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E90/E91/E92/E93 (2006 - 2013)
The E9X is the 4th evolution of the BMW 3 series including a highly tuned twin turbo 335i variant pushing out 300hp and 300 ft. lbs. of torque. BMW continues to show that it sets the bar for true driving performance! -- View the E9X Wiki

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  #326  
Old 10-06-2012, 09:06 AM
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  #327  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
There's no question that BMW softened the F30 for those of us (raises hand) that are more interested in a comfortable ride than a harsh one. I loved many things about my E90 M-Sport, but the pothole explosions were not one of them, made my kids nauesous just to ride in it.

So what you used to view as the "base" suspension on a 3 Series is now on what is called the Sport line. Had you driven that, you'd have been impressed that a car that's larger is that nimble on its feet, the quick acceleration you noticed plus the traditional firmer ride. For another $900 you can add the Adaptive M Suspension which is the best of both worlds. Push a button, it adjusts for the soft Comfort ride of the base that you drove, push it again and it adjusts to the firm Sport ride of the Sport line that you would have liked.

What used to be a 3 Series given- a taut, connected ride- is now something you have to ask for. It's still there, but if you test drive the wrong version you're going to be disappointed.

BJ

I did not have an F30 for long - only 3 or 4 days. So, I am not as good a judge as you. Still, in my limited impression, it felt like the F30 was fairly nimble. For me, it handled as well, just with a somewhat nice ride. In other words, it is more of the classic ride/handling balance of the earlier gen BMWs.

But, again, I did not drive it very long or very hard (I don't know why but that sentence reads like a cheap innuendo to me).
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  #328  
Old 10-06-2012, 05:46 PM
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What's sad is that there are rumors floating around that the next generation M3 will have electric steering. So glad I grabbed an e92.
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  #329  
Old 10-06-2012, 06:35 PM
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The E90 handled the reflector requirement in a subtle, cool sort of way. Flows nicely with the car.

The F30 executes it poorly, looks like a stuck-on bandage, very uncool. So it must go.

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  #330  
Old 10-06-2012, 08:11 PM
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The next X5 has a "stuck on" iDrive screen. Looks like it's here to stay y'all.
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  #331  
Old 10-07-2012, 07:05 AM
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The next X5 has a "stuck on" iDrive screen. Looks like it's here to stay y'all.
I don't think so. Once BMW figures out how to reclocate behind-dash components and mold a form fitting dashboard it'll be built-in. Really, for the life of me, I can't figure out why they did it this way. Yes I did read BJ's 'perfect location and presentation' posts.

There's a lot I'm willing to accept in a car if the trade off is worth it, but this wart is totally asynchronous with modern design.

BMW was already lacking in it's interior comparo's with Audi, now it looks clunky next to Mercedes and...everyone else. Watch for a mid-run interior revision.

Last edited by DSXMachina; 10-07-2012 at 07:07 AM.
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  #332  
Old 10-07-2012, 11:24 AM
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Originally Posted by DSXMachina View Post
I don't think so. Once BMW figures out how to reclocate behind-dash components and mold a form fitting dashboard it'll be built-in. Really, for the life of me, I can't figure out why they did it this way. Yes I did read BJ's 'perfect location and presentation' posts.

There's a lot I'm willing to accept in a car if the trade off is worth it, but this wart is totally asynchronous with modern design.

BMW was already lacking in it's interior comparo's with Audi, now it looks clunky next to Mercedes and...everyone else. Watch for a mid-run interior revision.
I think the idea of putting the screen up high so that the driver does not have to look down to see it makes a certain amount of sense but in reality if you are looking at the iDrive screen you are not looking at the road regardless of where the screen is situated.

You can easily demonstrate this to yourself by holding your smart phone in your direct line of site and then looking at an object in the distance.

If you are looking at the screen you are not seeing far enough ahead to be driving safely regardless of where it is placed so it is going to be necessary to view the screen in "short bursts and constantly refocus on the road ahead. I don't think that the fact that the F30 screen is slightly higher than the one in the E90 is going to make much of a difference.

As for the aesthetics, that is a matter of taste. I personally don't think it is horrible but I think it could have been better integrated into the interior design. Would not be a deal breaker for me if I was interested in purchasing an F30.

CA
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Last edited by captainaudio; 10-07-2012 at 11:45 AM.
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  #333  
Old 10-07-2012, 12:02 PM
anE934fun anE934fun is offline
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Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
I think the idea of putting the screen up high so that the driver does not have to look down to see it makes a certain amount of sense but in reality if you are looking at the iDrive screen you are not looking at the road regardless of where the screen is situated.

You can easily demonstrate this to yourself by holding your smart phone in your direct line of site and then looking at an object in the distance.

If you are looking at the screen you are not seeing far enough ahead to be driving safely regardless of where it is placed so it is going to be necessary to view the screen in "short bursts and constantly refocus on the road ahead. I don't think that the fact that the F30 screen is slightly higher than the one in the E90 is going to make much of a difference.

As for the aesthetics, that is a matter of taste. I personally don't think it is horrible but I think it could have been better integrated into the interior design. Would not be a deal breaker for me if I was interested in purchasing an F30.

