Entry level F30 320i heads to the US - Starting at $33,445

No Dynamic Handling Package option with new 320. This is what makes a BMW The Ultimate Driving Machine.

A cheap BMW sedan. Isn't that sad?

Originally Posted by donquixotesque

A cheap BMW sedan. Isn't that sad?

Why the long face? Badge whores nationwide rejoice !!!

Originally Posted by y789

If that's the case then BMW must be out of business already. They sell far more 316, 318 and 320 in europe than 328 or 335. yes, cost is not proportionaly different between different engines but each 3 series regardles of engine will make health profit to BMW, else no point in making something with little margin.

The same model has a much lower price tag in the US than elsewhere in the world. Unless you can offer your own math to dispute my contention, for example if you think BMW will cut cost on the 320i, making it much cheaper to manufacture than the 328i. Otherwise the $4k lower price will hit profit margin, there is no way around this.

Originally Posted by donquixotesque

A cheap BMW sedan. Isn't that sad?

Cost is relative. It's not really cheap. The 320 is more expensive than an Acura TSX and ILX, and both are considered entry level luxury cars.

Plus, the 320 is not new. It's always been available in other countries, and not only that, you can get 318s and 316s in other countries as well.

So I'm not really sure what your point is.

Originally Posted by Bmwlvr60

No Dynamic Handling Package option with new 320. This is what makes a BMW The Ultimate Driving Machine.

this seems like a pretty dumb statement. there is a sport package with the 320i. the car is still RWD. its still more than fast enough to have a fun drive in.

seems like it'd still be a pretty good car to drive. just not as good as higher model BMWs. but i'd still drive a sport pack 320i every day of the week over say a v6 camry or a 2.0 fusion

Originally Posted by hans007

this seems like a pretty dumb statement. there is a sport package with the 320i. the car is still RWD. its still more than fast enough to have a fun drive in.

seems like it'd still be a pretty good car to drive. just not as good as higher model BMWs. but i'd still drive a sport pack 320i every day of the week over say a v6 camry or a 2.0 fusion

I agree. Some people just don't get it.

Originally Posted by hans007

this seems like a pretty dumb statement. there is a sport package with the 320i. the car is still RWD. its still more than fast enough to have a fun drive in.

seems like it'd still be a pretty good car to drive. just not as good as higher model BMWs. but i'd still drive a sport pack 320i every day of the week over say a v6 camry or a 2.0 fusion

The new 320 is plenty fast. My point is that I'm surprised a 3 series isn't being offered with DHP as an option. It still blows away the Japanese competitors with handling I'm sure.

Originally Posted by donquixotesque

A cheap BMW sedan. Isn't that sad?

You are thinking like an American. Cheap BMW's and 4 cylinder models have been in Europe for decades. Not sad.

Originally Posted by Bmwlvr60

The new 320 is plenty fast. My point is that I'm surprised a 3 series isn't being offered with DHP as an option. It still blows away the Japanese competitors with handling I'm sure.

There are a lot of option limits on this car vs the 328.

Originally Posted by Michael Schott

You are thinking like an American. Cheap BMW's and 4 cylinder models have been in Europe for decades. Not sad.

I think you meant it as an insult. But I'll take it as a compliment.

For decades, BMW has been considered a premium car, at least here in the United States. Now with $30K options being introduced, that in my opinion is starting to dilute the brand. You can probably spec out an Accord now for $30.

And I don't like the fact that my $40K 328i now looks pretty much like a $30K 320i. That in my mind reduces it's exclusiveness.

I didn't mind the 1-series so much because it had different body style to distinguish it.

Will have to seriously consider a 4-series when it is time to buy a new car.

I know many will disagree with this, but many more will agree too.

Originally Posted by donquixotesque

And I don't like the fact that my $37K 328i now looks pretty much like a $33K 320i. That in my mind reduces it's exclusiveness.

Fixed that for you.

This has always been the case between the 335 and 328 and I always found the mentality obnoxious. Now it spreads to 328 owners too, how nice!

The DHP obviously is more complex and cost more to add in. Given the nearly $4k price cut, the fact the 320 actually offers a sport package with all the necessary sporty elements and at a lower package price, is a win already. Complain about something else, the lack of DHP is not one of them.

Originally Posted by Michael Schott

You are thinking like an American. Cheap BMW's and 4 cylinder models have been in Europe for decades. Not sad.

I would say it a little differently than that. You're basically right, except the part about thinking like an American. Most people on this forum are Americans., Its only a small # of people on this forum that don't know BMW sells a ton of cheaper models elsewhere.

Plus, the 320 hardly qualifies as being cheap in the first place, so I really don't get WTH he was talking about.

Originally Posted by donquixotesque

For decades, BMW has been considered a premium car, at least here in the United States. Now with $30K options being introduced, that in my opinion is starting to dilute the brand. You can probably spec out an Accord now for $30.

BMW is once again attempting to adopt the Euro business model to the US(eg. E36 318ti), whether it works or not, they will adapt accordingly.

Originally Posted by Jamesonsviggen

Fixed that for you.

This has always been the case between the 335 and 328 and I always found the mentality obnoxious. Now it spreads to 328 owners too, how nice!

I suppose I feel your pain now.

