Welcome to Bimmerfest -- The #1 Online Community for BMW related information! Please enjoy the discussion forums below and share your experiences with the 200,000 current, new and past BMW owners. The forums are broken out by car model and into other special interest sections such as BMW European Delivery and a special forum to voice your questions to the many BMW dealers on the site to assist our members!

Please follow the links below to help get you started!

Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > BMW Model Discussions > 3 Series / 4 Series > E90/E91/E92/E93 (2006 - 2013)

E90/E91/E92/E93 (2006 - 2013)
The E9X is the 4th evolution of the BMW 3 series including a highly tuned twin turbo 335i variant pushing out 300hp and 300 ft. lbs. of torque. BMW continues to show that it sets the bar for true driving performance! -- View the E9X Wiki

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #51  
Old 10-11-2012, 02:20 PM
laser's Avatar
laser laser is offline
now driving number eight!
Location: Atlanta
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,172
Mein Auto: 2007 S2000
Quote:
Originally Posted by DSXMachina View Post
there is thought of putting a clutch on it so it presents no load when the battery is fully charged
Not sure about the F30 but this is reality on the F10 ...... alternator is disengaged when accelerating or there is a load on the engine!

But new batteries are only $500 - $550 for the F10
__________________
Laser

"sometimes you're the windshield .... sometimes you're the bug"
___________________________

2014 328i Mojave Metallic
2009 328i Black Sapphire Metallic
2007 328i Black Sapphire Metallic
2007 Honda S2000 Berlina Black
(Hey Jim... am I diversified?)
Reply With Quote
  #52  
Old 10-11-2012, 04:01 PM
CALWATERBOY's Avatar
CALWATERBOY CALWATERBOY is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: San Francisco
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 10,007
Mein Auto: 2009 E93 N54
Quote:
Originally Posted by DSXMachina View Post
....load the battery with a good old fashioned scary carbon pile load tester. Those'll pick up a weak battery like nothing else. They also look very impressive as they glow like Chernobyl and smoke like a cold tractor.

Excellent in the colder months, ATD's manual warns that the carbon pile may emit steam if there is condensation between the carbon plates.

That'll but the fear o'God in 'em! Yuppies, don't try this at home.
Reply With Quote
  #53  
Old 10-11-2012, 04:06 PM
CALWATERBOY's Avatar
CALWATERBOY CALWATERBOY is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: San Francisco
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 10,007
Mein Auto: 2009 E93 N54
Quote:
Originally Posted by DSXMachina View Post
You're right, but the NSA feed is too complex and nobody pays any attention to it. What works best is rumors gathered at cocktail parties.

That's what they WANT you to think. Truth: They all come to feed at that particular table.


Reply With Quote
  #54  
Old 10-11-2012, 05:45 PM
Ilovemycar Ilovemycar is offline
wooohooo
Location: CA
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 2,742
Mein Auto: '08 335i coupe 6MT sport
Quote:
Originally Posted by DSXMachina View Post
(or 'break' as it seems to be now on this forum)
One of my favorite driving techniques I read about here is "engine breaking". It's a close second to PnG's technique of using the turn signal on the track. j/k, but I do like that story.

Kat, following the google shopping links, I realize my charger is only 4-step, not 8-step like the other link I had provided that shows off the higher end 7002 model. (If I bought mine all over again, I'd probably get that one "just because", even if I probably don't need what it can do).

Maybe Fun's hypothesis is correct about your battery going south, but I won't be the least bit surprised if your battery is just fine. I think I originally bought it when I suspected a hungry battery after a slightly longer crank one day when starting the car. My car is not a DD, my battery is now just a couple of months shy of 5 years, it took 24 hrs of charging and of these, were +20 hrs of the "fast charging mode" to get it up to 80% capacity? I mean, that's a lot of charging for a battery that has been acting perfectly since. I push the start button and no hesitation ever since.

Also, I almost can't keep track of all the cars it's been used on. I have a friend who had an Explorer that was basically non-operational (3rd car, maybe even briefly a 4th car?) that he finally wanted to sell. He couldn't get it to start at all, and remembered that I had my "special charger". I told him how I would give it at least 24hrs for a fair chance, and to their happy surprise, it revived the battery just fine. That vehicle was sitting there for a quite long time too.

