Welcome to Bimmerfest -- The #1 Online Community for BMW related information! Please enjoy the discussion forums below and share your experiences with the 200,000 current, new and past BMW owners. The forums are broken out by car model and into other special interest sections such as BMW European Delivery and a special forum to voice your questions to the many BMW dealers on the site to assist our members!

Please follow the links below to help get you started!

Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > BMW Model Discussions > X Series > X3 E83 (2004 - 2010)

X3 E83 (2004 - 2010)
Talk about the E83 BMW X3 in this forum!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 03-26-2013, 12:57 PM
old city old city is offline
Registered User
Location: usa
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 6
Mein Auto: bmw x3
Blue smoke and rough idle X3 2005

I've BMW X3 2005 3.0 , with heavy blue smoke during the cold start and engine have rough idle. Recently changed oil filter housing gasket and valve cover gasket. Any help?
Reply With Quote
Ads by Google
  #2  
Old 03-26-2013, 01:11 PM
halltristan's Avatar
halltristan halltristan is offline
Bimmer Enthusiast
Location: Tennessee
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 652
Mein Auto: 325i and X3
Could be the CCV. After the engine warms does it still smoke? Does it smoke more while idling, for example, at stoplights?

Also check your coolant and see if there's any discoloration. Could also be a head gasket.
__________________

Member No. 470379
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 03-26-2013, 02:02 PM
old city old city is offline
Registered User
Location: usa
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 6
Mein Auto: bmw x3
Thanks halltristan, I've smoke only during the cold start.Coolant is ok.And oil level too. I'm thinking about replacing oxygen sensor ? And CVV too.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 03-26-2013, 02:03 PM
old city old city is offline
Registered User
Location: usa
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 6
Mein Auto: bmw x3
I hope is not head gasket....
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 03-26-2013, 02:10 PM
halltristan's Avatar
halltristan halltristan is offline
Bimmer Enthusiast
Location: Tennessee
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 652
Mein Auto: 325i and X3
Quote:
Originally Posted by old city View Post
Thanks halltristan, I've smoke only during the cold start.Coolant is ok.And oil level too. I'm thinking about replacing oxygen sensor ? And CVV too.
An oxygen sensor wouldn't cause this. Blue smoke indicates burning oil. My bet is that its the CCV. Pull a couple spark plugs and see if they're oily. If its the head gasket one plug may be oily while the others aren't. If its the CCV, several of the plugs will be oily.

You can also send your oil in an have it examined. That would tell you for sure if it's the head gasket or not. It's only $30 with shipping so you might want to consider it.
__________________

Member No. 470379
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 03-26-2013, 02:24 PM
fivepointnine fivepointnine is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Olympia, Wa
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 345
Mein Auto: BMW X3, Mercedes CLK500
99% that it is the CCV failed.....the rough idle is a dead giveaway.
this was what mine looked like
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 03-26-2013, 04:11 PM
halltristan's Avatar
halltristan halltristan is offline
Bimmer Enthusiast
Location: Tennessee
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 652
Mein Auto: 325i and X3
Quote:
Originally Posted by fivepointnine View Post
99% that it is the CCV failed.....the rough idle is a dead giveaway.
this was what mine looked like
Rough idling is not a usual symptom of a failing CCV so it isn't a "dead giveaway".
__________________

Member No. 470379
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 03-26-2013, 07:17 PM
fivepointnine fivepointnine is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Olympia, Wa
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 345
Mein Auto: BMW X3, Mercedes CLK500
rough idle with the the addition of the blue smoke on start up is! To the OP, have you done the "plastic bag" test? Put a plastic bag over the oil fill while running, it should have LIGHT suction, if you get positive pressure or extreme suction your CCV is definitely bad. Also since your OFHG and VCG both failed that could also point to the CCV over-pressurizing the oil system on start up. I chased/researched my CCV issue for a while so I am very familiar with the characteristics of the system.

Last edited by fivepointnine; 03-26-2013 at 07:18 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 03-26-2013, 07:28 PM
2k323iT 2k323iT is offline
Registered User
Location: Iowa
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 6
Mein Auto: 323iT
Remove oil fill cap - if you have strong suction - I mean like vacuum cleaner strong - its probably CCV. I just went through this myself with our X3

Last edited by 2k323iT; 03-26-2013 at 07:30 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 03-26-2013, 07:51 PM
halltristan's Avatar
halltristan halltristan is offline
Bimmer Enthusiast
Location: Tennessee
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 652
Mein Auto: 325i and X3
Quote:
Originally Posted by fivepointnine View Post
rough idle with the the addition of the blue smoke on start up is! To the OP, have you done the "plastic bag" test? Put a plastic bag over the oil fill while running, it should have LIGHT suction, if you get positive pressure or extreme suction your CCV is definitely bad. Also since your OFHG and VCG both failed that could also point to the CCV over-pressurizing the oil system on start up. I chased/researched my CCV issue for a while so I am very familiar with the characteristics of the system.
I agree that it's most likely the CCV but the rough idling you experienced was likely something else.

