540 mods and SC build

Really nice thread. I really enjoyed reading it. So many other threads are about guys complaining about their cars or the typical E39 issues. I'm on vacation this week and this thread makes me think I should really take my SC off the shelf and install it.....but it will be going on my Mustang. My E39 is my DD and I want to keep it that way.

Originally Posted by cjay88

My E39 is my DD and I want to keep it that way.

so is mine

Ay my boosted brothers Im thinking of installing Superspint headers. Now im running the stock Vf engineering tune but with these supersprints installed will i need a custom tune for maximum performance out of these headers or would they perform the same with the Vf tune? Allso would they be a problem with the Vf tune ? or can i just bolt them on and im good to go ?

Originally Posted by LalaRay

Ay my boosted brothers Im thinking of installing Superspint headers. Now im running the stock Vf engineering tune but with these supersprints installed will i need a custom tune for maximum performance out of these headers or would they perform the same with the Vf tune? Allso would they be a problem with the Vf tune ? or can i just bolt them on and im good to go ?

I can't speak to E39 - VF exactly but I can speak to the same exact question for a number of forced induction cars, and the answer is usually:
- yes to get the most from them you would need a custom tune or an upgraded off-shelf tune from VF
- yes you prob would get some small gains on the base VF setup, prob not as much big dyno peak number gains as "area under curve" type and mostly noticeable in part throttle and mid-RPM roll-on benefits (this is because most tunes are optimized for WOT & redline but have room to trim and adapt and add fuel in mid-RPM areas)
- no probably would not cause a problem either, just be less gain than if you get the tune upgraded
- don't know about VF but most kit / tune mfrs for any given platform have a pre-configured tune for upgraded exhaust plumbing.. aka "Stage 1 = OEM exhaust, Stage 2 = headers & exhaust"

It's too bad putting headers on these cars is such a hassle... esp given the OEM header leaves something to be desired... I kinda lust for the upgrade but have decided I wouldn't do it myself and I don't lust for the bill that would come with the install...

Some kid i was talking to at a shop one day while he was getting his car tuned (Lexus GS 430 with a supra motor swap) told me tunes are not permanent or something. That he has to get one in summer than in winter cause of the season change (weather and temperature) or something ? Is this true, cause im not looking to get my car tuned Now than in summer it Blows up or something cause i need to have the whole thing retuned..That tuning Sh*t aint cheap ya know ... So basically im asking if i get my car custom tuned is that it, am i done?! Like am i good to go for life now ? All year around ? lol

Originally Posted by LalaRay

Some kid i was talking to at a shop one day while he was getting his car tuned (Lexus GS 430 with a supra motor swap) told me tunes are not permanent or something. That he has to get one in summer than in winter cause of the season change (weather and temperature) or something ? Is this true, cause im not looking to get my car tuned Now than in summer it Blows up or something cause i need to have the whole thing retuned..That tuning Sh*t aint cheap ya know ... So basically im asking if i get my car custom tuned is that it, am i done?! Like am i good to go for life now ? All year around ? lol

Yeah. Sounds like just the kind of thing a ricetard would say.

On an old school motor the issue would be that you could tune hotter for winter air density and temps but would have to be more careful about detonation and exhaust temps in summer when the air is hot and thin.

Anything from 90's on will have IAT (intake air temp) and engine operating temp and MAF (mass air flow) sensor and ambient atmospheric and/or manifold air pressure (MAP) and then compensation constants and tables that ensure the car runs in all conditions as those things go up and down. A good tune and ECU/DME can totally handle all that for you.

Shizzy tuners only know the main fueling / timing tables and don't know the more sophisticated and nuanced stuff which is where you'll hear about guys getting great peak dyno numbers but then when the weather changed or he started driving it on the street the car wouldn't idle right or wouldn't make power or threw CEL's etc.

Only reasons I can think you might "need a seasonal" tune would be:

• If the tuner didn't KNOW how to or didn't bother to tune the temp or barometric compensation properly for either a speed-density or mass-air type system
• Running speed-density but the ECU doesn't HAVE an atmospheric pressure sensor or MAP to tell it if barometric is up/down.
• If the car is running speed-density or alpha-N system pushed to limit so that seasonal barometric changes knock it out of range of trim

Assuming your tune would still be on OEM DME then it will be totally fine. It's a MAF based system with IAT sensor. If the tuner really does crazy stuff and sets you up speed-density with the OEM DME then you might have an issue since it doesn't seem to have an ambient or MAP pressure sensor but that's highly unlikely.

http://www.autoenginuity.com/BMW-All...EngineDME52M62

Oh and BTW even if the ric3rs tune did need seasonal changes, he's chosen poorly if he doesn't have a setup these days where he can reflash the tune back and forth himself a la shark injector / etc. etc. style - SO many tuners now use tools where you can flip yourself back and forth from stock to tune and more and more allow you to buy a second tune so you can have street-tune and track-tune for instance and this would be just the same... shouldn't be a big deal even if you have to do it...

Originally Posted by geargrinder

Yeah. Sounds like just the kind of thing a ricetard would say.