I realize after seeing DSX's shopping link, that our sponsor DD could be pretty competitive once you apply a coupon code. I believe I got mine from DD, now that I think about it, and I was surely timing it with a detailing supply purchase I'm sure.
Reply With Quote
  #55  
Old 10-11-2012, 06:08 PM
DSXMachina's Avatar
DSXMachina DSXMachina is offline
Non compos Mentos
Location: New Hampshire
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 10,695
Mein Auto: 335i E92 TiAg 6MT ED
I know my car is only one example, and I tend to discount anecdotal evidence, but FWIW: Accepted on redelivery Nov 2007, very rarely driven in the Winter, I commute to work and back on the nicest days 2 miles each way, on weekends I might put a hundred miles on the car, occasional track days. In short I am a battery's worst nightmare. The engine has never failed to crank like new and start immediately.
I don't lock the doors in the garage either. So what's going on? Did I get an upper third sigma battery or what?
Reply With Quote
  #56  
Old 10-11-2012, 06:28 PM
Nordic_Kat's Avatar
Nordic_Kat Nordic_Kat is offline
Omnes rationi moderatum
Location: Texas
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 7,371
Mein Auto: Certified Garage Princess
Quote:
Originally Posted by DSXMachina View Post
I know my car is only one example, and I tend to discount anecdotal evidence, but FWIW: Accepted on redelivery Nov 2007, very rarely driven in the Winter, I commute to work and back on the nicest days 2 miles each way, on weekends I might put a hundred miles on the car, occasional track days. In short I am a battery's worst nightmare. The engine has never failed to crank like new and start immediately.
I don't lock the doors in the garage either. So what's going on? Did I get an upper third sigma battery or what?
I think your car just has good Mojo. That, and I'd bet a steak dinner that your car spends at least some of its garage time on a battery tender, especially during those cold winter months where she's in hibernation. Not having unending months where the temperature range is lows of 78 and highs of 104 probably doesn't hurt either. I'll also bet those 100 miles of weekend driving if its done regularly helps.
Reply With Quote
  #57  
Old 10-11-2012, 08:37 PM
pointandgo's Avatar
pointandgo pointandgo is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Los Angeles area
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 4,854
Mein Auto: '13 F10 535i (loaner)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilovemycar View Post
One of my favorite driving techniques I read about here is "engine breaking". It's a close second to PnG's technique of using the turn signal on the track. j/k, but I do like that story.

Kat, following the google shopping links, I realize my charger is only 4-step, not 8-step like the other link I had provided that shows off the higher end 7002 model. (If I bought mine all over again, I'd probably get that one "just because", even if I probably don't need what it can do).

Maybe Fun's hypothesis is correct about your battery going south, but I won't be the least bit surprised if your battery is just fine. I think I originally bought it when I suspected a hungry battery after a slightly longer crank one day when starting the car. My car is not a DD, my battery is now just a couple of months shy of 5 years, it took 24 hrs of charging and of these, were +20 hrs of the "fast charging mode" to get it up to 80% capacity? I mean, that's a lot of charging for a battery that has been acting perfectly since. I push the start button and no hesitation ever since.

Also, I almost can't keep track of all the cars it's been used on. I have a friend who had an Explorer that was basically non-operational (3rd car, maybe even briefly a 4th car?) that he finally wanted to sell. He couldn't get it to start at all, and remembered that I had my "special charger". I told him how I would give it at least 24hrs for a fair chance, and to their happy surprise, it revived the battery just fine. That vehicle was sitting there for a quite long time too.

I realize after seeing DSX's shopping link, that our sponsor DD could be pretty competitive once you apply a coupon code. I believe I got mine from DD, now that I think about it, and I was surely timing it with a detailing supply purchase I'm sure.
Quote:
It's a close second to PnG's technique of using the turn signal on the track.

I somewhat object that you bring this up. An explanation is in order... As Buttonwillow Raceway in CA can be configured in many different ways and the "A" (me) and "D" (novice) driving groups can be on the track at the same time in certain circumstances, it was only MY INTENT and courtesy effort to point the "D" group into the APPROPRIATE turns.

There...you have the truth. Needless to say, my E46 M3 was "victorious" in humiliating the "hamster" "D" group in spite of a few arrogant Porsche drivers who could never pass me.

