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E90/E91/E92/E93 (2006 - 2013)
The E9X is the 4th evolution of the BMW 3 series including a highly tuned twin turbo 335i variant pushing out 300hp and 300 ft. lbs. of torque. BMW continues to show that it sets the bar for true driving performance! -- View the E9X Wiki

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  #1  
Old 06-21-2013, 07:04 AM
dexterp652 dexterp652 is offline
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Transmission Question

I have a 2009 xi coupe with the sport package. The car is an auto and I DO NOT believe the "life time" fluid.

Just wanted to know if my plan sounds reasonable to keep the car going for 160,000 + miles.

I currently have 37,400 on the clock and drive right now 18,000 (should go down after a move to a more reasonable 12000). My plan is to change the ATF at 50,000 and then every 30,000 after.

Does this sound reasonable, and as long as I drive like a sane person is it totally unreasonable to expect to get 160,000 + miles out of the transmission (and engine for that matter).

Thanks
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  #2  
Old 06-21-2013, 07:17 AM
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CALWATERBOY CALWATERBOY is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dexterp652 View Post
I have a 2009 xi coupe with the sport package. The car is an auto and I DO NOT believe the "life time" fluid.

Just wanted to know if my plan sounds reasonable to keep the car going for 160,000 + miles.

I currently have 37,400 on the clock and drive right now 18,000 (should go down after a move to a more reasonable 12000). My plan is to change the ATF at 50,000 and then every 30,000 after.

Does this sound reasonable, and as long as I drive like a sane person is it totally unreasonable to expect to get 160,000 + miles out of the transmission (and engine for that matter).

Sure. Why wouldn't it?

Proviso: You're not talking to transmission design or R&D engineers. But we know that more frequent than recommended changes won't hurt you.

Question: What happens inside if you stick to BMW's lifetime claim?

Procedure


BMW Lifetime transmission fluid at 51k mi - claimed to smell like burnt Coca Cola:



.

Last edited by CALWATERBOY; 06-21-2013 at 07:36 AM.
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  #3  
Old 06-21-2013, 07:24 AM
dexterp652 dexterp652 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CALWATERBOY View Post
Sure. Why wouldn't it?

Proviso: You're not talking to transmission design or R&R engineers. But we know that more frequent than recommended changes won't hurt you.

Question: What happens inside if you stick to BMW's lifetime claim?

Procedure

.
I would assume sticking to the 100,000 mile changes would mean i wouldnt ever reach change #2. as the fluid would breakdown causing early death to the transmission.


I know your not engineers (well, there may be some here) but I figured that if anyone would be able to provide good advice it would be the guys here
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Old 06-21-2013, 09:11 AM
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BB_cuda BB_cuda is offline
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planning to change my fluid every 40k miles. Doing it myself. parts and fluids available here.
http://www.thectsc.com/
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  #5  
Old 06-21-2013, 09:39 AM
dexterp652 dexterp652 is offline
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Thanks, I could get the stuff and have an indy shop do the actual labor (i lack the tools and the know how to do it). I figure 160,000 miles before i need to rebuild anything is not unreasonable.

When the time comes i guess ill just evaluate how the car is doing and either keep or trade it when i am ready for a 2 series (MT this time!)
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  #6  
Old 06-21-2013, 10:57 AM
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floydarogers floydarogers is offline
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Let's be clear: BMW walked back "lifetime" on the auto tranny fluid - it's now 100K miles.

Mike Miller recommends 60K mile intervals, and although I don't always agree with him, I decided to do 60K intervals - 100K is IMHO too long, anything shorter might be a waste (these aren't trannies built 20 years ago.)

It's kind of expensive - $500+, and a lot of that is just the fluid. Don't forget a tranny pan gasket and clean the screen.
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Old 06-21-2013, 12:39 PM
dexterp652 dexterp652 is offline
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Sounds like i should be able to expect (baring gremlins) to get 160,000+ miles out of the thing if I do the maintenance. I have to say, i love this car and would like to keep it even after i get my next one. Just wanted to see if it would be wise to do it down the line if at that time i was at 150,000 miles

Thanks Guys
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Old 06-21-2013, 05:30 PM
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@floyd, the do it your self cost is more like $250ish + shipping. I bet indy would do it for ~$100 labor. Dealercost sounds to vary. I recall one guy on diesel forum saying $800 and you're saying $500. I would change the pan as there is no other way to change the filter other than to find a substitute metal pan and then use the E53 style filter. I have learned in the diesel forum that the Ford 8R70 transmission has the same bolt pattern as our 6hp28 transmissions (335D people that is). An aftermarket aluminum one is available for the ford 8R70. The link i give above points the gassers to the different pan and filter kit. When i do the trans fillter, fluid change i will also do the fuel filter as it is right by the trans. A little labor is happening to drop the body panel closeouts anyway so I'm thinking i'm gonna get on the change the fuel filter once per year bandwagon as diesel has water management needs. $30 per filter is cheap insurance. A couple guys have added a water separator to their systems. i'll shut up with my diesel talk now.