CA
+1. Your logic applies even with HUDs. The brain concentrates on what its sensors (eyes in this instance) are looking at. Call it tunnel-vision or whatever, but if the brain is concentrating on a displayed image, it won't pick up other images in the surrounding area. In a previous life, I owned a 2003 Corvette that was equipped with the HUD option. The HUD display was the definition of cool, but I found myself being distracted to the HUD instead of looking for CHPs wanting to make their ticket quota.
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  #334  
Old 10-07-2012, 12:36 PM
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I don't think so. Once BMW figures out how to reclocate behind-dash components and mold a form fitting dashboard it'll be built-in.
You mean, like it is done right now in the current X3, X5, X6, 5-, and 7-Series?
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  #335  
Old 10-07-2012, 12:37 PM
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+1. Your logic applies even with HUDs. The brain concentrates on what its sensors (eyes in this instance) are looking at. Call it tunnel-vision or whatever, but if the brain is concentrating on a displayed image, it won't pick up other images in the surrounding area. In a previous life, I owned a 2003 Corvette that was equipped with the HUD option. The HUD display was the definition of cool, but I found myself being distracted to the HUD instead of looking for CHPs wanting to make their ticket quota.
In the Corvette HUD, it's located on the windshield at eye level straight ahead of your seating position. Just glancing at it for speed information while driving on public roads is not going to distract your train of thought or vision on the road for more than a second or two. But, taking your eyes off of the road to look to the right to view GPS or trip information is much more of a distraction, IMO, regardless if it was located above or below the air vents.

Where and how this screen is located on the F30 is a deal breaker for me, even if I were in the market for another car at this point which I am not. I'm very happy with my 335is convertible with the integrated GPS screen.

Last edited by beden1; 10-07-2012 at 12:40 PM.
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  #336  
Old 10-07-2012, 01:11 PM
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In my experience, the higher the OEM Nav screen is on the dash the better -and safer- to look while driving. And much better still is when the Nav is not touchscreen. And best is when the controls are naturally closer to your hand so you do not have to be looking to the dash buttons to be pressed/turned.

The iDrive screen position and controler is the best interface to me right now. The HUD in the F30, F10 and F01 just makes it the best, IMO. I always liked the VW MFD since 2007, where it shows current street and arrow view in the instrument cluster while the OEM Nav screen is showing full map view, always standard with Nav and now in full color. But HUD is better just because it is higher in the dash -again- and right there with the natural eye level view.

No need to lower your view to look at the instrument cluster.

2004 M3 with OEM Nav:


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  #337  
Old 10-07-2012, 01:52 PM
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All recent BMW models have had the Nav mounted high on the dashboar. There is a limit to how high it can be mounted without blocking the view of the road.

I maintain that the difference in the height of the iDrive screen on these models will make very little difference and you will have to take your focus off of the road ahead to see any of them. You can even see that in these pictures. Try focusing on the iDrive screen on any of them and you will have to divert your attention from the view out the windshield.

I agree that having the iDrive conroller on the console is preferable to and safer than a touchscreen.



E9X



F30



5 Series



6 Series



7 Series
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  #338  
Old 10-07-2012, 02:00 PM
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They're actually around the same height eh?
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  #339  
Old 10-07-2012, 02:09 PM
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They're actually around the same height eh?
The F30 iDrive screen is slightly higher, based on the instrument cluster level.
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  #340  
Old 10-07-2012, 02:09 PM
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They're actually around the same height eh?
Yes they are and on all of them you can see that being up high is better than having to focus under the dashboard as was the case on some of the other brands and older BMW models shown a few posts back.

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  #341  
Old 10-07-2012, 02:14 PM
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Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
All recent BMW models have had the Nav mounted high on the dashboar. There is a limit to how high it can be mounted without blocking the view of the road.

I maintain that the difference in the height of the iDrive screen on these models will make very little difference and you will have to take your focus off of the road ahead to see any of them. You can even see that in these pitrures. Try focusing on the iDrive screen on any of them and you will have to divert your attention from the view out the windshield.

I agree that having the iDrive conroller on the console is preferable to and safer than a touchscreen.



E9X







F30
The F30 screen sits up about 1" higher than the E90's and without its shroud there is a lot more visibility on both sides and atop it.

It's like BMW designers took the E90 iDrive's helmet off, chiseled away all that unnecessary plastic, let it breathe a bit. It now resembles an iPad, a half-tablet peeking out of the dash.

BJ
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  #342  
Old 10-07-2012, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by boltjaM3s View Post
The F30 screen sits up about 1" higher than the E90's and without its shroud there is a lot more visibility on both sides and atop it.

It's like BMW designers took the E90 iDrive's helmet off, chiseled away all that unnecessary plastic, let it breathe a bit. It now resembles an iPad, a half-tablet peeking out of the dash.

BJ
The visibility on both sides of it is meaningless because the view to the sides is of the dashboard. Visibility over the top of it is about equal and neither of them block the view of the road ahead. On both designs you are going to have to take your eyes off the road ahead and the slight hight of the screen on the F30 is not going to change that fact.