I was always the "lead" car of course...sans driving instructor. Actually, one Porsche driver left the schools in frustration and in a "huff" as he couldn't drive his car up to its capabilities...even in the novice class. His name sounds familiar in here.
__________________
F30 328i
E90 328i
E92 335i 6MT
E46 M3 6MT
E39 528i 5MT
MBz W140 S320
MBz W124 300E (slammed)
(unmentionables in between)
'71 AMC Javelin (4-Spd Stick on the floor)
'67 Pontiac Firebird 'cabrio' (1st car - "the leaker")
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Member: BMW CCA

Last edited by pointandgo; 10-11-2012 at 08:43 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #58  
Old 10-20-2012, 08:09 PM
Nordic_Kat's Avatar
Nordic_Kat Nordic_Kat is offline
Omnes rationi moderatum
Location: Texas
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 7,371
Mein Auto: Certified Garage Princess
One more question

Sorry to dredge this up from page four, at least it's not four years old.....

So in light of the computer keeping track of starts and stops and how long and hard and fast you drive, if you have to access car electronics, i.e. for me retracting my top, is it better to start the engine and do it via the center console buttons or do it via the metal key in the drivers door (manual) system? I am not going to alter my routine of cleaning and lubricating my top seals on a somewhat weekly basis, but I can't imagine that doing this simple thing is causing a huge drain on my battery. It's counter-intuitive, but it seems like starting the car and using the power generated from the engine upsets the computer more than using a draw off the battery. All in all both scenarios seem to be "negative" imputs to the computer. Which is the more detrimental?
__________________
If your sport doesn't put blood, dirt or grease under your fingernails,
then it's just a game.

Euro Modded|Split Armrest|Rear Foglight Mod|BMW Performance Exhaust|CDV Delete|Shark Fin Antenna Delete|Front Reflector Delete|LUX H8 Angel Eyes|328i|3 Pedals|Das Fahren im Freien| BMWCCA#445793
Reply With Quote
  #59  
Old 10-20-2012, 08:16 PM
anE934fun anE934fun is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: S.F. Bay Area
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 6,807
Mein Auto: 2010 335d
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordic_Kat View Post
Sorry to dredge this up from page four, at least it's not four years old.....

So in light of the computer keeping track of starts and stops and how long and hard and fast you drive, if you have to access car electronics, i.e. for me retracting my top, is it better to start the engine and do it via the center console buttons or do it via the metal key in the drivers door (manual) system? I am not going to alter my routine of cleaning and lubricating my top seals on a somewhat weekly basis, but I can't imagine that doing this simple thing is causing a huge drain on my battery. It's counter-intuitive, but it seems like starting the car and using the power generated from the engine upsets the computer more than using a draw off the battery. All in all both scenarios seem to be "negative" imputs to the computer. Which is the more detrimental?
Sounds like a distinction without a difference. Both actions will drain the battery. If you go with your concept of connecting a trickle-charger over the weekend and during periods of non-use, you shouldn't have to worry about which activity is going to be more or less detrimental.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #60  
Old 11-05-2012, 08:45 AM
Nordic_Kat's Avatar
Nordic_Kat Nordic_Kat is offline
Omnes rationi moderatum
Location: Texas
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 7,371
Mein Auto: Certified Garage Princess
Quote:
Originally Posted by David1 View Post
You will need a battery next month.
Guess where the E93 is this morning!
__________________
If your sport doesn't put blood, dirt or grease under your fingernails,
then it's just a game.

Euro Modded|Split Armrest|Rear Foglight Mod|BMW Performance Exhaust|CDV Delete|Shark Fin Antenna Delete|Front Reflector Delete|LUX H8 Angel Eyes|328i|3 Pedals|Das Fahren im Freien| BMWCCA#445793
Reply With Quote
  #61  
Old 11-05-2012, 04:33 PM
fun2drive's Avatar
fun2drive fun2drive is offline
BMWCCA 149159
Location: Panhandle of Florida
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 2,634
Mein Auto: 335 vert//M3/4/ 13Outback
Kat from what you posted I think there were a few of us that unfortunately felt confident your battery is toast.

Regarding what is better starting the car engine running or letting the battery take the whole load, starting the car and allowing the top to operate is always better because of the huge amp draw the battery receives. The alternator can help catch that draw down up if you let it run a few minutes.

If you can the battery tender is really helpful to prolong life. Mine is approaching 5 years 9 mos and I don't think it would have lasted that long without the tender.

