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X5 E70 (2007 - 2013)
E70 BMW X5 produced between 2007 and 2013. Discuss the E70 X5 with other BMW owners here.

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  #1  
Old 11-08-2012, 07:11 PM
z51vette z51vette is offline
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2013 X5 5.0 M Performance Package. Runnig Rich 7.8 MPG! + Tranny Issues.

Had my 2013 X5 5.0 for a little over a month now. Car seems to be running rich. There is a pronounced exhaust smell out of the tips and excessive carbon build up. Even on the bumper under the tips is a black residue. The smell can be best described as burnt gunpowder with a hint of sulfur. I'm getting about 7.8 MPG around city. About 11.5 mpg combined. This is by no means driving with a lead foot or aggressive. In regular D with the tranny shifting at about 1500 - 1800 rpm. With the terrible gas lines around NYC this is completely unacceptable. I just filled up, drove 42 miles and went through a quarter tank.

Car seems to behave completely different on the highway. During a recent trip of about 150 highway only miles. I got 26.5 MPG doing steady 60.

To add insult to the injury, the car recently started surging on the 3-2 and especially 2-1 downshift. Happens only in regular D. Does not happen in Sport or Manual. When coming to stop, such as a stoplight from about 30, the RPMs surge from 1200 to about 1800 on the 2-1 downshift right before stopping. This produces an engine braking effect and is really bothersome during relaxed driving with the family as the car jerks, halting on the 2-1 downshift. I would expect if this would be happening in DS or Manual. But it only happens in regular D. In Manual, with the car doing down shifting by itself, it is perfectly smooth. This is also absent in DS. There is a pronounced electric "gulf cart" whine as well, that is most noticeable at about 1,800 rpm. Seems like what was described in the 2011's and 12s from the oil pump. The tranny seems to constantly be looking for the right gear when it is between 1 and 3. Driving around town with the rough down shift and the go cart whine, it is truly bothersome.

Took the car to the dealer twice already. The first time for the running rich condition. The dealer hooked it up to the computer and didn't find any codes. Although they did note there was excessive carbon build up on the tips and the exhaust smell. They couldn't do anything because the car is not throwing any faults.

The second time I took it to a different dealer, Park Ave BMW in NJ, for the running rich condition as well as the tranny downshift and gear hunting issues. The dealer's service tech took a test drive with me, noted the surge and stated it was unusual. They did the same thing. Hooked up to the computer and didn't find any codes or faults. I requested they reset the transmission adaptations. They stated they will not do it under warranty because there is nothing wrong with the car and it would take them two hours to do. I would have to pay $400 for the tranny reset. I spoke to the service manager, naturally quite upset at this point. He agreed to reprogram the transmission free of charge for me as a courtesy but stated he would note on the work order, "car performs to factory spec, reprogram per customer request". His reasoning behind this as well as not wanting to do it under warranty is, he didn't want to give me any repair attempts/time that can be used towards a Lemon Claim.

Picked up the car from the dealer, came to the first stop light, car in D, RPMs surge from 1,200 to 2,000 and the car jerks violently. I figure if they reprogrammed the transmission. I would drive really light for a few hundred miles as to program the new relaxed driving values into the tranny in hopes of smoothing it out. After 700 miles the car still surges RPMs at stops and now there is a 2 second delay when you floor it, looking for brisk acceleration. Almost got rear ended the other day trying to switch lanes while accelerating out of a situation that happened in front of me.

Called BMW customer relations, trying to get a regional rep to inspect the car.
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  #2  
Old 11-08-2012, 08:54 PM
NoI4plz NoI4plz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by z51vette View Post
Had my 2013 X5 5.0 for a little over a month now. Car seems to be running rich. There is a pronounced exhaust smell out of the tips and excessive carbon build up. Even on the bumper under the tips is a black residue. The smell can be best described as burnt gunpowder with a hint of sulfur. I'm getting about 7.8 MPG around city. About 11.5 mpg combined. This is by no means driving with a lead foot or aggressive. In regular D with the tranny shifting at about 1500 - 1800 rpm. With the terrible gas lines around NYC this is completely unacceptable. I just filled up, drove 42 miles and went through a quarter tank.

Car seems to behave completely different on the highway. During a recent trip of about 150 highway only miles. I got 26.5 MPG doing steady 60.