Regarding the price - I don't believe the invoice price for the 320i has been published yet, but it will probably be $30K. And many dealers will sell for invoice.

Originally Posted by Jamesonsviggen

Fixed that for you.

This has always been the case between the 335 and 328 and I always found the mentality obnoxious. Now it spreads to 328 owners too, how nice!

exactly what comes to mind, now think about the 5 series owners how do they look at the 3 series, or the 7 series owners what do they think of 5 series!

to the skeptics, a BMW is a BMW regardless of the engine and price point. Drive a 320i and drive then go drive a Honda and tell me if they compare!

Originally Posted by krash

I would say it a little differently than that. You're basically right, except the part about thinking like an American. Most people on this forum are Americans., Its only a small # of people on this forum that don't know BMW sells a ton of cheaper models elsewhere.

Plus, the 320 hardly qualifies as being cheap in the first place, so I really don't get WTH he was talking about.

If you think ACCORD is cheap. Then so is the 320i. Both can be configured for the same price.

It's good for BMW though to introduce cheaper models. They sell more cars. Get more people hooked on to BMWs too. And those like me who want a "bit" exclusive car will strive for the next model up (4-series) for their next car.

Originally Posted by y789

Drive a 320i and drive then go drive a Honda and tell me if they compare!

I don't want to start a war here but how different do you expect a 320i to drive from a top of the line Accord?

Originally Posted by donquixotesque

I suppose I feel your pain now.

Regarding the price - I don't believe the invoice price for the 320i has been published yet, but it will probably be $30K. And many dealers will sell for invoice.

What does it matter, just compare MSRP's as it lacks variables that muddy up comparisons. Base to base is $37k vs $33k.

Originally Posted by donquixotesque

I don't want to start a war here but how different do you expect a 320i to drive from a top of the line Accord?

Fairly different...the reason


Architecture.

RWD vs FWD changes the whole design and construction of a car.

Look at where the weight is carried on a FWD car while a 3 series allows for a design thats nets 50/50 weight balance.

I have driven great handling FWD cars. But they almost always have to come with the caveat...for FWD.

The Accord(going to drive one on Saturday as a new car for my M-I-L) and I expect for it to be a well made, good driving and solid car. But its inherent design/architecture keeps it from being a proper sports/sporty sedan. This is also often true of FWD cars given an AWD variant, same issues apply.

Originally Posted by donquixotesque

If you think ACCORD is cheap. Then so is the 320i. Both can be configured for the same price.

There is overlap, but I disagree with that line of thinking, because you basically have to load up the Accord with everything and strip the 320 to the bone for that to be true. A nicely equipped 320, which most people will want, is going to be around $40k.

Plus, based on the average household income in America today, I wouldn't consider a loaded Accord to be cheap anyway.

Just because i drive around in $50,000 cars, that doesn't mean a car with a base price of $33k is cheap by most peoples' standards.

Originally Posted by Jamesonsviggen

What does it matter, just compare MSRP's as it lacks variables that muddy up comparisons. Base to base is $37k vs $33k.



Fairly different...the reason


Architecture.

RWD vs FWD changes the whole design and construction of a car.

Look at where the weight is carried on a FWD car while a 3 series allows for a design thats nets 50/50 weight balance.

I have driven great handling FWD cars. But they almost always have to come with the caveat...for FWD.

The Accord(going to drive one on Saturday as a new car for my M-I-L) and I expect for it to be a well made, good driving and solid car. But its inherent design/architecture keeps it from being a proper sports/sporty sedan. This is also often true of FWD cars given an AWD variant, same issues apply.

We are on the BMW forum so obviously a bias is expected. But really, drive that Accord on Saturday and report back. I think you yourself will be surprised.

Just a disclaimer, I haven't driven an Accord in years. But recently I have had an opportunity to drive a couple of new model full sized sedans as rentals, like the Malibu and I have to say I was impressed. Of course they were no BMWs but they didn't cost as much either. I suspect the differences between a high end Accord and entry level 320i are diminishing.

Originally Posted by donquixotesque

I don't want to start a war here but how different do you expect a 320i to drive from a top of the line Accord?

Honda Accord = FWD = Torque steer.



There is no way you can compare that to a RWD BMW. I don't care how much they strip it down. The RWD BMW will always be superior.

Originally Posted by krash

There is overlap, but I disagree with that line of thinking, because you basically have to load up the Accord with everything and strip the 320 to the bone for that to be true. A nicely equipped 320, which most people will want, is going to be around $40k.

I would think that a loaded accord would have everything an entry 320i has for the most part.

And while you might assume that most people will want a nicely equipped 320i, I would assume most people wanting to buying a 320i will keep it modestly equipped.

For every F30 owner on this forum that has a really nicely equipped BMW, there is one who has a modestly version. And then everything in between.

Originally Posted by hans007

this seems like a pretty dumb statement. there is a sport package with the 320i. the car is still RWD. its still more than fast enough to have a fun drive in.

seems like it'd still be a pretty good car to drive. just not as good as higher model BMWs. but i'd still drive a sport pack 320i every day of the week over say a v6 camry or a 2.0 fusion

its the dumbest statement i have ever read. only a fool would say such a stupid thing.