Op - don't use a plastic bag whatever you do. Just use your hand. Just imagine if the bag was to get sucked into your engine - most expensive bag in history. and I still recommend pulling the plugs just to be sure.
__________________

Member No. 470379
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 03-26-2013, 09:39 PM
fivepointnine fivepointnine is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Olympia, Wa
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 345
Mein Auto: BMW X3, Mercedes CLK500
with blue smoke on start up I almost would expect to see positive pressure from the oil fill cap
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 03-27-2013, 07:02 AM
old city old city is offline
Registered User
Location: usa
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 6
Mein Auto: bmw x3
How much is going to cost replacment of CVV and what else need to bee replaced?
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 03-27-2013, 07:20 AM
halltristan's Avatar
halltristan halltristan is offline
Bimmer Enthusiast
Location: Tennessee
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 652
Mein Auto: 325i and X3
Quote:
Originally Posted by old city View Post
How much is going to cost replacment of CVV and what else need to bee replaced?
Well if you do it yourself you're looking around $300 for all the hoses, dipstick tube, CCV, etc. If a dealer does it you're looking at $1500.00. You need to be sure it's the CCV though and pull some plugs!!!
__________________

Member No. 470379
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 03-27-2013, 07:56 AM
sjladopoulos sjladopoulos is offline
MotorPress.ca
Location: Toronto
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 250
Mein Auto: 2007 BMW X3 3.0si
Blue smoke = oil in cylinder
Rough Idle = CVV or Idle sensor or Oxygen sensor cause of burned oil or blocked fuel lines or air intake or spark plugs or many more.

What worries me is the blue smoke... Head gasket and valve springs need to be checked before any damage occurs.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 03-27-2013, 07:58 AM
old city old city is offline
Registered User
Location: usa
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 6
Mein Auto: bmw x3
OK, thank you halltristan !
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 03-27-2013, 08:00 AM
mbovino mbovino is offline
Registered User
Location: New Jersey
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 14
Mein Auto: 2004 X3
CCV is the best suspect

I agree on the CCV as the probable culprit. It's more likely to be one or more of the four related hoses that failed vs. the oil separator component itself. The hoses are made of thermoplastic and become brittle over time. Some are buried on the left side of the engine and can't be easily checked. And some are covered with an insulative sheath often hiding a broken hose inside.

Part of the diagnostics include if you have the Service Engine Soon light illuminated. If so and if you pull the codes you will probably find lean codes on the banks and various ignition misfires. The lean codes are from rather large vacuum leaks from when the CCV hose(s) breach. This causes the ECU to think it needs more fuel to keep up with what it thinks is too much air resulting in longer fuel injection pulses to the point of fouling the plugs causing misfire. So couple poor vacuum which also means improper oil vapor venting, and rich plugs and you get the resulting rough idle and blue smoke.

A quick test is to remove the oil cap while running as others suggest. But if when you remove that cap and the engine freaks out and shutters, that is conclusive proof of a massive vacuum leak - the cap was the last barrier helping the engine to breathe properly. You can also carefully remove the vent hose from the front of the valve cover and blow in it (squeeze the sides of the locking ring and pull to release). If you have zero resistance and it sounds like you are blowing in the tube and it is coming right out of the other side, that is another indication of a broken CCV hose. When I recently repaired mine, and after evicerating the left side engine bay to finally get my hand on those hoses, they crumbled like styrofoam.

What is often overlooked is that besides the vacuum problems described above, and depending on the point of failure, the lower half of the crankcase also gets affected. The bottom-most hose connects from the oil separator to the crankcase via the dipstick tube. That is intended to return condensed oil vapor back to the engine. So as with happened on my car, that hose broke causing vaccum leaks on the top end and lower crankcase breathing problems on the lower (recall that an engine is a pump with air displaced and sucked in at various points). The broken hose also caused a slow loss of oil and a resultant mess on the lower left side near the break. You can somewhat check for this by getting under the car and removing the splash pan and reaching up in front and around the lower metal support plate and feel for oil slime. It should be relatively dry unless that hose has failed.

So if you've done all of that and are convinced it is the CCV system and want to perform the repair yourself, the good news is that not many tools are needed and there are some excellent threads on this board on how to do it. The bad news is the job is about an 9 out of 10 on the PITA scale because so much has to be removed to get to the oil separator and some of it is done purely by feel. Mind you, maybe only one of the four hoses has failed (three go to the separator), but just getting your hands on the release clips requires a fair amount excavation to get to.

I suggest you go all in and buy a kit with the separator and four hoses. I bought mine from FCPEuro in Groton CT., who supplies mostly OEM components and the rest are from high quality suppliers. That kit cost about $150. While you are at it you should replace the throttle body o-ring gasket, the lower dipstick o-ring, the six o-rings on the air intake manifold on top (removal makes getting to two of the hoses a bit easier), and probably the lower air intake boot since that is known to fail (crack) at the smaller branch that connects to the Idle Control Valve. It has to be removed anyway so for $50 or so dollars it is good preventative maintenance to replace it. All in, the parts should cost less than $225 (less if you buy all aftermarket but why take the chance?) After recently completing the job I can believe the cost to have a shop do the work at $1500 - there is about 8 hours of labor start to finish. But it is not difficult if you are handy and if you are methodical (bag and tag the bolts and nuts as you remove them). It also helps if you have a spouse who will rub your back when it's done because you are going to need it!!

