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7 Series - E65 / E66 (2002 - 2008)
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  #1  
Old 10-30-2013, 01:20 AM
760LIving 760LIving is online now
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Self Leveling Suspension

I am probably sure that there is already a thread for what I'm having a problem with but I couldn't come up with the right search terms to find it. So if there is one I apologize for my lacking in search skills.

I had the fuel filter replaced and since my self leveling suspension lowers almost to the wheels when I turn the car off. It goes right back up when I turn the car on and there are not any messages or lights on about it. So this could be normal - I am not certain. It just hasn't done that before jacking it up to change the fuel filter...


Much thanks to all here on the forum I have been able to do so much from the help offered on here - Fuel Filter, Tuner Mod, ISM, CCV's and Akebono brakes.

So if any advice to my current dilemma or direction to an existing thread on the matter would be much appreciated.
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  #2  
Old 10-31-2013, 02:08 PM
mws mws is offline
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hmmmm, I've dinked around with the self-leveling suspension on my 760Li but... it perplexes me. I even spend time in INPA re-setting Zero and trying to recalibrate it to accept the new ride height of the front H&R springs and it still sometimes does weird stuff. 70% of the time the rear is in the proper ride height when parked, but 30% of the time I come back and just one wheel is 1" lower than the other and feels like mush until it drives a bit and fixes itself.

one thing I am thinking: did you turn the car on when it was jacked up? rear wheels in the air when you did that?
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  #3  
Old 10-31-2013, 04:36 PM
760LIving 760LIving is online now
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Yes I did turn the car on while lifted. I put power to test the pressure at the fuel filter before lowering the car. I didn't lift the whole car for the filter - I just jacked up the drivers side to get to the filter so only one back wheel was off the ground.
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  #4  
Old 11-01-2013, 10:19 AM
mws mws is offline
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unfortunately, you've exhausted all I know about this subject and also, there's not much in the forum on troubleshooting it, from what I have seen. The Mercedes SLs use something similar, I would not doubt they might even be made by the same manufacturer, and the symptom you mention is a common trouble-spot for them.

Since your suspension does go back to level ( and mine mostly does as well) it's even more difficult to figure out what to replace.
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  #5  
Old 11-01-2013, 10:36 AM
brettsg brettsg is offline
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what you probable have is a small leak (usually from the bladder) of the strut. when you turn the car off the air bleeds off but when you turn the car back on it activates the pump to bring it back to normal height. spray soapy water on the bladder and see if you see any bubbles.
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  #6  
Old 11-01-2013, 12:45 PM
760LIving 760LIving is online now
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Thanks I'll try the soapy water and see. I was really hoping maybe it would just reset itself or something because of me jacking up the one side i thought i might have thrown something off.
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  #7  
Old 11-01-2013, 01:22 PM
mws mws is offline
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brettsg, how about this one: car has 148K miles on it. Original struts. (I know, I know...)

I lowered the car in front using H&R springs. The self-leveling system in back came down after the dropping of the front, but was still high about 3/4" inch compared to the front.

So I used INPA hand control to lower the rear a bit more, and then did a calibration to set a new Zero.

Drive a bit. Park. Sometimes come to the car and one side is 1/2 to an inch low. Drive on it, and it does not come back up. Sometimes it does. it depends.

When I do use INPA to pump it back up, it does so with no problem at all and holds for awhile. Drive some more. Sometimes after a drive or after parking, the entire rear is just sagging and loses it's firmness and feels wallowy and frankly, dangerous.

re-set it back up, maybe a little higher, set a new Zero. After a day it loses zero and wants to adjust itself so the front and rear are about matched. Now it's kinda OK but one side is still usually (not always) droopier than the other.

Last edited by mws; 11-01-2013 at 01:24 PM.
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  #8  
Old 11-14-2013, 11:18 AM
mws mws is offline
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As I mentioned I did the H&R springs in front and used INPA to lower the rear self leveling suspension on my 760Li and had been having issues ever since. I seem to have figured out and solved my above problem with the rear self-leveling suspension behaving strangely and not seeming to hold the zero I set. It would always slump and also not be even from side to side in the back.

I had the system in "Economy Mode" by accident. I apparently set it in INPA using the hand control pane and the Mode page. It was completely by accident. The strange thing is: I would get errors in DIS and in German in INPA saying the system was in Economy Mode and the error was currently present, but when I would check modes page it said Production Mode was chosen. I turned Production Mode off, and suddenly that Economy mode error stopped being persistent. Apparently Production mode and Economy mode are the same thing. IN any case, don't F with that page. That is the lesson I learned.

In any case, after driving the car today, the rear end went back up to zero and is perfectly even side to side. I'll keep an eye on it. At 148K miles, that's pretty amazing, if it's still working properly.