Big question....is the dealer going to cover this or are you?
Reply With Quote
  #62  
Old 11-05-2012, 06:17 PM
Nordic_Kat's Avatar
Nordic_Kat Nordic_Kat is offline
Omnes rationi moderatum
Location: Texas
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 7,371
Mein Auto: Certified Garage Princess
Quote:
Originally Posted by fun2drive View Post
Big question....is the dealer going to cover this or are you?
That's a big question.

Today is 5 weeks exactly from when I first posted about this issue. This morning when I went out to start the car, it sort of started to crank, then it stopped cranking and started clicking and all the dash lights were flashing like strobes, and just as I thought sure it was going to go "all stop" it turned over and started. I drove the 5.5 miles to the dealership and handed over the keys to my SA with a full explanation. As of 3:45 this afternoon, they still could not reproduce the behavior but are keeping the car for further investigation.

While I think it's a red herring, the SA keyed in on my saying that both times this has happened it's been coincident with me washing the car, so they are wanting to check for possible points of water intrusion.

I think it's a weak or faulty cell in the battery, because I've been doing the same type of behavior for 3 years now and it is just suddenly an issue.

I never got a chance to try the good old fashioned "load" test before it choked. I'm getting to the point where every morning when I fire it up, I'm going to have my cell phone capturing a video of the process, so I can catch it the next time it happens and have some solid evidence.
__________________
If your sport doesn't put blood, dirt or grease under your fingernails,
then it's just a game.

Euro Modded|Split Armrest|Rear Foglight Mod|BMW Performance Exhaust|CDV Delete|Shark Fin Antenna Delete|Front Reflector Delete|LUX H8 Angel Eyes|328i|3 Pedals|Das Fahren im Freien| BMWCCA#445793
Reply With Quote
  #63  
Old 11-05-2012, 06:19 PM
Mark K's Avatar
Mark K Mark K is online now
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Cincinnati, OH
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,180
Mein Auto: 2011 E92 335i MT
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordic_Kat View Post
Guess where the E93 is this morning!
If it were digging a trench, I would understand the leeriness to do it. But driving a perfect car that you LOVE driving just for the heck of it? C'mon, give it a 20-30 miles spin for fun once a week!
__________________

_____________________________________________

2011 E92 335i 6MT ZSP ZCW (ED May 17th 2010)

2013 118d BMWNA Special Edition. Black on black cloth (yay!), 5 door hatchback, 140hp diesel. Special edition items: factory debadge| "VW", "Golf" and "TDI" badges factory applied | MT | Standard go flat tires | Spare tire (yay!) | No moonroof (yay!) .
Reply With Quote
  #64  
Old 11-05-2012, 06:31 PM
Nordic_Kat's Avatar
Nordic_Kat Nordic_Kat is offline
Omnes rationi moderatum
Location: Texas
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 7,371
Mein Auto: Certified Garage Princess
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark K View Post
If it were digging a trench, I would understand the leeriness to do it. But driving a perfect car that you LOVE driving just for the heck of it? C'mon, give it a 20-30 miles spin for fun once a week!
Ah, but in the last 5 weeks, that's exactly what I've been doing. In fact, 3 or 4 weekends ago I took it for a 350 mile spin. Trying my best to rectify the "you don't drive it enough" issue, this weekend it was driven up and down the freeway both on Saturday and Sunday, probably putting 50-60 miles on it.
__________________
If your sport doesn't put blood, dirt or grease under your fingernails,
then it's just a game.

Euro Modded|Split Armrest|Rear Foglight Mod|BMW Performance Exhaust|CDV Delete|Shark Fin Antenna Delete|Front Reflector Delete|LUX H8 Angel Eyes|328i|3 Pedals|Das Fahren im Freien| BMWCCA#445793
Reply With Quote
  #65  
Old 11-05-2012, 08:06 PM
sorus sorus is offline
Registered User
Location: KS
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 27
Mein Auto: E93
Kat,

Hopefully the dealer would have the battery replaced under warranty for you. I just want to add another data point regarding the power draw of the retractable top mechanism. The car and the battery are 6-month-old, so presumably in good condition.

Every time I operate the top 3 or 4 cycles in succession without driving the car, it would show an "Increased battery discharge!" warning on the iDrive screen upon start up with the yellow car-on-a-lift service warning in the instrument cluster. So the top is obviously drawing a lot of power from the battery during operation and the battery doesn't like it at all. The car never failed to start or cranked for a long time, and after driving the car for 15 minutes, the warning message no longer returns when the car is started.