Good luck, Mike
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 03-27-2013, 08:08 AM
fivepointnine fivepointnine is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: Olympia, Wa
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 345
Mein Auto: BMW X3, Mercedes CLK500
http://www.pelicanparts.com/cgi-bin/...0Each%20%20%20

OEM BMW parts

labor will run about 300 at an Indy shop (just checked, I paid $312 in labor) free if you have an afternoon to dedicate to it, there are youtube videos to guide you, it is IDENTICAL to doing an E46, parts are the same part number and everything, just make sure to get the insulated version. When I replaced mine I had both a split hose AND a seized Crank Vent Valve.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 03-27-2013, 12:02 PM
old city old city is offline
Registered User
Location: usa
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 6
Mein Auto: bmw x3
Thanks Mike!
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 05-19-2013, 02:24 PM
yodude66 yodude66 is offline
Registered User
Location: CT
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3
Mein Auto: 528i\X3
Replaced by dealer: DISA Valve (adaptation valve), plugs, CCV, did a fuel system cleaning.

Mine rough idles on start-up sometimes. EML and SEs light come on till the RPM comes up. Some blue smoke at the tail pipe. Have to top-off oil.

What's next to stop this oil consumption\burn?
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 05-21-2013, 09:05 AM
yodude66 yodude66 is offline
Registered User
Location: CT
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3
Mein Auto: 528i\X3
I have also read the old style oil dipsticks and 'o' ri\ng could be a problem.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 09-11-2013, 01:48 PM
CapsLock911 CapsLock911 is offline
Registered User
Location: Cleveland, OH
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 5
Mein Auto: X3
Same Symptoms - rough idle / some smoke

I just ordered my manual. I have an 07 X3. I've been through VW, Jaguar, etc. This is my first BMW. I love the suv and am looking forward to learning more as I tear into it. I apprecate all the posts. Providing nothing goes boom before the manual arrives, I will post photos and what I find / fix.

I'm praying for sunshine until the job is done. That means I get to ride the Triumph (another mechanics dream
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 09-13-2013, 09:26 PM
yeswecan yeswecan is offline
Registered User
Location: Washington, dc
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 69
Mein Auto: Washington, dc
bad CCV will causes blue smoke, as well as rough idle, it's part of vacuum system, intake air go through the ccv, if there is a air leak and bad ccv it will causes blue smoke and rough idle
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 10-03-2013, 12:57 PM
CapsLock911 CapsLock911 is offline
Registered User
Location: Cleveland, OH
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 5
Mein Auto: X3
2007 BMW X3 Osi
So, after ordering the CVV parts, I dug into the engine. I soon discovered that I have an N52, not an N54. I didn't even know the engine existed and I've been driving it for a while...how embarrassing!

So, I have a new CVV (valve , hoses and manifold o-rings) for an N54 for sale on the cheap = $200

My new OBDll tester came in. I cleared the codes and ran it. #4 cylinder misfire was what it read.

There are typically a few issues on the N52 that can cause these symptoms: Plugs Coils Vanos (2 each) Hook Seal Valve Cover Gasket. I ordered 2 Vanos and changed them, as they have high miles and I'm considering it preventative. I replaced 6 spark plugs oops, #4 is saturated in oil! So, I pulled the VC off and will replace the seals when they arrive tomorrow. The #4 was leaking internally.

I think / hope this is the fix. If it's the hook seal, it means a cam removal to check. Ouch! I'll update this thread when I'm complete.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 06-16-2014, 07:57 PM
pezjunki pezjunki is offline
Registered User
Location: Ky
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 54
Mein Auto: 2005 X3 3.0
Link:
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 06-17-2014, 05:33 AM
swampX3 swampX3 is offline
Officially Welcomed to the 'Fest
Location: New Orleans
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 486
Mein Auto: X3 and 330
heat traced

also ....remember many of the 52 engines and beyond after the 54 series ended have heat tracing under the insulation of the CCV plastic piping ....they connect thru a hub under the intake manifold....a little tricky but very doable
the heat tracing helps reduce freeze ups in cold areas of the globe .....don't forget to hook it up......also read the posts on hydro locking your engine if the CCV fails and sucks engine oil into the engine
also on the 52 check the extra DISA under the intake manifold
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Forum Navigation
Go Back   Bimmerfest - BMW Forums > BMW Model Discussions > X Series > X3 E83 (2004 - 2010)
Today's Posts Search
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On



Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:11 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
© 2001-2011 performanceIX, Inc. All Rights Reserved .: guidelines .:. privacy .:. terms