I turned the SUV in at the end of the lease, it was as solid as the day I got it new. nevermind the fact that one of my friends wanted to switch out, being tired of the issues and he was shocked at how far down their value is.

One thing about German and Japaneses cars. They don't look like rags 5 years down the road. Maybe that is why they lose so little of their value compared to most American cars.

Now I am not saying that the ATS will be like this, but I can bet you anything 5 years down the road an F30 335i or 328i will hold its value much better than any ATS model.

I don't ever use politics as an analogy, it shows the worst of people, there is a reason why political references are often prohibited in all other discussions Nor will I ever call others wrong for their car choices.

This has nothing to do with your personal taste or feeling, I am simply pointing out a fact. It would seem a stretch to call those former Bimmer drivers wrong or clueless for choosing the ATS. Maybe some of you intentionally try to sound like a *********, or show your arrogance, to get more people to reinforce their stereotype of the Bimmer drivers and stay away, so that you can gain some exclusivity driving the F30 around.

Who knows, maybe it's working.

When it comes to reliability issues, a lot of those left BMW due to reliability experiences too. It is fair to say if you want a fun car in this segment, lease it or trade it in before the warranty expires.

Speaking of Buick, Verano has enjoyed some surprising successes since it's introduction, and is likely taking some serious bite out of all the entry level luxury market shares.

Originally Posted by dtc100

This has nothing to do with your personal taste or feeling, I am simply pointing out a fact. It would seem a stretch to call those former Bimmer drivers wrong or clueless for choosing the ATS. Maybe some of you intentionally try to sound like a *********, or show your arrogance, to get more people to reinforce their stereotype of the Bimmer drivers and stay away, so that you can gain some exclusivity driving the F30 around.

What I want to know is: When are you jumping off the BMW brand and picking up your brand new Cadillac?

What's the date? October 29? November 10?

BJ

not soon enough

Originally Posted by boltjaM3s

What I want to know is: When are you jumping off the BMW brand and picking up your brand new Cadillac?

What's the date? October 29? November 10?

BJ

Due to my recent business expansion, I might have to get a pickup truck to replace my 328i soon, does this answer help?

Originally Posted by dtc100

Due to my recent business expansion, I might have to get a pickup truck to replace my 328i soon, does this answer help?

So soon you will be a non-BMW driver, praising a Cadillac, all while driving a truck?

Originally Posted by dtc100

Due to my recent business expansion, I might have to get a pickup truck to replace my 328i soon, does this answer help?

Awesome!

So now you can stop your agenda of trying to get BMWs attention to make a smaller 3 Series? Now you can go troll the Ford and Chevy forums about what they should be doing with their trucks to make them more nimble, smaller, and firmer?

I hear the new Cadillac Dumpster DeVille is the Ford F-150 killer. Get on it.

BJ

Originally Posted by boltjaM3s

Awesome!

So now you can stop your agenda of trying to get BMWs attention to make a smaller 3 Series? Now you can go troll the Ford and Chevy forums about what they should be doing with their trucks to make them more nimble, smaller, and firmer?

I hear the new Cadillac Dumpster DeVille is the Ford F-150 killer. Get on it.

BJ

Originally Posted by samualcc

So soon you will be a non-BMW driver, praising a Cadillac, all while driving a truck?

Or if I can find a reliable helper who has a truck, I can keep driving a sport sedan, then the F30 and ATS will continue to be on my very short list.

Originally Posted by boltjaM3s

Awesome!

So now you can stop your agenda of trying to get BMWs attention to make a smaller 3 Series? Now you can go troll the Ford and Chevy forums about what they should be doing with their trucks to make them more nimble, smaller, and firmer?

I hear the new Cadillac Dumpster DeVille is the Ford F-150 killer. Get on it.

BJ

Indeed trucks have gone too far raising the height of the bed, making them very difficult to work with, that is if they are used for their intended purposes. These days too many people buy trucks as luxury cruisers, rarely use the bed, so trucks are becoming less job friendly. Not all that different when a sport sedan must cater to those who seek comfort and luxury, not much else.

Originally Posted by boltjaM3s

what they should be doing with their trucks to make them more nimble, smaller, and firmer?

Toyota Tacoma S-Runner FTW.

Originally Posted by elistan

Toyota Tacoma S-Runner FTW.

Unfortunately must be able to lay 4 ft plywood down flat