I don't have a good solution, but it seems like this is what it boils down to. The top mechanism draws a lot of power. Someone with a Bentley manual should confirm this, but I suspect the battery capacity for E93s is the same as the other E9x models, and it isn't really big enough for operating the top again and again without the car being driven, especially as the battery ages. A trickle charger hooked up while operating the top while detailing might help, but in final analysis E93 owners would have to accept shorter battery life compared to other E9x.

"Unfavourable driving pattern" is bollocks. If BMW can't make a car that has to be driven more than 5 miles a day to stay charged, perhaps we should all stop buying BMWs altogether. If the service advisor insists this is the cause of battery failure and refuses warranty coverage, I would demand documentation issued by BMW NA or BMW AG specifying minimum driving criteria for battery replacement under warranty. I doubt such a document exists (for it would be absurd), but if it does, it would make a comical read.


Sorus
Reply With Quote
  #66  
Old 11-06-2012, 05:46 PM
Nordic_Kat's Avatar
Nordic_Kat Nordic_Kat is offline
Omnes rationi moderatum
Location: Texas
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 7,371
Mein Auto: Certified Garage Princess
Update: (Subtitle more Horse Puckey)

This morning I got the call that once again the car threw a whole bunch of "Unfavorable Driver Behavior" codes.

The SA point blank asked me if the car doors get opened and closed "a lot" between driving the car. "Well, uh - yes, when I'm giving the car its weekly bath, driver's door gets opened about 5-6 times, passenger door 3-4 times, trunk at least once, then there is the two stage top down to dry and lube the seals, then top up. And yes, sometimes the car gets turned on, pulled into the driveway then turned off. Isn't this normal/usual behavior if you own and maintain a car? Shouldn't a battery be able to deal with this?"

"Well, yes", concedes the SA. "That is why we are going to go ahead and replace the battery in your car and do the paperwork to get BMW to "goodwill" it even though they really don't like to do that when the car throws 'UDB' codes." So, the new battery has been installed but the car is spending another night at the dealership on their monitor to see if it has a phantom voltage sucker.

Now I am in earnest going to finalize a decision about which batttery tender to buy.

It's election night. I think I need post a poll......
__________________
If your sport doesn't put blood, dirt or grease under your fingernails,
then it's just a game.

Euro Modded|Split Armrest|Rear Foglight Mod|BMW Performance Exhaust|CDV Delete|Shark Fin Antenna Delete|Front Reflector Delete|LUX H8 Angel Eyes|328i|3 Pedals|Das Fahren im Freien| BMWCCA#445793
Reply With Quote
  #67  
Old 11-07-2012, 06:46 AM
David1's Avatar
David1 David1 is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Great Lakes
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,059
Mein Auto: 07 X3 and 335i
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordic_Kat View Post
Guess where the E93 is this morning!
What's the prize?
__________________
2009 335i Coupe - LBM - Black Dakota/Glacier aluminum - 6spd | Nav | M-Sport | Premium | Logic7 | Heated Seats | CA |BMW Performance Suspension/M3 control arms|
2009 X5 3.0 - AW- Black Dakota/Bamboo | Premium |Tech | Cold Weather | Ipod | Rear Climate |
07 X3 - Sold
07 335 coupe - sold
Reply With Quote
  #68  
Old 11-07-2012, 03:17 PM
Nordic_Kat's Avatar
Nordic_Kat Nordic_Kat is offline
Omnes rationi moderatum
Location: Texas
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 7,371
Mein Auto: Certified Garage Princess
Quote:
Originally Posted by David1 View Post
What's the prize?
A slightly used battery?
__________________
If your sport doesn't put blood, dirt or grease under your fingernails,
then it's just a game.

Euro Modded|Split Armrest|Rear Foglight Mod|BMW Performance Exhaust|CDV Delete|Shark Fin Antenna Delete|Front Reflector Delete|LUX H8 Angel Eyes|328i|3 Pedals|Das Fahren im Freien| BMWCCA#445793
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Forum Navigation
Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > BMW Model Discussions > 3 Series / 4 Series > E90/E91/E92/E93 (2006 - 2013)
Today's Posts Search
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On



Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:24 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
© 2001-2011 performanceIX, Inc. All Rights Reserved .: guidelines .:. privacy .:. terms