760LIving, not sure if this is your issue, but you might get with someone who has INPA and double-check.
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  #9  
Old 12-26-2013, 09:26 AM
760LIving 760LIving is online now
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New update for the self leveling suspension. Last night while driving the drivers side rear wheel dropped completely. It had zero shock absorbing in that tire. I parked it last night and this morning it looks like both the front and rear drivers side is low compared to the passenger side. Before last night when the car started it would raise itself back to normal now when i start the car i hear a pump (sounds like right under driver side passenger door) continually running. It sounds like what brettsg said about a leak in the bladder. So I'm leaning in that direction to start with but the way the front is sitting now it made me wonder if there is something else. Before taking it to the dreaded dealer I would appreciate any direction to start in. thanks

[IMG][/IMG]

[IMG][/IMG]

Last edited by 760LIving; 12-26-2013 at 12:01 PM. Reason: corrected images
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  #10  
Old 12-28-2013, 08:13 PM
slowd slowd is offline
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One wheel lower

I am seeing a very similar issue and I have identified that cold seems to make things worse. Mine has gotten to the point where even if I drive it and its below 32 degrees outside it will not pump up. I was curious about these struts. I think I may want to replace them but if this doesn't hijack your thread, I wanted to know if you or anyone else is aware of possible strut options aside from BMW OEM. Is this application too specialized for anyone else to make an adaptation for BMW? Have you considered replacing these?
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  #11  
Old 12-28-2013, 09:02 PM
mws mws is offline
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760Living. Do you have acceess to anyone on this forum or else wise who knows INPA? Have them check the status of hue get rear axle as per my findings above. At least, they can test the pump and see of indeed, it will no longer hold air.

Slowd, did yours happen by itself, or after lowering the front?
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  #12  
Old 12-28-2013, 09:34 PM
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csmeance csmeance is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slowd View Post
I am seeing a very similar issue and I have identified that cold seems to make things worse. Mine has gotten to the point where even if I drive it and its below 32 degrees outside it will not pump up. I was curious about these struts. I think I may want to replace them but if this doesn't hijack your thread, I wanted to know if you or anyone else is aware of possible strut options aside from BMW OEM. Is this application too specialized for anyone else to make an adaptation for BMW? Have you considered replacing these?
Only cheap option is pulling them out of a wrecked 750 but they are expensive as OEM compoenents. Maybe you can go to a custom shop and have them fit a custom bladder into the stock shock for less.
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  #13  
Old 12-29-2013, 08:56 AM
760LIving 760LIving is online now
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Update: Car is at the Dealer and I'll keep updating with the results. I appreciate all the input. MWS I haven't met anyone on here yet to go to so I am biting the bullet on this one and am waiting to see how deep this goes from the dealer.
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  #14  
Old 12-31-2013, 06:05 PM
wog boy wog boy is offline
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Mine is doing the same, fully deflate when I am travelling, originally the right hand rear but I would stop and let the car sit for up to 5 mins then I would start it and it would raise fine and I would continue on, then when I noticed the right hand rear deflated I continued to drive the 5 mins or so to get home and I notice both the rear struts/bellow deflated. Allowed the car to sit for a few hours and then it would raise fine again, it is a 2005 E66 750Li however the car doesnt sag sitting overnight or even for a couple of days but now I am getting a popping noise from me rear boot area really loud on bumpy roads. I have not removed the struts yet to inspect but the noise it definatley coming from the upper strut/bellow area. Did they call you back about yours yet? What options have we got?

Last edited by wog boy; 12-31-2013 at 06:08 PM.
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  #15  
Old 01-02-2014, 08:09 AM
760LIving 760LIving is online now
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Ok Dealer told me left rear air strut completely collapsed. They want $2200 to repair - $1900 for the strut and $300 for install. They told me they would price match if I could show them another place that will fix it for less. I found a dealer in Atlanta that sells the strut for $1350. Cheapest I've found yet for New OEM part.

I am going to put H&R springs on the front and I'm wondering what would be a good upgrade for the rear. I found bilstein Air struts that said they were for the E65 models not E66 and had this disclaimer (Only for cars with Self Levelling and Adaptive Drive Suspension. Not for cars with EDC) So I think that rules me out. I'm not familiar with the difference coil overs would offer compared to the air drive. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
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  #16  
Old 01-02-2014, 10:09 AM
new760Liowner new760Liowner is offline
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I wonder if the rears are rebuildable?

I just rebuilt my E38 750iL rear SLS/EDC hydraulic shocks, the ones that are $600 new off Ebay and $1,100 at the dealer with a $7 nylon seal.

