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X5 E70 (2007 - 2013)
E70 BMW X5 produced between 2007 and 2013. Discuss the E70 X5 with other BMW owners here.

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  #51  
Old 01-28-2013, 08:39 AM
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serge1 serge1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crohit View Post
Finally, got the diesel smell inside cabin fixed. Dealer kept the vehicle for 2 full days.
Cause: High Pressure EGR Cooler issue. They also replaced microfilters, cleaned blower motor and air ducts.
They also found issues with coolant system, so drained and cleaned it.
No more smell of diesel in the cabin.
thanks
Dropped my 35d this morning. The foreman was not in, so there was not attempt to reproduce the issue with me on site.

Did they reproduce the smell? Or simply went and just replaced the EGR?

The smell is hard to reproduce, as it occurs in the morning and at any point during the day. Sometimes it feels like there's a cloud of fumes lingering under the hood, and at certain points comes out. Very random.

P.S. Got a gourgeous black saphire MSport 328i coupe as loaner.

Last edited by serge1; 01-28-2013 at 08:42 AM.
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  #52  
Old 01-28-2013, 10:26 AM
crohit crohit is offline
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I live 3 miles away from dealership and had the appointment at 6:30am, so it worked out for me. When i reached there, the cabin already had the smell fresh.
I realize that if you take quick sharp turns, you will get the smell in during the day.
They did see soot under the hood and around the coolant and were also able to smell the diesel in the air ducts, filters etc.
I did not make any suggestions to them about the EGR issue, so I am sure that they did their due diligence before going changing it.
Also, they kept the vehicle for 2 days, so they had the opportunity to test it the next morning.
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  #53  
Old 01-28-2013, 10:33 AM
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serge1 serge1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crohit View Post
I live 3 miles away from dealership and had the appointment at 6:30am, so it worked out for me. When i reached there, the cabin already had the smell fresh.
I realize that if you take quick sharp turns, you will get the smell in during the day.
They did see soot under the hood and around the coolant and were also able to smell the diesel in the air ducts, filters etc.
I did not make any suggestions to them about the EGR issue, so I am sure that they did their due diligence before going changing it.
Also, they kept the vehicle for 2 days, so they had the opportunity to test it the next morning.
Thanks. Hoping for same result. I will suggest they change the filters when they give me a call to update. Don't mind 2 days; the 328i coupe m-sport loaner makes things very, very right.
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  #54  
Old 01-28-2013, 01:55 PM
alexmish alexmish is offline
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Smell in cabin - EGR valve issues (most of the time as per SA) ... and you do get CEL on soon thereafter (perhaps on next engine restart)
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  #55  
Old 01-28-2013, 09:22 PM
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serge1 serge1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alexmish View Post
Smell in cabin - EGR valve issues (most of the time as per SA) ... and you do get CEL on soon thereafter (perhaps on next engine restart)
Never got a CEL, unless this type of CEL is a level that does not show up to driver.
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  #56  
Old 01-29-2013, 08:54 PM
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serge1 serge1 is offline
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UPDATE
Got the vehicle back from deler. They changed the EGR cooler (it's shiny now vs. black old one).
During the 1.5hr drive home in traffic, never smelled the fumes - a good sign. Will check in the morning, which used to be a guaranteed reproduction. Feeling confident this was the fix, also hoping the new EGR stays working for a while.
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  #57  
Old 02-19-2013, 03:36 PM
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quackbury quackbury is offline
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I am the latest victim. 65,000 miles on the X5D. I pulled her into the service bay, walked into the office, and 3 different SA's said "WHOA your car smells." We all subsequently decided it wasn't just the car, but me, as the diesel smell had permeated my clothes. Yuck. My kids go to school with a boy whose father owns a (very successful) septic-tank-pumping business. I smell about as bad as one of his drivers right now.

Driving an X3 loaner and disappointed, as the steering and brake pedal have even less feel than our 535. With its smaller size and lighter weight, I had expected the X3 to be more tossable than our X5, but it definitely is not (even though my X5 is on snows and the X3 is on A/S tires).