On an old school motor the issue would be that you could tune hotter for winter air density and temps but would have to be more careful about detonation and exhaust temps in summer when the air is hot and thin.

Anything from 90's on will have IAT (intake air temp) and engine operating temp and MAF (mass air flow) sensor and ambient atmospheric and/or manifold air pressure (MAP) and then compensation constants and tables that ensure the car runs in all conditions as those things go up and down. A good tune and ECU/DME can totally handle all that for you.

Shizzy tuners only know the main fueling / timing tables and don't know the more sophisticated and nuanced stuff which is where you'll hear about guys getting great peak dyno numbers but then when the weather changed or he started driving it on the street the car wouldn't idle right or wouldn't make power or threw CEL's etc.

Only reasons I can think you might "need a seasonal" tune would be:

• If the tuner didn't KNOW how to or didn't bother to tune the temp or barometric compensation properly for either a speed-density or mass-air type system
• Running speed-density but the ECU doesn't HAVE an atmospheric pressure sensor or MAP to tell it if barometric is up/down.
• If the car is running speed-density or alpha-N system pushed to limit so that seasonal barometric changes knock it out of range of trim

Assuming your tune would still be on OEM DME then it will be totally fine. It's a MAF based system with IAT sensor. If the tuner really does crazy stuff and sets you up speed-density with the OEM DME then you might have an issue since it doesn't seem to have an ambient or MAP pressure sensor but that's highly unlikely.

http://www.autoenginuity.com/BMW-All...EngineDME52M62

Oh and BTW even if the ric3rs tune did need seasonal changes, he's chosen poorly if he doesn't have a setup these days where he can reflash the tune back and forth himself a la shark injector / etc. etc. style - SO many tuners now use tools where you can flip yourself back and forth from stock to tune and more and more allow you to buy a second tune so you can have street-tune and track-tune for instance and this would be just the same... shouldn't be a big deal even if you have to do it...

ok thanks youve been great help Anyone happen to know how many hours a Headers install for a 540 is ?

Originally Posted by LalaRay

ok thanks youve been great help Anyone happen to know how many hours a Headers install for a 540 is ?

Ask Bricas he's done it himself, his old threads might even say...

Originally Posted by geargrinder

Ask Bricas he's done it himself, his old threads might even say...

Yea i got answers on the M5board. Figure it should be from 5-7 Hours with a shop that knows wtf there doing, so that's not bad. But Where the F*ck is briscas? lol He aint checked in ina awhile..

Originally Posted by LalaRay

Yea i got answers on the M5board. Figure it should be from 5-7 Hours with a shop that knows wtf there doing, so that's not bad. But Where the F*ck is briscas? lol He aint checked in ina awhile..

He might be international traveling... He's local to me but we keep missing the chance to connect since we both travel a lot for work outside country. He was going to australia for long trips IIRC. We even use same mechanic (I saw his 540 being tuned w the new piggy back system few months ago but he wasn't in the shop at the time).

Hey guys from down under! No 540 here unfortunately had to put her in storage. I will be here for a the foreseeable future.

Thanks for the comments the build took forever but she is a dream! I did install the headers and they are a PITA to do took me like 12-15 hours the first time. It is much easier to pull the motor. 5-7 sounds far too optimistic to me. They are an incredible addition though! I can not say about the tune but I am sure it would be fine... I would add an AFR when you do it just to be on the safe side. My tune was fully custom and like said I had a piggy back module to make live tuning possible... We also had sooooo much trouble with the MAF remapping.

A good tune should be able to compensate at any temp!! That is the point of the sensors and fuel injection!

A custom tune would be better than an "off the shelf" tune for sure with or without headers but it should be ok.

Originally Posted by cjay88

Really nice thread. I really enjoyed reading it. So many other threads are about guys complaining about their cars or the typical E39 issues. I'm on vacation this week and this thread makes me think I should really take my SC off the shelf and install it.....but it will be going on my Mustang. My E39 is my DD and I want to keep it that way.

my e39 was my DD as well!

Originally Posted by bricas45

my e39 was my DD as well!

Same here. My e39 was and still is my DD!

Originally Posted by Flug540

Same here. My e39 was and still is my DD!

Alex, how is your car going?

Originally Posted by bricas45

Alex, how is your car going?

Ohh Brian, I looooove my car For the most part it just makes me smile every time I drive it. There are still some issues though that I'm trying to resolve. In parallel working on a little project of mine to replace my AEM gauges with a touch panel controlled by a device that will do several other things aside from controlling the gauges.

How are things down under?

Originally Posted by Flug540

Ohh Brian, I looooove my car For the most part it just makes me smile every time I drive it. There are still some issues though that I'm trying to resolve. In parallel working on a little project of mine to replace my AEM gauges with a touch panel controlled by a device that will do several other things aside from controlling the gauges.

How are things down under?

Sounds like a good project! It was sad to put her into storage. Australia is great so incredibly hot here it hit 45C Friday! So hot they had to come up with a new color for the scale... For temps over 50C!!