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  #26  
Old 01-28-2013, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by boramkiv View Post
Okay, so here's the question of the year:
How many ATS's will you see with the "roadster roofs"?

I've seen CTS-V's with the roof and white wall tires so its possible.
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  #27  
Old 01-28-2013, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by boramkiv View Post
Okay, so here's the question of the year:
How many ATS's will you see with the "roadster roofs"?

I've seen CTS-V's with the roof and white wall tires so its possible.
It will happen, though it will be very few.

People do tacky crap to BMWs too...like fake M badges and M stripes and all kinds of lame stuff.

Which is worse? At least the fake convertibles are not implying performance that the car is not equipped with.
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  #28  
Old 01-28-2013, 12:26 PM
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The CTS has stolen some 3-series sales over the years - that's why its in it's second generation. The ATS will most likely do the same.

The idea that it meaningfully handles different on public roadways from a 3-series is bunk. It's barely different in instrumented testing, accounting for differences in tires.
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  #29  
Old 01-28-2013, 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by LegendsNeverDie View Post
Unfortunately the F30 is softer than the ATS and the ATS is a little bit more "sport" oriented than the F30. I just configured a nice 2.0T Performance online and came out to be around 42K the way I wanted it. It's going to be tough choosing the F30 over the ATS.
Honestly, when you buy a BMW, you know what you want. BMW's are known to be refined with a sportier 'feel' to them. Unlike it's competitors which have recently just joined the 'sporty' ball game.
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  #30  
Old 01-28-2013, 12:34 PM
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F30 Owners should stop chat chatting with ATS owners

This forum is being contaminated with GM germs
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  #31  
Old 01-28-2013, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Jamesonsviggen View Post
It will happen, though it will be very few.

People do tacky crap to BMWs too...like fake M badges and M stripes and all kinds of lame stuff.

Which is worse? At least the fake convertibles are not implying performance that the car is not equipped with.
Quote:
Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
Yes, but look at that picture. You think that 7 owner is young and has no idea they're destroying a great car. Yet the Caddy owner wants to plush every single thing because the ride is too harsh on their bones.
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  #32  
Old 01-28-2013, 12:38 PM
LegendsNeverDie LegendsNeverDie is offline
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Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=- View Post
Honestly, when you buy a BMW, you know what you want. BMW's are known to be refined with a sportier 'feel' to them. Unlike it's competitors which have recently just joined the 'sporty' ball game.
Hmm this is true, however I had a blast driving a B5 A4 Quattro, it felt as "sporty" as my E90. I really like the F30 328i M Sport but I think the ATS chassis is better and the LSD is the icing on the cake. IMO BMW has a better drivetrain and the ATS has a better chassis. I also prefer the exterior of the ATS but I prefer the interior of the F30.
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  #33  
Old 01-28-2013, 12:39 PM
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justinnum1 justinnum1 is offline
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Exterior of the ATS can't touch the msport f30.
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  #34  
Old 01-28-2013, 12:41 PM
LegendsNeverDie LegendsNeverDie is offline
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Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
Exterior of the ATS can't touch the msport f30.
I disagree. The M Sport looks really good but I think the ATS is just more proportional and aggressive looking while being elegant at the same time. I like it more.
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  #35  
Old 01-28-2013, 12:42 PM
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I disagree. The M Sport looks really good but I think the ATS is just more proportional and aggressive looking while being elegant at the same time. I like it more.
Understood, tho i think you are in the minority with that opinion.
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  #36  
Old 01-28-2013, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by trinipirate View Post
Seeing 2 ATS in one day has to be very rare.
Likely CTSs mistaken for ATSs. From the initial surveys so far, it appears the average age of the ATS drivers is a few years younger than that of the 3 series drivers.

Last edited by dtc100; 01-28-2013 at 12:57 PM.
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  #37  
Old 01-28-2013, 12:58 PM
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Originally Posted by boramkiv View Post
Yes, but look at that picture. You think that 7 owner is young and has no idea they're destroying a great car. Yet the Caddy owner wants to plush every single thing because the ride is too harsh on their bones.
I tend to doubt that the owner of that car uses it to go to and from the Senior Center.