CA
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Last edited by captainaudio; 10-07-2012 at 02:37 PM.
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  #343  
Old 10-07-2012, 02:49 PM
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The visibility on both sides of it is meaningless because the view to the sides is of the dashboard. Visibility over the top of it is about equal and neither of them block the view of the road ahead. On both designs you are going to have to take your eyes off the road ahead and the slight hight of the screen on the F30 is not going to change that fact.

CA
I disagree. The positioning and the visibility do make a significant difference in the amount of concentration required to view the screen. The new screen positioning allows the driver much improved use of his peripheral vision when looking toward the screen. For use as a navigation screen in cars that do not have the Technology package it is much better than the previous design. It is much easier, more natural, and less distracting to look at.
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  #344  
Old 10-07-2012, 06:24 PM
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My Porsche has the display below the vents. The display has both touch screen and the use of plain view source and function buttons. The best feature is having the digital speed readout straight in front of the driver's view through the steering wheel. In the same area as the digital speed readout (just below), you can display the step-by-step turning directions to your destination which is also verbally spoken by the digital voice assistant.

I sit lower in the Porsche than I do in the BMW, so I'm not sure if the display being lower than the BMW is more of a distraction or not as I have not noticed a problem? I have found the display to be much easier to use because the function buttons are clearly marked and I'm not having to figure out how to get to where I want by playing with the iDrive while driving. Also, if I do happen to not be able to quickly put my eyes on the button I want, then I can touch the screen to get to the function.

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  #345  
Old 10-07-2012, 11:00 PM
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In the Corvette HUD, it's located on the windshield at eye level straight ahead of your seating position. Just glancing at it for speed information while driving on public roads is not going to distract your train of thought or vision on the road for more than a second or two. But, taking your eyes off of the road to look to the right to view GPS or trip information is much more of a distraction, IMO, regardless if it was located above or below the air vents.

Where and how this screen is located on the F30 is a deal breaker for me, even if I were in the market for another car at this point which I am not. I'm very happy with my 335is convertible with the integrated GPS screen.
All it takes is a second or two when you are passing a CHP hiding behind one of those concrete lane dividers or around a blind spot on a curve.... I am speaking from personal experience. Fortunately for me, my attorney was able to get the case dismissed - the CHP didn't get the radar unit calibrated/whatever it is that they have to do to get the speed reading evidence-ready.
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  #346  
Old 10-08-2012, 06:20 AM
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The visibility on both sides of it is meaningless because the view to the sides is of the dashboard. Visibility over the top of it is about equal and neither of them block the view of the road ahead. On both designs you are going to have to take your eyes off the road ahead and the slight hight of the screen on the F30 is not going to change that fact.

CA
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Originally Posted by tturedraider View Post
I disagree. The positioning and the visibility do make a significant difference in the amount of concentration required to view the screen. The new screen positioning allows the driver much improved use of his peripheral vision when looking toward the screen. For use as a navigation screen in cars that do not have the Technology package it is much better than the previous design. It is much easier, more natural, and less distracting to look at.
Raider's right, CA.

And, again, please reference the photos above, the new screen does not have 2" of helmet-head plastic atop it nor does it have anything on the sides burying it in a cave. It's less invasive in your line of sight. Whether or not it's attractive is subjective, but physically it occupies a lot less mass vs. the older design.

BJ
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  #347  
Old 10-08-2012, 06:36 AM
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Having a large, easily visible display mounted in the new F30 is important as it provides something to keep the driver awake and occupied while driving it.

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  #348  
Old 10-08-2012, 07:36 AM
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Having a large, easily visible display mounted in the new F30 is important as it provides something to keep the driver awake and occupied while driving it.
You drive a used status-symbol in the silly boy-racer trim.

This is your forum, and I'm sure you're treated like The King Badass by the high school boys drooling over your ride that's just out of the reach of their Bar Mitzvah savings, but you may want to come to grips with the fact that the F30 is a great car and eventually you'll be driving one.

And before you say "never" go talk to all the E46 owners circa 2006 who said the same nasty crap about the E90 who are happily driving them right now.

BJ
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  #349  
Old 10-08-2012, 07:47 AM
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All it takes is a second or two when you are passing a CHP hiding behind one of those concrete lane dividers or around a blind spot on a curve.... I am speaking from personal experience. Fortunately for me, my attorney was able to get the case dismissed - the CHP didn't get the radar unit calibrated/whatever it is that they have to do to get the speed reading evidence-ready.
I'm not real sure what your personal experience was that you are referring to, but when driving, you do have to have some talent like being able to walk and chew gum at the same time.
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  #350  
Old 10-08-2012, 08:06 AM
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You drive a used status-symbol in the silly boy-racer trim.

This is your forum, and I'm sure you're treated like The King Badass by the high school boys drooling over your ride that's just out of the reach of their Bar Mitzvah savings, but you may want to come to grips with the fact that the F30 is a great car and eventually you'll be driving one.

And before you say "never" go talk to all the E46 owners circa 2006 who said the same nasty crap about the E90 who are happily driving them right now.

BJ
///M-Rated's M3 is the current model and will be for the next couple of years and he actually does take it to the track,

CA
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