Has anyone attempted this on an E65/E66 or even took one apart? If you end up replacing
the part, make sure to keep the used one for pics as I'm sure alot of the DIY talent here would be interested.
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  #17  
Old 01-02-2014, 10:18 AM
mws mws is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by new760Liowner View Post
I just rebuilt my E38 750iL rear SLS/EDC hydraulic shocks, the ones that are $600 new off Ebay and $1,100 at the dealer with a $7 nylon seal.

Has anyone attempted this on an E65/E66 or even took one apart? If you end up replacing
the part, make sure to keep the used one for pics as I'm sure alot of the DIY talent here would be interested.
Holy Crap!! Link, please.

were they not also belching oil otherwise leaking?

that said, I don't have a set of E66 that need that attention, but would love to know your source. McMaster?

Last edited by mws; 01-02-2014 at 10:25 AM.
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  #18  
Old 01-02-2014, 10:23 AM
mws mws is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 760LIving View Post
I am going to put H&R springs on the front and I'm wondering what would be a good upgrade for the rear. I found bilstein Air struts that said they were for the E65 models not E66 and had this disclaimer (Only for cars with Self Levelling and Adaptive Drive Suspension. Not for cars with EDC) So I think that rules me out. I'm not familiar with the difference coil overs would offer compared to the air drive. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
no upgrade, just fix your rear shocks.

here's my story.

H&R with SLS and EDC

short version: the self leveling will come down to meet your H&Rs almost exactly. If you want more trimming, use INPA/rear axle/hand control
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  #19  
Old 01-02-2014, 10:45 AM
new760Liowner new760Liowner is offline
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Ebay seller is from Czech Republic I think...

The rear SLS/EDC seals for my 95 750iL (E38) are K35-016 16 x 23,3 x 3,2.
Dismantling the shock is very similar to the E32 writeup, just the
nylon seal is a different size. I ended up placing the central rod in the
freezer prior to assembly using a large socket to hammer the seal block
back on the rod.

My shock was leaking oil so I had nothing to lose. It's been on the car for the past few
months with no leaking. The Ebay seller was bohemia_seal.

Last edited by new760Liowner; 01-02-2014 at 10:46 AM.
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  #20  
Old 01-02-2014, 12:02 PM
760LIving 760LIving is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mws View Post
no upgrade, just fix your rear shocks.
MWS thank you for replying. I have been reading through the other posts and have came across a few of yours pertaining to the springs and SLS and had came to conclusion just to fix the air strut.

Do you have any feedback on Eibach vs H&R's - I've read much on here going back and forth and I am just curious if you have an opinion since you went with H&R. Thanks
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  #21  
Old 01-16-2014, 09:04 AM
760LIving 760LIving is online now
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Dealer fixed the rear strut for $2000. Now the air pump doesn't ever shut off. It makes the same noise as when the strut was broken and would not inflate. The air pump would just continue to pump. Now after having the strut replaced the air ride seems correct. The pump just doesn't ever stop running. Of course the dealer said to bring it in so they can charge me a diagnostic fee and to see if the pump is bad.

I am wondering if an air line could have came loose and/or what I could look for - Again the ride seems fine its just the pump won't stop pumping.
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  #22  
Old 01-16-2014, 09:59 AM
mws mws is offline
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you need to bitch those SOBs out and tell them the car never should have left the dealership in that condition. Start with: "who test-drove the car and verified the car was in good enough condition to return to me?". Get a name. The service advisor is allowing cars to go out that are not ready and that is HIS/HER responsibility to NOT do.

That should get their attention. If they want to charge you for the diagnostic, screw them and find someone else.
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  #23  
Old 01-16-2014, 10:50 AM
slowd slowd is offline
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If you decide to check the oil tubes yourself, please take pictures. I plan to check this myself as I have seen the tubes and have not had the opportunity to verify that they are not leaking... I plan to take a spray bottle of soapy water under there with me. I will do it this weekend and try to map this out if you can wait that long.
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  #24  
Old 01-16-2014, 10:58 AM
mws mws is offline
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btw: if it's not easy to mix up and find a sprayer-- the hardware store sells it already in a bottle called "gas leak detector" in the plumbing section. It's a small spray bottle that is ready to go.
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  #25  
Old 01-21-2014, 09:57 AM
760LIving 760LIving is online now
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I yelled at the dealer and they agreed to look at again but now it doesn't make the noise anymore. I've had it in the air, jumped up and down on the trunk did whatever I could to try to make the pump come back on but no luck. So I said I can't be mad that there is not an issue at the moment. So lets not try to make on. And left it at that. So I'm hoping that there is not a problem with the pump but it did run continuously for two or three days after replacing the rear strut. Then it stopped and has been normal since.
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