To add insult to the injury, the car recently started surging on the 3-2 and especially 2-1 downshift. Happens only in regular D. Does not happen in Sport or Manual. When coming to stop, such as a stoplight from about 30, the RPMs surge from 1200 to about 1800 on the 2-1 downshift right before stopping. This produces an engine braking effect and is really bothersome during relaxed driving with the family as the car jerks, halting on the 2-1 downshift. I would expect if this would be happening in DS or Manual. But it only happens in regular D. In Manual, with the car doing down shifting by itself, it is perfectly smooth. This is also absent in DS. There is a pronounced electric "gulf cart" whine as well, that is most noticeable at about 1,800 rpm. Seems like what was described in the 2011's and 12s from the oil pump. The tranny seems to constantly be looking for the right gear when it is between 1 and 3. Driving around town with the rough down shift and the go cart whine, it is truly bothersome.

Took the car to the dealer twice already. The first time for the running rich condition. The dealer hooked it up to the computer and didn't find any codes. Although they did note there was excessive carbon build up on the tips and the exhaust smell. They couldn't do anything because the car is not throwing any faults.

The second time I took it to a different dealer, Park Ave BMW in NJ, for the running rich condition as well as the tranny downshift and gear hunting issues. The dealer's service tech took a test drive with me, noted the surge and stated it was unusual. They did the same thing. Hooked up to the computer and didn't find any codes or faults. I requested they reset the transmission adaptations. They stated they will not do it under warranty because there is nothing wrong with the car and it would take them two hours to do. I would have to pay $400 for the tranny reset. I spoke to the service manager, naturally quite upset at this point.

He agreed to reprogram the transmission free of charge for me as a courtesy but stated he would note on the work order, "car performs to factory spec, reprogram per customer request". His reasoning behind this as well as not wanting to do it under warranty is, he didn't want to give me any repair attempts/time that can be used towards a Lemon Claim.


Picked up the car from the dealer, came to the first stop light, car in D, RPMs surge from 1,200 to 2,000 and the car jerks violently. I figure if they reprogrammed the transmission. I would drive really light for a few hundred miles as to program the new relaxed driving values into the tranny in hopes of smoothing it out. After 700 miles the car still surges RPMs at stops and now there is a 2 second delay when you floor it, looking for brisk acceleration. Almost got rear ended the other day trying to switch lanes while accelerating out of a situation that happened in front of me.

Called BMW customer relations, trying to get a regional rep to inspect the car.

WOW. JUST WOW. Not gonna lie, if someone said, that I`m gonna do something that may not fix your issue, but in return you have to hand over control of a LEGAL right, I would run as far away as possible. NO service rep, has the legal right to be like, well you know something, you may have a problem, and since we cant pull the codes like dummy, were gonna not fix the situation, and say its normal.

My thing, is there a ton of other dealership in the your area. Find the best out of the bunch, and go there and this time, see what they say. If its truly running rich, or has a hesitation problem, they need to acknowledge, and find a solution (may that be software update or hardware update).

Honestly you made a considerable investment in the BMW brand, they better stand by their product.

Hoping things work out.
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  #3  
Old 11-08-2012, 09:51 PM
ard ard is online now
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How could you let them say "that is unusual" but then lie on the work order and say 'it is fine"??????

Just becuase they dont find codes does NOT mean 'the car is fine'....there are just no codes.

Furthermore, they can look at AFRs, O2 values, long and short term fuel trims if they areally want to. But clearly they dont.

Force them to document what the tech said. ON A WORK ORDER. Keep bringing it back. They will circle the wagons, maybe even already... but until you get SOMETHING on the record, BMWNA will jsut say 'work with the dealer'

Sorry.....

A
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  #4  
Old 11-09-2012, 01:46 AM
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ChrisF01 ChrisF01 is offline
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Dumb question,

But will disconnecting the battery for an extended length of time reset it?

Thats really unfortunate

Good Luck
Chris
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  #5  
Old 11-09-2012, 05:27 AM
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gresch gresch is offline
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I'm surprised to hear that Park Ave was so unhelpful, they've been pretty good in my experience over the last 10 years. That being said, either beat them up to get it fixed or go somewhere else. IMO, I would take it back to the selling dealer and be relentless in forcing them to address the problem. Maybe also take a video of the condition to document it in light of the SA's attempt to deny you the documentation on your trip to Park Ave.