I am betting it is the EGR cooler, and will report back when I know more.
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Current BMW's:
2014 535i MSport Space / Black, ZCW, ZDA, ZLP, ZLS, ZPP, H-K and 704
2014 328i Sport Wagon, Glacier / Black, ZSL, ZD2, ZD3, ZDH, ZLP, ZPP, ZTP, and H-K

Prior BMW's
2011 535ix MSport
2011 X5 35D
2008 ///M3 Vert
2008 X5 3.0
2007 X5 3.0
2006 X5 3.0
2006 550iA SP
2003 540iA M-Technic
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  #58  
Old 02-19-2013, 05:15 PM
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serge1 serge1 is offline
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The EGR fix will take away the very obvious diesel smell.
However, I am still ocasionally smelling something when slowing down or taking turns (same situations as with bad EGR).
The smell is not the same as was from EGR. I have opened the engine cover and put my nose next to EGR - no smell at all.
This smell is more "misty". I wonder if it may be coming from that opening on the right side of the engine. Not nearly as bad as was with EGR cooler, but still doesn't feel right.
This is the same smell I was experiencing before EGR got really bad. Perhaps it's something else that eventually got overwhelmed by EGR smell. I will investigate when I have time...
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  #59  
Old 02-19-2013, 05:53 PM
blue dragon blue dragon is offline
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^^ Thats what I can't put a finger on, my problem is not my EGR cooler, mine is the shiny one which was replaced as part of the emissions recall. My smell is not constant either, but it may be when the DEF is injected into the exhuast. I never used to smell anything before, not even during burn off.
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  #60  
Old 02-19-2013, 06:07 PM
JohnMN JohnMN is offline
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I too had an exhaust smell in the cabin on start-up. Check engine light came on as well. Car sounded a little louder, ran a little rougher, and about a 2 mpg drop in mileage (it's pretty cold here, so that could have caused the MPG drop).

Took it in last week. Air mass meter was identified as the problem. Part number 13-62-8-509-725.

Smell is gone, vehicle is quieter, MPGs are back up, and check engine light is off.

Last edited by JohnMN; 02-19-2013 at 06:08 PM.
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  #61  
Old 02-20-2013, 02:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quackbury View Post
I am the latest victim. 65,000 miles on the X5D. I pulled her into the service bay, walked into the office, and 3 different SA's said "WHOA your car smells." We all subsequently decided it wasn't just the car, but me, as the diesel smell had permeated my clothes. Yuck. My kids go to school with a boy whose father owns a (very successful) septic-tank-pumping business. I smell about as bad as one of his drivers right now.

Driving an X3 loaner and disappointed, as the steering and brake pedal have even less feel than our 535. With its smaller size and lighter weight, I had expected the X3 to be more tossable than our X5, but it definitely is not (even though my X5 is on snows and the X3 is on A/S tires).

I am betting it is the EGR cooler, and will report back when I know more.
At least you got 65k before yours went, mine went at 10k, agree with the X3, I was not impressed at all, finger light steering, a lot of highway float. Wow, 65k, I thought I drove a lot !
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  #62  
Old 02-20-2013, 07:04 AM
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quackbury quackbury is offline
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UPDATE: My SA called. Definitely the EGR cooler. Part is $1,200, plus labor, so likely a +/- $2,000 job when all is said and done. Fortunately covered under the Federal emissions warranty. Anyone remember how long that warranty lasts (I am thinking 10 years but not sure if there is a mileage limit). I would RTFM (actually RTFWI with WI = warranty information) but that is in the X5's door pocket at the dealership.I was thinking of buy my X5 at lease end, but may need to factor the cost of an out-of-warranty EGR replacement into the equation.
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Current BMW's:
2014 535i MSport Space / Black, ZCW, ZDA, ZLP, ZLS, ZPP, H-K and 704
2014 328i Sport Wagon, Glacier / Black, ZSL, ZD2, ZD3, ZDH, ZLP, ZPP, ZTP, and H-K