Back to the thread. Klaus from the CTSC says change at 50,000 miles. There is such a thing as change BEFORE it needs it. Seems to me, the fluid should be changed before it gets ooky black like the waterboy photo. As i said above, i'm going with the 40,000 mile plan. Still have that lead on the aluminum bmw pan but it will be very pricey.

Last edited by BB_cuda; 06-21-2013 at 05:36 PM.
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  #9  
Old 06-21-2013, 09:07 PM
sptt144 sptt144 is offline
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I am going to do mine at 50K. I am at 42K. Thinking the same thing. I just did my other car 3 times in 6 weeks and the fluid went from dark brown at 112K to pretty pink and shifting issues got smoother. I did not flush but just drain and refill (and did not use the dealer's expensive ATF which saved me half). I will use the BMW fluid but looking for a deal online for that and pan/filter.

Here is the filter for $134.00:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/BMW-OEM-Oil-...9f70b9&vxp=mtr

Last edited by sptt144; 06-21-2013 at 10:14 PM.
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  #10  
Old 06-21-2013, 11:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BB_cuda View Post
@floyd, the do it your self cost is more like $250ish + shipping. I bet indy would do it for ~$100 labor. Dealercost sounds to vary. I recall one guy on diesel forum saying $800 and you're saying $500.
$512.xx from my independent. 7 quarts fluid, plus filter and gasket, they charged a couple hours labor. It's not just a drain and refill, as you have to flush it through the torque converter to get it all.
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  #11  
Old 06-22-2013, 06:38 AM
dexterp652 dexterp652 is offline
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Flush vs drain, what would BMW do for the 100,000 service? Also does it make any difference if I have a GM transmission instead of a ZF
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  #12  
Old 06-24-2013, 02:12 PM
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Sorry Dexter, I don't know what to say about the GM based trans. My philosopy is to just do the drain and refill. If you do it earlier and more frequently like i do, you are effectively flushing it ~ every other change out. I've done this on my truck 3 times now. Pertaining to the truck, I have read of folks disconnecting the trans from the cooler (built into radiator) and watching the dark fluid flow into a bucket until clean red flows out of hose. I have no idea if arrangement is similiar on BMW ZF or not. It is simpler to just do it early and often. Obviously, it you're paying someone to do the service the tradeoff is not quite as easy.
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Old 06-24-2013, 03:40 PM
harooni harooni is offline
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i have 60k miles and i want to do mine in the next 6-8k miles but i am worried that the dealship will charge me and then laugh and say "lifetime" to each other and not even drain and fill with new fluid. and then im also worried that an indy shop will not do it correctly. am i just paranoid or what?
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  #14  
Old 11-23-2013, 08:11 AM
bballfreak bballfreak is offline
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Question on changing transmission fluid in 335d

How does on measure the oil temperature when filling the ATF fluid in this car?
In mu Audi, I have the diagnostic cable and a laptop and I can actually see the temperature of the ATF fluid displayed using the software, and it has to be between
35C to 38C when filling and the engine running.
So it is a 2 man operation, one filling and another watching the temperature.
So, I am ready to change the ATF in my 2009 335d, I am told it is 6HP26
and have ZF-Lifeguard 6 and the ZF-transmission pan.
Also, need the torque values for the oil pan bolts, drain plug and fill plug values.
Any way to drain the ATF from the torque converter?
Any help would be great.
Thks
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Old 11-23-2013, 08:44 AM
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CALWATERBOY CALWATERBOY is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bballfreak View Post
How does on measure the oil temperature when filling the ATF fluid in this car?
In mu Audi, I have the diagnostic cable and a laptop and I can actually see the temperature of the ATF fluid displayed using the software, and it has to be between
35C to 38C when filling and the engine running.
So it is a 2 man operation, one filling and another watching the temperature.
So, I am ready to change the ATF in my 2009 335d, I am told it is 6HP26
and have ZF-Lifeguard 6 and the ZF-transmission pan.
Also, need the torque values for the oil pan bolts, drain plug and fill plug values.
Any way to drain the ATF from the torque converter?
Any help would be great.
Thks

Why does Audi have a temp requirement?