Good luck.
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  #6  
Old 11-09-2012, 09:05 AM
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Kzang Kzang is offline
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The excessive carbon build-up on the exhaust tips ( especially on the left - driver side ) is normal..
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  #7  
Old 11-09-2012, 03:44 PM
z51vette z51vette is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kzang View Post
The excessive carbon build-up on the exhaust tips ( especially on the left - driver side ) is normal..
Why would there be more build up on one side than the other. You must be talking about the 6 cylinder. The V8 has a completely symmetrical intake/exhaust layout. From the intakes to the cylinder banks to the headers/turbos, cats, exhaust piping, muffler, tips.

My neighbor has a 2012 5.0 X6. Her tips after 15K are without build up at all. Mileage on the X6 with the same motor is almost twice as good.

Here is what the insides of my tips looked like a few days after delivery. Then, only after a few hundred miles. You can see the welds and the clean metal surrounding weld areas. Now, it's all coated with a black carbon residue.

Note, the white is just flash reflection from the condensation


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  #8  
Old 11-10-2012, 07:55 PM
4Bimmers 4Bimmers is offline
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Go have an emission test done that will tell what is the story. Since BMW America's is in NJ I would get ahold of them and report it ASAP.

Beta or RC is irrelevant as I am sure they have to go through so much testing and qualifying for US emission that they cannot be too rogue. Lexus is so boring to drive so again irrelevant. Just MHO.
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  #9  
Old 11-11-2012, 03:42 AM
Brian425 Brian425 is offline
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The abrupt downshift from 3-2 is somewhat normal. I know that I was not happy with my truck initially. It did get better over time. It is not perfect; but, it is much better.

I know you are in Brooklyn also. If you want, I can demonstrate in my truck. (2012 X5 50i)
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  #10  
Old 11-12-2012, 10:07 AM
BR328 BR328 is offline
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Shot in the dark - do you fill up at the same gas station all the time when you get the poor mpg local driving? If so, try another one. Bad gas can deliver poor gas mileage.
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  #11  
Old 11-12-2012, 06:09 PM
z51vette z51vette is offline
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Filled up at numerous as well as out of area stations.
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  #12  
Old 11-12-2012, 06:10 PM
z51vette z51vette is offline
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Originally Posted by Brian425 View Post
The abrupt downshift from 3-2 is somewhat normal. I know that I was not happy with my truck initially. It did get better over time. It is not perfect; but, it is much better.

I know you are in Brooklyn also. If you want, I can demonstrate in my truck. (2012 X5 50i)

Brian that would be great. Let me get a few things out of the way after the storm and we can meet. I will pm you.

Thanks!
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  #13  
Old 11-13-2012, 05:24 AM
Brian425 Brian425 is offline
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Originally Posted by z51vette View Post
Brian that would be great. Let me get a few things out of the way after the storm and we can meet. I will pm you.

Thanks!
No problem. Everyone around us was impacted by the storm.

I had the down shift issue, it does seem to get better over time. I believe the computer for the tranny learns as it goes. My truck has 9k miles on it now and is MUCH better.
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  #14  
Old 11-16-2012, 02:33 PM
z51vette z51vette is offline
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Progressively getting worse. Down to 6.4MPG city. The exhaust smell is really pronounced now. I can even smell it for a while after the car is off. This is by no means aggressive driving. Trying to baby the car.

The tranny is not getting any better at all. It freaked out on me twice yesterday. During a 1-2 up shift, it hesitated for a while then suddenly got into gear followed by a mechanical clunk and sharp jolt.

Meanwhile BMW customer relations called me yesterday after two weeks of investigations telling me they are not going to do anything about it as they have been in touch with the dealer and the dealer declined regional rep involvement or inspection. I asked Customer Relations to send the regional rep to inspect the vehicle, and they are telling me they will only do it if the dealer is asking for assistance.

Tried to find an inspection shop today that still has stand alone emission analyzer instead of the plug into the OBD II port, the local ones are flooded and equipment destroyed by the hurricane.

Getting about 160 miles on a tank of gas combined Hwy/City. This is crazy. Started looking at MB again. If there is no resolution, going to trade it in. Gas bill last month was $650.

This is a shame, as the car was absolutely amazing for the first 500 miles.