CA
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  #38  
Old 01-28-2013, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=- View Post
Honestly, when you buy a BMW, you know what you want. BMW's are known to be refined with a sportier 'feel' to them. Unlike it's competitors which have recently just joined the 'sporty' ball game.
As they say in the music business:

"You're only as good as your last hit"

CA
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Last edited by captainaudio; 01-28-2013 at 01:01 PM.
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  #39  
Old 01-28-2013, 01:07 PM
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boramkiv boramkiv is offline
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Originally Posted by dtc100 View Post
Likely CTSs mistaken for ATSs. From the initial surveys so far, it appears the average age of the ATS drivers is a few years younger than that of the 3 series drivers.
I can believe this. It can't be a fair comparison however. BMW changed their style to attract the mature buyers with the 3, and its working.
Caddy changed their style with the A, and it's not working so well. So even though the average age of A is lower than that of 3, the success lies with the 3 so far because they're selling more.
Again, I have YET to see an ATS around here. Haven't been out of town in a while, but haven't seen one yet. And I will definitely know when I see one.

Last edited by boramkiv; 01-28-2013 at 01:14 PM.
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  #40  
Old 01-28-2013, 01:37 PM
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Originally Posted by boramkiv View Post
I can believe this. It can't be a fair comparison however. BMW changed their style to attract the mature buyers with the 3, and its working.
Caddy changed their style with the A, and it's not working so well. So even though the average age of A is lower than that of 3, the success lies with the 3 so far because they're selling more.
Again, I have YET to see an ATS around here. Haven't been out of town in a while, but haven't seen one yet. And I will definitely know when I see one.
Give the ATS some time. The 3 series moniker has been around for far longer then Caddie's ATS moniker. A couple years down the line, we'll see it have a very big following, if not bigger(on the internet anyway) if BMW keeps up with the current trend of softening up their cars. It's losing it's core base that helped it get to where it is today - Purists.
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  #41  
Old 01-28-2013, 01:53 PM
Spagolli94 Spagolli94 is offline
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Originally Posted by krash View Post
I sat in an ATS at the Philly Car show today. Didn't drive it obviously.

I really don't like the instrumentation at all, and the overall quality of materials isn't as nice as what we get in the F30.

Plus, it didn't feel as comfortable in terms of head room. It felt really cramped to me. It could have been how the seat was adjusted, but I'm not really sure...

Driving experience is one thing, but instrumentation and quality of materials is a huge factor when choosing a car, and I think the ATS really falls short. CUE is terrible!
Agree. Just checked it out at the Philly show as well. While I liked their interior in pics, when seen in person, it still has that "GM-ish" feel to it. GM's interior designs have come a long way. Now they just need their materials to catch up. Not there yet.
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  #42  
Old 01-28-2013, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=- View Post
Give the ATS some time. The 3 series moniker has been around for far longer then Caddie's ATS moniker. A couple years down the line, we'll see it have a very big following, if not bigger(on the internet anyway) if BMW keeps up with the current trend of softening up their cars. It's losing it's core base that helped it get to where it is today - Purists.
I don't think that GM, in their wildest dreams, expected the ATS to outsell or sell even come close to selling as well as the 3 Series in the first few years of production. If the ATS is well received it will gradually gain market share.

A lot of the threads about brands that compete with BMW have a lot of preconceptions. You will see "A Mustang can't go around corners in spite of the fact that on the track they are very competitive with, and sometimes faster than an M3.

Many people choose a car brand because the way other people perceive them (or more accurately the way THEY perceive that other people perceive them) is very important to them. In the general scheme of things choosing a product based on who else you think owns that product is rather silly, but to a certain point we all do that.

I remember seeing a show on television a few years ago where there were a group of people who were taste testing vodka. Before the test they asked the participants what their favorite vodka brand was and most named Grey Goose. When the participants were aware of the brand they were tasting Grey Goose won the taste test. When they repeated the test and they did not know what brand they were tasting Grey Goose was far down on the list behind several far less expensive brands.

CA
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  #43  
Old 01-28-2013, 03:28 PM
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Originally Posted by boramkiv View Post
I can believe this. It can't be a fair comparison however. BMW changed their style to attract the mature buyers with the 3, and its working.
Caddy changed their style with the A, and it's not working so well. So even though the average age of A is lower than that of 3, the success lies with the 3 so far because they're selling more.
Again, I have YET to see an ATS around here. Haven't been out of town in a while, but haven't seen one yet. And I will definitely know when I see one.
Ultimately though it is whether it works for you, not what is working for BMW, that is important.