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  #16  
Old 11-23-2013, 09:19 AM
bballfreak bballfreak is offline
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transmission question on 335d

Audi, VW and Porsche all have a temperature requirement when refilling the transmission fluid to avoid overfill.
I think BMW also states the same, I think
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  #17  
Old 11-23-2013, 06:19 PM
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BB_cuda BB_cuda is offline
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Klaus from http://www.thectsc.com/ gave me these pdfs explaining how to torque trans pan as well as refill complete with temp spec during refill. I believe the instructions cover whether the trans pertains to a gasser or diesel type transmission. I have not done this procudeure yet as my diesel still only has 28,000 miles on it. Use at your own risk. Klaus from the link has given me pretty good advice though the pdfs seem trustworthy to me.

EDIT: After looking at the files again (its been awhile), the files with "x" in their names pertain to X5 with the steel pan. This doesn't pertain to our E9X transmissions. The other 2 files with no "x" in their names are for servicing trans with plastic pans. The filling procedure file provides temperatures. The other file provides torque sequence and torque value. Enjoy.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf 6hp26x_steel_bmw_fluidlevel.pdf (146.9 KB, 17 views)
File Type: pdf fluid_change_6.pdf (143.4 KB, 16 views)
File Type: pdf fluid_change_6x.pdf (60.7 KB, 11 views)
File Type: pdf 6hp26_28_bmw_fluidlevel.pdf (222.0 KB, 12 views)

Last edited by BB_cuda; 11-23-2013 at 06:31 PM.
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Old 11-23-2013, 07:05 PM
bballfreak bballfreak is offline
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ATF fill procedure in 335d

These pdf file does not tell how does one measure the temperature of the ATF fluid
when filling?
How does one know that you have reached 40C?
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Old 11-24-2013, 05:32 AM
fdriller9 fdriller9 is online now
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I flushed my trans fluid at 42k. About to do it again with a pan change at 100k.

The damn trans fluid filter is integrated into the pan itself on ZF trans. Damn you ZF and BMW for this stupid lifetime fluid campaign!
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Last edited by fdriller9; 11-24-2013 at 05:33 AM.
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Old 11-24-2013, 05:34 AM
fdriller9 fdriller9 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bballfreak View Post
These pdf file does not tell how does one measure the temperature of the ATF fluid
when filling?
How does one know that you have reached 40C?
You need an infrared thermometer. Normally you fill the trans, run the car with the wheels in the air for a few minutes, check temp and fill to spec as soon as it reaches the designed temp.
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Last edited by fdriller9; 11-24-2013 at 05:35 AM.
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Old 11-24-2013, 08:01 AM
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CALWATERBOY CALWATERBOY is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fdriller9 View Post
You need an infrared thermometer. Normally you fill the trans, run the car with the wheels in the air for a few minutes, check temp and fill to spec as soon as it reaches the designed temp.

There is a temp differential, outside case temp vs inside fluid. Estimate 5F min. More if ambient's frigid.
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Old 11-24-2013, 08:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BB_cuda View Post
Klaus from http://www.thectsc.com/ gave me these pdfs explaining how to torque trans pan as well as refill complete with temp spec during refill.

Impressive!

Enjoyed browsing through their tech doc section.....many thanks!!!


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  #23  
Old 11-24-2013, 08:53 AM
bballfreak bballfreak is offline
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i thought this was a plastic pan vs. aluminum and can one get exact temperature
off a plastic pan?
I do have IR temperature gun.
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  #24  
Old 11-25-2013, 07:27 AM
fdriller9 fdriller9 is online now
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I thought I remember reading in my Bentley manual that you leave the fill port open and read temp through the opening, pointing the infared thermometer directly at the fluid.
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Old 11-25-2013, 07:34 AM
bballfreak bballfreak is offline
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Really, did not know that. I have the Bentley manual for 335i for the same year and read up when I get home.
I thought it said that you need to have the OBD scanner where it displays the temperature on the laptop screen.
That is how it is for Audi, VW and Porsche and that is how I did the fluid refill in these cars.
And apparently it was like 1/2+ quart less than what it should be based on the temperature measurements.
Wonder what type of OBD scanner cable and software does one need to have to do this accurately.
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