Last edited by z51vette; 11-16-2012 at 02:36 PM.
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  #15  
Old 11-16-2012, 03:55 PM
ard ard is online now
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You don't want just an emissions test... You want to look at AFRs, etc.

GL

A
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  #16  
Old 11-16-2012, 06:30 PM
Brian425 Brian425 is offline
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Personally, I would give the dealer another shot. I would make sure that they ACCURATELY document everything that you experience and everything that they tell you. If the tech says "Wow, 6.5 MPG is really low." The work order should state that the tech noted that vehicle is getting very poor MPG. Do not let them leave anything important off. This is for your benefit. If they refuse to update the order, ask for a manager.

We have chatted a bit, I like not far away. I only get about 11.5 MPG. For me this is mainly street driving and includes 1-2 trips per week stuck in traffic on the BQE on the way to the city. If you want, we can meet on Sunday. I will let you drive my truck. It will give you another vehicle to compare to side by side. (I impose a strict you break it you buy it rule.)
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  #17  
Old 11-16-2012, 06:37 PM
Brian425 Brian425 is offline
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The reason I suggest sticking with the dealer is to document all the issues and to keep the clock ticking on the lemon laws. The NY State laws appear pretty generous, they allow for a full refund of the purchase price up to 12,000 miles. The link to the NY Attorney General's website.

http://www.ag.ny.gov/consumer-frauds...law-fact-sheet
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  #18  
Old 11-19-2012, 01:53 PM
z51vette z51vette is offline
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Filled up a couple of days ago. 58 Miles almost down to half a tank

Washed the car, it was spotless. This is the exhaust residue on the bumper after only about 30 miles. BMW can't tell me this is normal for a car with 2K miles.






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  #19  
Old 12-20-2012, 03:58 AM
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5seriesHB 5seriesHB is offline
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Yikes
What r u going to do Vette
Sorry to hear about this
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  #20  
Old 02-18-2013, 04:56 PM
a51fff a51fff is offline
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hi there, i am new to this forum,
did you manage to get your x5 sorted?
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  #21  
Old 02-18-2013, 07:21 PM
TahoeM3 TahoeM3 is offline
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I'm also curious what happened with your X5, because I'm having a similar problem except without the gas mileage problem or the gear shift surging. I got a check engine light and I've had rough idle, heavy soot buildup on the driver side exhaust (new), strong gas smell, and it takes longer to start. I've been told that the injectors are bad and they are in the process of replacing them now.
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  #22  
Old 02-18-2013, 07:35 PM
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Exclamation

Quote:
Originally Posted by TahoeM3 View Post
I'm also curious what happened with your X5, because I'm having a similar problem except without the gas mileage problem or the gear shift surging. I got a check engine light and I've had rough idle, heavy soot buildup on the driver side exhaust (new), strong gas smell, and it takes longer to start. I've been told that the injectors are bad and they are in the process of replacing them now.
How many miles do u have..Do u think it has anything to do w the dinan
So many issues with the f10 and dinan!
Bad injectors etc!

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=633260

Good luck!
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Last edited by 5seriesHB; 02-18-2013 at 07:36 PM.
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  #23  
Old 02-19-2013, 03:17 AM
a51fff a51fff is offline
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hi there,
yes i had exactly same problem, hesitant to start at random times etc and then i started getting alot of carbon build up on exhaust tips, mind you still get it now but not as bad, and in the end it was bad injectors. but it took 4 mayb 5 trips for them to sort the problem and they kept it for 3 weeks.
been fine since in regards to that problem, but it starting to stall. it cuts out when you reverse and put it into drive as u change direction.
im glad you are getting them injectors sorted. with some luck you wont have any other problems.
good luck.
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  #24  
Old 02-19-2013, 06:20 AM
Alpine300ZHP Alpine300ZHP is offline
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Wow. Sorry you guys are having problems with your 5.0 motors. Hope you get them sorted out. The gas mileage is horrendous. My x5M gets 11 mpg city easy.
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  #25  
Old 02-19-2013, 06:22 AM
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yahtzee yahtzee is offline
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You have already taken a beating with the gas mileage and your time spent on this. DO NOT trade this car in. Fight it and either get it replaced or get your money back. This is an anomaly but it should be handled much differently than it is. Don't back down.
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