Prior BMW's
2011 535ix MSport
2011 X5 35D
2008 ///M3 Vert
2008 X5 3.0
2007 X5 3.0
2006 X5 3.0
2006 550iA SP
2003 540iA M-Technic
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  #63  
Old 02-20-2013, 07:30 AM
jashearer jashearer is offline
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"The following components and/or systems are/is
covered under the Federal EmissionWarranty for
a period of 8 years or 80,000 miles, whichever
occurs first.
CATALYTIC CONVERTER
ENGINE CONTROL MODULE (INCLUDING
ONBOARD DIAGNOSTIC SYSTEM)
For assistance in determining coverage of the
specific components of the Onboard diagnostic
system, please contact your authorized BMW
SAV center."


Out of the Service Warranty Booklet for X5/X6. The California section is much more specific as to what falls under their 7/70k program, but not sure where you are located.

In my mind, anything directly related to diesel emissions standards (since they are EPA mandated) should fall under the 8/80k bucket but the way the booklet is written leaves a lot to be desired in the confidence inspiring arena.

Jay
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  #64  
Old 02-20-2013, 07:40 AM
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quackbury quackbury is offline
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Thanks Jay. Glad mine failed before 80,000 miles, but unless the cooler has been redesigned and is now failproof, that definitely gives me pause about buying the X5 at lease end.
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Current BMW's:
2014 535i MSport Space / Black, ZCW, ZDA, ZLP, ZLS, ZPP, H-K and 704
2014 328i Sport Wagon, Glacier / Black, ZSL, ZD2, ZD3, ZDH, ZLP, ZPP, ZTP, and H-K

Prior BMW's
2011 535ix MSport
2011 X5 35D
2008 ///M3 Vert
2008 X5 3.0
2007 X5 3.0
2006 X5 3.0
2006 550iA SP
2003 540iA M-Technic
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  #65  
Old 02-20-2013, 08:17 AM
smyles smyles is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quackbury View Post
UPDATE: My SA called. Definitely the EGR cooler. Part is $1,200, plus labor, so likely a +/- $2,000 job when all is said and done...
The list price is ~$700, so it's either smthg else, several parts included, or your dealer has one hell of a mark up.

Also, it's only covered by the CA emissions warranty that is applicable in few other states; if yours is not one of them, and you got it covered specifically by the Federal one, I'd like to hear the details, as I need to have one replaced myself.

Last edited by smyles; 02-20-2013 at 08:20 AM.
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  #66  
Old 02-20-2013, 08:33 AM
jashearer jashearer is offline
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Originally Posted by smyles View Post
Also, it's only covered by the CA emissions warranty that is applicable in few other states; if yours is not one of them, and you got it covered specifically by the Federal one, I'd like to hear the details, as I need to have one replaced myself.
How hard did you push BMWNA, do you have a listing of which components are covered under the 8/80 federal and which ones are excluded? Would love to see this...

Jay
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  #67  
Old 02-20-2013, 08:53 AM
smyles smyles is offline
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It's in owner's manual.
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  #68  
Old 02-20-2013, 09:05 AM
jashearer jashearer is offline
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Are you referring to this list?

The following systems are covered by the
Federal Emission PerformanceWarranty for a
period of 2 years or 24,000 miles, whichever
occurs first. The specific systems may vary
according to model, therefore, all of the systems
listed may not be used on your vehicle. For
assistance in determining which systems and
specific components within these systems apply
to your vehicle, please contact your authorized
BMW SAV center.
AIR INDUCTION SYSTEM
FUEL METERING SYSTEM
IGNITION SYSTEM
POSITIVE CRANKCASE VENTILATION
SYSTEM (PCV)
FUEL EVAPORATIVE CONTROL SYSTEM
EXHAUST SYSTEM
ENGINE EMISSION CONTROL SYSTEM
SENSORS/DEVICES
ONBOARD DIAGNOSTIC SYSTEM (OBD)
RELATED PARTS ASSOCIATED WITH THE
ABOVE SYSTEMS


None of that includes the wording "EGR Cooler" so I'm curious to find out where BMWNA classifies that. The California (and Arizona, California, Connecticut, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Jersey, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, Vermont or Washington) section is much more detailed and lists the EGR cooler as a 7/70k part but I have never seen a matrix like the California one for us lowly states.