If BMW starts to cater to the retirees, and since we have a retiree boom now and in the future, it could work very well for BMW, but would such a policy also work for under 40 year olds?
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  #44  
Old 01-28-2013, 03:32 PM
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I don't think that GM, in their wildest dreams, expected the ATS to outsell or sell even come close to selling as well as the 3 Series in the first few years of production. If the ATS is well received it will gradually gain market share.

A lot of the threads about brands that compete with BMW have a lot of preconceptions. You will see "A Mustang can't go around corners in spite of the fact that on the track they are very competitive with, and sometimes faster than an M3.

Many people choose a car brand because the way other people perceive them (or more accurately the way THEY perceive that other people perceive them) is very important to them. In the general scheme of things choosing a product based on who else you think owns that product is rather silly, but to a certain point we all do that.

I remember seeing a show on television a few years ago where there were a group of people who were taste testing vodka. Before the test they asked the participants what their favorite vodka brand was and most named Grey Goose. When the participants were aware of the brand they were tasting Grey Goose won the taste test. When they repeated the test and they did not know what brand they were tasting Grey Goose was far down on the list behind several far less expensive brands.

CA
Nicely said, CA! It's going to take some time for the ATS to gather a following but I'm sure once it does, it'll be the new 'cool' thing to have for the younger buyers that Cadillac is targeting. Believe it or not CA, McDonalds Coffee was rated as #1 in a blind taste test over Starbucks and Dunkin Donuts. It just goes to show how a brand can play with peoples minds.
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Last edited by -=Hot|Ice=-; 01-28-2013 at 03:36 PM.
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  #45  
Old 01-28-2013, 03:35 PM
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I have seen 3 ats so far, 1 a 2.5, the other 2 a 3.6. all 3 had drivers close to 60.


Most F30's i am seeing the drivers are between 30-40.
Hey, I resemble that remark! Except you see what I drive.
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  #46  
Old 01-28-2013, 03:35 PM
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boramkiv boramkiv is offline
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Ultimately though it is whether it works for you, not what is working for BMW, that is important.

If BMW starts to cater to the retirees, and since we have a retiree boom now and in the future, it could work very well for BMW, but would such a policy also work for under 40 year olds?
True. So right now BMW is doing well. When sales start to shift the other way, I'm sure BMW
will immediately pull that magic trick out of their sleeve.
We can all remember what BMW's used to be.
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  #47  
Old 01-28-2013, 03:37 PM
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Hey, I resemble that remark! Except you see what I drive.
The average age of a 3 series driver is 42.
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  #48  
Old 01-28-2013, 03:43 PM
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The average age of a 3 series driver is 42.
What about Z4 drivers?
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  #49  
Old 01-28-2013, 03:44 PM
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Nicely said, CA! It's going to take some time for the ATS to gather a following but I'm sure once it does, it'll be the new 'cool' thing to have for the younger buyers that Cadillac is targeting.
I'm not err really sure about that one. I mean yes it's cool, but as of today it's still just a Cadillac. The V HAS to be really good in order for the ATS name to be permanently sealed in our minds as a car that dominated the automotive industry.
The CTS-V did that, (the second gen) but reading their forums revealed a lot of unhappy owners who just accepts the major faults on the car which are inferior to some of the competition. And basically saying the cars power makes up for the refinement. The ATS is at the doorstep, GM just needs to let it in and make if feel at home, warm and cozy not leave out there in these frigid temps.
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  #50  
Old 01-28-2013, 03:46 PM
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I'm not err really sure about that one. I mean yes it's cool, but as of today it's still just a Cadillac. The V HAS to be really good in order for the ATS name to be permanently sealed in our minds as a car that dominated the automotive industry.
The CTS-V did that, (the second gen) but reading their forums revealed a lot of unhappy owners who just accepts the major faults on the car which are inferior to some of the competition. And basically saying the cars power makes up for the refinement. The ATS is at the doorstep, GM just needs to let it in and make if feel at home, warm and cozy not leave out there in these frigid temps.
Which is what CA and I have ben saying. It's going to take awhile, but it can happen.
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