That's what I would like to see, my question was asking you if you had pressured BMWNA for a similar matrix related to Federal Emissions warranty. They have to have it right, in order to be systematic about approving/overriding warranty work requests.

Jay
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  #69  
Old 02-20-2013, 09:22 AM
smyles smyles is offline
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The federal 2/24k warranty is irrelevant, since we have 4/50K factory warranty. The CA 7/70k, like you've said, does list (and covers) EGR cooler. The 8/80K Federal covers only cats and ECU. If Quack got the cooler covered by 8/80 Fed, he got lucky... and I'd like to use it as a precedent.
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  #70  
Old 02-20-2013, 09:38 AM
jashearer jashearer is offline
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This is where I think your logic is flawed. The US market is primarily a gasoline market, which is what all this documentation and wording was originally meant to reflect. To meet federal emissions requirements a gasoline engine needs a catalytic converter and a computerized testing system to tell you if that converter is doing its job. To meet specific state testing requirements they may need more hence the California documentation.

To meet federal emissions requirements a diesel engine needs EGR/DPF/SCR as well as a testing system to tell you if they are doing thier jobs. To me that means all of those components should be covered under the 8/80k and I would be willing to fight BMWNA very hard on that logic. So unless they could show me a document which specificl excludes that I would expect them to cover it. I am either underestimating the fight you put forth or you gave up to easy.

On a second note if they showed me that document I would then start researching diesel specific forums and see what other manufacturers do and try to feel out environmental lawyers, etc. I feel that strongly about my logic.

Jay
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  #71  
Old 02-20-2013, 09:53 AM
smyles smyles is offline
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It's not my flawed logic; it's the EPA requirements to meet certain standards (2/24) and cover certain components (8/80). Unless I appeal to EPA to extend the emission standards (to 8/80 or any other period/mileage), BMW is in full compliance as is.
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  #72  
Old 02-20-2013, 10:40 AM
jashearer jashearer is offline
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Would you mind sharing exactly how far you got before you stopped fighting. Did your SA say it wasn't covered so you stopped? Did BMWNA 1st tier customer service say it wasn't covered so you stopped? Did the EPA say it wasn't covered so you stopped?

Will help me and others when chosing to buy and extended warranty or not I think.

Jay
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  #73  
Old 02-20-2013, 11:39 AM
smyles smyles is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jashearer View Post
Would you mind sharing exactly how far you got before you stopped fighting. Did your SA say it wasn't covered so you stopped? Did BMWNA 1st tier customer service say it wasn't covered so you stopped? Did the EPA say it wasn't covered so you stopped?

Will help me and others when chosing to buy and extended warranty or not I think.

Jay
I'm awaiting a call back from BMWNA customer advocate (?)... it's been few weeks already, so not holding my breath.

Re costs, it's a ~$550 part online and not very hard to replace, I'm just waiting for warm weather to DIY it, and since it involves coolant it makes sense to throw pump & thermostat replacement into the mix.
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  #74  
Old 02-21-2013, 01:58 PM
smyles smyles is offline
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In a meantime I've filed a safety complaint with US DOT NHTSA and advise others to do the same.
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  #75  
Old 02-23-2013, 01:22 PM
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quackbury quackbury is offline
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FWIW my Repair Order states "covered under 7 YR / 70,000 emissions". Based on re-reading the thread above, I am assuming that it's the CARB warranty, not the Federal. For once, living in Taxachusetts may have paid benefits.
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Current BMW's:
2014 535i MSport Space / Black, ZCW, ZDA, ZLP, ZLS, ZPP, H-K and 704
2014 328i Sport Wagon, Glacier / Black, ZSL, ZD2, ZD3, ZDH, ZLP, ZPP, ZTP, and H-K

Prior BMW's
2011 535ix MSport
2011 X5 35D
2008 ///M3 Vert
2008 X5 3.0
2007 X5 3.0
2006 X5 3.0
2006 550iA SP
2003 540iA M-Technic
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